the best, and worst in RPGs

[Sasha Janre]

Me and the action element of Western RPGs don't mix very well, so I can't say I've played any that have kept me interested to get over my bad handicap with them, so I'll stick to what I've liked about the JRPGs I've played.

Story - If the game has a solid story, and one that grabs you and holds you until you've gotten to the end, despite the linarity of it (FFX was pretty linear, but it's probably one of the most powerful stories I've gone through), I've found I don't care about the graphics as much. This was the thought going through my head when I was playing FF9 again.

Characters - As Yahtzee's said, some of them have pretty crazy hair and okay a good number of the men look like girls (I honestly thought Kuja from FFIX was a woman and that "mysterious man" was a typo), but they have some serious depth to them. I did a paper on the psychological state of Cloud for a literary analysis class and found that he's arugably one of the most complex characters I've played as. Even as "rushed" as Squall's character development was, he still went through it and I have a weakness for the anti-hero, who thinks everyone's nuts and wants nothing to do with being a hero.

So despite how much people have ragged on FF8 and how much I complain about the story, FF8 was my first Final Fantasy and I have a soft spot for it. (Even if I wanted to kick Rinoa's useless arse off of Garden .. I did lose her in space once!) FF7 is a great game to get lost in and there's just so much to DO in it. FF9's story was nice and it got to the girly side of me. Quite honestly, though... FFX made me cry at the end. Heheh. I'm also not sure if I'm the only one who liked FF12. I mean it wasn't groundbreaking or awesome, but I liked it. The characters were realistic, there were no forced romances, the voice acting was incredibly well done and while I got lost trying to follow the story, I spent most of my time on hunts. XD; It's a very pretty game and was good. Not great, but good.

As for the worst, it's really that forced minigame aspect of JRPGs (mostly in Final Fantasy) that drives me up the wall. In FF7 it was Fort Condor (Which I later decided wasn't so bad, I liked the other minigames), FF9 the card tournament (tetra master, damn you!), but the biggest annoyance was Blitzball in FFX. Most of my guy friends found it fun and thought i was crazy for not liking it but I just hated playing it. Thank God you only had to play it once. I STILL don't know what you were supposed to be doing in X-2 when you go back to Luca and are "playing" blitzball with all the girls. Speaking of X-2, the spherebreak game made me want to chew on my controller and break it. Blah.

And .. wow, that's quite a lot of rambling. XD; sorry.

 

[shadow skill]

Gee, another thread about RPGs, the OP of which didn't even mention JRPGs, that immediately turned into an FF-bashing marathon. What a humongous surprise.

Are we reading the same thread? I saw several people who commented that JRPGs did "x" right while Western RPGs tend to do "y" right, and people who listed JRPGs often listed several titles. Often at least one Final Fantasy title was on the "like" stack.

Perhaps you're just seeing what you expected to.

- J

Did you read what he said? The original poster made no mention of Jrpgs, his question was about western RPG's, yet there are posts about how FF games suck etc.

Now to actually answer your question OP: The problem with Western rpg's at least right now is the fact that the combat is just terrible. The settings are really nothing more than ripoff's of lord of the rings or Star Wars etc. The whole open world concept is also a problem since it's no fun to spend five minutes running across the map while actually trying to complete a quest. The worst part is that some of the more popular WRPGs have the most vapid and uninteresting stories (Elder scrolls I wish Bethesda never existed their games truly suck.)

As far as what Western RPGs do right is that seem more likely to use guns whichh mixes things up from the typical swords mess.

 

[thebobmaster_v1legacy]

Sasha, you are not the only FFXII fan here. I also like the game.

 

[Sasha Janre]

Yay! I'm glad to hear that .. most of the posts here about it have been ripping it to shreds.

 

[thebobmaster_v1legacy]

I know, and I've been quietly refuting their negative points in my head. Such as the gambit system, which is completely optional and can come back to bite you in the ass if you try to just set one gambit for the entire game.

 

[Sasha Janre]

Yeah, seriously. I ended up taking control of the party leader and letting the others run on auto. The story itself isn't bad, and the "plot" is how the characters are caught within it and responding to it. Though I did lose most of the coherency since I spent a lot of in between moments off on hunts.

 

[hollow-soull]

I think good ones were:
- Oblivion
- Icewind dale 2
- Morrowind

Bad ones iv played were:
- Shivering isles
- Icewind dale
- Baldurs gate

 

[Aurora Firestorm]

I'm not a fan of American RPGs, but then again, I haven't played many.

