Teen gets probation after killing 4 people - "Affluenza" Blamed

[Galen Marek]

My dad killed 2 people in a drunk driving accident. You people need to realize that guilt will follow this kid throughout his life. Honestly if my father hadn't of done that I think he'd probably be in jail or dead by now. Now he's a loving hardworking father and has been throughout his his life. Always trying to do the right thing.



EDIT- Oh yeah almost forgot the irony of my pathetic life. I was in a drunk driving accident as well and suffered a broken femur. One of the worst pains someone will ever have. Do I blame the driver no. Now I realize that this is way different from what happened here but kids will be stupid kids even if it costs the life of others. Throwing them in jail will not teach them anything.

Guilt Vs lose of life + Sadness/depression of more then 1 person.

We realize guilt, but his guilt is only a small factor. If someone feels guilty then they know they stuffed up and they have done something wrong. If you stuff up, there should be a greater reprecussion then just "guilt" (I mean no disrespect to your father but drink driving and killing someone isn't something just feeling "guilty" fixes).

This feels like a very lift sentence for such a crime. Underage drinking. Driving intoxicated. Killed 4 people. I don't think probation really fits the bill regardless if the boy feels guilty or not.

Probation is just rubbing salt into the very deep wounds that the families of these victims now have. Disappointing.

 

[tippy2k2]

I sincerely don't know how to feel about this.

On one hand, ten years of probation gives him the chance to turn around his very very young life. Another misstep and he's going to jail for at least a decade (according to CNN.com's story). I think the mistake has less to do with being rich and more to do with a young kid doing something INCREDIBLY fucking stupid.

On the other hand, is this sentence justice? By putting him in jail, you would be giving the surviving family members the justice of having this kids life taken from him just like their family members lives have been taken. It's easy for me to sit here and say "an eye for an eye will make the whole world go by" when my family member and friends have not just been killed.

Is an eye for an eye worth it here? Is destroying the kids life due to some VERY stupid actions worth it? I really don't know and am glad that I don't have to make that decision.

 

[Vivi22]

Right, so, clearly this is very silly and kind of appalling, but I know there's a lot of teens around these parts, and young twenties, and I wonder how you feel about this defense. Do you think being raised rich/spoiled constitutes some form of mental disability, to the point where it should be taken into consideration when sentencing is applied for a crime? We take other forms of problematic upbringing into consideration when sentencing (at least, hypothetically we do). Is neglect through over indulgence different than good old fashioned vanilla neglect?

I have no problem taking mitigating factors into account when it comes to sentencing. How a person was raised is obviously going to have an impact on if they start stealing, doing drugs, etc.

But when it comes to crimes like this, where the potential outcomes are obvious to anyone who's ever been preached to about the dangers of drinking and driving in school, or seen a TV ad made by MADD, there is no mitigating factor that should keep you out of prison. I don't believe for one second that kid wasn't aware that drinking and driving are dangerous, and he should be in jail.

Now we can argue that if he has a drinking problem, or if his upbringing played a role he should probably get treatment for alcoholism, or be eligible for parole sooner based on successful completion of a treatment program, etc. There are lot's of ways his sentence could be adjusted for mitigating circumstances. But getting probation for killing four people and severely injuring two more is disgusting. It may not have been intentional in the sense that he didn't intend to kill them, but he did kill them while intentionally committing another crime in which bodily harm to himself or others was likely. Last I checked things like that are supposed to be taken more seriously, not less.

One has to wonder if he'd have gotten off so easily if he were poor or a visible minority, or both.

 

[Dogstile]

His defense basically amounted to "screw the rules, I have money".

And it worked.

The fuck is wrong with people these days?

These days? This is the way of the world, the more money you have, the less you are given as a sentence. Its been this way for thousands of years.

 

[Rendark]

Kid needs to be put in jail for the rest of his life or maybe even put down. The kid is 16 he knows what he was doing.

