The American standards: Arrogance, ignorance, forgetfulness, or asocial?

[Legion]

I don't mean to be a nitpicker, but the fact that 31.9% (Yea, I use the awesome period as a decimal mark) of the people on these forums are American doesn't make us a minority. We are, in fact, the largest ethnic group (Is that the right term?) by 6.7%.

That's what I thought.
The world isn't divided into Americans and Non-Americans OP.

 

[Lord George]

I don't think its that much of a problem, I understand most American terms (through all the American television and Film that is constantly around) and if I don't understand a term I'll ask or look it up. Though I have noticed I have to inform Americans about many British terms such as Chav, Pikey, Sixth Form, A levels, GCSE and wanker to name a few.

I also find it hilarious that the fanny refers to the opposite of the English usage and thus confuse many of my American friends by bursting into laughter.

 

[Theissen]

Let me clear up one thing: I don't mean linguistic terms in particular, but also how about their society and how it works.

To bring some examples:
College/high school (What's what and when do you attend?)
Healthcare (How does it even work in the first place?)
Politics (Are there only really 2 parties? I'm fairly into this one myself)
Stereotypes based on state
Religion (Some are very into, some are not, but what about the specifics?)

I reread my first post and I can see why some people took offence. I'll look into it later today if I have time to rewrite it. Bear in mind I wrote it at 2 am. Poor excuse, I know.

My point is not so much to bash America. Rather, it's to understand it, but the information I'm looking for is not the kind of stuff you would find on Wikipedia.

I'm sorry if anyone feel offended.

Disclaimer: This is not a rant about America or anything related to it.

A trend is appearing on internet forums. Undeniably, Americans are notable on forums that contains international communities, such as The Escapist. In a recent poll, Americans make up 31,7 % of this forum. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.109602#1892120] Seeing as they basically are a minority, one would think that they would have to explain their country.

What is this? 31,7 % ?!?! 31% or 7%, is that what you mean?

I actually know that you're indicating thirty-one and seven-tenths percent (in the US we write that 31.7%) but I think I've made my point.

Pretty ironic when you consider the content of the OP, don't you think?

I think he's being funny. I laughed when I read it

Truthfully I rarely if ever receive requests to explain basic functions of America. On the other hand I (and other Americans) do seem to query about things happening in other societies with some frequency.

This perhaps leads to the assumption that most people know what "we" are talking about, but then again if nobody ever asks for information there is no way to really tell.

I do think that America dominates largely though the spread of ideas and that a good portion of the world is fairly well informed about America. Heck, it seems like the entire globe watches American national elections with baited breath (because we are the dominant world power mostly) and everyone certainly seems to have opinions on things like the Presidential election no matter where they are from.

That is simply my experience. I don't think I've ever had anyone need me to explain to them what the office of the President is, what exactly it does, the political parties, or even who is involved. On the other hand I have in the past had to ask for information about some pretty high offices in other nations when people have made referances.

>>>----Therumancer--->

Yay for good answers. Thank you.


EDIT: I just read the whole thread again. Let me underline that:
I don't mean linguistic terms in particular
I don't mean linguistic terms in particular
I don't mean linguistic terms in particular
I don't mean linguistic terms in particular
I don't mean linguistic terms in particular

 

[Theissen]

Come to think of it, British people are just as bad. Someone mentioned "chavs" earlier. Like him, I have no idea what it means.

I suppose it's not fair to call this an American trend. Though I do think that they are "worse" than most other nationalities in regards to explaining themselves.

 

[Lonko]

I think he's being funny. I laughed when I read it

I was referring to the use of commas in your decimals rather than fullstops, which would confuse any American not familiar with such usage.

 

[S.H.A.R.P.]

Yeah, silly North-Americans, using words like Sulfur, instead of Sulphur. Airplane, instead of aeroplane. Theorize instead of Theorise.

Seriously though, it is understandable that North Americans talk use their own terms for certain things. For example, describing their educational system would be rather annoying if you can't use terms like junior high and freshman and stuff.

