Sword Art Online... WTF Happened?

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Jan 12, 2012
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(For clarity's sake, I'm going to split the first 25 episodes between a 'first season'[1-14, the original SAO] and 'second season' [15-25, Alfheim]. Yes, I'm a terrible Canadian philistine with no sense of cultural propriety. I watched the dubbed version too.)

I'm not a big fan of anime, but I had heard good things about Sword Art Online, it's on Netflix, and there's only two seasons so I knew I wouldn't get tired halfway through.

The first season was fine, a bit touch-and-go about how the game rules worked (do they feel pain or not?) but generally fine. The only worrying thing was the amount of fanservice -it seemed like every female character had a couple shots of her legs that lingered too long, a personal issue I have with a lot of anime (I'm too old to ogle teenagers, even animated ones). It came to a decent ending, setting up a new arc about coming back to the real world.

But that second season... ugh.

The Incest
Holy shit, the incest. A storyline about a middle schooler with breasts the size of her head wanting to sleep with her brother/cousin sounds like the kind of porn that gets people arrested, not the big arc of the new main character Suguha.

On a related note, the fanservice hit an all time high. I don't think there's been a single female character on the show who hasn't thrown themselves at Kirito, and we get plenty of lingering shots of their bodies. It's really weird to have the villain be a creepy racist when the animators were clearly loving the idea of Asuna in terror.

The Game
At no point in the show did I have any idea how Alfheim worked. I think that the 10 minute flight limit was the only hard point of data about the game- they mentioned that there were a number of different races, but 2/3rds of them never made an appearance, and even among the ones we see there was very little to distinguish them beyond aesthetics. The Sylphs were probably the most represented, but they never even said what kind of magic they specialized in (healing, I guess?). Not that the magic is well explained at all: Leafa could pull off a pretty good illusion while Kirito never tried it, and not only was there no explanation for Kirito turning into a giant monster it was never brought up again in the season. Similarly, I never knew how powerful anyone or anything was, other than Kirito being better than everyone.

There seemed to be no hard rules or benchmarks for who could do what and why, and I never felt any tension as anything happened. Even dying never seemed like the big deal the characters made it out to me; oh, no, your quest is going to take a 5 minute break while you respawn. That clearly requires dramatically shoving people out of harm's way and shouting at them to stay out of your business because you can't ask them to sacrifice themselves for you. How was "assassination" such a big plot point when all it could do was mildly inconvenience people? Heck, why was there a summit at all when they could just send messages to each other?

The General Character Arcs
This was the biggest disappointment to me. Other than the love story, it seemed like none of the character decisions and development of the previous season mattered. Asuna was a prisoner who didn't get to do much of anything other than toss a keycard (which led to some incredible reaches of logic by Kirito to surmise it came from her), which is pretty disappointing for someone who was such a badass in the first season (though she did have some weirdly passive moments there too).

Kirito, meanwhile, seems to have forgotten that whole "I need friends" thing that broke him out of the lousy 'lone protagonist' mould that seems to plague a lot of anime. He manages to save two nations, but it never occurs to him to ask them to help him go up the World Tree. He refuses to even take Leafa with him during the actual quest despite the fact that there's no reason or consequence if they fail and 'die'. He never goes to his friends from SAO and ask them for help busting out Asuna, despite the fact that they'd love to help if they knew, they're incredibly experienced players who may benefit from the same levelling glitch as Kirito, and the bar owner clearly has links to the Alfheim community. (I'll let the "play the game instead of going to the police about the forced marriage and rape of an unconscious girl," in the name of the basic plot of the story).


**********
TL;DR I just finished the second season of SAO, and it was a letdown in so many ways, really poorly put together in terms of storytelling, and the sexual content went from 'kind of weird' to 'seriously disturbed'.

I know you like anime, Escapists, and you've probably seen the rest of the show or maybe even read the source material. Tell me, does it get better? Does it actually do a good job of handling the psychological aspects of surviving a death game, or even just "What if you lived in a MMO?" Am I totally blind and misreading everything that happened?
 

Zontar

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Feb 18, 2013
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No it does not. The second season (SAO II) is an improvement over the first, but that's like saying that a bag on fire on your doorstep is better then a bag on fire on your doorstep which contains a turd in it.

