Jeez, I wonder if Escapist has a record for most responses to a video or article. Personally, though I may not agree entirely with Bob's viewpoint, I do think his presentation isn't without merit. I like to focus on the "Long Live PC Gaming" part in the title since I can see that as a positive outlook for the system or all systems. And no, the word "Dead" doesn't truly describe the situation. Saying that the Jaguar, the Virtual Boy, and the Dreamcast would count as being literally "Dead" but pc gaming doesn't seem to fit in that area. Personally, I would like to be a pc gamer but I can't afford a strong system though I realize the merits of such technology. Good work on the episode Bob. Keep it up.
The Big Picture: PC Gaming Is Dead - Long Live PC Gaming!
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Oh sure, try and give everyone an existential crisis.arc1991 said:Who's to say we aren't in one nowMullahgrrl said:
Dun Dun Duuuuuuuuuuuuuuun!
I feel like no one even really listened when they watched this video. Everyone is getting caught up in how PC gaming is supposively booming or that tablets and laptops are also PCs when the argument is that having a huge system unit and monitor that goes in a separate cabinet and desk will become obsolete. Why do I need a stationary device with it's own desk when my laptop can do the same thing plus anywhere I want? And with technology advancing at an exponential rate, you can't use the argument that you need the extra power a desktop PC offers because, unless you're making movies for Pixar, what do you need that much power for?
This was probably the worst time period on The Escapist to release this video. March Mayhem is going to blow this thread right u-. Oh we're at page 33 already.MovieBob said:
But that is a non-argument because a laptop is a PC too. The premise of the video seemed to me to be that PC gaming was dying out, which is ummm incorrect. I don't really get what Bob was getting at tbh, I mean sure I can see where he's going with the advancement of consoles but that basically leads them to being closed off PCs, sorta like buying a Mac. Honestly in that case I think the open model wins longterm.I forgot said:
I'm not sure what Bob means at the end with "Although PC gaming is dead, PC games are not." What exactly does that mean?
As a sidenote: I must admit that for me, growing up, PC gaming has died. I used to be an avid PC gamer but after a lengthy years-spanning break from gaming, I'm now back into it thanks to the PS3 my wife gave me for Christmas.
As a sidenote: I must admit that for me, growing up, PC gaming has died. I used to be an avid PC gamer but after a lengthy years-spanning break from gaming, I'm now back into it thanks to the PS3 my wife gave me for Christmas.
He really lost his creditability with me in that one when he started bashing the Prime games for, I don't know, being FPS's?D_987 said:
OP: Just stick to movies. Laptops ARE PCs. Well, everything else has everything has already been said, just wanted to point that out.
If power is not important just go back to the first Ps or the xbox, why do you have to have the new generation consoles? the only difference between them and the previos generation is pover, and things you can do elsewhere.I forgot said:
Just go online, look at some videos of the latest games and compare the PC and the console versions, then try to make the same argument.
Why indeed. I can check my e-mail or write a paper or compile software far more easily on my home desktop and yet most of my e-mail is written on a phone, my papers and programs are written on an ultra-portable laptop and I often play games an a device dedicated to the purpose. It isn't a question of capability of a given device. I'm not blind to the fact that my iPhone makes writing an e-mail more difficult than it needs to be and I certainly am not blind to the fact that any particular program I write and compile on this ultra-portable laptop is going to take far longer to run than the significantly more powerful desktop computer I have at home. The fact is, any of these devices can do anything the others can provided you don't care how long the task might take.Jim Grim said:
So, if I am not blind to the fact that these devices represent sub-optimal environments to do any particular job, why exactly do I use them? Let's just run down the list:
1) iPhone. I use this for playing games and communicating across a wide variety of media. While it represents the worst possible choice that I currently own for any of these tasks, it is notable in that I always have it on my person thus making these tasks at least possible far more often than they otherwise would be.
2) Ultra-Portable: At roughly 1/4 the computing power of my desktop with an, at times uncomfortably small keyboard, this device is less suited to any activity that I might use my desktop for. Still, it's small size and long battery life ensure that I have it on my person throughout the day for classes and it can reasonably be brought anywhere I think I might have cause to need it.
