So the Netherland is banning foreigners from buying weed.

[Coraxian]

I'm Dutch, so let me explain. We have immense amounts of trouble with the "drugstourism" each year. Seriously, these people are responsible for like 20 percent of all petty crimes in Holland. We have nothing against the drug itself, but the kind of people that come to our country in order to obtain it, are often not the most savory sort of individuals. We believe that if we make sure foreigners won't be able to obtain weed in our country, we'll have less of these idiots breaking shop windows and mugging people. Also, the European Union has been pressuring us to ban the drug completely, because people are importing it from the Netherlands to country's where weed is illigal. So we met them halfway by saying that we would'nt sell to foreigners anymore.

Ps. Please excuse my poor English, as earlier stated I am not a native speaker.

I can understand the whole pressure of the E.U. thing, but I know plenty of people who go to coffee shops in the southern provinces of the Netherlands to buy (obtain is a bit to broad a term for this) weed. The only "trouble" these guys cause is taking up parking space, since they go in, buy what they want and then drive back home. That's a problem any "shopping city" has.

I doubt that the people currently breaking shop windows and mugging people will be dissuaded to obtain (in this case a valid term) weed in the Netherlands when the market will still be packed with it.

 

[KingofallCosmos]

Yeah a lot of politicians in Holland want to turn it back. As far as I know, it's the towns near the border experimenting with this, and Amsterdam is considering it, but there's a lot of resistence. For now, your trip to Amsterdam will be unaffected.

My prediction is there'll be a lot of those lil' dutch new rules before the next goverment decides to blow the whole thing off.

 

[Trolldor]

Good on 'em

If you're only going for the weed you can fuck right off.

 

[TheHecatomb]

As a Dutchy I'm glad to hear this. I've had just about enough of all the uninformed and careless junkies who invade my city to desperately score some pot, only to go into some rampage because they've been completely overwhelmed by it's potency. Just the fact that there's hardly 20 replies in here and several individuals have already announced to reconsider their holiday plans makes me glad for this new policy. If you plan your holiday somewhere just so you can use drugs you have issues and I do not want you in my country.

 

[bjj hero]

I don't really care, although I can see why they are changing the law. There is sound logic behind it. Let the Dutch pass what ever laws they choose. If I go to the Netherlands it will be to train kickboxing and MMA. Those boys take it seriously.

It may stop the Netherlands being a Mecca for many of the UK's wasters.

 

[Crazy_Dude]

Yeah a lot of politicians in Holland want to turn it back. As far as I know, it's the towns near the border experimenting with this, and Amsterdam is considering it, but there's a lot of resistence. For now, your trip to Amsterdam will be unaffected.

My prediction is there'll be a lot of those lil' dutch new rules before the next goverment decides to blow the whole thing off.

Some of the new rules are already taking place.

You are usually allowed to buy a max of 5 gram of weed at a time. At some local coffeeshops they have turned it down to 3. Though I dont see that having any impact on the useage. You just have to go more often.

No new coffeeshops are allowed to open at any given time. So if the owner of a shop dies the shop gets closed down. There are some loopholes in this. (A father made his 5 year old the owner of the shop so it could stay open after he is gone) But still this whole area is still "grey". I rather have them just legalize it fully instead of making up these stupid rules.

 

[MrGalactus]

Isn't this a massive, massive threat to tourism in the Netherlands?
There's no way....

I just don't get it. What is the advantage of illegalising it? Tourism will go down, crime will rise, and it won't stop anyone from getting it.

Colour me confused.

I'm Dutch, so let me explain. We have immense amounts of trouble with the "drugstourism" each year. Seriously, these people are responsible for like 20 percent of all petty crimes in Holland. We have nothing against the drug itself, but the kind of people that come to our country in order to obtain it, are often not the most savory sort of individuals. We believe that if we make sure foreigners won't be able to obtain weed in our country, we'll have less of these idiots breaking shop windows and mugging people. Also, the European Union has been pressuring us to ban the drug completely, because people are importing it from the Netherlands to country's where weed is illigal. So we met them halfway by saying that we would'nt sell to foreigners anymore.