I as a Dutchman am a minority, and when I explain something I tend to be general in my wordings. I try and use British English if I can, but beyond that I am already adjusting myself because I'm talking a foreign language. If I want to explain my school system, I just talk about the ages of students, because the North American school system is too weird and different for me.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_and_British_English_differences
This is a useful link to see what kinds of differences there can be between North Americans and the Brits. There are quite a lot.

By the way, have you noticed my use of North in North-Americans?

 

[Theissen]

Political jargon, for example. But since most American political discussions are made between Americans, I fail to see the issue here. Not to mention that Australians, Britons and so on are just as guilty. Not to mention that if you're going to discuss the politics of a foreign country with someone from that country, the onus is on you to understand their political terms, not on them to explain the terms.

i completely agree with this point.

if you're going to discuss something, whether it be american educational / political system, or cantonese cuisine, you should know what you're talking about. it's each person's responsibility to understand what they're talking about if they plan to bring something worthwhile to the table.

Well, that's just the point. You are effectively leaving out many people of a discussion. Sure, the only people who most likely have an interest in the subject are people already into the stuff. But anyone that has gaps in their knowledge about a subject are left out of the discussion. Completely.

Personally, I would never start a subject discussing Danish politics without some heavy explaining to start with. I know that Denmark is 60 times smaller than USA, but that's not the point

 

[scott91575]

To a one misconception....

The United States spends the second most on international tourism of any country in the world. Add to the fact that 3 of the other top four are European countries (UK, Germany, France) where traveling internationally is about the same for most Americans traveling 1 or 2 states over and you get a better picture. The US and Europe are about the same size. You have to realize a trip from Chicago to Miami is about the same as London to Sicily, and New York to Los Angeles is like traveling from Moscow to Lisbon . So not only do Americans have a huge country in which they travel themselves, they also travel internationally rather well in comparison. I am willing to bet if you eliminated "international" from Europeans traveling within Europe, the United States would be the number one international travel country by a large margin (or if you instead included interstate travel into the US numbers the same would be true).

The only reason Europeans travel more internationally is because international travel in Europe is much easier.

 

[scott91575]

Political jargon, for example. But since most American political discussions are made between Americans, I fail to see the issue here. Not to mention that Australians, Britons and so on are just as guilty. Not to mention that if you're going to discuss the politics of a foreign country with someone from that country, the onus is on you to understand their political terms, not on them to explain the terms.

i completely agree with this point.

if you're going to discuss something, whether it be american educational / political system, or cantonese cuisine, you should know what you're talking about. it's each person's responsibility to understand what they're talking about if they plan to bring something worthwhile to the table.

Well, that's just the point. You are effectively leaving out many people of a discussion. Sure, the only people who most likely have an interest in the subject are people already into the stuff. But anyone that has gaps in their knowledge about a subject are left out of the discussion. Completely.

Personally, I would never start a subject discussing Danish politics without some heavy explaining to start with. I know that Denmark is 60 times smaller than USA, but that's not the point

I assume you are from Denmark. If you were to start a thread about Danish politics I would not expect you to explain things in detail.

I am from the US. Laws and political structures are unique to each state (something I don't think many other people understand...the US is a confederation of states which all have unique laws). Yet when someone from another state starts a discussion on their politics I don't expect them to give a summation of their differences. If I am interested I make it a point to learn the differences, or ask. Same goes for foreign countries. Possibly that is part of the fundamental difference. Things within the US are so different within the same country it is impossible to start every conversation with a synopsis of the differences. People just talk. Not with the understanding that people already understand, but with the knowledge that if you don't understand you will ask.

 

[Lonko]

Political jargon, for example. But since most American political discussions are made between Americans, I fail to see the issue here. Not to mention that Australians, Britons and so on are just as guilty. Not to mention that if you're going to discuss the politics of a foreign country with someone from that country, the onus is on you to understand their political terms, not on them to explain the terms.

i completely agree with this point.

if you're going to discuss something, whether it be american educational / political system, or cantonese cuisine, you should know what you're talking about. it's each person's responsibility to understand what they're talking about if they plan to bring something worthwhile to the table.

Well, that's just the point. You are effectively leaving out many people of a discussion. Sure, the only people who most likely have an interest in the subject are people already into the stuff. But anyone that has gaps in their knowledge about a subject are left out of the discussion. Completely.

