Should I buy SimCity?

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FFP2

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-Always online DRM
-Origin
-Micro-transactions
-Focuses on the "social" aspect of city building. A genre famous for being multiplayer focused.
-It's EA.

Rather get Simcity 4. Much better game. And you can actually load your saves locally.

This video pretty much sums it up:
 

Vetta E-dom

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MammothBlade said:
Gabe Yaden said:
MammothBlade said:
No, don't touch it with a f**king barge pole :)

Actual gameplay footage by SWIM:
Yep, No other game in the history of gaming has ever had server issues day one, completely unreasonable!
Of course, but I criticise those games just as much. For a game that should not be exclusively multiplayer, this is an appalling standard.
While I agree its disappointing that those people who wish to play solo have to wait in a server queue, in the grand scheme of playing the game it will most likely be alleviated in a few days so not something really indicative of overall gameplay.

"No, don't touch it with a f**king barge pole", How about approaching the issue with a bit of maturity. The game has been what looks like completely overhauled, great graphics, nice gameplay, deep logistics, new design ideas. Well worth a look at if your into such games. yeah again the server thing is disappointing, so buy it maybe in a week or so.

Also just looking at the photo A NO. 1 server on launch yeah its going to be busy
 

MammothBlade

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BloatedGuppy said:
MammothBlade said:
Of course, but I criticise those games just as much. For a game that should not be exclusively multiplayer, this is an appalling standard. Look what I did just now, I picked up simcity 2000 from gog.com and I could play it perfectly well without having to log into EA's server first. That's the sort of smooth pick up and play experience one should expect from a game even on release day.
Servers down on day one is lame.

No offline mode is lame.

Servers down on day one and no offline mode is not the entirety of what the game is, either.

I don't know why people can't take a balanced approach to anything any more. They latch on to a single talking point, and beat it into the ground. Servers down for a few minutes on launch day? DE DEVIL! DE DEVIL!

The best part is the OP is obviously already aware of the online DRM and remains conflicted, yet 90% of the thread is people informing him of the existence of the online DRM and insisting he use it as the sole criteria for dismissing the game.

I should start thread-bombing advice threads with "Don't buy this! Playstation exclusive! Don't support exclusionary business practices!". It's about as useful.
The implication is that having no offline mode, and always-online DRM will ruin the game experience and value for money so much that it doesn't matter if there's some sort of pretty game underneath. Buying it now would definitely be a mistake at least.
 

BloatedGuppy

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MammothBlade said:
The implication is that having no offline mode, and always-online DRM will ruin the game experience and value for money so much that it doesn't matter if there's some sort of pretty game underneath. Buying it now would definitely be a mistake at least.
What implication?

The OP states IN THE OP that he is aware of the DRM and hates it, then goes on to ask about Origin, whether the game is worth getting anyway, and whether the general consensus is that a purchase of the game will result in future games adopting the same DRM. And what happens?

Post after post of "HURR DURR NO DON'T BUY IT DID U NO IT HAS DRM?"

I understand people LOVE to grind axes on this forum. Like, they could change the name from "gaming forum" to "axe grinding" forum, but it's not like reading a 5-6 sentence OP and responding to it as requested is a monumental fucking challenge, is it?

This is probably my favorite exchange on the subject of SimCity and its crappy DRM to date:

 

Rachmaninov

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BloatedGuppy said:
MammothBlade said:
Of course, but I criticise those games just as much. For a game that should not be exclusively multiplayer, this is an appalling standard. Look what I did just now, I picked up simcity 2000 from gog.com and I could play it perfectly well without having to log into EA's server first. That's the sort of smooth pick up and play experience one should expect from a game even on release day.
Servers down on day one is lame.

No offline mode is lame.

Servers down on day one and no offline mode is not the entirety of what the game is, either.

I don't know why people can't take a balanced approach to anything any more. They latch on to a single talking point, and beat it into the ground. Servers down for a few minutes on launch day? DE DEVIL! DE DEVIL!

The best part is the OP is obviously already aware of the online DRM and remains conflicted, yet 90% of the thread is people informing him of the existence of the online DRM and insisting he use it as the sole criteria for dismissing the game.

I should start thread-bombing advice threads with "Don't buy this! Playstation exclusive! Don't support exclusionary business practices!". It's about as useful.
If playing SimCity 2013 meant the player would be bashed over the head with a rock, it wouldn't matter if the game was good, or if they were aware of potential rock-bashings.

