The 'Beautiful People' in media, Why does Hollywood/Media still sexualise nearly EVERYTHING.

[Vegosiux]

Well...is it an insult if it's true?

It can be. An insult often becomes an insult through what isn't being explicitly said. Calling a gay man "gay" with a derisive, mocking tone is an insult, I think we'd agree - because the tone implies there's something wrong with being gay; not simply because his homosexuality was pointed out, while technically true.

There's also the "Calling that idiot dumb as a rock would be an insult to rocks" thing, I've actually seen people take offense from an insult directed at somebody else because "How dare you compare that idiot to me", if it was a tactless one.

As for "beautiful people" problem, well...

Spoiler: I kind of like this clip

The tried and true tactic of "make people unhappy with themselves so that they'll be willing to buy shit you're selling them", that's what it is. I find that rather annoying.

 

[shootthebandit]

It's like what Charlie Brooker pointed out on Screen Wipe a few weeks ago. Did the french media and people care about their Presidents alleged affair and mystery romance with another women? Heck no. But did the UK media get obsessed about it and had it on every newspaper and channel? YES. Did we Brits actually give a damn. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. So who exactly thinks we need all this nonsense when we don't?

Thats why I think people like charlie brooker are amazing because they challenge society. As a straight man im all for seeing good looking women on the TV but I think its got to the point now where we judge people too much on there looks/sexuality. This is partially the reason why our homosexual brethren still face a lot of discrimination. Its also the reason why women (and increasing with men) have inrealistic expectations for themselves.

In mainland europe sex is not a taboo and people are more educated and diverse when it comes to sex. Amsterdam has a huge LGBT community and its no coincidence that they are also one of the most sexually open countries in the world. We have so much to learn from mainland especially when it comes to the likes of the story highlighted by charlie brooker

 

[nuttshell]

...I find it insulting...Thinking the notion of 'sex sells' work today. Yes I know it been happening for decades and centuries but that's my point. Don't they think we have moved on from that or do they still assume we want everything 'sexy'.

You got it all wrong, mate. It's a sign of good will. They are basically saying: "Yeah, we know that what we produce is garbage, here are some Tits, Ass and Abs to make your stay at our place less of a chore."

If Mass Effect 2 didn't have Miranda's Ass all over the place, I would have thrown it into the dumpster and burnt it right away, instead of later.

 

[Insanity_Incarnate]

To put it simply- if I could look at a good looking person, or an ugly person... Well, as Kevin Bacon loves to say 'it's a no brainer'

isn't Frankenstein's monster mean't to be made up of several body parts?

Just wanted to correct you on this, however. I read the book recently and I'm pretty sure the monster isn't made from other body parts, that's only what films have projected to emphasise the horror element which wasn't really there in the book apart from the premise.

Actually he was, in the book Frankenstein was so obsessed with making his monster perfect that he selected only the most beautiful body parts he could find to make his creation, but he still found it hideous at the end (either because he was horrified at what he had done or because it was imperfect in some other way). So in a way a beautiful monster is the most faithful creation to what is described in the book.

 

[Ihateregistering1]

Sex sells.

I mean, that's really all there is to it. They've done lots and lots of studies on this, and people (and this includes men and women, looking at both men and women) enjoy looking at people they perceive as attractive more than they like looking at people perceived as unattractive. In the case of movies and television, more people looking=more money. It's really not much more complex than that.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/wired-success/201108/why-we-pay-more-attention-beautiful-people

 

[Alssadar]

One thing I have to offer is that most actors' selling points are their appearance and acting ability. Some can manage without the former, but most can't manage without either.
Guys who take military roles chose to buff up because they need to portray soldiers who have muscle. The idealized portrayal of women is skinny with curves, so actresses sometimes alter themselves to make it so. By doing this, sure, they're perpetuating the stereotype, but they're getting paid. And in the acting business, you need to get paid.
Also, have you seen any non-attractive people in Hollywood? They're either: 1) not on screen, 2) you're being judgmental, or 3) the make-up department is doing their job and making them look good. They have to work hard -- Give them some credit.

 

[Adam Jensen_v1legacy]

It's actually quite simple. Aside from actual artists, show business also attracts a certain kind of people. Shallow people with no talents or any other real value to society. Just like how big video game publishers think that every shooter must be a CoD clone and every MMO a WoW clone, these shallow show businessmen think that every person must look and behave the same to be successful. It doesn't matter how many times you prove them wrong, they will never get the fuckin' message.

