So... My sister is marrying a traveller

[Tanakh]

So gypsies are allowed to be racist against everybody else, but it's pointing this out that is "discrimination".

Cool.

Ahh, discrimination is born out of prejudice, almost every european state has tried to erase romani people for at the very least 500 years now.

After half a freaking millennium of having payos trying to erase your culture and traditions in the best case and mass murdering in the worst, it would be stupid to trust them.

I am not saying that non gipsies should trust them, it would be very stupid of them to do if you know a little of their traditions and culture. I am just trying to say, on one side you have some grass destroyed for a while, on the other you have genocides against your people for five centuries; it's not in the same ballpark, not the same game, its not even in the same planet.

Anyway, I am a payo, and all I am saying is both sides have reasons to be distrustful on a first meeting basis, but theirs are soooooooo much better.

 

[vortexgods]

As an American who has no idea about the whole Gypsie thing, this thread seems very inflammatory. We've had tons of threads about people hating on prejudiced groups, and now we have this thread that says that all Gypsies are sexist and steal to live.

This reminds me of comments that people make about Mexicans here in the US.

I'm sure you have very good reasons to say these things, but maybe you shouldn't make it seem so unfairly prejudiced.

That's what I'm saying. I mean, here if we say black people and mexicans are all drug sellers and gang members, we instantly sound like prejudiced idiots. But this gypsy hate seems real normal.

Gypsies are not a minority like black people or Mexicans in that they genuinely have a different way of life. Which would be fine, if their intersections with other people's ways of life involved more respect and desire for peaceful coexistence on their part. Frequently though, they don't give a shit at best and are at worst seriously hostile.

Also, note that nearly everybody in this thread with a bad word to say about travellers is talking from experience. Ignoring facts in the name of tolerance just denigrates tolerance more than anything else.

Look, I love Mexicans but they definitely have a different way of life. I mean, they even have their own language.

 

[Seventh Actuality]

How I feel about gypsies, hmm, not in a good light.

My dad hired one to patch up a hole in the roof, my dad gives him half the money at the start and was planning to give him half when he finished, my dad goes inside so they can get working on the roof, they just leave taking the money.

At my primary school gypsies tended to go there for a few months then away then a few more months, they wouldn't be very clean yet when I seen them get into their parents cars they had nice fancy cars, are they just too lazy to wash themselves?

I know this isn't true for all of them but this is my experience with them.

Now subsitute "gay" or "black" for "gypsies" above and you will see how racist that story is. While you claim not to be susing that small number as a reflection as a whole, you clearly are.

Not how it works. Travellers are a culture, not a race, and it's not a "small number" reflecting the whole.

I love how all of the shocked and sympathetic posts in this thread come from people who have nothing to base their opinion on beyond The Hunchback of Notre Dame.

 

[JediMB]

Dear god, tell me I didn't read that right. That may be a PC term for them, but it's a term made up by ignorant foreigners (I don't mean you) who don't know jack about anything.
Allow me to explain. Do you know what Romanians call themselves in their language? Romani. Now, why is this term used to describe the Gypsies, a community of people who originally came from India, and are currently spread out all over Europe? That's absurd. That would be like if all the Jews were called Deutsch, simply because they were somewhat more numerous in Germany at one point in time.

Sorry for the rant, just had to get that out there.

I haven't exactly made any research on the subject, but I've been told they consider the word "gypsy" (and the equivalent in my language) derogatory, so we call them "Romer", while people from Romania are called "Rumäner" here.

Reminds me of how English doesn't distinguish Indians (from India) and Indians (as in Native Americans), while we in Sweden refer to them as "Indier" and "Indianer".

 

[Images]

Hmmm, I'm a brit/kraut grew up in Hong Kong and was very keen on beating the drum for civility but when here in Europe my experiences with gypsies have never been great...

On one of our regular family holidays in France they stole our clothes pegs...then tried to sell them back to us the next day. Don't think they realised the strangeness of the Chinese brand in both shape and lettering might be a tip off.

Here in Birmingham they moved into the local park, making a complete mess of poo, cans and plastic bags, let violent dogs run around scaring the crap out of local kids and shoplifted from the cornershop.

The most recent time when a traveller fairground came to the same park, the same day they showed up all my clothes disappeared from the washing line, save for one grotty T-shirt I found in a bush on the road leading towards the park. Everything else nicked was brand new, guess they didn't want my lazy day T. Friends who lived near by also said random stuff outside their houses went missing the same day as if they'd just done a sweep of the area.

