Square Enix on Low Western FF13 scores

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Internet Kraken

Animalia Mollusca Cephalopada
Mar 18, 2009
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Onyx Oblivion said:
Daystar Clarion said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
Oh look...a JRPG hate thread.


GO GO JRPG DEFENSE RANGERS!
Not again Onyx...please...FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!
Huh, wassat? I'm just taking a stand against baseless JRPG hate around this site...
There's tons of baseless JRPG defense as well. This thread isn't even really about JRPGs, yet you barge in and act like everyone is randomly bashing JRPGs. Before anyone has even made one god damn comment. JRPG defenders are getting to be just as annoying as the bashers. There isn't nearly as much hate for them as you like to think there is.

I apologize if I sound rude, but I just need to vent about this.

On-topic: There is nothing that says that an open world game can not tell a compelling story. However, the problem with the games you listed, as other have pointed out, is that they are not open world or they don't tell a compelling story (seriously, Oblivion was fun but the story was not one of its strengths).
 

Onyx Oblivion

Borderlands Addict. Again.
Sep 9, 2008
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Internet Kraken said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
Daystar Clarion said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
Oh look...a JRPG hate thread.


GO GO JRPG DEFENSE RANGERS!
Not again Onyx...please...FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!
Huh, wassat? I'm just taking a stand against baseless JRPG hate around this site...
There's tons of baseless JRPG defense as well. This thread isn't even really about JRPGs, yet you barge in and act like everyone is randomly bashing JRPGs. Before anyone has even made one god damn comment. JRPG defenders are getting to be just as annoying as the bashers. There isn't nearly as much hate for them as you like to think there is.
Preemptive striking.
 

Internet Kraken

Animalia Mollusca Cephalopada
Mar 18, 2009
6,915
0
0
Onyx Oblivion said:
Internet Kraken said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
Daystar Clarion said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
Oh look...a JRPG hate thread.


GO GO JRPG DEFENSE RANGERS!
Not again Onyx...please...FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!
Huh, wassat? I'm just taking a stand against baseless JRPG hate around this site...
There's tons of baseless JRPG defense as well. This thread isn't even really about JRPGs, yet you barge in and act like everyone is randomly bashing JRPGs. Before anyone has even made one god damn comment. JRPG defenders are getting to be just as annoying as the bashers. There isn't nearly as much hate for them as you like to think there is.
Preemptive striking.
Which is ridiculous. Look at this thread; there is barely any JRPG bashing. You don't need to valiantly defend JRPGs in every thread that might have something to do with them. The JRPG defense is just as absurd as the hate they receive.
 

Arkhangelsk

New member
Mar 1, 2009
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I don't like Western RPG stories. I found Mass Effect and Fallout very bland and boring. Final Fantasy, on the other hand... So I'm inclined to agree with Toriyama.
 

Onyx Oblivion

Borderlands Addict. Again.
Sep 9, 2008
17,032
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Internet Kraken said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
Internet Kraken said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
Daystar Clarion said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
Oh look...a JRPG hate thread.


GO GO JRPG DEFENSE RANGERS!
Not again Onyx...please...FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!
Huh, wassat? I'm just taking a stand against baseless JRPG hate around this site...
There's tons of baseless JRPG defense as well. This thread isn't even really about JRPGs, yet you barge in and act like everyone is randomly bashing JRPGs. Before anyone has even made one god damn comment. JRPG defenders are getting to be just as annoying as the bashers. There isn't nearly as much hate for them as you like to think there is.
Preemptive striking.
Which is ridiculous. Look at this thread; there is barely any JRPG bashing. You don't need to valiantly defend JRPGs in every thread that might have something to do with them. The JRPG defense is just as absurd as the hate they receive.
I did jump the gun a bit didn't I?

I just get so enraged at constant Bioware praise...I like Bioware, don't get me wrong, its just that I also hate them for dumbing down the RPG genre to talking and shooting...And getting praised as "the best RPG developer". So when I saw THREE Bioware games on his list of 5 games, my mind snapped.

