Sony Patents a Way to Sabotage Used Game Market
- Thread starter Greg Tito
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- Apr 1, 2009
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They have more than a few similar patents and they haven't used them, what people forget is that sony also makes DRM for games, they are the ones responsible for securom, which pc gamers looooooove. I would saw the odds of them using it are rather small, especially for the launch of a new console since that is the most vulnerable time for them to be on the market, but it does seem like something they might use later in its life.Gearhead mk2 said:
Sony may be a corporation, but it's bosses are not complete idiots. I think they realize, that if they will actually use this tech then major part of consumers (if not most of them) will simply drop their support for the system.
But if this really happens, I will never buy PS4. I've been a PS fan since the very first one, but I will not, as a consumer, tolerate such tactics.
The steambox sounds even nicer now.
But if this really happens, I will never buy PS4. I've been a PS fan since the very first one, but I will not, as a consumer, tolerate such tactics.
The steambox sounds even nicer now.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism - that is fascism. What is happening here is, quoting Zaeed Massani, "A goddamn suicide!"Cid SilverWing said:
I fully support Sony's move to patent this on the grounds that I only have an XBox and a patent means that Microsoft can't use this technology against me.
Kidding, of course. If this goes through it'll hurt all of us in the long run. I'd make some comment about dealing with it on PC with Steam already but at least Steam makes up for the inability to sell used by simply selling games for cheap enough that the discount tends to be greater than the money I would've made by selling it back anyways. I somehow doubt Sony (Or third party publishers) will drop prices on new games to make up for the inability to sell used.
Kidding, of course. If this goes through it'll hurt all of us in the long run. I'd make some comment about dealing with it on PC with Steam already but at least Steam makes up for the inability to sell used by simply selling games for cheap enough that the discount tends to be greater than the money I would've made by selling it back anyways. I somehow doubt Sony (Or third party publishers) will drop prices on new games to make up for the inability to sell used.
I always have this to say; WHY THE FUCK SHOULD YOU GET ANYTHING FROM USED SALES?!
If I sell anything else I own, the original creator doesn't expect to get anything at all out of it. I sell my car, that's all my money. I sell my TV, that's all my money. I sell my house, all my money.
In other words, of course you don't get anything from used sales, games industry. No industry does. What makes you so fucking special?
If I sell anything else I own, the original creator doesn't expect to get anything at all out of it. I sell my car, that's all my money. I sell my TV, that's all my money. I sell my house, all my money.
In other words, of course you don't get anything from used sales, games industry. No industry does. What makes you so fucking special?
Movie publishers can sue you if you play music with too many people around, say, in your cafeteria. I think that's on the same level.Nicolaus99 said:
Microsoft already patented a Kinect feature that would block too many strangers from watching the same movie together with you.
The other analogies are faulty, since they are governed by property rights, that are quite a lot more clear-cut than IP rights. It is only the copyright industry that is constantly trying to come up with more and more rights for themselves, while also pretending that it's a matter of protecting "artists' property", so liberalization is out of question.
sooo sony will make sure then every game ever released on that system will be sold all the time. try to find ps3 games that were launch titles will almost always lead you to secondhand games. if they indeed use it i will never ever touch a playstation in my life
Well Sony, you've just gone full on stupid. Seriously this is just greedy on many kinds of levels. Plus their sales would be hurt even more because Gamestop would drop that console like the large brick it would turn out to be. Sony pretty much would kill themselves in the console race to end up actually implementing this, which would be ironic since the number 4 represents death in Japanese culture. Although I don't think Sony would call it the PS4 for that reason. Plus with the new console generation they are most likely gonna drive up the price of new games to like $70 or $80 which is plain outrageous and many people would not spend that much money on a single game. Hell I don't even pay $60 for a new game because I think it's outrageous which is why I buy games used. Not everyone has deep pockets Sony, thought you would've realized this after the launch debacle of the PS3...
It's more a case of this being a profit deal.Cid SilverWing said:
Think of it this way. By preventing borrowed or rented copies from working, they're forcing purchase on us as our one and only means of accessing the PS4 library. This means more PS4 units will get sold, plus more individual game copies. They shaft rental outfits and used games sales, but guarantee that they'll see every cent of every dollar for every purchase ever made for their new console.
They're not Fascists, they're greedy. They need to be if the PS4 follows the same production dynamic the PS3 did. Produce at astronomical costs because you've bloated your hardware capacity, then slice the price down for retail - which doesn't do much, as even the starting retail price was horrendously high.
It's the same reason why backwards compatibility was shelved in console updates. Keeping this feature in costs them money and robs them of any potential capital they might gain from PS3 owners potentially returning to their PS2. Or, better yet, some first-time console owners choose the PS3, then dial back to the PS2 to check out the previous generation's catalog!
They can't charge for an emulator, but they can certainly charge for a full set of hardware. Hence why the PS2 is still being produced, even if this is about to change.
They have patents for every potential technology even if they know they won't use it.
It's the Prisoner's dilemma game theory all over again. For this to happen both Sony and Microsoft would have to collude.
If xbox releases without this new DRM, sony will have to follow suite or they would lose over 50% of sales
If xbox decided to implement the DRM, then sony will not because they know they will nab a crap load of market share..
Unless they both integrate the technology, but they won't use it until half way through the console cycle.....