DRM is the rock, and EA are swinging it with all their might.

Day One DLC, microtransactions, Origin requirement and always-online DRM bury what might be a good game under EA's usual nonsense. I was actually looking forward to this game, but to tell you the truth, I'd feel guilty for contributing to industry ruining business practices if I bought it, now.

EDIT:

And by the way, our negative responses in no way stop people from having positive responses. The OP asked if he should buy SimCity, and we're giving him reasons why not. He said he's aware of the DRM, but not that he's aware of how incredibly bad it is.
 

BloatedGuppy

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Rachmaninov said:
If playing SimCity 2013 meant the player would be bashed over the head with a rock, it wouldn't matter if the game was good, or if they were aware of potential rock-bashings.

DRM is the rock, and EA are swinging it with all their might.

Day One DLC, microtransactions, Origin requirement and always-online DRM bury what might be a good game under EA's usual nonsense. I was actually looking forward to this game, but to tell you the truth, I'd feel guilty for contributing to industry ruining business practices if I bought it, now.
I'll say it one more time, and then I'm going to be done repeating myself.

OP is aware of the DRM, and is asking for opinions on the game in spite of it.

If you made a thread asking "I know World of Warcraft is an MMO, but I'd like to know what people think in spite of that" and I chimed in immediately with "Don't it bro, it's an MMO!" would you want to punch me right my stupid face? Because you should.

Rachmaninov said:
And by the way, our negative responses in no way stop people from having positive responses. The OP asked if he should buy SimCity, and we're giving him reasons why not. He said he's aware of the DRM, but not that he's aware of how incredibly bad it is.
He says it's crap, and he hates it. How much more bilious must his comments be before he seems adequately enraged by the DRM?
 

Rachmaninov

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BloatedGuppy said:
Rachmaninov said:
If playing SimCity 2013 meant the player would be bashed over the head with a rock, it wouldn't matter if the game was good, or if they were aware of potential rock-bashings.

DRM is the rock, and EA are swinging it with all their might.

Day One DLC, microtransactions, Origin requirement and always-online DRM bury what might be a good game under EA's usual nonsense. I was actually looking forward to this game, but to tell you the truth, I'd feel guilty for contributing to industry ruining business practices if I bought it, now.
I'll say it one more time, and then I'm going to be done repeating myself.

OP is aware of the DRM, and is asking for opinions on the game in spite of it.

If you made a thread asking "I know World of Warcraft is an MMO, but I'd like to know what people think in spite of that" and I chimed in immediately with "Don't it bro, it's an MMO!" would you want to punch me right my stupid face? Because you should.
If I made a thread asking "I know World of Warcraft is an MMO, but I'd like to know what people think in spite of that" and you told me "The fact that it's an MMO ruins it." you'd be answering my question legitimately.

In other words, you looked at the pros and the cons, and the con of it being an MMO outweighed the pros.

But in the interest of peace and clarity, I'll do what I think you're asking and give a more full breakdown, and answer the OPs question, except with more words. Because that's what you're asking for right?


SimCity:

The pros: Some people like the streamlining, the little bits of interaction with other players and the polish.

The cons: Supporting EA's industry-crashing business practices, reliance on EA's unreliable servers, some people do not like the streamlining and you can get a very similar experience elsewhere, for less, without the DRM, microtransactions, Day One DLC and the other nonsense.

Conclusion: Don't buy it. Get a similar experience elsewhere (SimCity 4/Cities XL). Most importantly, don't encourage EA.



The above has already been said on this topic by different people, and the DRM simply cannot be stated enough times.
 

Zipa

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Watch this if you are unsure, TB brings up the good , the bad and the ugly with the game.
 

BloatedGuppy

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Rachmaninov said:
...and the DRM simply cannot be stated enough times.
I'm going to have to disagree. I've heard more about DRM this year than every human rights atrocity combined. There is a point at which the volume of the whining becomes patently absurd, and we soared past it many, many threads ago.

Rachmaninov said:
If I made a thread asking "I know World of Warcraft is an MMO, but I'd like to know what people think in spite of that" and you told me "The fact that it's an MMO ruins it." you'd be answering my question legitimately.
No, I wouldn't. It would be me hijacking a thread with a familiar game title in it so I could promote my agenda.