3) 360/PS3: Less powerful than my Desktop by a wide margin these devices still see plenty of use even though they exist mere feet from my desktop. While I am perfectly willing to play a PC game if I want to play games with any of my close friends I am generally forced to play on one of them simply because my friends (all of whom are former PC gamers) have become increasingly unwilling to deal with the various problems inherent to PC gaming.
4) DS/PSP: Sitting somewhere between my laptop and my iPhone, these devices are easily portable but see rare use. The situations where I might use them are limited to those where I have more time than I could reasonably fill with iPhone diversions yet less time than would make setting up the various accessories necessary to make gaming on the laptop a reasonable option.
In any scenario (save making a phone call), I would rather use my PC than these accessory devices and yet, because I spend much of my waking time somrewhere other than at my home they see frequent use. The only "problem" with distributing the things I do across so many dedicated devices is that of transferring a task from one device to another as the situation dictates but, most of the time, that problem can be resolved. As time moves on, this task will be less and less troublesome thus eliminating this damning flaw.
Excuse me, but am I the only one that neither has the time nor the inclination to buy a new fucking computer every time a new game is released?
Seriously, why is it my computer, which wasn't cheap or old, can only handle games from five years ago.
And how come playing online is such a hassle to someone who doesn't have a working knowledge of patches, downloads and upgrades?
Consoles are dedicated gaming machines which makes them better for gaming. Yeah, they can't do RTS, but neither can my computer, so what the hell.
Well done, Bob. Right on the money. Computers as we know them are going to die. May the consoles, I phones and laptops (yes they are different to computers, smart asses) soon replace them.
Seriously, why is it my computer, which wasn't cheap or old, can only handle games from five years ago.
And how come playing online is such a hassle to someone who doesn't have a working knowledge of patches, downloads and upgrades?
Consoles are dedicated gaming machines which makes them better for gaming. Yeah, they can't do RTS, but neither can my computer, so what the hell.
Well done, Bob. Right on the money. Computers as we know them are going to die. May the consoles, I phones and laptops (yes they are different to computers, smart asses) soon replace them.
The irony is that in episode 11 ("This can happen to Us") of his youtube Game Overthinker series Moviebob pointed out that the cheapest console would run you $300 and asked if it was unreasonable to expect the PS IV to cost $800-1,000 when it came out. I pointed out there that the Gaming Historian showed his "The Crash of '83" video one of the things that helped cause the crash was the appearance of the PC as a viable competitor. While some people do go nuts with the amount of money they put into their gaming rigs they are in the minority and there are computer configures right now that either equal or beat console prices.
This goes into two other issues that lead to the "The Crash of '83"--console choice overload and game production glut. The smart phones, pads, and what not out there all have their one OSes and for the most part they can't use stuff made for other OSes--effectively the console choice overload problem in a nice new package.
The game production glut is already seen in the explosion of Flash and OpenSource games and if HTML5 realizes its potential it is only going to get worse and the fact Sturgeon's Law is already operating can't be ignored and the gaming industry goes into another crash taking the consoles with it.
This goes into two other issues that lead to the "The Crash of '83"--console choice overload and game production glut. The smart phones, pads, and what not out there all have their one OSes and for the most part they can't use stuff made for other OSes--effectively the console choice overload problem in a nice new package.
The game production glut is already seen in the explosion of Flash and OpenSource games and if HTML5 realizes its potential it is only going to get worse and the fact Sturgeon's Law is already operating can't be ignored and the gaming industry goes into another crash taking the consoles with it.
What is hard about patches? Most games download them for you. What is hard about that? Computers to which Bob is refering to are desktops, Laptops are still PCs. Also if you want to buy a PC that you can game with you never buy from a shop you have to build it yourself and shop around. If you don't like that well fair enough that is up to you but a PC can do everything consoles can except motion controls fully at the moment while a console can only do the job of a PC watered down.brainless_fps_player said:
this whole eps is a trolling. Cheers bob. Every time you step out of movies and into Gaming you seem to have no clue of what your talking about. Its why i dislike this show, it's so vague and assuming.