 

[Sarge034]

Snip

The short answer is that sex still sells.

The long answer is that our subconscious is hardwired to favor people who are more fit to breed with and our brains make that determination by appearances.

HOWEVER, I think it goes in the "opposite" direction too and ad agencies are starting to learn this. Used to be a time not too long ago that you had to be a <90 pound twig of a woman to be a model but now modeling agencies are showing a range of weights and body styles that are still considered "slim". The reason being that the "twig" body style actually turns off more people than it entices because our brains subconsciously realize that something is off. Our subconscious perceives the lack of weight as an indicator of a terminal illness or other problem detrimental to her health and as such to perceive her as an unfit mate.


As tired as I am of the unrealistic portrayal in movies and tv that "every" (generalization, yes I know there are exceptions) woman is fit and toned, I can't say I would change it. Hear me out. If the same script was made twice and the ONLY thing different was the body type of the woman which would you choose? I'm a man, I think with both heads whether I want to or not...

TLDR- Sex still sells and subconsciously you know it.

 

[Parasondox]

One thing I have to offer is that most actors' selling points are their appearance and acting ability. Some can manage without the former, but most can't manage without either.
Guys who take military roles chose to buff up because they need to portray soldiers who have muscle. The idealized portrayal of women is skinny with curves, so actresses sometimes alter themselves to make it so. By doing this, sure, they're perpetuating the stereotype, but they're getting paid. And in the acting business, you need to get paid.
Also, have you seen any non-attractive people in Hollywood? They're either: 1) not on screen, 2) you're being judgmental, or 3) the make-up department is doing their job and making them look good. They have to work hard -- Give them some credit.

I know actors and actresses work really really hard and they do so much for each role that their health is often effected in the future. I 100% respect them and have no problem with them, it's there job. It's more on the lines of several executives and PR people and others that obsess about the perception of beauty, that often goes too far.

Okay maybe the US and the UK are different when it comes to this like for example soap operas. Yours in the US is completely different to ours. I remember a few years ago the BBC did a same documentary on this and had several Americans watch British soaps like Eastenders and Coronation Street and had to comment on what they thought on it. The majority liked it because they thought it was actually showcasing how people look and act in real life, eg. not having make up on as soon as they wake up, wearing everyday clothes that aren't designer wear and lack of product placement. They preferred the real life feel to it because it made them feel comfortable that not all the actors and actresses are "beautiful" and "made up". They then had several Britons watching American soaps and where told to comment what they thought and say. Some liked it because it was more over the top storylines, the characters were more glamorous and music that made the scenes more intense provoking emotions.

So really I think it plays on how each country sees "beauty". In Europe, not everything have to be "sexy" in order to sell the simplest things. Maybe another factor is how American drama and European drama are different to one another.

 

[Uhura]

In Europe, not everything have to be "sexy" in order to sell the simplest things.

I feel like there is a clear difference between how Europeans and Americans approach sex and sexiness in media.
- the US media/Hollywood is obsessing over beautiful people, sexiness and titillation (in movies and all kinds of advertisements) but portraying actual sex remains a taboo (at least in the mainstream media)
- In the "western Europe" it's not a taboo to portray sex and nudity in movies. Actors don't have to look like the "Hollywood ideal" to be in movies/sex scenes and there is also plenty of non-sexual nudity movies.

I guess that's why I sometimes find the portrayal of women in mainstream American movies/games off putting. It seems so repressed.

 

[Parasondox]

In Europe, not everything have to be "sexy" in order to sell the simplest things.

I feel like there is a clear difference between how Europeans and Americans approach sex and sexiness in media.
- the US media/Hollywood is obsessing over beautiful people, sexiness and titillation (in movies and all kinds of advertisements) but portraying actual sex remains a taboo (at least in the mainstream media)
- In the "western Europe" it's not a taboo to portray sex and nudity in movies. Actors don't have to look like the "Hollywood ideal" to be in movies/sex scenes and there is also plenty of non-sexual nudity movies.

I guess that's why I sometimes find the portrayal of women in mainstream American movies/games off putting. It seems so repressed.