Seriously, Mass Effect 2 can barely be considered an RPG at this point...And YES, I am playing it.
 

AzrealMaximillion

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Jan 20, 2010
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Sturmdolch said:
That bigoted attitude with the rush of JRPG fans in this thread saying how all WRPGs are shit (and that you're a xenophobe for liking them) remind me of why I dislike these games and the culture around them.

If you think that Fallout 3's story was shit, maybe it's because you've been turned into a mindless drone going from part A to part B and can't function anymore in an open world, losing track of the story after the first conversation choice? The story of Fallout 3 isn't just the main story, it's all the small side stories combined with the main one. Look at it as the sum of its parts, not just at a part of the whole. I don't play a JRPG's first level, quit, then say, "THAT GAME WAS SHORT LOLZ What a shit story, it didn't even get concluded!"

I think we understand that Fallout has more than just the main story, but that main story was garbage. The open world in Fallout 3 was extremely boring. You have 5 enemy types that are all easy to beat, and also have crappy AI. The game came out glitched to shit. And some of those side quest were kind of stupid as well. Why in a nuclear apocalypse am I seeing a robot overlord and an Ant Queen fighting over a town? I've seen JRPGs old and new have more endearing side quests. The Star Ocean series has been doing is well since 1996. FFVI through IX did a great job of appealing side quests as well. And both the Star Ocean series and FF 6-9 also had large open worlds to travel through (Airships for the win.)
Another point. No one here ever said that all WRPGs were bad. Hell that isn't even the argument here. Take a look at this list:
MatParker116 said:
http://kotaku.com/5472712/square-enix-attempts-to-explain-low-western-reviews


Fallout
Dragon Age
Mass Effect
KOTOR
Elder Scrolls 4
We're arguing about the stories of these games being compelling, which in the majority of the posts here, they aren't. These games are good, albeit flawed, but their stories are bland and contain plot holes for the most part. An example of a WRPG that has a compelling story as well as can do the open world thing well is 1999's Diablo II. Now that game should have been mention on the list above. Neverwinter Nights,Dues Ex,as well as Baldur's Gate II are all examples of games with better stories than those listed above.
 

AzrealMaximillion

New member
Jan 20, 2010
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Nowadays almost all western RPGs need some form of firearm. Why? Fallout3, Borderlands, Mass Effect, what's the deal? Why can't we have a WRPG that isn't a shooter with leveling?
 

Metalgamer81

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Dec 28, 2008
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Casual Shinji said:
Fans don't want Final Fantasy to change.

Just look at the community's reaction to FF12.
At first I had the same reaction. My thought was "this is NOT Final Fantasy." Then I noticed how vastly improved it was over the traditional turn-based combat of the previous games in the series. Of course, then I played through to almost the end and I realized how tedious the gameplay was. Once I discovered that you could simply choose one character to act as both damage mitigator and damage dealer and have the others just hang back and buff/heal him the game just became way too easy. Also, it was basically an offline MMORPG, complete with lots of grinding.

I do feel that JRPGs lock the player into a linear story. Sometimes I feel more like I'm watching an interactive movie than playing a game. Xenosaga was particularly guilty of this. That was the big trend in JRPGs for a while, and they don't seem to have gotten past it yet. Great storytelling is fine, but it should be a part of the gameplay experience, not a substitute for it. I feel like Square Enix is not interested in making innovative games. They want to make safe games.

Although I do agree with some of the posters that argue that the western RPGs aren't necessarily all that open. In Dragon Age I was pretty disappointed when I realized that the gameplay experience is virtually the same no matter how you choose to "role play" except that you stand to lose allies or items if you don't play the role of the nice guy.

Dragon Age is, however, open-ended in that you're given the task of recruiting each of the four factions to help you conquer the blight and are given some freedom with respect to the order in which you do so, but the challenge curve prevents the player from completing the game in any order other than mages, elves, Redcliffe, Dwarves.