 

[KingsGambit_v1legacy]

Tragic though the outcome is, the deaths aren't a "crime". He was responsible for causing an accident which led to the deaths. The difference is distinct. He lost control of the vehicle and the vehicle did the rest. Whoever says he should be jailed forever, WTF? He's not a killer, he's a stupid, irresponsible driver. He shouldn't be allowed to drive again, certainly, but to jail him like a murderer for an accident? What would that achieve?

Here's the thing, let's say he had the same accident but no one was hurt, instead he hit only a tree? Then what would his punishment be? Jailed for life? The fact that people died is tragic, but seeking to jail him for the accident which led to their deaths is punitive, it is not justice. It's revenge. I'm not suggesting such a thing go unpunished, but people need to a) realise it's a kid and b) the difference between killing someone in cold blood and someone dying indirectly because of a car accident.

 

[RJ 17]

Snip.

God damnit, Guppy, you ninja'd my topic! Well, apparently it's your topic since you beat me to the punch by a good...8 hours. But I was at work, damnit!

Ahhhh, but you did neglect to mention that along with his probation he gets to go to rehab! In California at a treatment center that his father is going to pay $500K for! Translation: go hang out with wasted celebrities at Club Med for a while.

Anyways, yeah, this is pretty ridiculous. Apparently the best way to address someone with a "psychological disorder" that causes them to believe that their family is far too rich for them to suffer any consequences is to...prove to them that their family is far too rich for them to suffer any consequences... >.>

 

[LetalisK]

Tragic though the outcome is, the deaths aren't a "crime". He was responsible for causing an accident which led to the deaths. The difference is distinct. He lost control of the vehicle and the vehicle did the rest. Whoever says he should be jailed forever, WTF? He's not a killer, he's a stupid, irresponsible driver. He shouldn't be allowed to drive again, certainly, but to jail him like a murderer for an accident? What would that achieve?

Here's the thing, let's say he had the same accident but no one was hurt, instead he hit only a tree? Then what would his punishment be? Jailed for life? The fact that people died is tragic, but seeking to jail him for the accident which led to their deaths is punitive, it is not justice. It's revenge. I'm not suggesting such a thing go unpunished, but people need to a) realise it's a kid and b) the difference between killing someone in cold blood and someone dying indirectly because of a car accident.

This is more or less my thought as well. I think the sentence was a bit light on the rehabilitative side of things, but I don't agree with the calls to string him up. Throwing him in prison as a murderer isn't going to help anything.

 

[Jolly Co-operator]

Kid needs to be put in jail for the rest of his life or maybe even put down. The kid is 16 he knows what he was doing.

"Put down"? What is he, a dog? And as for "he knew what he was doing", yes, he most likely knew that driving after drinking was an irresponsible thing to do, but I doubt he knew that he was going to kill someone; it's not like he wanted this to happen. That certainly doesn't justify his actions, but killing him isn't going to accomplish anything, other than the sating the blood-lust of internet arm-chair judges. Violence without practical application is simply petty.

As others have already said, ten years is a long time to be on probation. If he violates that some time down the line, he could very well end up being tried as an adult, with a much harsher sentence. Putting him in prison for the maximum 20 years for this (I think it's twenty, but even if it's not, the potential maximum for this offence is sure to be high)isn't likely to change him into a productive and functioning member of society. At least this way, there's a chance that he can recognize his mistake and make changes for the better. I'm not saying that that's a sure thing, and I know that feeling like he's just getting away with this is a gut-wrenching feeling to have. However, emotions aside, I'd much rather pick the option that at least has a chance of letting this kid turn himself around and live a positive life.

I understand your anger at this, but no amount of punishment or retribution is going to bring those people back.

 

[Caiphus]

Well, it seems that the judge didn't buy the argument. And the expert witness called by the defence seems... shady. I dunno.

But yeah, poor upbringing should be a factor when dealing with juvenile cases. And having no direction or discipline from parents should probably be one factor of poor upbringing.

But in the end, if the judge didn't accept the defence, then it doesn't really matter. The defence could have said "But the boy is actually from an alien planet where drink driving is legal", and then we'd get headlines saying "Boy given light sentence after killing 4 people, aliens blamed." even if it made no difference. No?