I still want to be civil but frankly now, they give me the heebie jeebies. And also I do get rather pissed off that they dodge all the fees and taxes I have to pay. I just realised though, with TV going digital nationwide, isn't it going to be a lot harder to cheat the TV license fee?

 

[Tanakh]

Look, not all of them are bad, and it took my sisters fiancée to make me see that. He is a great guy, and he loves and respects my sister a lot.

Damn you for making me look for your posts in the thread. Anyway, for what i can gather, your sister is marrying a great guy and we are happy about it, and that the thread, right?

 

[lokun489]

Stop being racist, Gypsy is a racist term, Romani is correct.

 

[Seventh Actuality]

So gypsies are allowed to be racist against everybody else, but it's pointing this out that is "discrimination".

Cool.

Ahh, discrimination is born out of prejudice, almost every european state has tried to erase romani people for at the very least 500 years now.

After half a freaking millennium of having payos trying to erase your culture and traditions in the best case and mass murdering in the worst, it would be stupid to trust them.

I am not saying that non gipsies should trust them, it would be very stupid of them to do if you know a little of their traditions and culture. I am just trying to say, on one side you have some grass destroyed for a while, on the other you have genocides against your people for five centuries; it's not in the same ballpark, not the same game, its not even in the same planet.

Anyway, I am a payo, and all I am saying is both sides have reasons to be distrustful on a first meeting basis, but theirs are soooooooo much better.

You do know travellers =/= Romani, right?

Although that would be total bullshit either way. Trying being on the recieving end of robbery or assault and still giving a shit about history. Nothing justifies violence against innocent people.

 

[vortexgods]

This is starting to make more sense now. When I think "Gypsie" I always think of some people in the countryside having no contact with people, and it becomes kind of shocking when you suddenly hear so many negative things about them.

I understand it more now, though. Americans don't get information like this very often, being thousands of miles away from Europe.

We have Gypsies in the United States, my Dad was a cop in New Jersey and Gypsy organized crime was occasionally a problem, though I got the impression it was strictly amateur night compared to La Cosa Nostra or some of the recently arrived Cuban gangsters (Mariel boatlift). They were really scary, while the Gypsies were more irritating. Not that if you got ripped off by a Gypsy you felt good about it, but it was better than the Mafia running your business into the ground.

Of course, if someone in America were to try to smear all Cubans and Italians as being gangsters, just because some are, it wouldn't go over well.

[Edit]

Hmm... didn't realize Gypsy was considered offensive, well, I meant no offense, but I won't Orwell my post, since that's the term my Dad used in his cop stories.

 

[Jenitals]

My experience of Gypsies stems mainly from the local folk festival (I live in a very rural area -.-' ) and the campers that come through perform folk music, put up a circus and little marcees. Some of the money earned goes to charity.

So yeah, I didn't have to get quite as close as you did to learn that gypsies aren't all that bad, at least not in my experience.

Anyway, your sister.

As the mother of her child, she'll want what's best for her. I'm sure she'd take into consideration all the aspects of her lifestyle that she can think of that might affect her child. It's almost certain she'll be just as, probably even more worried than you are for her child or at least has been.

Be supportive of her decisions and offer advice that covers your concerns,voice them as much as possible but don't be too persistent or you'll just upset her. That's about all you can do short of being a third parent.

 

[The Random One]

While there are many who see a lot wrong with it, I personally think your sister married a perfectly fine 90's role playing system.
But seriously folks...

Don't fret about it. There will always be some people who do something mainstream society considers 'weird' and unfortunately children can't really choose where to be born, so they have to put up with whatever their parents have for them. You said yourself the community is strong, and I think that is enough to outset any problems your niece would have from being considered an 'outcast'. She might be better off than many other people.

 

[Staskala]

I haven't exactly made any research on the subject, but I've been told they consider the word "gypsy" (and the equivalent in my language) derogatory, so we call them "Romer", while people from Romania are called "Rumäner" here.

Reminds me of how English doesn't distinguish Indians (from India) and Indians (as in Native Americans), while we in Sweden refer to them as "Indier" and "Indianer".

Doesn't Swedish use a word similar to Zigeuner/Zingari?
Because it has a somewhat different background than the English gypsy, which isn't considered derogatory (or at least not to the same extent).
Zi-whatever is/was mostly used by continental European countries and is generally not considered PC because - you guessed it - the Nazis also used it.

