Square Enix to return focus to JRPGs

[aozgolo]

According to this news article: http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/03/31/square-enix-to-refocus-on-jrpgs-after-bravely-default-success

Square Enix is "finally" going to refocus on what they do best, and that is appeal to the audience that built them in the first place, fans of JRPGs!

I think this is great news, maybe we'll finally see some of those Dragon Quest 3DS games they're making, and maybe even... *gasp* some actual JRPG content for the newest consoles.

What are your thoughts on this?

 

[Eve Charm]

Fire the FF13 guys and give the bravely default guys all the money. Seriously to make the worst grossing FF's one after another means they have no idea about why people Actually liked Final fantasy games anymore.

You can't go by charts and graphs and expect to make a game people are going to get into.

 

[Casual Shinji]

I'm not big on JRPGs, but I'll believe it when I see it.

And doesn't Square have a couple of big, fat, bloated Final Fantasy games in the works still? Unless it's for handhelds I can't see Square taking a step back in over-presentation. It's like they can't think small anymore even if their life depended on it.

 

[FootloosePhoenix]

Square Enix...they...they're making an effort to learn from their mistakes? And listening to what gamers actually want from them? Sounds too good to be true, but the way they've been talking lately does make me very, very hopeful.

So this means 16-bit styled Final Fantasy XVI, right Squeenix? Like how you made that Final Fantasy XIII storyline retrospective, only playable. Right, guys?
...Guys?

 

[remnant_phoenix]

I hope that Square-Enix is speaking about itself as "Square-Enix, The Developer" and not "Square-Enix, The Publisher."

Because hey, Square-Enix The Publisher, yes, I'm talking to you. Yeah, hi, if this "new direction" you're talking about gets in the way of a follow-up to Deus Ex: Human Revolution?

...

Well, let's just say that I know some people.

 

[Andy Shandy]

Ugh, I hope this doesn't affect their western studios.

They've been putting out a lot of good stuff over the past few years, so I hope this doesn't change that.

 

[Exhuminator]

What are your thoughts on this?

My thoughts when I bought Bravely Default brand new day zero (despite being in no hurry to play the game) were:

"I hope this game outsells Lightning Returns, egg on SQEX's face."

"Maybe if Nintendo and SQEX see how well Bravely Default sells in the USA, one of them will bother to bring Dragon Quest VII's 3DS remake over here too."

So far only one of those thoughts has come true.

 

[shrekfan246]

Eh, as much as I dislike the games, I wouldn't really say Final Fantasy XIII wasn't a JRPG. In fact, they probably would've been much easier to stomach had they simply not been called Final Fantasy, because JRPGs encompass so many widely varied styles depending on the developers behind them.

That having been said, I've been more into Square Enix as a publisher than developer in the past few years anyway. Between Sleeping Dogs, Tomb Raider, and Deus Ex: Human Revolution, they've put out some of my most-enjoyed action games in the past few years.

That doesn't mean I wouldn't be interested in seeing a return to form for the likes of Final Fantasy, or even the return of other JRPG franchises they've left dead for the last ten+ years, but like many other people I'm sure, I remain yet to be convinced of their ability to consistently produce quality products with what appears to be their current design philosophy. If they scale back the whole style-over-substance thing and finally realize that flashy graphics aren't all they need to keep people interested in their games, then maybe...

And on the other hand, they do have multiple teams and many different people working under them. I'd be worried about any project headed up by Motomu Toriyama, as I've mentioned before, but I'm still willing to give the majority of the other guys a good chance to impress me, as it's really only been Toriyama's work so far that I haven't been a fan of.

 

[remnant_phoenix]

Ugh, I hope this doesn't affect their western studios.

They've been putting out a lot of good stuff over the past few years, so I hope this doesn't change that.

My thoughts exactly.

Granted, they said that they recognize Bravely Default's success and this is why they are are reconsidering their view on the profitability of JRPGs. It would follow that they would also recognize that Deus Ex: Human Revolution and Tomb Raider were also successes.

At the same time, Square-Enix has often shown itself to have a tenuous relationship with logic, so I am at least a little bit worried.

 

[remnant_phoenix]

Eh, as much as I dislike the games, I wouldn't really say Final Fantasy XIII wasn't a JRPG. In fact, they probably would've been much easier to stomach had they simply not been called Final Fantasy, because JRPGs encompass so many widely varied styles depending on the developers behind them.

That having been said, I've been more into Square Enix as a publisher than developer in the past few years anyway. Between Sleeping Dogs, Tomb Raider, and Deus Ex: Human Revolution, they've put out some of my most-enjoyed action games in the past few years.

That doesn't mean I wouldn't be interested in seeing a return to form for the likes of Final Fantasy, or even the return of other JRPG franchises they've left dead for the last ten+ years, but like many other people I'm sure, I remain yet to be convinced of their ability to consistently produce quality products with what appears to be their current design philosophy. If they scale back the whole style-over-substance thing and finally realize that flashy graphics aren't all they need to keep people interested in their games, then maybe...

