Star Wars: TOR = SWG?

[tc1259]

Star Wars: TOR = SWG?

A long time ago in our life time, a company made Star Wars Galaxies (Sony).... Star wars fans rejoiced everywhere yet the game was almost universally criticised for bad game play, development and size.

So when Bioware announced that it was going to take the star wars universe and make it in to a new MMORPG, i was both excited and worried that a franchise I love perhaps a little too much was going to be destroyed yet again, so in an effort to work out if SW: TOR is going to be like SWG i thought that a list of everything bad about the game should be addressed.

1. Starting with a lightsaber
When SWG first started, becoming a member of the Jedi / Sith was a hard thing. There was no way you could instantly pick up a lightsaber, go out in to the deserts and slaughter the first group of sand people you come across.

You had to work through various professions, unlock secret puzzles, meditate and then find a hidden trainer which then unlocked the first force sensitive profession.

Things in SWG were good... then came the dark times... Sony decided to cut all the classes and allow new players to instantly create a Jedi Character. Sure they had to work to get there lightsaber, but the game was fundamentally changed.

I remember walking my character out of the Theed spaceport to see no less than 20 Jedi / Sith fighting in full view and sight of a Patrol of Stormtroopers... I logged off and haven?t touched the game since.

2.Sith Vs Jedi = Imperial vs Rebel?
When SWG was released it touted the highly anticipated Imperial vs Jedi combat. It never worked, nothing ever changed! I can only hope and pray that the political landscape and those who play in the Jedi vs Sith battles will make a difference in the game.

3. Player owned cities and buildings
I have to admit to loving this aspect of SWG, it game you a sense of ownership and a place to store the millions of items you tended to collect over your galactic travels. In fact in the new star wars game, if there isn?t a place / ship / room in an apartment building you cannot claim as your own i?ll be a little disappointed.

4.Choice...
In SWG the game play was so linear and the missions were so go here, do this and report back. That any choices you made in the game seemed to only relate to the color of your skin / race and clothing you wanted to wear on that particular day.
Even then the game forced you to wear certain items, if you didn?t the next time you encountered a bug three feet from the walls of a major city or at worst on your very own doorstep you were going to have a bad day and end up awaking in a clone vat facility.

5.Classes
SWG took classes in much the same way as a Obsessive Compulsive would sort jellybeans. Originally SWG had more professions (38) Starting professions than any other game around at the time, this doesn?t count any of the advanced professions which included the Force Sensitive lists.

At the time myself and a few friends couldn?t understand why Marksman someone who had a pistol needed to learn an entire new tree to get a rifle certification. We were simply awestruck with the complexity and yet the game seemed to balance one skill over another.
Then Sony decided to modify the game, going from these 38 professions and cutting the game down to 9 professions. 2 of which were in the Advanced Listings.

The game to many players at that stage lost skills, abilities and otherwise characters that they had been playing with for a decently long time.

6. Will Bioware learn from the mistakes of Sony, or are they simply having their turn at the wheel?
This really is the million dollar question, God i hope not.
SWG was a good idea, but for the few good points the game had it was woefully designed and the developers didn?t seem to have any understanding of the history and status of Star Wars.

Bioware on the other hand have made good role play games for years, KOTOR being one of the best star wars games ever to be made. I hope that they put as much detail, effort and listen to what experienced MMORPG players have to say otherwise I think the game may indeed suck .
Anyways I would love to hear people?s experiences in SWG or hopes for the new Star Wars game, hopefully in a year we can look back on this thread and say ?It didn?t suck?

 

[A Playful Shark]

I played galaxies for a but, i didn't like it much.
TBH i probably won't try this one either.

 

[Ashbax]

Actually I hear TOR is meant to make up for SWG's mistakes, so im gonna try the beta at the very least. I hope they make the lightsaber a non-starting thing, and you have to do 10 levels of story missions at the least before getting one...I mean, KOTOR 1 and 2 were very successful and getting lightsabers in them took days of playing. Im gonna try SWTOR when it comes out. I checked out the website a while back and occasionally check for updates. im pretty hyped.

 

[quiet_samurai]

I'm excited for this game too. And I hope being a force user isn't just a class that you can select righrt away. If that is the case you are going to have nothing but Jedi and Sith runnung around.

 

[Flying-Emu]

I've already scripted my Bounty Hunter's backstory, if that tells you anything

I think that Bioware knows what they're doing. They're a group of intelligent developers; even though this is their first foray into the dangerous sea of MMOs, I expect them to do well.

Even WoW had a horrible launch; buggy, hard to play/understand, but they FIXED it. I expect Bioware to do the same.

I think that Bioware will far surpass SW:G in all shapes and forms. So long as they have player-owned ships and space combat.