It's the Prisoner's dilemma game theory all over again. For this to happen both Sony and Microsoft would have to collude.
If xbox releases without this new DRM, sony will have to follow suite or they would lose over 50% of sales
If xbox decided to implement the DRM, then sony will not because they know they will nab a crap load of market share..
Unless they both integrate the technology, but they won't use it until half way through the console cycle.....
I already have little interest in the PS4 due to Sony's prior debacles and their increasingly burdensome policies and procedures attached to the use of their products. Just these past couple of days, a friend of mine could not get a simple bluray player from Sony to operate correctly cause of all the account creation and need to connect to some unknown server that may or may not be available. He took it back and get one from a different vendor which worked instantly. We had been fussing with the Sony player for two days. The other one worked by just plugging it up. If Sony were to actually implement this in their next console, it would only serve to cement my decision to forego purchasing their next console.
Sometimes just cause you can do something doesn't mean you should.
Sometimes just cause you can do something doesn't mean you should.
im just wondering with all this stopping second hand games thing how many people only buy these games knowing that they can play them for a few weeks then sell them back and get some money towards their next game. you take away the ability to get rid of games they dont like they might spend some more time working out if the game is worth their money, so no more impulse buys or getting a game you dont think is worth full price but might be worth it for less, the good games might make it through but if a game bombs then a big ad campaign will only get it so far.
You would have thought publishers and devs alike would have figured it out by now. No money from used sales is because they do sod all to get involved.
GameStop provides shelf space, and a system for buying and selling used. GameStop makes money.
Ford provides forecourt space, and a system for buying and selling used. Ford makes money.
Games companies provide sweet FA, and make no money.
See? I just solved your used games issue and I don't take a six figure salary to do it.
GameStop provides shelf space, and a system for buying and selling used. GameStop makes money.
Ford provides forecourt space, and a system for buying and selling used. Ford makes money.
Games companies provide sweet FA, and make no money.
See? I just solved your used games issue and I don't take a six figure salary to do it.
You guys totally had it coming.
As mods, and indie fan-games are being Cease-and-Desisted, you shrugged and claimed that they had it coming for infringing on the publisher's Property.
As youtube videos are being taken down for using the wrong BGM, you just shrugged and looked for another link, or reuploaded them, as if copyright hindering our everyday life would be just an inevitable force of nature, because listening to that BGM would take away Sony's Property
As multiple artists are begging on Kickstarter so they can make "spiritual successors" to their old genre-defining classics, you just shrugged and accepted that the original classic brands can't be used themselves, because they are all now EA's "Property".
As people are trying to download old abandoned software, or access any game from Albania, or watch an anime series that was never released outside of Japan, you called them thieves for "taking away the Artist's Property", after all it's their choice whether you are allowed to access it.
The answer is not to react with the industry's own "You wouldn't steal a car" bullshit, by claiming that "but we CAN resell a car".
Games are not cars. They are data, concepts, designs, ideas floating around in 0s and 1s. Their original creator has a reasonable interest in somehow profiting from them, their paying audience also have an interest in dealing with them, and the general public also has an interest in accessing them (e.g.: Fair Use, Public Domain).
The answer can't be to pretend that one of these interested parties owns it as "Property", or that the player only owns the physical disc that it is written on, but not the data on the disc.
We need to look at what was the original purpose of copyright, and fix it in a way that the original purpose is guaranteed, while we as interested parties will also end up with enough rights. Not because "it's our property", but because it's no one's property, it's something else.
As mods, and indie fan-games are being Cease-and-Desisted, you shrugged and claimed that they had it coming for infringing on the publisher's Property.
As youtube videos are being taken down for using the wrong BGM, you just shrugged and looked for another link, or reuploaded them, as if copyright hindering our everyday life would be just an inevitable force of nature, because listening to that BGM would take away Sony's Property
As multiple artists are begging on Kickstarter so they can make "spiritual successors" to their old genre-defining classics, you just shrugged and accepted that the original classic brands can't be used themselves, because they are all now EA's "Property".
As people are trying to download old abandoned software, or access any game from Albania, or watch an anime series that was never released outside of Japan, you called them thieves for "taking away the Artist's Property", after all it's their choice whether you are allowed to access it.
Even if that question would have made sense a few decades ago, when every single version of a content existed on a separately printed copy, it doesn't, any more. If you install "your" game on a HDD, you are creating a new copy. If you download a Steam game on a new computer, you are creating a new copy. And if you would truly have a right to make new copies, what would stop you from sharing them with "your friends" on the Internet?Nicolaus99 said:
The answer is not to react with the industry's own "You wouldn't steal a car" bullshit, by claiming that "but we CAN resell a car".
Games are not cars. They are data, concepts, designs, ideas floating around in 0s and 1s. Their original creator has a reasonable interest in somehow profiting from them, their paying audience also have an interest in dealing with them, and the general public also has an interest in accessing them (e.g.: Fair Use, Public Domain).
The answer can't be to pretend that one of these interested parties owns it as "Property", or that the player only owns the physical disc that it is written on, but not the data on the disc.
We need to look at what was the original purpose of copyright, and fix it in a way that the original purpose is guaranteed, while we as interested parties will also end up with enough rights. Not because "it's our property", but because it's no one's property, it's something else.