You're also not blind to what happened, SAO is infamous within the anime community for how divisive it is, you either love it, hate it, or your hatred for it is so strong it becomes a masochistic type of love (I am in that last category). And that's for the first half of the season. For the second half, it's a state where even many fans of the show hate.

The issue stems from the nature of the source material, something they REALLY should have thrown out instead of adapting. SAO has multiple problems to it, first is that the first half was adapted out of two light novels instead of four, and those two where a single story that was basically the end, and a bunch of side stories that where made after the fact (that's the reason why there is an 8 episode gap of nothing happening of substance in the first half) while the second was made out of two light novels which where made years after the fact, since SAO only went from being a web story to a full on series after Accel World became popular.

What happened is this: Reki Kawahara is a bad writer, he doesn't think things through, and the anime has an illogical fidelity to the source material to its incredible detriment. I could spend hours explaining why the GOOD part of SAO is terrible and clearly comes off as the 'MMORPG as written by someone who has never played an MMORPG' shlock it is.

At the end of the day the SAO II is an improvement over the second half of the first one, but again that's like saying Star Trek Voyager was better then Enterprise, yes it's better but it's still a piece of crap that doesn't justify its own existence using a premise which was good but in the hands of the wrong people and ending up as one of the biggest and worst cases of wasted potential the industry has ever seen.
 

Aerosteam

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Sep 22, 2011
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Don't worry, it becomes not shit at season 5, or late into SAO II. Though I wouldn't bother if I were you, unless you don't find having a major villain called Death Gun cringeworthy as fuck who is pretty much a Death Note ripoff. Also some pretty moronic things happen in SAO II from the get go. (An MMO with randomized character appearance? Like what?)

Also what you're calling seasons is actually called arcs.
 

Fat Hippo

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Aerosteam said:
(An MMO with randomized character appearance? Like what?)
*ahem* Rust *ahem*

Sorry, just had to put that out there, even though I know it's not a proper MMO.

As for actual topic: Pretty much what a load of people who liked the first arc (myself included) felt about the second arc. They should have made the first arc the entire anime and simply written new storylines for it. The setting (MMO in which death means actual death IRL) was always the most interesting thing about the show anyway. But after it loses that, eh...
 

omega 616

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May 1, 2009
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When I started watching I was expecting a pokèmon style of anime. 4 or 5 episodes of silly "side quest" kind of stuff, like that girl whose familiar died and she had to get a flower to revive it and then a boss episode.

That would have been a good 400+ series instead by episode 4 or 5 they are at floor 40 or something and we've seen one boss.

Then when the whole fight me now and the game is over thing happened, I thought the writers want this to end quickly!

Irl stuff started and I figured he would get into kendo and be awesome at that, getting laughed at for his weird stance etc

Then they brought in that elf stuff and I thought "oh now we're getting into some kinky hentai kind of anime I can't stand. I watched it all but Jesus it got creepy quickly!
 

TWRule

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The first arc was flawed but overall enjoyable and even a little thoughtful at times, the rest ranged from having a few interesting moments but being mostly uninspired to provoking the same sort of audible 'ugh' everyone let go at the second arc.

Spoilers, they even re-use the same cartoonishly-insane pervert type of villian for part of the third arc, and there's all sorts of other hang-ups about sexuality throughout while the 'harem' for Kirito continues to grow. In the third arc, the new female lead they introduce (Asuna again is fairly absent) has basically no personality other than a somewhat cliche and difficult-to-relate-to psychological issue. After that you get some blatant filler episodes and then an arc which would be refreshing for its lack of focus on Kirito in favor of Asuna if not for the sequences which are supposed to be emotional falling flat and the introduction of a bunch of new characters that you never really get invested in.
 

StormShaun

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Feb 1, 2009
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Thunderous Cacophony said:
Tell me, does it get better?
Do you want the short or long version?

Short: No.

Long: Noooooooooooooo.
Kirito is still Kirito, the virtual harem king who somehow beats most people despite the main weapon of the third arc. The excitement of the new arc quickly dies, and naturally ... The added characters are not that great. Basically, it is more Sword Art Online season 1, another girl to add to the non-romantic harem. Personally, I would find it much more interesting if Kirito just marries someone ... That isn't Asuna. Hey, it would make many people angry and give the story a little twist.

Also the villain.
He is named "Death Gun".
If you are like me, you will laugh every damn time it is mentioned.
Truth be told, I'm still laughing now.

