Honestlyk, to the folks here who keep bringing up Call of Duty:
Do you honestly feel that comparing average games to what is generally considered the high water mark in AAA non-subscription game sales is even remotely honest? Because by that metric, companies shouldn't even take risks on most of the AAA market. Everyone should just make Call of Duty. I think we're better off now that everyone and their mother has stopped trying to make COD killers. And honestly, I thought that was the consensus of these boards: that we'd had enough shitty COD clones and MMSes.
Saints Row The Third was, to that point in their lifespan, THQ's best selling non-licensed game (according to their own financial reports). Should they have not made it or its sequel, the superior Saints Row IV (yeah, they tanked before it came out, I know), simply because they weren't getting COD numbers? THQ considered the game a pretty big success and touted it hard. It was one of the first properties snatched up when they crashed, too.
Hey, remember when everyone was incredulous that Squarenix was disappointed with Hitman, Deus Ex and Tomb Raider for "only" selling 4-6 million a pop? I do. I still think it's absurd that these numbers are considered "bad," but they're not COD numbers. Or remember when people got pissed off that a game that only sells a couple hundred thousand units traditionally wasn't coming to the West at all?
It seems like if we shoot specifically for those numbers and set them as a measure of success, then we're disqualifying most of gaming. Including the games "for guys."
sumanoskae said:
My 2 cents: You're gonna, what, do a survey on somebody and use that as a metric to predict their capacity for sexual violence? You really see no problem with that logic?
Weeeeeeeeell, except that's not what the study said or did.
This is the problem. There's two debates going on. One among academics and one among gamers. Whenever one of these studies comes out, it's a case of gamers and/or the gaming press turning them into "games make you murderers/rapists!" and then railing against that strawman and it never seems to end. No matter how reasonable or uncontroversial such a study is, it sparks "controversy" if it finds anything even potentially negative about gaming.
Which is weird, because we as a whole seem to intuitively understand things like cultivation theory are real when it's media depicting gaming in a negative light. Suddenly, such depictions are biased and poison the mainstream against us. This study and its coverage will probably be used as exactly such an example thousands of times.
There is a hell of a lot more that goes into the psychology of a rapist than spouting off macho bullshit, and there is no way in hell that you can judge someone's ability for empathy by showing them a picture and telling them a story.
And there's a hell of a lot more to these studies than the reductive argument that's being made against them. Hell, I'm not even sure where the "therefore, rapist" mentality comes from. I'm not sure why it's wrong for this hypothetical/fictional other group to overly simplify things, but it's absolutely fine to reduce a study on decreased empathy response among people who view sexualised media (neither new nor controversial in academic or scientific circles) into this crusade against video games. That this specific study charts a correlation between identification with the protagonist and lack of empathy still doesn't even come close to
My 2 cents: You're gonna, what, do a survey on somebody and use that as a metric to predict their capacity for sexual violence?
They might full well see a problem with that logic, because it's not theirs. However, that's the problem: since they never said any of this, there's no way to know. And since they're not going to post here, asking loaded questions is even less helpful. They might even agree that there's more to the psychology of a rapist, but then, they never address that issue, either.
I'm wondering how many of the people outraged here have actually read the study. Or so much as looked at the abstract.
Or did they just Listen and Believe when they were told they should be outraged at this study because it says...I don't know, the claims have become so distorted it's hard to keep track.