Regardless, I surrender. I've done this DRM song and dance on these forums before, and I know no amount of pleading on my part for perspective will make an ass hair worth of difference. So carry on folks. OP, don't buy this game. It requires you to be connected to the internet, and that gives you cancer.
 

duwenbasden

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I am not getting it now:
1 city size
- my neighbourhood is bigger than 2x2km.
- I have at least two cities in SimCity 4 > 400km^2.

no custom region / large scale terraforming.
- I don't want to play the same maps over and over again.

no offline saves.
- backups much?
 

mfeff

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The older Sim Cities and all their iterations are pretty good, enjoyed City Life and most of it's iterations... (although the lack of multi-threading kills the newer versions). Of course there is Tropico, which is a great little series as well.

As far as Sim City...

Played the beta/demo, thought it looked great, wanted to really like it... but I found it a little lacking in some areas. It is a "new" I.P. that is wrapped in an old and familiar wrapper.

Reminded me a lot of how X-Com (and some other games) have been rebooted or re-imagined. It isn't "bad" on it's own terms but it isn't exactly what I look for in a modern PC builder style game.

I found it crippled in scope, apparently to lower the PC requirement gate. Smaller city sizes is a big turn off, coupled with no SLi support out of the box... (had to manage that external the game). The demo was stable but I hear the release not so much.

If you can run it maxed with good frames it is a pretty attractive game.

I find the multi-player interesting in the same way as I do the new Total War series multiplayer... It's cute, and would of been a "nice to have" addition, to a single player game with a coherent A.I.

Yes you can play single player, but much like the previous Sim City (not counting societies which is garbage), there is no discernible difficulty in such a project. This means that there are very optimized paths to "victory" if you want to call it that.

In that, there is little in the way of challenge/accomplishment contrast, which makes it a little boring as a composition. Maybe if you played with all assholes there could be some challenge? Unfortunately, like yourself, not really in a position to sit around and work out when me and mine are going to "raid" Sim City.

Essentially in that scenario one would imagine some sort of population or cash cap for teams... or something to give a "win" state, and provide some game tension... and I didn't see that (or think that is even possible outside of a server wide meta competition as with a lot of micro trans games).

Ultimately I am a little confused as to who this game is actually for. It is a little too casual, a little too "online", a little too "friendly", to meet my "game hobby" needs.

It comes off as a paint brush tool-set which is time gated to a "money" stat. Like I said, it is a very friendly game, everything about it smacks of a friendliness, for me it crosses a line between "user friendly", and "Mr. Rodgers".

For what it is worth... I would buy it once they slash the price, but that is a concern simply because EA could just as well turn off the servers... and you are buying nothing.

Shrug... pass for me.
 

Akisa

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Cyfu said:
I've watched a few videos of it and it looks really good and fun. I love games like that.
One thing I hate with it is the always online DRM. I really want the game, but I don't want to support that crap DRM.


What do you think I should do?


And do you think that if SimCity sells well, do you think that DRM like that will be more regular?

EDIT: And I haven't tried Origin yet, but I've heard nothing good about it. Honestly, How bad is it?
I would say no, don't reward anti consumer DRM.
 

Vetta E-dom

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Akisa said:
Cyfu said:
I've watched a few videos of it and it looks really good and fun. I love games like that.
One thing I hate with it is the always online DRM. I really want the game, but I don't want to support that crap DRM.


What do you think I should do?


And do you think that if SimCity sells well, do you think that DRM like that will be more regular?

EDIT: And I haven't tried Origin yet, but I've heard nothing good about it. Honestly, How bad is it?
I would say no, don't reward anti consumer DRM.
Would you mind describing to me how this is Anti Consumer DRM? I have yet to see how this falls under those lines, but would like to know more?
 

Don Incognito

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Gabe Yaden said:
Would you mind describing to me how this is Anti Consumer DRM? I have yet to see how this falls under those lines, but would like to know more?
Not everyone has reliable broadband internet service.

You are unable to save/reload your game, as it is all done "in the cloud".

Many consumers do not want to rely on others when playing a single-player game.


That's a start.
 