And on the other hand, they do have multiple teams and many different people working under them. I'd be worried about any project headed up by Motomu Toriyama, as I've mentioned before, but I'm still willing to give the majority of the other guys a good chance to impress me, as it's really only been Toriyama's work so far that I haven't been a fan of.

Headline: "Square-Enix realizes that Motomu Toriyama is a bad writer and kicks him to the curb; considers re-structuring the writing staff of its development studio."

THAT would reinvigorate my hope for the future of JRPGs that Square-Enix develops.

EDIT: And I agree that Tomb Raider 2013 and Deus Ex: HR were some of the better games of recent years. Here's hoping this "new direction" doesn't mess with the follow-through on their western-developed successes.

 

[gyrobot_v1legacy]

Just because they are going back to JRPGs doesn't mean they know what kind of JRPGs we need in this time and age. We need more dark fantasy JRPGs with softcore scenes like Thi4f and Witcher and political intrigue of morally grey heroes. Funny how they started off the whole "dark gritty RPG" and yet it was WRPGs who are still doing it.

 

[WeepingAngels]

Fire the FF13 guys and give the bravely default guys all the money. Seriously to make the worst grossing FF's one after another means they have no idea about why people Actually liked Final fantasy games anymore.

You can't go by charts and graphs and expect to make a game people are going to get into.

I thought FF13 was the fastest selling Final Fantasy game ever. Also, I hear that Bravely Default gets worse the longer you play, some people even said that they hit a point where they couldn't take it anymore and quit. That may have been here on the Escapist but I can't remember. Me, I couldn't stand the demo.

 

[shrekfan246]

Headline: "Square-Enix realizes that Motomu Toriyama is a bad writer and kicks him to the curb; considers re-structuring the writing staff of its development studio."

THAT would reinvigorate my hope for the future of JRPGs that Square-Enix develops.

I'm content to just not see him in the director's position again, since he isn't entirely unbearable when he's got people around to pull back his reigns, but yeah, it's pretty sad when even Tetsuya "Embrace the darkness!" Nomura can write out a better story than you. And I like the Kingdom Hearts stories.

 

[remnant_phoenix]

Fire the FF13 guys and give the bravely default guys all the money. Seriously to make the worst grossing FF's one after another means they have no idea about why people Actually liked Final fantasy games anymore.

You can't go by charts and graphs and expect to make a game people are going to get into.

I thought FF13 was the fastest selling Final Fantasy game ever. Also, I hear that Bravely Default gets worse the longer you play, some people even said that they hit a point where they couldn't take it anymore. Me, I couldn't stand the demo.

It was the fastest-selling right out of the gate, but it had horrible follow-up sales.

It sold very well for the first 1-2 months, but after reviews and word-of-mouth got around, sales took a dive. Down the road (4-6 months) after release, there were stacks (literally, my wife worked at Gamestop at the time) of cheap used copies around for second-hand sales and Square-Enix wasn't making squat off of the game anymore.

Compare that to, say, FFVII, which is still making money due to PC-version and PSN download sales.

"Fastest-selling" doesn't always mean "outlandish success," especially for a game like FFXIII which had a HUGE budget; it needed to sell a ton of copies, even by general AAA-budget standards, for the game to be a resounding financial success overall.

 

[remnant_phoenix]

Headline: "Square-Enix realizes that Motomu Toriyama is a bad writer and kicks him to the curb; considers re-structuring the writing staff of its development studio."

THAT would reinvigorate my hope for the future of JRPGs that Square-Enix develops.

I'm content to just not see him in the director's position again, since he isn't entirely unbearable when he's got people around to pull back his reigns, but yeah, it's pretty sad when even Tetsuya "Embrace the darkness!" Nomura can write out a better story than you. And I like the Kingdom Hearts stories.

Agreed.

I see Toriyama like I see George Lucas.

Toriyama did extensive work on FFVII and FFX, which I love, but for those projects, he was not in a position of great creative control; he was part of a creative team. FFX-2 and the FFXIII series were the instances where he was in the main director's chair, and, well, those are the two most common points that people point to when they talking about FF "losing its way."

Likewise, George Lucas made the original Star Wars trilogy as part of a creative team of writers and directors, he didn't even direct all the scenes that made it into the final products. Conversely, he wrote/directed/had complete creative control over every aspect of the prequel trilogy and was surrounded by a team of people saying "Yes, George. Whatever you want George." And the results? Yeah...

Granted I'm of the opinion that the Star Wars prequels weren't as bad as some people make them out to be, and I feel the same about FFXIII when I'm in a certain type of forgiving mood, but in both cases you've got two guys who do not have the talent to be given unmitigated creative control over such things.

To return to topic, I'm not necessarily advocating Toriyama being fired and I don't think that he is completely without talent. I agree with you, as long as he isn't at the helm of the writing/direction, I'm more optimistic about the project.

 

[shrekfan246]

It was the fastest-selling right out of the gate, but it had horrible follow-up sales.