Otherwise I'll be sad. Because then I can't be a spice smuggler.

By the way, OP: Great first post/thread, and I love your avatar. Welcome to the Escapist. I think you'll enjoy it here.

 

[NeedAUserName]

Having never played Galaxies, or any other MMO from the launch I feel I would quite like to start with this one. In my opinion most games go through a high point, then everything gets nerfed, i.e. The Burning Crusades in WoW, I would quite like an Original WoW with old Naxx there for players who missed it to give it a shot.

 

[TheFacelessOne]

Welcome to the Escapist. And a great first post.

And I am VERY excited about TOR. I believe it will be very sweet.

(P.S., I am still debating over weither to have bounty hunter or sith!)

 

[NeedAUserName]

My only concern is to whether I can play this on my Mac...

 

[Nargleblarg]

.....let's all hope this doesn't happen but then again you have to remember bioware is making the game and if you need further hope just take a look at bioware's list of past games and by each one it should say something like "game of the year" or "editor's choice" so I'm not that worried unless they let lucasarts touch the game then we are screwed.

 

[Dirty Apple]

Galaxies had alot of faults, but its greates asset was the crafting system. The best items all came from people who had spent the time searching for the best resources and combinations. I actually found the resource hunting kinda fun. And I even played before the advent of vehicles. I had heard that the CU really killed the game, but from what I remember the game was circling the tube before the update was implemented.

 

[A Hot Hotpocket]

First of all, Welcome to The Escapist and great first post.

Now onto SW:TOR, I myself just found out about this project not that long ago and became very excited and interested in it's development. Having never played Star Wars:Galaxies during the good times before the NGE or during the bad times after it's implementation, I relish at the oppourtunity to start on the same playing field as everyone else in a Star Wars MMO (since Galaxies is all but doomed). I check the site daily and browse the forumns to see what's new and what speculation has arisen.

My first MMORPG was the behemoth that is World of Warcraft and while I enjoyed it for about 3 years, I eventually got tired of all my hard work being worth nothing once Blizzard released a new expansion and the level cap went up so I walked away. Ever since then, I've been searching for a futuristic MMO and with my love of the Star Wars universe, SW:TOR seemed like my cup of tea. So here I am today, watching the development of the game, hoping that it will live up to everything it can be.

Also, Jedi and Sith will be starting classes, so prepare to see alot of them. I confess that I will probabbly have one as well, but I'll try other classes as well. Bioware seems very aware that there must be classes other than those two and balance is important, so I am pretty confident in them. The Bounty Hunter class interests me alot and the Trooper looks alright I guess too.

Oh, and a Smuggler class has been confirmed by a developer on a German website when he accidentally spilled the beans, so that ought to be interesting as well.

Cheers!
-Hotpocket

 

[Darathy]

1. Starting with a lightsaber
When SWG first started, becoming a member of the Jedi / Sith was a hard thing. There was no way you could instantly pick up a lightsaber, go out in to the deserts and slaughter the first group of sand people you come across.

Given the amount of schtick Bioware caught for not doing this in K1, it'll probably be a starting option, or remarkably easy. This game is about the cash and nothing else.

You had to work through various professions, unlock secret puzzles, meditate and then find a hidden trainer which then unlocked the first force sensitive profession.

You had to work through various professions, unlock secret puzzles, meditate and then find a hidden trainer which then unlocked the first force sensitive profession.

LOL, not in a Bioware game you don't!

2.Sith Vs Jedi = Imperial vs Rebel?
When SWG was released it touted the highly anticipated Imperial vs Jedi combat. It never worked, nothing ever changed! I can only hope and pray that the political landscape and those who play in the Jedi vs Sith battles will make a difference in the game.

Given the storyline and Biowhore's record, don't bet on it.

3. Player owned cities and buildings
I have to admit to loving this aspect of SWG, it game you a sense of ownership and a place to store the millions of items you tended to collect over your galactic travels. In fact in the new star wars game, if there isn't a place / ship / room in an apartment building you cannot claim as your own i'll be a little disappointed.

At best, imagine it like this feature in Fable. i.e., totally peripheral and meaningless, but an amusing credit-sink.

4.Choice...
In SWG the game play was so linear and the missions were so go here, do this and report back. That any choices you made in the game seemed to only relate to the color of your skin / race and clothing you wanted to wear on that particular day.

Yeah, Bioware like linear plots and Fedex-style quests. It saves having to actually expend much effort.

Even then the game forced you to wear certain items, if you didn't the next time you encountered a bug three feet from the walls of a major city or at worst on your very own doorstep you were going to have a bad day and end up awaking in a clone vat facility.

Less likely to be a problem, although given that they have a mixed and increasingly bad record with bugs...