That's at least what I heard, I'm not exactly an expert on the matter.

 

[DanielBrown]

I haven't exactly made any research on the subject, but I've been told they consider the word "gypsy" (and the equivalent in my language) derogatory, so we call them "Romer", while people from Romania are called "Rumäner" here.

Reminds me of how English doesn't distinguish Indians (from India) and Indians (as in Native Americans), while we in Sweden refer to them as "Indier" and "Indianer".

Doesn't Swedish use a word similar to Zigeuner/Zingari?
Because it has a different background than the English gypsy, which isn't considered derogatory (or at least not to the same extent).
Zi-whatever is/was mostly used by central European countries and is generally not considered PC because - you guessed it - the Nazis also used it.

Zigenare is the Swedish word for gypsy.
Fillertextfillertext!

 

[Jazoni89]

While there are many who see a lot wrong with it, I personally think your sister married a perfectly fine 90's role playing system.
But seriously folks...

Don't fret about it. There will always be some people who do something mainstream society considers 'weird' and unfortunately children can't really choose where to be born, so they have to put up with whatever their parents have for them. You said yourself the community is strong, and I think that is enough to outset any problems your niece would have from being considered an 'outcast'. She might be better off than many other people.

Thank you very much!

After a couple of pages of gypsy bashing, it's great to have a positive poster.

 

[PeePantz]

This thread has reached absurd levels with people crying racism. We're not talking about races here, just individuals who lead a certain lifestyle. Usually this lifestyle is kept up due to crime. Therefor, we are talking about criminals, not certain races.

To all Americans who don't understand this (I'm American by the way), it's more like how do you feel about carnie folk. Carnies (people who travel with a carnival) tend to be among a group riddled by crime, drugs, and traveling. This is nowhere near the same as interchanging it with "Mexicans".

OT: From my experience (yes, I've encountered gypsies in America), I'm not a fan. Small groups of children have come into my work before trying to run scams and steal from those who were unsuspecting, all whilst their parents were waiting outside.

 

[winter2]

wuth? Traveler?

* reads through OP *

AAH! Gypsies! Why didn't you just say that..

Well.. so they are still around? Didn't know that.. well.. carry on I guess!

* hides silverware *

 

[Kanatatsu]

I had no idea this "traveller" and "gypsy" business was a real thing. Weird.

 

[joshthor]

what the shit? there really are gypsies? ive never seen one. that seems like the lamest predudice ever tho.

 

[Spitfire]

Dear god, tell me I didn't read that right. That may be a PC term for them, but it's a term made up by ignorant foreigners (I don't mean you) who don't know jack about anything.
Allow me to explain. Do you know what Romanians call themselves in their language? Romani. Now, why is this term used to describe the Gypsies, a community of people who originally came from India, and are currently spread out all over Europe? That's absurd. That would be like if all the Jews were called Deutsch, simply because they were somewhat more numerous in Germany at one point in time.

I find your example ill informed and a bit funny. We were originally known as "hebrews" or "israelites". We are now called Jews because the majority of us for a long time lived in Judea. Jews is just a English mangling of Judea that happened over the centuries.

So we are in fact known by the name of where we were numerous for a long time

That's different. Judea was inhabited by the Jews, and wasn't a foreign state for them. For the Gypsies to be called Romani, however, makes no sense, as they're not natives of Romania.

Dear god, tell me I didn't read that right. That may be a PC term for them, but it's a term made up by ignorant foreigners (I don't mean you) who don't know jack about anything.
Allow me to explain. Do you know what Romanians call themselves in their language? Romani. Now, why is this term used to describe the Gypsies, a community of people who originally came from India, and are currently spread out all over Europe? That's absurd. That would be like if all the Jews were called Deutsch, simply because they were somewhat more numerous in Germany at one point in time.

Sorry for the rant, just had to get that out there.

I haven't exactly made any research on the subject, but I've been told they consider the word "gypsy" (and the equivalent in my language) derogatory, so we call them "Romer", while people from Romania are called "Rumäner" here.

Reminds me of how English doesn't distinguish Indians (from India) and Indians (as in Native Americans), while we in Sweden refer to them as "Indier" and "Indianer".

I don't disagree that the term "Gypsy" is derogatory, I just think that they shouldn't be named after a nationality that they don't belong to.