So, what causes a guy to go on a nutty killing spree?
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I don't think insanity has anything to do with it. I think that's just a cop-out for people who don't understand and aren't interested in understanding, and who would like to think that there's some fundamental defect that makes other people capable of murder, but not them.
My guess is that if a person is depressed enough to commit suicide but also angry and vindictive enough, they'll decide there's no reason they're the only one who should die. Since this person has now decided to take their own life as well as the lives of others, it's also not hard to imagine such a person paying little or no attention to who the victims are; they're figuring that there will either be no punishment in death or they're already in for a pretty nasty afterlife anyway, so there's no reason to hold back.
Lots of people seem to decide that there's no easy way for them to contribute something good to the world, and so try to make their mark or amuse themselves by being assholes, trolls, vandals, thieves, or worse. The destruction caused and the infamy achieved becomes their measure of success. Such is the case, I imagine, with mass shooters (that sounds like such a silly term). So the fake Morgan Freeman quote, which states that the problem is how the media popularizes the shooters, seems partly right.
If you want to prevent this, I don't think you'll be able to do it by attempting to outlaw or restrict the possession of weapons. Weapons are ubiquitous and it is well known that people can take them where they want to, if they only want to badly enough.
These shooters are a symptom of larger problems, often cultural ones, and solving them is not as easy as simply passing reactionary laws. We can do that of course, and I suspect we will, just like the last few times major incidents like this happened. It gives us the impression we have Done Something, but you shouldn't expect it to have any effect on actual shootings.
To be honest, I'm not sure what we can do. However, I'm willing to bet that we could help by teaching our kids that being an asshole to other kids is not a sign of strength, but of social incompetence. I think that we could help by providing support for those who struggle instead of telling them to deal with it. I think that if we had a society where it was evident that hard work was rewarded and corruption punished, fewer people would decide that the only justice in the world is what they take for themselves.
My guess is that if a person is depressed enough to commit suicide but also angry and vindictive enough, they'll decide there's no reason they're the only one who should die. Since this person has now decided to take their own life as well as the lives of others, it's also not hard to imagine such a person paying little or no attention to who the victims are; they're figuring that there will either be no punishment in death or they're already in for a pretty nasty afterlife anyway, so there's no reason to hold back.
Lots of people seem to decide that there's no easy way for them to contribute something good to the world, and so try to make their mark or amuse themselves by being assholes, trolls, vandals, thieves, or worse. The destruction caused and the infamy achieved becomes their measure of success. Such is the case, I imagine, with mass shooters (that sounds like such a silly term). So the fake Morgan Freeman quote, which states that the problem is how the media popularizes the shooters, seems partly right.
If you want to prevent this, I don't think you'll be able to do it by attempting to outlaw or restrict the possession of weapons. Weapons are ubiquitous and it is well known that people can take them where they want to, if they only want to badly enough.
These shooters are a symptom of larger problems, often cultural ones, and solving them is not as easy as simply passing reactionary laws. We can do that of course, and I suspect we will, just like the last few times major incidents like this happened. It gives us the impression we have Done Something, but you shouldn't expect it to have any effect on actual shootings.
To be honest, I'm not sure what we can do. However, I'm willing to bet that we could help by teaching our kids that being an asshole to other kids is not a sign of strength, but of social incompetence. I think that we could help by providing support for those who struggle instead of telling them to deal with it. I think that if we had a society where it was evident that hard work was rewarded and corruption punished, fewer people would decide that the only justice in the world is what they take for themselves.
As a privileged white male, this rings far more true than you would expect. It took me three different tries to convince my family to spend some money and take me to a doctor. Once there he was easily able to find that I was a manic depressant. But before it all happened, I was told to just get over it. Mental illness are things that can go unchecked, but really shouldn't. I do think we as a society do need more systems to help anyone who thinks or appears to have some kind of illness.Vegosiux said:
This is pretty much the answer, as far as I'm aware, and is something that Japan has a MASSIVE problem with.Vegosiux said:
No, they don't have mass-murderers, because their culture focuses on honor more than anything else, but they have something nearly as bad instead: An absolutely insane rate of suicide.
There is, last I heard of, a whopping ONE psychiatrist in all of Japan, a foreigner at that. Mental illness basically isn't recognized at all in that country, and when a (usually male) student snaps under pressure, most families just let him lock himself in his room and pretend he doesn't exist.
So, naturally, many of these now-failures kill themselves for disgracing their families, yet they don't go on shooting/slashing/driving sprees, likely because they don't wish to disgrace their families any further. The vast majority of gun deaths in that country are suicides.
It's all subjective to us who realize it, but to everyone who goes by society's definition of crazy [footnote]This is what I hate a lot, people thinking that their definition and outlook on things I always right.[/footnote], they have to rationalize, however horribly they do it.Vegosiux said:
It's times and events like these that I thank myself for being a nonconformist.
OT- People will always find things to blame instead of themselves. It's a sad truth, but that's what it is OP.