 

[zumbledum]

hmm i dont get it , this was in texas ? you murder 4 people in texas and dont get to sit down in the chair? oh wait hes only 16... not like merica executes minors ^^

 

[Kuilui]

Well I mean he only brutally murdered four people with his truck, while intoxicated. Eh a slap on the wrist and off you go sport. *Facepalm* *Sigh*. Well just reading this gave me a headache from the utter stupidity. I see a lot of therapy in this kids future or drugs and early death from not being able to handle the guilt of slaughtering people.

I have a friend who about 12 years ago was driving a forklift at 15 years old in a warehouse, illegally, might have been intoxicated. He ran someone in the place over with it and killed him. They didn't do anything to him. I don't even think he got probation. I wonder what goes through his mind, I'm sure he still thinks about it. I guess minors can just get away with that stuff here in America. What I just said took place in New York by the way.

 

[AntiChri5]

Drunk driving needs to be reclassified as criminal stupidity and negligence. Anyone who harms someone else while driving drunk needs to have to face serious consequences.

But oh no, poor little drunk dumbass just made a single mistake. Well too fucking bad. People. Are. Dead.

There are laws against driving drunk for a fucking REASON. But no, every fucknut thinks that they are the exception. The one person whose fine to drive. Fucks sake.

Yes, he didn't decide to kill anybody. But he made a series of decisions which made him a danger to every body and ended with four people dead.

 

[Jux]

I'm all for rehabilitative methods as opposed to punitive ones, so as far as the sentence goes, I don't have much of a problem. Assuming he is prohibited from alchohol for the duration of the probation, I really hope they're testing him multiple times a week randomly.

As for the defense? Rage inducing.

 

[MrDumpkins]

Being white and wealthy in America will get you that privilege. I'm surprised that people are surprised.

This sums it up, the dad wants to send him to a correctional facility in california that costs $450,000 a year instead of prison.

I understand that sending a 16 year old to prison isn't going to help, but if he seriously gets to kill 4 people and wound many others and just ends having to go to a spa rehab facility that's just wrong. He should be sent to mental institution and be treated the same way other people without money should be. All this is going to teach him is that manslaugher is ok as long as you have money. But then again, in America, you can do any crime you want and get out free if you have a lot of money.

If I was a family member of one of those killed in this accident I'd be appalled if he gets away with 10 years in a luxury rehab facility.

 

[idarkphoenixi]

This basically translates into = "He grew up not realising that actions have consequences...So let's continue that fact by making sure his actions don't have consequences."

One guy who was in the vehicle now has massive brain damage and can't move by himself. So that's 4 dead and one who's entire life has been destroyed. A second passenger has several broken bones and internal damages.

Essentially he's too rich to go to jail. Any "normal" person would be put away for the rest of their lives.

It's just sickening. And now that "affluenza" has officially been ruled a solid legal defence, we can expect to see a lot more of this.

 

[EternallyBored]

This basically translates into = "He grew up not realising that actions have consequences...So let's continue that fact by making sure his actions don't have consequences."

One guy who was in the vehicle now has massive brain damage and can't move by himself. So that's 4 dead and one who's entire life has been destroyed. A second passenger has several broken bones and internal damages.

Essentially he's too rich to go to jail. Any "normal" person would be put away for the rest of their lives.

It's just sickening. And now that "affluenza" has officially been ruled a solid legal defence, we can expect to see a lot more of this.

No, no they wouldn't, even a poor as dirt juvenile would have spent a few years in prison max. Pretty much anything outside of intentional murder will result in a juvenile being released around 21 at the latest, in most cases he likely would have been jailed until 18 and then released on severe probation, automatically kicked into the adult system upon violation.

Being rich got him a good lawyer, it didn't buy him magical super law powers, and even then, the judge rejected the "affluenza" defense, so no, it's not a solid legal defense just yet. What that lawyer got him was a plea deal with the judge that extended his probation well into adulthood, in lieu of jail time, he gets severely restricted rights, with the stipulation that if he even so much as blinks at his probation officer wrong, he goes right back to court in the adult system and likely serves the full 10-20 years that gets given to adults (so even if he was a poor adult, he wouldn't have gotten anything close to a life sentence).