"Fastest-selling" doesn't always mean "outlandish success," especially for a game like FFXIII which had a HUGE budget; it needed to sell a ton of copies, even by general AAA-budget standards, for the game to be a resounding financial success overall.

Not to mention that the sequels both had dramatically reduced sales numbers. XIII-2 sold, what, roughly half of what XIII did, and Lightning Returns has supposedly sold half of that?

My numbers are probably off since I don't care enough to do the research again, but if we're going by sales numbers then XIII quantifiably burnt a lot of people who originally bought it on the goodwill of the rest of the Final Fantasy franchise.

 

[WeepingAngels]

Fire the FF13 guys and give the bravely default guys all the money. Seriously to make the worst grossing FF's one after another means they have no idea about why people Actually liked Final fantasy games anymore.

You can't go by charts and graphs and expect to make a game people are going to get into.

I thought FF13 was the fastest selling Final Fantasy game ever. Also, I hear that Bravely Default gets worse the longer you play, some people even said that they hit a point where they couldn't take it anymore. Me, I couldn't stand the demo.

It was the fastest-selling right out of the gate, but it had horrible follow-up sales.

It sold very well for the first 1-2 months, but after reviews and word-of-mouth got around, sales took a dive. Down the road (4-6 months) after release, there were stacks (literally, my wife worked at Gamestop at the time) of cheap used copies around for second-hand sales and Square-Enix wasn't making squat off of the game anymore.

Compare that to, say, FFVII, which is still making money due to PC-version and PSN download sales.

"Fastest-selling" doesn't always mean "outlandish success," especially for a game like FFXIII which had a HUGE budget; it needed to sell a ton of copies, even by general AAA-budget standards, for the game to be a resounding financial success overall.

Yes, let's compare re-releases of FF7 to FF13. Isn't it forseeable that in 10 years FF13 could be rereleased on newer platforms and sell for $9.99 or $11.99? Anyway, my point was that pretending Bravely Default is the best thing SE has done is over. Too many people have come out and said that the game really goes downhill after awhile and I would also like proof that FF13 was the worst grossing Final Fantasy (sequels not included). If we did include sequels, then they would surely have sold worse than the main game anyway.

In fact, the sequels are what SE needs to get away from, we have more than enough WRPG's that are mostly made up of side quests, we don't SE making them too.

http://vgsales.wikia.com/wiki/Final_Fantasy

The above link tells me that Final Fantasy XIII sold more than all the other Final Fantasy games except VII and VIII. Did Bravely Default sell 6.9 Million units because that's what FF13 sold. The best information I can find is that Bravely Default sold 200,000 units a month after it's release.

 

[Atmos Duality]

Agreed.

I see Toriyama like I see George Lucas.

That's a good analogy, really.
Though I liken Final Fantasy as a whole to Star Wars since each is a milestone series in its respective medium that just got lost up its own ass after its creators' priorities changed.

 

[McMarbles]

Just because they are going back to JRPGs doesn't mean they know what kind of JRPGs we need in this time and age. We need more dark fantasy JRPGs with softcore scenes like Thi4f and Witcher and political intrigue of morally grey heroes. Funny how they started off the whole "dark gritty RPG" and yet it was WRPGs who are still doing it.

I love how people say "we need" when what they really mean is "I want".

 

[alphamalet]

Fire the FF13 guys and give the bravely default guys all the money.

Do people really want the FF13 guys fired?
Look at who worked on FF13, and what their previous work was..

Toriyama (Director) - Event Director and scenario writer for Final Fantasy X
Kitase (Producer) - director of Final Fantasy VI, Director of Final Fantasy VII, and Director of Final Fantasy VIII
Kamikokuryo - Background Art Director for FFX
Wantanabe (Writer) - Served as a writer for Final Fantasy X

That is a tremendous amount of talent that has collectively worked on games adored by fans...

The way I see it, Final Fantasy XIII was a swing and a miss. They tried to do a lot of new things, but a lot of them didn't quite pan out. I would speculate that this was mostly due to the development team adjusting to the amount of work needed to produce a LARGE HD game with pressure to hurry up and release the game as delays mounted. The sequels to Final Fantasy XIII weren't made by the Final Fantasy A-team, and were the result of the company needing income in a time where they were bleeding money as they were (successfully) redoing a botched MMO.

I would be fine with the group of talent that was responsible for Final Fantasy XIII being the group that makes the next Final Fantasy, so long as their focus shifts. I would add Hiroyuki Ito to the team (inventor of the materia system, co-director of FF6, director of FF9, inventor of the ATB battle system), who is a tremendous talent currently being relegated to mobile games.

Seriously to make the worst grossing FF's one after another means they have no idea about why people Actually liked Final fantasy games anymore. You can't go by charts and graphs and expect to make a game people are going to get into.

Wikipedia says:

Final Fantasy XIII became the fastest-selling title in the history of the series. As of January 2013, the game has shipped 6.6 million copies worldwide.

Those sales are hardly poor.