Ps. Please excuse my poor English, as earlier stated I am not a native speaker.

No, no, your English is perfectly understandable!

Would not the problem be solved by say, legalising it everywhere?
Holland doesn't have to deal with idiots wrecking their country.
We have a new economy boosting industry.
People might learn to chill out.
The Netherlands wont be famous for being the liberal ones anymore, so people might look at it and realise there's a lot more to the place than what it's known for.

This makes sense.
Quickly, alert the authorities! Bring in the Krypteia!

um..?
Isn't that the regime by which Spartan warriors used to train? Or something.

Confused again.

 

[Neonit]

what that means is, all the dealers will move to the streets. because thats safer. i do not understand my goverment. tbh i think someone received a big bribe or its just another big "prestige project".

 

[DefunctTheory]

I find this law weird, but find everyone who's actually planning to fly across the world to get higher even more so.

And, no offense to the Dutch here, legalizing weed is about as far away from 'enlightenment' as legalizing prostitution: both pretty good ideas, but by no means enlightening.

...

Unless you're talking about that thing where you get so stoned everything looks like a rainbow. I guess that's enlightening in a sense.

 

[kayisking]

I'm Dutch, so let me explain. We have immense amounts of trouble with the "drugstourism" each year. Seriously, these people are responsible for like 20 percent of all petty crimes in Holland. We have nothing against the drug itself, but the kind of people that come to our country in order to obtain it, are often not the most savory sort of individuals. We believe that if we make sure foreigners won't be able to obtain weed in our country, we'll have less of these idiots breaking shop windows and mugging people. Also, the European Union has been pressuring us to ban the drug completely, because people are importing it from the Netherlands to country's where weed is illigal. So we met them halfway by saying that we would'nt sell to foreigners anymore.

Ps. Please excuse my poor English, as earlier stated I am not a native speaker.

I can understand the whole pressure of the E.U. thing, but I know plenty of people who go to coffee shops in the southern provinces of the Netherlands to buy (obtain is a bit to broad a term for this) weed. The only "trouble" these guys cause is taking up parking space, since they go in, buy what they want and then drive back home. That's a problem any "shopping city" has.

I doubt that the people currently breaking shop windows and mugging people will be dissuaded to obtain (in this case a valid term) weed in the Netherlands when the market will still be packed with it.

I have no doubt you are right, but trust me when I say that they are only part of the group that comes here. Even though the trouble makers are a minority, they still give cause us a pretty big hassle. I did not mean to insult all foreign weed-users.

 

[raankh]

Well, it isn't technically legal for anyone to buy weed in the Netherlands, they signed the UN resolution in '61, banning cannabis, after all.

I'm Dutch, so let me explain. We have immense amounts of trouble with the "drugstourism" each year. Seriously, these people are responsible for like 20 percent of all petty crimes in Holland. We have nothing against the drug itself, but the kind of people that come to our country in order to obtain it, are often not the most savory sort of individuals. We believe that if we make sure foreigners won't be able to obtain weed in our country, we'll have less of these idiots breaking shop windows and mugging people. Also, the European Union has been pressuring us to ban the drug completely, because people are importing it from the Netherlands to country's where weed is illigal. So we met them halfway by saying that we would'nt sell to foreigners anymore.

Ps. Please excuse my poor English, as earlier stated I am not a native speaker.

I do sympathise with the sentiment to get rid of drugtourism-- that must be a real pain to put up with, but for me as a European, the issue of Netherland being liberal is more important than cannabis. I do realise it's an image; in fact most Dutch I've met are pretty conservative, but as a bastion of freedom the Netherlands has a very important symbolic value to the rest of us. Not on a political level, I mean on an individual level; for the citizens of the European countries it is important to feel that there is somewhere that freedom can be had.