As far as Adam Lanza goes, he was as they usually describe them, shy but polite, quiet, and very intelligent. However he would have these 'withdrawals from reality' during class. As far as the information we have goes, he'd close down during class and it was nearly impossible to break through his barrier. His mother apparently 'battled the school-board' and for some reason blamed the school for treating her son differently instead of trying to figure out why he had these withdrawls. However, we don't even really know what went on in that house, or if she was as 'fantastic' a mother as every one wants us to believe; since apparently she didn't ever give out much information about her home-life, even though people seem to know a lot about her bar-frequenting, practice shooting, and being very 'well-to-do', or rich and 'being a brave woman to put up with her son'. I've known Mother's as sweet as honey in public and they end up being monsters at home. Or maybe she was great and he was growing worse and uncontrollable. We don't know.
Usually there is something that just overloads that persons already tired yet warped mental state and they break with reality. It just explodes in the worst way and everyone suffers. I think more parents should be aware of their children's behavior and have them evaluated (if they can afford it through just being well-to-do or insurance) if something isn't right, instead of trying to pretend their child is "normal", or be 'ashamed' that their child is 'crazy' and just removing them from people's view. That attitude helps no one. But I also believe we need a better mental health system in place for those parents who know their child needs help, but can't afford do to anything about it. It's a sad state of affairs and is just asking for more tragedy.
Usually there is something that just overloads that persons already tired yet warped mental state and they break with reality. It just explodes in the worst way and everyone suffers. I think more parents should be aware of their children's behavior and have them evaluated (if they can afford it through just being well-to-do or insurance) if something isn't right, instead of trying to pretend their child is "normal", or be 'ashamed' that their child is 'crazy' and just removing them from people's view. That attitude helps no one. But I also believe we need a better mental health system in place for those parents who know their child needs help, but can't afford do to anything about it. It's a sad state of affairs and is just asking for more tragedy.
Yes, it really is. Mental health issues are vastly stigmatized here in the US, to the point that people are extremely reluctant to even admit they have a problem, let alone seek help for it. And when they do, getting insurance to pay for it is a whole other hurdle. It's disgraceful that this country doesn't consider taking care of your mind to be as important as taking care of your body.SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
Yeah! Those people should be blinded with a laser pointer in a colour of their choice, and be shot![footnote]This is humor. Not a serious suggestion.[/footnote]TizzytheTormentor said:
The guy had had a series of mental breakdowns or something to that effect.
And this is America. Where everyone and their mum gets slapped with a schizophrenia diagnosis. So it's to be expected the severity of the guy's condition was going to be shrugged off as less important than it is.
Now, I'm normally the last to throw out blanket insults at a country, and I'd even like to live in the US one day, but their psychological help system is a damn joke.
A lot of the time it's something that has been going on for a long, long time. Little things that happened that most other people would just brush off and get on with the rest of their day. Then one day they wake up and think "You know what? Fuck it. I've had enough. Today I'll get them all back." and in that state of mind the thought of any repercussions or the consequences of their actions don't register properly, or they don't care, because by that point a lot of them have given up on the world already.
No not really. He seems to be exaggerating. Where I'm from if you want help from your school's guidance councilor you can get it rather easily. Hell, you can visit a priest or preacher, they'll try to help you too.SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
OT: In my opinion though, the problem could lie with the family and I don't mean bad parenting. If your kid has a mental illness what do you do? If he threatens someone do you immediately call the police and have him arrested on the spot? Most parents love their children and I bet if the time comes they couldn't just give their child up or get them the help they need. It's a matter of the parents just being scared.
Its simple, the guy was a nut.
There doesnt need to be a trigger, a nut can just get up one day and decide to go on a killing spree.
I could make that same concious decision one day, but im not that far gone. Yet.
Come to think of it, the worlds supposed to start ending tomorrow, maybe that has something to do with it.
There doesnt need to be a trigger, a nut can just get up one day and decide to go on a killing spree.
I could make that same concious decision one day, but im not that far gone. Yet.
Come to think of it, the worlds supposed to start ending tomorrow, maybe that has something to do with it.
I think that whoever said that there is no one trigger has it dead on. It's not something that we can find a single 'cure' for and eradicate, like smallpox. It's not social or cultural; even guns only make the kill count higher, they don't stop the problem. There was a man in China not a week ago who went on a rampage with a knife in an elementary school. No one was killed, thank God, but there were 23 seriously hurt children. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chenpeng_Village_Primary_School_stabbing if you want the link.
Does there need to be stronger gun control in the US? I think so. But that single action, complex though it may be, won't stop the rampages.
Does there need to be stronger gun control in the US? I think so. But that single action, complex though it may be, won't stop the rampages.
Regarding the recent Lanza killings, he suffered from schizophrenia, his parents had a very bitter divorce, his mother began stockpiling weapons and supplies for the end of the world and she took him to gun ranges to learn how to use guns.
There are interviews with parents terrified of their violent mentally ill children, in cases like Lanza we should be talking about parental support and awareness, not finding something easy to blame like video games, which the NRA will blame during a conference on the 21st.
Last Friday a man in China stabbed 24 or so children, it's barely in the news just thought i'd share...
There are interviews with parents terrified of their violent mentally ill children, in cases like Lanza we should be talking about parental support and awareness, not finding something easy to blame like video games, which the NRA will blame during a conference on the 21st.
Last Friday a man in China stabbed 24 or so children, it's barely in the news just thought i'd share...
Tha't the thing, unless the shooter explain why he/ she did it (like Breivik) we have no idea what motivate a person to go on a killing spree (we can only speculate the cause behind it).