I will admit though, I disliked the first and second season. I don't know even why I started the third arc. Still, I sound quite negative. If you want someone who might redeem it, talk to Elfgore.

Anyway, I'm going to move on from SAO, and bask in the glory that is JoJo's Bizarre Adventure.
 

NiPah

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May 8, 2009
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Dear god... the sister wants to shag her brother and sexualized violence to boot? I knew I liked Sword Art for some reason.

The show aired uncensored on national cable and Adult Swim didn't get one complaint over the show, this isn't Please Twins here this is a little sister who has a little unrequited crush on her brother, stop with the damn bolded incest crap.
 

Ugicywapih

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I've got to say I've never watched SAO, but if you're looking for a recent anime set in an MMO world, where players have somehow gotten imprisoned as their own characters, with 2 seasons, limited fanservice, at least by anime standards, good amount of hard data and information on both characters (levels, classes etc.) and the world (exposition galore), considerably fewer inconsistencies and much less squick than SAO (there still is some IMO and, not having watched SAO, I find it hard to compare, but I hadn't heard of other viewers making a fuss about it, so given the shitstorm over SAO, I'm guessing it's fairly minor in comparison), consider watching Log Horizon. It really is pretty good, though if you get down to it, it's a whole diffrent kind of story, much more focused on planning and politics, with the entire main cast getting decent amounts of agenda and screen time, rather than a personal physical (well, not quite, the world being an MMO, but you get what I mean, right?) struggle of a solitary hero.

TL;DR: Watch Log Horizon

*adjusts glasses*
 

CrystalShadow

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Apr 11, 2009
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Second half of the first season is by far the worst thing.
The first half of the second season is... Better, but rather problematic. (Gun Gale Online)
I mean, the end of that arc... Kinda traumatised me somewhat (personal reasons. Please don't ask. But if you know what the ending involves, you can probably guess)

The "Mother's Rosaria" arc at the end of season 2 on the other hand, comes pretty close to making up for every dumb, creepy thing the series has pulled up to that point.
(Also, Kirito is barely in it. Go figure. XD)

So... If by 'season 2' you mean the second half of season 1, then yeah. Sure. That... Was awful.

It gets better eventually, but it takes it's sweet time about it.
Having said that I've heard the stuff it's based on got much better later on. (the author took a break for a few years or something, and apparently realised how awful the early stuff was, and something about him having been a horny teenager when he wrote it? Eh.)

Fingers crossed season 3 (as in, what is officially season 3, which would more or less be the 5th major arc) can keep up the bar set by "mother's rosario", and not degenerate into something stupid again...

There's absolutely no telling at this point though.
 

Casual Shinji

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I couldn't even get through the first season, what with Kirito being the best ever at everything because, and every female character insta-splooshing the minute they met him. Nothing wrong with a little wish fulfillment, but there's a line that once crossed it might as well just be Logjammin'. 'I am Kirito. Ich bin expert.'
 

Zontar

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Feb 18, 2013
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NiPah said:
The show aired uncensored on national cable and Adult Swim didn't get one complaint over the show, this isn't Please Twins here this is a little sister who has a little unrequited crush on her brother, stop with the damn bolded incest crap.
Actually Adult Swim got a fair number of people who asked for it not to be aired, many of whom ironically being people who initially had asked for it to be aired during the first arc before the second one had started to air and derailed the whole thing even for people who enjoyed it (hell, I know I kept watching just to see how stupid it would get. Was not disappointed, there isn't any doubt the series only made it to air due to Accel World becoming popular and Reki Kawahara making the mistake of reviving his rushed, half baked story into a series).
 

List

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Firstly Just to point out kirito is adopted. That's why they were trying to show tension in the first few episode between them in season one that's why he ran to an MMO.... So technically it's not incest?

Second. This show is full of god damn fan-service. It's basically a MMO-themed Harem anime.

I don't have netflix but from what I understood. What your looking for is more likely Log Horizon? It has very few fan-service and focuses more on the game. rather than flipping games like a pack of cards like SAO does.

Also no, It generally wont get better. Kirito will just continue being a badass lone wolf and add more females to his harem.
 

Scars Unseen

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May 7, 2009
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Yeah, SAO was a bit of a disappointment to me. I can usually work around the fan service if the story is entertaining enough, but once SAO hit the Alfheim arc... incest, literal princess in the tower, rapey villain... I watched through it, hoping that it would get better, but it just didn't. Huge waste of an initially interesting premise.