5.Classes
SWG took classes in much the same way as a Obsessive Compulsive would sort jellybeans. Originally SWG had more professions (38) Starting professions than any other game around at the time, this doesn't count any of the advanced professions which included the Force Sensitive lists.

At the time myself and a few friends couldn't understand why Marksman someone who had a pistol needed to learn an entire new tree to get a rifle certification. We were simply awestruck with the complexity and yet the game seemed to balance one skill over another.
Then Sony decided to modify the game, going from these 38 professions and cutting the game down to 9 professions. 2 of which were in the Advanced Listings

Played NWN?

6. Will Bioware learn from the mistakes of Sony, or are they simply having their turn at the wheel?
This really is the million dollar question, God i hope not.
SWG was a good idea, but for the few good points the game had it was woefully designed and the developers didn't seem to have any understanding of the history and status of Star Wars

Given Biowhore's record, they probably view these weaknesses as good things, or simply will unthinkingly include them.

Bioware on the other hand have made good role play games for years, KOTOR being one of the best star wars games ever to be made. I hope that they put as much detail, effort and listen to what experienced MMORPG players have to say otherwise I think the game may indeed suck .
Anyways I would love to hear people's experiences in SWG or hopes for the new Star Wars game, hopefully in a year we can look back on this thread and say 'It didn't suck'

KotOR was good, but far from the best Star Wars game ever made - its sequel has to rank above it as a story-centred RPG, and for an SW game more generally I'd say the playing-field is much less black-and-white - I recently reinstalled Battlefront, and it's a lot of fun, and not mentioning stuff like X-Wing or Rogue Squadron will probably get you lynched by the more hardcore SW gamer.

Personally, I'm expecting it to be awful, but I'm angry that they wouldn't make an SPRPG KotOR III, and won't play it, regardless. I also don't relish the idea of enjoying the Star Wars universe while being constantly harrassed and killed by DarthAwsum1101!!11 every three minutes, but that may just be me.

I mean, KOTOR 1 and 2 were very successful and getting lightsabers in them took days of playing.

Actually, you can finish Taris in K1 in about 2 hours, minimum. Getting your lightsaber in KotOR II is more varied, and your number is more accurate for that, though.

So long as they have player-owned ships and space combat.

Given that they won't put mounted combat into Dragon Age on the grounds, effectively, that it's too much work, it seems unlikely they'll then include space combat in TOR, unless it's similar to the gunfights in KotOR I.

 

[Flying-Emu]

*snip*

You are a very negative person. Thanks for quashing my dreams.

Oh well, I'll keep hoping. It's all I've got!

 

[Darathy]

I'm jaded by experience.

Seriously, though, by all means keep hoping; I might be wrong, and BioWare might genuinely do something brilliant, but given their record and what they're doing with Dragon Age, I'm not seeing much likelihood of it.

If you want a really good SPRPG experience, though, you might like the NWN2 expansion, Mask of the Betrayer. If you can get past the game's engine issues and lacklustre optimisation, it's really worth playing.

 

[tc1259]

Thanks Guys,

Yes I've played a few of those games you've mentioned. there all pretty good in there own right.

I guess the issue is, I do not want to see another games company take a crack at the Star Wars Franchise and completely destroy it due to poor development, balance and you know all the other issues that plague most if not all of the online games.

Myself and a friend were recently discussing the options of training and we thought a grind / time based leveling system would do well.

Those that wish to grind, go for it.

Those that wish to go time based, it would work as well, the training time being taken from the average time of all grinders. Thou admittedly it might have to be an option you select from the start.

 

[quack35]

Does TRGEF = HDJKaL > UotP?

 

[Rigs83]

I'll play it and hope it gets better with time. From what I here all MMO suck at release since they have to do so many patches to figure out how it works in a real world crap shoot that is the interwebs.

And don't worry about Mac compatibility since you have bootstrap.

 

[Prons]

This thread needs more photos of the crazy bugs SWG used to have. Like when they forgot to put a limit to how tall you could make your character, so cities literally had giant level 1's running around.

 

[big_shaq12]

Well, considering that they said that they set the game in the middle of a Sith Jedi war and not during the movie era, just so they could have 10,000 Jedi and Sith running around probably means the lightsaber is easy to get. but I don't see why that's a bad thing. The lightsaber is just the sword of star wars. If Blizzard took out the ability to us a sword until you reached lvl 20 and did a special quest in WOW every one would go WTF. the lightsaber in my opinion should be treated like any other weapon class getting your first lightsaber is easy but getting a really good extremely awesome lightsaber should be hard.

 

[luckshot]

you have pretty much summed up what i loved about swg and what went horribly wrong (people losing all the work they put into a character because the class was deleted), and what i hope and fear in the coming game

as some have said the game is being set in a jedi/sith war, so we can only hope that they put in place a system that makes sense