You have a great point. I don't how the US media/Hollywood is obsessed of beautiful things and beautiful pets and beautiful everything and the notion of "sex sell" and at the same time as soon as there is a wardrobe malfunction or a sex scene, it goes straight too;

"GOOD GOD ALMIGHTY, they are having sex/their boobs fell out and it's wrong wrong wrong, think of the children please think of the children, that person should apologise (then they make a pupic apology), blah blah blah" - it was an accident, her dress fell apart (Remember the Janet Jackson/Justin Timberlake Superbowl situation?) I mean you have cheerleaders at sports games in next to nothing so all of a sudden partial nudity warrants an angry mob?

"Robin Thicke has topless women in the uncensored version of his video" - Have you not seen other rap videos of the past 20 years? Have you not seen Heavy Metal/Rock videos in the past 30/40 years? The Robin Thicke video was barely... well it was barely anything.

Okay can someone honestly explain to me why that is? Why "sex sells" is apparently great for everything but actually sex and partial nudity is a taboo subject and deemed bad which will result in an angry mob??

 

[Uhura]

- it was an accident, her dress fell apart (Remember the Janet Jackson/Justin Timberlake Superbowl situation?) I mean you have cheerleaders at sports games in next to nothing so all of a sudden partial nudity warrants an angry mob?

"Robin Thicke has topless women in the uncensored version of his video" - Have you not seen other rap videos of the past 20 years? Have you not seen Heavy Metal/Rock videos in the past 30/40 years? The Robin Thicke video was barely... well it was barely anything.

Okay can someone honestly explain to me why that is? Why "sex sells" is apparently great for everything but actually sex and partial nudity is a taboo subject and deemed bad which will result in an angry mob??

I think some of the ire stems from the context, not the sex/nudity in itself. I remember the Janet Jackson/Timberlake scandal (I don't think it was an accident, she had some kind of rhinestone star covering her nipple) and while I think the response to the incident was overblown, I can understand why people didn't think the performance was appropriate for the event. I'm personally more annoyed with the way sexuality and nudity is dealt with in movies, which have clear narrative reasons for the portrayal of sex/nudity. The MPAA seems to have a huge issue with portrayals of female sexuality in movies.

Also, from my experience people who hated the Robin Thicke video were not just upset about the nudity. They were put off by the skeevy lyrics of the song combined with the decision of putting topless women in the video as props. I thought the whole thing was gross.

 

[Parasondox]

I think some of the ire stems from the context, not the sex/nudity in itself. I remember the Janet Jackson/Timberlake scandal (I don't think it was an accident, she had some kind of rhinestone star covering her nipple) and while I think the response to the incident was overblown, I can understand why people didn't think the performance was appropriate for the event. I'm personally more annoyed with the way sexuality and nudity is dealt with in movies, which have clear narrative reasons for the portrayal of sex/nudity. The MPAA seems to have a huge issue with portrayals of female sexuality in movies.

Also, from my experience people who hated the Robin Thicke video were not just upset about the nudity. They were put off by the skeevy lyrics of the song combined with the decision of putting topless women in the video as props. I thought the whole thing was gross.

You mean how the MPAA is okay supporting scenes where a women is involved in sexual torture and violence for "entertainment reasons" but if a women wants to express her own sexuality, they would rather censor that or just give that movie a higher rating? Yeah the MPAA is really guilty of that and as many have mentioned, it's a very misogynistic showing from them. "Oh no, a women is expressing her sexuality that doesn't involve violence, distress and torture... CENSOR IT!", that right there is shameful.

I understand their anger also at the performance but I don't hear the same outcry when other singers like Rhianna, or Katy Perry and others do the same thing. Maybe it's there but I don't hear a loud horn being blown about it. As I recall, Justin ripped something off of Janet's top, her diamond/star nipple popped out and that became news media gold.

Yeah that music video was just a huge mess with massive insults and creepy lyrics but I must question why hasn't worse things in the past haven't gotten much outcry. Half the rap lyrics today are about "bitches, hoes, money, treating women like crap and as if they are worthless. I think it's wrong and degrading to women but for some reason Robin Thicke gets most of the attention.

 

[Gigano]

Because it works.

No one will care that you are insulted by something, if 99 people will simultaneously buy it. More importantly, no one should care, since your opinion on what constitute enjoyable personal entertainment isn't worth any more than that of any single one of those other 99 people.

People complaining about magazines they need not read, or movies they need not watch, is no less bizarre than people complaining about the taste of candy they need not eat. Yes, other people do like peppermint, what of it?