Personally, I would never start a subject discussing Danish politics without some heavy explaining to start with. I know that Denmark is 60 times smaller than USA, but that's not the point

Completely? Hardly. All a newcomer with an interest in the subject has to do is ask that it be explained. It's not an American's fault for assuming that someone interested in American politics would have a basic knowledge of the jargon. The only people who would be completely left out of the discussion are those unwilling to do a little research. If you're unwilling to learn about something, how can you expect to make a meaningful contribution to the discussion? Those willing to learn are perfectly capable of doing so, those not willing have no place in the discussion to begin with. It's not difficult.

 

[Theissen]

I assume you are from Denmark. If you were to start a thread about Danish politics I would not expect you to explain things in detail.

I am from the US. Laws and political structures are unique to each state (something I don't think many other people understand...the US is a confederation of states which all have unique laws). Yet when someone from another state starts a discussion on their politics I don't expect them to give a summation of their differences. If I am interested I make it a point to learn the differences, or ask. Same goes for foreign countries. Possibly that is part of the fundamental difference. Things within the US are so different within the same country it is impossible to start every conversation with a synopsis of the differences. People just talk. Not with the understanding that people already understand, but with the knowledge that if you don't understand you will ask.

Completely? Hardly. All a newcomer with an interest in the subject has to do is ask that it be explained. It's not an American's fault for assuming that someone interested in American politics would have a basic knowledge of the jargon. The only people who would be completely left out of the discussion are those unwilling to do a little research. If you're unwilling to learn about something, how can you expect to make a meaningful contribution to the discussion? Those willing to learn are perfectly capable of doing so, those not willing have no place in the discussion to begin with. It's not difficult.

I guess it depends on your target audience. If I ever came to a political debate in the US, there's no way I would expect everything explained to me. Or if I came to an American politics forum, I don't expect them to explain anything to me.

But being on the Escapist, a site devoted to games, I expect a little bit of explanation to outsiders on subjects taken up here. If someone decides to talk about Democrats, it's all good. Obviously, the target audience for that poster is other Americans, but it's important to notice that this isn't a forum for Americans only*. If you want to discuss national politics, sure, but at least offer some explanation for outsiders.

Depending on the situation, Lonko, you are right. I probably should go do some researching myself if I want to enter the discussion. I just don't think that The Escapist is one of those situations

 

[syndicated44]

To say that all Americans are ignorant shows ignorance. If you hate America hate it for the right reasons not because a few people on a forum talk differently then others.

 

[scott91575]

I assume you are from Denmark. If you were to start a thread about Danish politics I would not expect you to explain things in detail.

I am from the US. Laws and political structures are unique to each state (something I don't think many other people understand...the US is a confederation of states which all have unique laws). Yet when someone from another state starts a discussion on their politics I don't expect them to give a summation of their differences. If I am interested I make it a point to learn the differences, or ask. Same goes for foreign countries. Possibly that is part of the fundamental difference. Things within the US are so different within the same country it is impossible to start every conversation with a synopsis of the differences. People just talk. Not with the understanding that people already understand, but with the knowledge that if you don't understand you will ask.

Completely? Hardly. All a newcomer with an interest in the subject has to do is ask that it be explained. It's not an American's fault for assuming that someone interested in American politics would have a basic knowledge of the jargon. The only people who would be completely left out of the discussion are those unwilling to do a little research. If you're unwilling to learn about something, how can you expect to make a meaningful contribution to the discussion? Those willing to learn are perfectly capable of doing so, those not willing have no place in the discussion to begin with. It's not difficult.

I guess it depends on your target audience. If I ever came to a political debate in the US, there's no way I would expect everything explained to me. Or if I came to an American politics forum, I don't expect them to explain anything to me.

But being on the Escapist, a site devoted to games, I expect a little bit of explanation to outsiders on subjects taken up here. If someone decides to talk about Democrats, it's all good. Obviously, the target audience for that poster is other Americans, but it's important to notice that this isn't a forum for Americans only*. If you want to discuss national politics, sure, but at least offer some explanation for outsiders.