Rachmaninov

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BloatedGuppy said:
Rachmaninov said:
...and the DRM simply cannot be stated enough times.
I'm going to have to disagree. I've heard more about DRM this year than every human rights atrocity combined. There is a point at which the volume of the whining becomes patently absurd, and we soared past it many, many threads ago.
And I welcome the whining to continue, until people like EA stop trying to grind the industry into dust with their incompetence.

You've heard it all already. You know it doesn't fix anything. You know it only punishes the paying customers.

So it has to stop. I'm sorry that you're frustrated with people trying to stand up for themselves.

BloatedGuppy said:
Rachmaninov said:
If I made a thread asking "I know World of Warcraft is an MMO, but I'd like to know what people think in spite of that" and you told me "The fact that it's an MMO ruins it." you'd be answering my question legitimately.
No, I wouldn't. It would be me hijacking a thread with a familiar game title in it so I could promote my agenda.
So, if I say "I dislike X, but is the game good anyway?" and you say "No, X ruins it" that's you hijacking the thread to promote your agenda?

Looks like answering the question to me. Oh, well.
 

Rattja

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FFP2 said:
This video pretty much sums it up:
Hold up, hold up, wait just one moment... Let me get this straight.
Is what this guy saying true? You can't alter the terrain AND you can't load/use/make backupsaves? And you only have 10 in total!?
WHAT
THE
FUCK!?

DRM and all other shit aside, that is just wrong...

SimCity may be the games I played the most up through the years, hooked since 2000, so when I heard a new one would come I was kinda interested. However this just sounds worse and worse the more I hear.

Say if I build a larg... oh right I can't, a city, and I get frustrated with it. I can't then just nuke the damn thing or put a volcano in the middle to blow off some steam, and then reload?

I want to buy and own games to play on my own terms when I want to, not rent server space and leave everything in the hands of someone that just don't give two shits about me, and can fuck me over at any time.

Can we please stop this now? Please?
 

Rachmaninov

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Gabe Yaden said:
Would you mind describing to me how this is Anti Consumer DRM? I have yet to see how this falls under those lines, but would like to know more?
To add to the other guy's list;

You have to rely on EA's servers, which are unreliable.

You have to queue if your "server is full".

You will have to stop playing if they restart the servers.

If they ever turn the servers off, your game is a brick.

-----

And all that, when pirates will just crack the game so it thinks it's logged on when it isn't. Or perhaps even manage to connect to the EA servers through some trickery.

DRM only punishes the consumer. No one else.
 

BloatedGuppy

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Rachmaninov said:
And I welcome the whining to continue, until people like EA stop trying to grind the industry into dust with their incompetence.

You've heard it all already. You know it doesn't fix anything. You know it only punishes the paying customers.

So it has to stop. I'm sorry that you're frustrated with people trying to stand up for themselves.
No, I'm frustrated with hyperbolists who equate their irritation with online DRM to the last proud man's stand against corporate tyranny. I'm frustrated with the complete and utter lack of even a semblance of objectivity, just flat out bandwagon jumping and mob mentality. I'm frustrated that normally rational people support this, because "hey...it doesn't matter if people are being objective and irrational, so long as it supports my position". I've seen the battle against online DRM likened to Rosa Parks and to the Holocaust. I've heard it called "this generation's war". I've seen advocates against it liken themselves to revolutionaries. DRM offends you? That's great. Stupid offends me.

BloatedGuppy said:
So, if I say "I dislike X, but is the game good anyway?" and you say "No, X ruins it" that's you hijacking the thread to promote your agenda?
Without playing the game? With nothing more than a screenshot and a jibe? Yep.
 

Vetta E-dom

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Don Incognito said:
Gabe Yaden said:
Would you mind describing to me how this is Anti Consumer DRM? I have yet to see how this falls under those lines, but would like to know more?
Not everyone has reliable broadband internet service.

You are unable to save/reload your game, as it is all done "in the cloud".

Many consumers do not want to rely on others when playing a single-player game.


That's a start.
"Not everyone has reliable broadband internet service", Ok well its an online game,...So if someone doesn't have reliable internet- why would they buy the game?

You are unable to save/reload your game, as it is all done "in the cloud". Well that dose not sound great, slightly bad call but on the other hand... Its an online game... to play it you would be online anyway... I mean yeah the cloud could go down that sucks.

"Many consumers do not want to rely on others when playing a single-player game", well then dont, Play single player... you are not required to play with other people.