It's perhaps an outdated view, and probably incorrect in so many ways, but if the thought-police show up, at least you can flee to the Netherlands where free-thinkers are accepted. Perhaps promoting other liberal (in the non-economic sense!) ideals could shift the focus from cannabis to why the Netherlands has that relaxed stance in the first place; that of collective responsibility and freedom.

Also, the claims that the Netherlands export lots of weed is bogus-- propaganda from the absolutists in Brussels. From what I've read in British (and other) journals of criminology, most European states are now (21st century) self-sustaining when it comes to cannabis. The British Journal of Criminolgy even stated that the U.K is the largest producer of (illegal) cannabis in Europe. I would be guessing that's in fact Germany, though, seing as they are the most populous and have grow shops in lots and lots of places.

 

[kayisking]

Well, it isn't technically legal for anyone to buy weed in the Netherlands, they signed the UN resolution in '61, banning cannabis, after all.

I'm Dutch, so let me explain. We have immense amounts of trouble with the "drugstourism" each year. Seriously, these people are responsible for like 20 percent of all petty crimes in Holland. We have nothing against the drug itself, but the kind of people that come to our country in order to obtain it, are often not the most savory sort of individuals. We believe that if we make sure foreigners won't be able to obtain weed in our country, we'll have less of these idiots breaking shop windows and mugging people. Also, the European Union has been pressuring us to ban the drug completely, because people are importing it from the Netherlands to country's where weed is illigal. So we met them halfway by saying that we would'nt sell to foreigners anymore.

Ps. Please excuse my poor English, as earlier stated I am not a native speaker.

I do sympathise with the sentiment to get rid of drugtourism-- that must be a real pain to put up with, but for me as a European, the issue of Netherland being liberal is more important than cannabis. I do realise it's an image; in fact most Dutch I've met are pretty conservative, but as a bastion of freedom the Netherlands has a very important symbolic value to the rest of us. Not on a political level, I mean on an individual level; for the citizens of the European countries it is important to feel that there is somewhere that freedom can be had.

It's perhaps an outdated view, and probably incorrect in so many ways, but if the thought-police show up, at least you can flee to the Netherlands where free-thinkers are accepted. Perhaps promoting other liberal (in the non-economic sense!) ideals could shift the focus from cannabis to why the Netherlands has that relaxed stance in the first place; that of collective responsibility and freedom.

Also, the claims that the Netherlands export lots of weed is bogus-- propaganda from the absolutists in Brussels. From what I've read in British (and other) journals of criminology, most European states are now (21st century) self-sustaining when it comes to cannabis. The British Journal of Criminolgy even stated that the U.K is the largest producer of (illegal) cannabis in Europe. I would be guessing that's in fact Germany, though, seing as they are the most populous and have grow shops in lots and lots of places.

So we can't be liberal while still banning canabis to outsiders?

 

[Cowabungaa]

And, no offense to the Dutch here, legalizing weed is about as far away from 'enlightenment' as legalizing prostitution: both pretty good ideas, but by no means enlightening.

Personal freedom is though, so is not forcing your own morals (as our country is being led by conversative christians) on other people.

Mind you, I'm staying far away from both.

 

[Verlander]

I'd probably go to a different country that has decriminalised it. Like Spain

 

[raankh]

So we can't be liberal while still banning canabis to outsiders?

In the sense that it's important to us other Europeans as a bastion of freedom and that liberalism has its foundation in the equal rights of all people, no. But again, I'm not talking specifically about cannabis here, although that has become the primary thing that the Netherlands' liberalism is, I guess. I'm wishing that it would be a debate about other things than weed and whores.

I didn't see anything of drug-tourists when I visited Noordwijk or Utrecht, so I'm wondering if it's more of a problem in Amsterdam, maybe Rotterdam too?