As for JRPGs, I think the best are:

Chrono Trigger (got me into RPGs!)
Xenosaga I/II/III (Yes, I'm aware II wasn't the greatest, but the series itself must be counted as one RPG, to me)
.hack//GU series
Lunar 2: Eternal Blue (Beautiful remake! Great cutscenes and voice acting!)

I don't play Final Fantasy. Never really cared much about it.

Worst:

Chrono Cross. Seriously, guys, you took a beautiful plot from Chrono Trigger, killed everyone in it, abandoned the fans, and made something horrible. It even had a decent premise -- for a standalone game. But it was marketed as a sequel to Chrono Trigger, so I'll judge it as one, and you don't go killing off all the main characters, making one of the most noble people in Trigger into a stupid blonde chick, and not including Magus when you meant to. Subsequently, the Materia-style, equip-spells-as-items concept has never and will never make for a good combat system. And only leveling in boss fights is dumb.

Just my $0.02 for you.

 

[ThaBenMan]

Sasha, you are not the only FFXII fan here. I also like the game.

I like FFXII too. The story and characters are great, and the combat is pretty fun. Unfortunately I got stuck at the second esper you fight, the ice one, and I haven't played it since. I haven't played any other FF's except for a bit of IX, so that might have something to do with me liking it.

Anyway, I think overall I prefer WRPG's to JRPG's. I, being American, can relate to them better, like another poster said. And they just seem to be more fun. Like I said, I haven't played much FF but from what I have the combat doesn't appeal to me (the old turn-based style) and random encounters just plain suck. The character designs, setting, and story are usually very nice, though. And other JRPG's I've played with different systems were fun, like Dragon Quest VIII and Legend of Legaia. But games like Mass Effect, Planescape, Fallout, Baldur's Gate, just can't be topped: incredible stories and characters, and just a blast to play.

 

[tiredinnuendo]

Gee, another thread about RPGs, the OP of which didn't even mention JRPGs, that immediately turned into an FF-bashing marathon. What a humongous surprise.

Are we reading the same thread? I saw several people who commented that JRPGs did "x" right while Western RPGs tend to do "y" right, and people who listed JRPGs often listed several titles. Often at least one Final Fantasy title was on the "like" stack.

Perhaps you're just seeing what you expected to.

- J

Did you read what he said? The original poster made no mention of Jrpgs, his question was about western RPG's, yet there are posts about how FF games suck etc.

Now to actually answer your question OP: The problem with Western rpg's at least right now is the fact that the combat is just terrible. The settings are really nothing more than ripoff's of lord of the rings or Star Wars etc. The whole open world concept is also a problem since it's no fun to spend five minutes running across the map while actually trying to complete a quest. The worst part is that some of the more popular WRPGs have the most vapid and uninteresting stories (Elder scrolls I wish Bethesda never existed their games truly suck.)

As far as what Western RPGs do right is that seem more likely to use guns whichh mixes things up from the typical swords mess.

Lots of sensitive people here today.

My point was that JRPGs, and FF in particular, aren't being lambasted in this thread, as the post I quoted seemed to imply. Bad games are being lambasted, and good ones held up and admired, and there are Western and JRPGs on boths sides of that line.

I'll follow that with a blanket statement that threads evolve, they just do. I've tried to fight it too, but you can't in the end. We once had people answering "Chell" in the "Manliest protagonist" thread. It's weird, but that's how forums work.

- J

 

[Sylocat]

We once had people answering "Chell" in the "Manliest protagonist" thread.

Who says you have to be a man to be manly?

 

[Sasha Janre]

Sasha, you are not the only FFXII fan here. I also like the game.

I like FFXII too. The story and characters are great, and the combat is pretty fun. Unfortunately I got stuck at the second esper you fight, the ice one, and I haven't played it since. I haven't played any other FF's except for a bit of IX, so that might have something to do with me liking it.

Anyway, I think overall I prefer WRPG's to JRPG's. I, being American, can relate to them better, like another poster said. And they just seem to be more fun. Like I said, I haven't played much FF but from what I have the combat doesn't appeal to me (the old turn-based style) and random encounters just plain suck. The character designs, setting, and story are usually very nice, though. And other JRPG's I've played with different systems were fun, like Dragon Quest VIII and Legend of Legaia. But games like Mass Effect, Planescape, Fallout, Baldur's Gate, just can't be topped: incredible stories and characters, and just a blast to play.

On that ice esper ... I think it's more like you gotta stock up on your ice shields and spam the fire spells. It takes a bit of work, but it's not like Zeromus. XD; he was almost impossible.