...and really, who flips on the TV to see ordinary people do ordinary things? I'll take sexy women doing awesome things over that any day of the week. Not that it isn't perfectly fine to personally find such things shallow and unfulfilling, or even annoying and displeasing. To each his own, though taste is not truth.

 

[Uhura]

You mean how the MPAA is okay supporting scenes where a women is involved in sexual torture and violence for "entertainment reasons" but if a women wants to express her own sexuality, they would rather censor that or just give that movie a higher rating? Yeah the MPAA is really guilty of that and as many have mentioned, it's a very misogynistic showing from them. "Oh no, a women is expressing her sexuality that doesn't involve violence, distress and torture... CENSOR IT!", that right there is shameful.

That's actually exactly what I mean. Looks like we have been reading the same articles/ watching the same documentaries! Yeah, MPAA's attitude towards female sexuality is pretty messed up. As I recall, Kevin Smith got heat from the MPAA because Liv Tyler talked about masturbation in the Jersey Girl. Apparently that's "too much". I'm hopeful though that things are slowly changing. I think the popularity of certain HBO series that portray women taking active roles in their sex lives shows that the 'millennials' are not that bothered by frank portrayals of female sexuality. Times are changing.

I understand their anger also at the performance but I don't hear the same outcry when other singers like Rhianna, or Katy Perry and others do the same thing. Maybe it's there but I don't hear a loud horn being blown about it. As I recall, Justin ripped something off of Janet's top, her diamond/star nipple popped out and that became news media gold.

Yeah that music video was just a huge mess with massive insults and creepy lyrics but I must question why hasn't worse things in the past haven't gotten much outcry. Half the rap lyrics today are about "bitches, hoes, money, treating women like crap and as if they are worthless. I think it's wrong and degrading to women but for some reason Robin Thicke gets most of the attention.

What are you referring to with the Rihanna /Katy Perry thing? I haven't heard of stuff involving them.

I think Robin Thicke's video got a lot of attention because it was a huge mainstream hit and hence reached larger audiences (both American and international) than many rap songs/videos do. I also do think that rap artists get criticized a lot for their lyrics and the music videos. Last year Rick Ross lost his sponsorship deal with Reebok because of his pro-rape lyrics in U.O.E.N.O. (he raps "Put Molly all up in her champagne, she ain't even know it, I took her home and I enjoyed that, she ain't even know it."). So it's not like people singled out Thicke.

http://www.salon.com/2013/04/12/rick_ross_dropped_from_reebok_over_rape_lyric/

 

[Parasondox]

What are you referring to with the Rihanna /Katy Perry thing? I haven't heard of stuff involving them.

Nothing bad about them. I am just saying they seem as more sexual on stage when performing. Their main fan base is young girls/women and I don't see any or many compliant about them being too "sexual". Well actually there was the X-Factor thing that got many viewer complaints because Rihanna was wearing revealing clothing and children were watching. It's just my opinion but maybe some stars can get away with certain things and others can't, but hey apparently "sex sell".

I think Robin Thicke's video got a lot of attention because it was a huge mainstream hit and hence reached larger audiences (both American and international) than many rap songs/videos do. I also do think that rap artists get criticized a lot for their lyrics and the music videos. Last year Rick Ross lost his sponsorship deal with Reebok because of his pro-rape lyrics in U.O.E.N.O. (he raps "Put Molly all up in her champagne, she ain't even know it, I took her home and I enjoyed that, she ain't even know it."). So it's not like people singled out Thicke.

http://www.salon.com/2013/04/12/rick_ross_dropped_from_reebok_over_rape_lyric/

"Put Molly all up in her champagne, she ain't even know it, I took her home and I enjoyed that, she ain't even know it."? Holy fuck what the heck?!?! Where the heck is rap going with this? I know this is one guy but... COME ON NOW!! Maybe it's a sign of getting old but how could anyone listen to this? You are right, Thicke is mainstream and will get the most heat and attention. He weren't being singled out.

That's actually exactly what I mean. Looks like we have been reading the same articles/ watching the same documentaries! Yeah, MPAA's attitude towards female sexuality is pretty messed up. As I recall, Kevin Smith got heat from the MPAA because Liv Tyler talked about masturbation in the Jersey Girl. Apparently that's "too much". I'm hopeful though that things are slowly changing. I think the popularity of certain HBO series that portray women taking active roles in their sex lives shows that the 'millennials' are not that bothered by frank portrayals of female sexuality. Times are changing.