If you can get past the fan service and harem aspects, Is it Wrong to Pick Up Girls in a Dungeon seems to be a SAO's best hits kind of show. The fights are pretty good, the hero is likable(though dense as a neutron star, as per harem sub-genre requirements), and in general the show seems to be better at SAO than SAO was.
 

gigastar

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Sep 13, 2010
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Hm, surprised to see this hasnt been posted.


And thats just the first anime season. Episode-by-episode teardown of the GGO arc can be found here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHhebk70xRo (Part 1)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRgk5ZL1MqQ (Part 2)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3MmI_oD-Vg (Part 3)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOoiTEMTfyk (Part 4)
 

Lightspeaker

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Thunderous Cacophony said:
I know you like anime, Escapists, and you've probably seen the rest of the show or maybe even read the source material.
I don't know where you got that impression from, at least pertaining to SAO. Its been made VERY clear around here on numerous occasions that its more or less de rigueur to hate on SAO.

For what its worth: I like the series. The first arc is pretty strong but finishes way too abruptly, as it does in the novel (which yes, I have read). As I understand it the story behind that is that the author was writing it for a short story competition thing, realised it was taking too long and going on too long, and then just cut it dead.

The second arc is...somewhat fairly maligned. As far as I'm concerned Asuna is probably the best character in the series and she spends the entire second arc being locked in a cage and creeped over which is simultaneously creepy and conveniently sidelines the best character in the series. That being said I have a soft spot for it simply because of Suguha who is my personal favourite character.

The third arc (start of season 2) goes a bit weird honestly with the whole GGO thing. It looks good and is quite flashy with a new setting and etc etc but some of the stuff in it is pretty silly. You really have to just switch your brain off for it to get through. I kinda enjoyed it but it felt a bit campy and over the top.

The fourth arc was...I don't even know what to say about it. Its this mini-arc before Mother's Rosario about the game world ending because the game decided to do that. Or something. Its probably the weirdest storyline of all of them and lacked any real impact for me. It wasn't BAD but it didn't really feel particularly compelling.

Mother's Rosario is the fifth and final arc released so far and is pretty much as good as the first arc. It focuses largely on Asuna (who I've already pointed out is probably the best character in the series) and is very touching. Don't want to say much more because you really should watch that one to experience it.


In short it has more ups and downs in terms of quality than a lot of things I've seen, largely due to the arcs differing so much from one another. Some are just clearly better than others. The best being the first arc and the last arc of S2.
 

KenAri

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Don't bother carrying on. The next series, with the guns and stuff, sets a really interesting and gritty world that I was actually very fascinated to see. But it very swiftly turns into another love story about some girl who spend half of every episode having flashbacks (The same ones, mind you), Kirito basically making his own rules up in the games, and another oh-so-necessary rape scene. The arc following that is basically just a harem sucking Kirito off for about 7 episodes, at which point I got bored and stopped.

As others have mentioned, you might like Log Horizon (Season 1 is fantastic, don't bother with season 2). Same sort of premise, but the characters aren't empty and there are no tentacle-monster-raping-schoolgirl scenes.
 

OldNewNewOld

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SAO is garbage. The only people praising it are people who have extremely low standards and those who love to selfinsert into Kirito and the "us gamers, huh?" mentality. Hurr durr, kurito such badas!
There isn't a single redeeming point in SAO. It took a great idea and turned it into shit. But what can you expect from something that's writen by a horny teenage guy who never played a single MMO in his life.
 
Jan 12, 2012
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Lightspeaker said:
Thunderous Cacophony said:
I know you like anime, Escapists, and you've probably seen the rest of the show or maybe even read the source material.
I don't know where you got that impression from, at least pertaining to SAO. Its been made VERY clear around here on numerous occasions that its more or less de rigueur to hate on SAO.
I don't go into anime threads that often, but I know there's many fans of the genre, and SAO crops up every time someone asks, "I want to get into anime, where do I start?" (a quick search of the forums will back me up)

And that you for the advice, folks. I'll go watch a palate cleanser and then see if I can find Log Horizon. Good to know I'm not just totally misreading the genre and anime fans see how awful it was. (and I guess I'll need to call those divisions 'arcs'; Do anime shows usually change their titles or add a '2' for the second season?)