 

[El Chicken]

Hmm.. I couldnt help but notice that a lot of you dislike Nwn... How strange. To me it was one of the best games i had ever played in 2003 and the story was NEVER boring. I dont mind number games its just like DND (im a big fan). But anyway getting to the point, I am Shocked that no person here has put S.T.A.L.K.E.R on their list of favourite rpgs, so i shall put it on mine.

Best

Oblvion - Great game and greatly Encouraged free roaming, I have a beastly bounty ! A bit tedious though, but if you download the deadly reflex mod for it you'll find that the axe is a very fun weapon indeed!

STALKER - Fantastic game, but with an absolutely HUGE story. Chocked full of savage mutants, agressive mercenaries and chocked full of equiptment and mindwiped zombies. Whats not to like apart from constant deaths and enemies seeing you in a black bush wearing black armour in the middle of the night!

The Witcher - Ok so it was filled with a lot more sex than necessary but its just a small hole in what would otherwise be a complete masterpiece.

Nwn 2 + nwn 1 (with all expansions) - Great story, Character design but felt very linear

Kotor 2 - Same as nwn 2 really apart from it didnt feel as linear (due to the ability to change planets) and had an absolutely **** Ending!

Pretty much every game by blackisle - Apart from planescape because i dont have it. Im not really so into BG2 i thought it was a dissapointment due to the dungeon you start in being tedious and boring.

Fable - Had everything i could really ask for in an rpg.. Apart from lack of free roaming and a long story of course.

Worst

Diablo 2 - I agree with what someone else put, you couldnt follow instructions very easily as you didnt have a clue where you were going and it had a lack of exciting combat.

Dungeon siege 2 - Same as diablo 2 but less interested. At least it had cool cutscenes and badguys though!

Never played a JRPG in my life (might be because they all come on consoles).

 

[tiredinnuendo]

We once had people answering "Chell" in the "Manliest protagonist" thread.

Who says you have to be a man to be manly?

I says that in a thread asking for "the manliest character that simply oozes testosterone", characters like Chell are disqualified for:

1) Being female.
2) Oozing no testosterone.
3) Doing nothing "manly". No, surviving hard things isn't exclusively a male activity.

- J

 

[hippo24]

I like the the wester Rocket Propelled Grenade (stinger) its more effecient and its sat nav is twice as effective at longer ranges while the chinese RPG is much less advanced and they still use the standered gunpowder warheads

 

[CodeChrono]

Western RPG's bug me.

Plus, Shin Megami Tensai: Persona 3 takes the cake in any/all RPG's.

Well, with the exception of Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars.

 

[Zombire]

Best RPG? FF12. The game changed my life, if you don't like it well that's really unfortunate.

Worst? FFX and X-2. Why? I hatehatehate. 10 with a passion. I love turn based, I hate walk,walkwalk, BOOOOM GLASSS RAWR. The storyline pissed me off because when you add love it all goes to shit. X-2. Well, that game just had so much wrong. Glorified dress up anybody?

I also love Mass Effect like whoa

>.> I'm still waiting for my PS2 to be fixed to play Shin Megami Persona 3: FES x.x

 

[Writerling]

Hmm, to say...jRPGs certainly DO have a better storyline, yet all the characters seem to get extremely involed in the story up to the halfway point, then leave...
As for Western RPGS, you get a more free-roaming experience. You can say "screw the main quest, I'm going on a killing spree!" problem is, when you finish your killing spree and decide to do the main quest, you realise you've killed someone very importanat...bloody Morrowind.

 

[weirdaljedifan2]

RPGs are very addictive but there is a problem with ALL RPGs, after you defeat the Final Boss there is almost nothing to do after that. In Super Mario RPG, after you defeat Smithy, it goes back to right before the fight as if nothing happened and the only thing to do after that is either start the game over or beat Smithy AGAIN and that's about it. In Pokemon, all you do after the Pokemon League is "catch 'em all" which gets boring after 2-3 hours. X-Men Legends 2 however gives you the option of going back to each level and battle your way through again without the bosses, a lot more entertaining.

 

[Omnidum]

I like the the western Rocket Propelled Grenade (stinger) its more effecient and its sat nav is twice as effective at longer ranges while the chinese RPG is much less advanced and they still use the standered gunpowder warheads

Huh?

My personal favorites are Hellgate: London and Baldurs Gate 1/2

I have yet to encounter a "bad" RPG yet, but maybe Diablo II, although its a big field you can run around on, enemies are scarce.