Looks like MPAA and other parts of Hollywood like to stick with "tradition". "Tradition" as in, "A women wants to explore her sexual side without a man being in control? Nope, not gonna work round here". Let's hope things do change cause I watch a lot of European shows and movies, and they are more and more open with a women being able to express her sexual self without any issues. Hoping Hollywood takes note. Yeah it will take time but eventually it will come.

 

[Jusey1]

Original question - Sex Sells. Sad but true. Sex is along with the desire for food and shelter one of the primary motivators in the lives of humans and most other complex animals. Using sex to sell products is just exploiting this.

Pretty much this sadly...



The problem is, Hollywood had technically over done it to the point where around 95% of one's sex life is unnatural, so to say. (Though not everything unnatural is a bad thing).

I don't really want to go into much detail as these topics aren't something I like but to give ya some ideas of what I'm thinking...

Natural lust is the lust we gain at a proper mature age and normally happens around once every month or two months (Unless if female and pregnant then it wont happen at all). Natural lust is basically when we want to have children in order to continue the human race. Basically.

Unnatural lust is when we are doing it (or wanting to do it) for either A: The fun of it -or- B: Because we love that individual (Note: Love is actually fully unnatural, in my opinion)...

 

[briankoontz]

To put it simply- if I could look at a good looking person, or an ugly person... Well, as Kevin Bacon loves to say 'it's a no brainer'

isn't Frankenstein's monster mean't to be made up of several body parts?

Just wanted to correct you on this, however. I read the book recently and I'm pretty sure the monster isn't made from other body parts, that's only what films have projected to emphasise the horror element which wasn't really there in the book apart from the premise.

The actual issue is the question of what is beautiful.

Vanity isn't beautiful, and people "beautifying" themselves through cosmetics, plastic surgery, tanning beds, gym workouts, and the like makes them ugly, not the other way around.

Frankenstein is a classic example - Dr. Frankenstein is horribly ugly regardless of his physical appearance while Frankenstein's monster is attractive, due to his yearning for communication and humanity.

Hollywood is not exactly a hot bed of wisdom, so their idea of what is beautiful is considered irrelevant by serious people.

 

[HardkorSB]

Why? Why does Hollywood still sexualise everything cause I find it insulting. Yes I did say insulting because I feel that when anything is sexualised or 'made beautiful', that Hollywood things and assumes we want this. Thinking the notion of 'sex sells' work today. Yes I know it been happening for decades and centuries but that's my point. Don't they think we have moved on from that or do they still assume we want everything 'sexy'.

But we haven't moved on and we never will, at least not while we reproduce naturally.
Sex is the thing that's keeping humanity (and many other animals but let's focus on humanity) alive.
We are driven to fuck.
Once we reach sexual maturity, sex is constantly on our minds.
The people in the media understand that so they take people who other people would like to fuck and put them in the spotlight.

 

[Schadrach]

"Robin Thicke has topless women in the uncensored version of his video" - Have you not seen other rap videos of the past 20 years? Have you not seen Heavy Metal/Rock videos in the past 30/40 years? The Robin Thicke video was barely... well it was barely anything.

It was *popular* though, which makes it a better target. If that song were less popular, no one would have cared. Most of the more mainstream rap videos have the assorted women wearing more clothing (though not much), and metal/rap that we're talking about is noticeably less mainstream than Robin Thicke's Blurred Lines.

If you want a video that might be a tad more offensive to some eyes, look up the video for (S)AINT. It's on YouTube, uncensored, in the appropriate VEVO channel (and violates normal YouTube video policy, and violates this site's posting policy, which is why I'm not linking it). To quote the Marilyn Manson wiki:

The music video for "(s)AINT" is notorious for its extremely graphic nature. Directed by Asia Argento, it primarily features Marilyn Manson as a depraved hotel visitor, insufflating lines of cocaine on the front cover of a Bible, cutting his chest five times with a double-edged razor blade, receiving narcotic(s) intravenously while a rosary is used as a tourniquet, partaking in a series of bondage activities and masturbating in front of a woman who is later exposed as a man (portrayed by Tim Skold). This music video was banned by its parent label, Interscope Records, in the United States. In Japan and Germany, blurring techniques were applied to scenes depicting a woman's vagina and Manson performing cunnilingus.

...like you said, the Blurred Lines video is...barely anything.