I'd say getting rid of the Red Light district in Amsterdam would be the best place to start. I've never visited the Netherlands as a drug-tourist, and I haven't actually been to Amsterdam, so that's perhaps unjustified, but it seems to me that is the core of the drug-tourism problem?

 

[DefunctTheory]

And, no offense to the Dutch here, legalizing weed is about as far away from 'enlightenment' as legalizing prostitution: both pretty good ideas, but by no means enlightening.

Personal freedom is though, so is not forcing your own morals (as our country is being led by conversative christians) on other people.

Mind you, I'm staying far away from both.

Drug legislation has little to do with morals, and more to do with public safety. Things like heroin and meth NEED to be illegal, because the people on them frequently endanger those around them.

Weeds merely was swept up into a pretty nasty group a long time ago, and being punished by association.

But I get your point.

EDIT: And I think the only reason prostitution is still illegal is not because of our political leaders morals (Obviously, as it seems a great deal of them use hookers), but the peoples morals. And since a government should reflect its citizenry, well... sorry.

 

[Kair]

Isn't this a massive, massive threat to tourism in the Netherlands?
There's no way....

I just don't get it. What is the advantage of illegalising it? Tourism will go down, crime will rise, and it won't stop anyone from getting it.

Colour me confused.

I'm Dutch, so let me explain. We have immense amounts of trouble with the "drugstourism" each year. Seriously, these people are responsible for like 20 percent of all petty crimes in Holland. We have nothing against the drug itself, but the kind of people that come to our country in order to obtain it, are often not the most savory sort of individuals. We believe that if we make sure foreigners won't be able to obtain weed in our country, we'll have less of these idiots breaking shop windows and mugging people. Also, the European Union has been pressuring us to ban the drug completely, because people are importing it from the Netherlands to country's where weed is illigal. So we met them halfway by saying that we would'nt sell to foreigners anymore.

Ps. Please excuse my poor English, as earlier stated I am not a native speaker.

No, no, your English is perfectly understandable!

Would not the problem be solved by say, legalising it everywhere?
Holland doesn't have to deal with idiots wrecking their country.
We have a new economy boosting industry.
People might learn to chill out.
The Netherlands wont be famous for being the liberal ones anymore, so people might look at it and realise there's a lot more to the place than what it's known for.

This makes sense.
Quickly, alert the authorities! Bring in the Krypteia!

um..?
Isn't that the regime by which Spartan warriors used to train? Or something.

Confused again.

The Krypteia was the Spartan secret police who assassinated helots at will to suppress the helot slave population. For an example if a helot had an idea for an improvement in agriculture, he would be executed as he was a threat to the established system.

 

[kayisking]

So we can't be liberal while still banning canabis to outsiders?

In the sense that it's important to us other Europeans as a bastion of freedom and that liberalism has its foundation in the equal rights of all people, no. But again, I'm not talking specifically about cannabis here, although that has become the primary thing that the Netherlands' liberalism is, I guess. I'm wishing that it would be a debate about other things than weed and whores.

I didn't see anything of drug-tourists when I visited Noordwijk or Utrecht, so I'm wondering if it's more of a problem in Amsterdam, maybe Rotterdam too?

I'd say getting rid of the Red Light district in Amsterdam would be the best place to start. I've never visited the Netherlands as a drug-tourist, and I haven't actually been to Amsterdam, so that's perhaps unjustified, but it seems to me that is the core of the drug-tourism problem?

Oh no. Seriously, the biggest problems are with the southern provinces, since most of the uhm... plantlovers hail from the south, and they often don't go that far over the border. The red light district isn´t that bad, since instead of banning everything, we just control it (prostitution, gambling, cannabis). But I do not see how having legal pot makes us the bastion of freedom. Believe me, I have nothing against pot but the foreigners are just too much of a hassle, so I support this rule in full. And if you ever need to flee to our beautifull country, you will be a permanent citizen and then you can smoke as much as you want.

 

[Rayne870]

yeah that will pretty much single-handedly kill their tourism