The kid didn't circumvent the legal system, I've seen poor kids get off with only slightly more severe punishments in similar cases, Juvenile manslaughter doesn't have the severity in our legal system that some people here seem to think it does, but that has little to do with a kid having rich parents.

 

[JoJo]

Essentially he's too rich to go to jail. Any "normal" person would be put away for the rest of their lives.

I agree with the rest of what you posted but this part, not really. The maximum possible sentence was 20 years and realistically since he was a juvenile, the chances of them being able to hold him past the age of 21 is rather remote. This would apply equally to a 'normal' person too, no-one's going to be deliberately put away for the rest of their life for manslaughter and especially not a minor.

 

[Sarge034]

Tragic though the outcome is, the deaths aren't a "crime". He was responsible for causing an accident which led to the deaths. The difference is distinct. He lost control of the vehicle and the vehicle did the rest. Whoever says he should be jailed forever, WTF? He's not a killer, he's a stupid, irresponsible driver. He shouldn't be allowed to drive again, certainly, but to jail him like a murderer for an accident? What would that achieve?

Interesting, but I'm of the opinion that drinking and driving that results in a fatality, other than that of said intoxicated driver, is comparable to premeditated murder. HE did kill those people. HE decided to drink and drive. HE failed to safely operate the vehicle because HE was intoxicated. THOSE people died because of it.

As for what it would achieve... It would achieve justice. Explained below.

Here's the thing, let's say he had the same accident but no one was hurt, instead he hit only a tree? Then what would his punishment be? Jailed for life?

No. One count of all these real laws the driver would have broken in that scenario.

1)Underage drinking
2)DUI
3)Criminal negligence
4)Reckless endangerment
5)Failure to control a motor vehicle

The fact that people died is tragic, but seeking to jail him for the accident which led to their deaths is punitive, it is not justice. It's revenge. I'm not suggesting such a thing go unpunished, but people need to a) realise it's a kid and b) the difference between killing someone in cold blood and someone dying indirectly because of a car accident.

First we need to define what justice is. I'm serious, there are so many interpretations of what "justice" is that it helps to see where people stand on the matter before hand. I kind of have a similar view as Ra's Al Ghul in the Batman universe. Justice is balance, equality. This becomes a slightly grey area in some cases, such as this. This person took 4 innocent lives, but I will not take 4 lives in response. I would say equality is simply a life for a life. His death will satisfy the balance for each death individually. At this point most people respond with, "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind." and I would respond with, "Only if the entire world broke the law. If they did then they deserved it." I mean just look at the "mascot" for justice, aptly named "Blind Justice". Justice is blind to ensure equality. Justice weighs the evidence to determine a verdict. Justice looses consequences with her sword when appropriate.

Spoiler

A) 16 is old enough to know drinking and driving is irresponsible, reckless, and dangerous.

B) He killed them when he decided to drink and drive.

My dad killed 2 people in a drunk driving accident. You people need to realize that guilt will follow this kid throughout his life. Honestly if my father hadn't of done that I think he'd probably be in jail or dead by now. Now he's a loving hardworking father and has been throughout his his life. Always trying to do the right thing.



EDIT- Oh yeah almost forgot the irony of my pathetic life. I was in a drunk driving accident as well and suffered a broken femur. One of the worst pains someone will ever have. Do I blame the driver no. Now I realize that this is way different from what happened here but kids will be stupid kids even if it costs the life of others. Throwing them in jail will not teach them anything.

So let me make sure I understand this. Your father killed 2 people drinking and driving and then you went on to drink and drive. That guilt seems to have done a lot of good.

OT- In direct response to the article, this kid needs to watch his back. He will be hit with wrongful death lawsuits at the least and at the most I believe someone might make an attempt on his life. I can't condone murder, but in these family's position I can understand why someone might do something like that.

 

[Rob Robson]

No matter what you've done, you never deserve to be locked up for life before you're an adult. Ever.

The reasons are not important, a 16 year old is not a candidate for a life sentence.

Then again, I bet most rednecks will disagree.