Depending on the situation, Lonko, you are right. I probably should go do some researching myself if I want to enter the discussion. I just don't think that The Escapist is one of those situations

The problem is, how is someone supposed to know what you don't understand? Do you need a 50 page thesis on the basis of US governmental structure, or a simple explanation that a Democrat is part of 1 party in a 2 party system (huge oversimplification). Much easier to state your point and answer questions on what is not understood.

BTW...every time a come here I see jargon and ideals that are not common to a US only site. If I want to know, I ask. I don't complain that someone is not explaining things for me.

 

[Flying-Emu]

A counterquestion: Why do British people on these boards assume that everyone knows what a chav is?

It's simple slang/lingo logic. We use the words in our daily speech and subconsciously expect others to understand them. If they don't, we regard them strangely because they, by proving their lack of knowledge, have shown that they are not "with" the crowd. Therefore, they are strange. The human mind therefore classifies them under "Mystery", which invariably includes the subheading "Danger".

I want it to be clear I'm not dangerous when I say this, but what
is a "chav" exactly? A friend?

Exactly. I have no clue.

 

[la-le-lu-li-lo]

I personally wouldn't enter a dicussion without understanding something of what's being discussed.

Though if someone wanted to join a discussion I was having but was confused on a point, I'd happily explain as long as they were polite and not blatently idiotic.

So in the end it's all about compromise.

 

[hippykiller]

Fuck America and its EVIL,LIBERAL WAYS!

See, I think it's this way of thinking that prevents the world from truly uniting Star Trek style. What a wonderful world it would be if we could all just be happy being human together.

Don't complain at us. You're on the internet and you're complaining about a lack of information. If you don't have a Google searchbar on your browser then tell me otherwise.

Logic always wins.

you want to hear logic? every American tourist i have ever meet is the same as all of the others. LIBERAL! they think UNBORN BABY KILLING OK. oh and they claim to be catholic. all of them. now isn't that fucked up? now you tell me why i should get along with those people.

 

[OuroborosChoked]

Yeah, silly North-Americans,
[...]
By the way, have you noticed my use of North in North-Americans?

I c what u did thar...

And it's just as stupid every time someone else does it.

Name me one other country in North, Central, or South America that uses "America" in their name.

Ohthat'sright... there isn't another one... and you're not about to get anyone to start calling Americans USA-ers or United Statesians.

We're the Americans. Get over it.

If you're Canadian, you're Canadian. You have a nationality. If you want to say you're an "American", say you're a North American from Canada. Pretty simple, isn't it?

All this hoopla is over nothing. From what I can tell, a bunch of lazy Europeans are whining because they can't refer to Canadians as Americans instead of North Americans... as if referring to people by their continent is the best way to address someone or respond when someone asks where you're from. You'd still have to explain what country you're from...

Even if these... whoever they are trying to make a fuss over this... get their way, you'd STILL HAVE TO DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN THE THREE REGIONS. It's pointless and stupid.

 

[S.H.A.R.P.]

Yeah, silly North-Americans,
[...]
By the way, have you noticed my use of North in North-Americans?

I c what u did thar...

And it's just as stupid every time someone else does it.

Name me one other country in North, Central, or South America that uses "America" in their name.

Ohthat'sright... there isn't another one... and you're not about to get anyone to start calling Americans USA-ers or United Statesians.

We're the Americans. Get over it.

If you're Canadian, you're Canadian. You have a nationality. If you want to say you're an "American", say you're a North American from Canada. Pretty simple, isn't it?

All this hoopla is over nothing. From what I can tell, a bunch of lazy Europeans are whining because they can't refer to Canadians as Americans instead of North Americans... as if referring to people by their continent is the best way to address someone or respond when someone asks where you're from. You'd still have to explain what country you're from...

Even if these... whoever they are trying to make a fuss over this... get their way, you'd STILL HAVE TO DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN THE THREE REGIONS. It's pointless and stupid.

Eh... I was saying North America, because a friend of mine originates from South America, Chilli to be more precise. It always irks her to hear the USA referred to as America. America is a super continent, which also contains South America and her home country. Isn't it a bit pretentious to call your country the name of more than what it is?

That said, I'm not very serious about this. There's no way people will stop referring the US as America, and I myself even do it from time to time. And it's not like I want to refer Canadians as North Americans or anything. Even though I'm a lazy European.