I dont know anyone without a PC. Anyone at all... I also own said gen consoles apart from PS3 because they never have games i like. And yeah they have all their Faddy gimics like Wii sticks and you know what i havent played them in about 7months.
The Wii releases nothing but family branded party game fests, Most of the 360 stuff is jsut FPS and i got fallout off steam... PS3 is trying and failing to do it all.
The biggest issue you've missed is the internet. Consoles suck on line compared to PCs ask a game programmer if the PS3 could run wow and he'll laugh at you so hard you may kill him.
The PC is an evolving animal it can keep up with the cutting edge better with it. Next gen consoles are old tech even as they are launch apart from maybe the rubbish fad stuff they jam in there. Hell i only know 1 person with a blueray player and thats a PS3. Remotes arent something serious gamers are interested in. You even know about game tourney scene? GSM etc? maybe you should do some homework.
damn i fed the troll...
I dont know anyone without a PC. Anyone at all... I also own said gen consoles apart from PS3 because they never have games i like. And yeah they have all their Faddy gimics like Wii sticks and you know what i havent played them in about 7months.
The Wii releases nothing but family branded party game fests, Most of the 360 stuff is jsut FPS and i got fallout off steam... PS3 is trying and failing to do it all.
The biggest issue you've missed is the internet. Consoles suck on line compared to PCs ask a game programmer if the PS3 could run wow and he'll laugh at you so hard you may kill him.
The PC is an evolving animal it can keep up with the cutting edge better with it. Next gen consoles are old tech even as they are launch apart from maybe the rubbish fad stuff they jam in there. Hell i only know 1 person with a blueray player and thats a PS3. Remotes arent something serious gamers are interested in. You even know about game tourney scene? GSM etc? maybe you should do some homework.
damn i fed the troll...
PC Elitism: Off
Fanboy protocol: Disengaged
Episode content analysis: 100%
The entire episode talks about death when all that is really happening is Massive Home PC's becoming obsolete. You could have replaced every word of death with evolution and it would have been much less of a flame fuel episode.
Everything that is talked about here are portable devices and consoles, laptops are strangely absent for obvious reasons, becoming as powerful as PC's. But the thing is... we already have those. I'm typing this on the train in between playing Shogun 2 on my GAMING LAPTOP! (From the geniuses at Alienware)
Your episode takes a simple premise, that PC gaming is becoming mobile, that the giant metal boxes are being replaced with sleek mobile devices and then puts a spin on it to get people shouting. You put a small PC Games shall life on at the end to douse the otherwise 100% flame fuel episode, but it's really a bit useless when 2 minutes ago you mentioned RTS and Flight sims being the only thing left for PC.
Not to mention that the Wii only started featuring Adventure game libraries when Steam had been doing that for years. It amuses me how much effort went into making this episode as catchy as possible and I know I have contributed to that simply by writing this.
I'm way ahead of you in the future Bob. I guess the Big Picture already transformed into Hindsight.
Also I'm more of a Deus Ex Sunglasses gamer myself.
Fanboy protocol: Disengaged
Episode content analysis: 100%
The entire episode talks about death when all that is really happening is Massive Home PC's becoming obsolete. You could have replaced every word of death with evolution and it would have been much less of a flame fuel episode.
Everything that is talked about here are portable devices and consoles, laptops are strangely absent for obvious reasons, becoming as powerful as PC's. But the thing is... we already have those. I'm typing this on the train in between playing Shogun 2 on my GAMING LAPTOP! (From the geniuses at Alienware)
Your episode takes a simple premise, that PC gaming is becoming mobile, that the giant metal boxes are being replaced with sleek mobile devices and then puts a spin on it to get people shouting. You put a small PC Games shall life on at the end to douse the otherwise 100% flame fuel episode, but it's really a bit useless when 2 minutes ago you mentioned RTS and Flight sims being the only thing left for PC.
Not to mention that the Wii only started featuring Adventure game libraries when Steam had been doing that for years. It amuses me how much effort went into making this episode as catchy as possible and I know I have contributed to that simply by writing this.
I'm way ahead of you in the future Bob. I guess the Big Picture already transformed into Hindsight.
Also I'm more of a Deus Ex Sunglasses gamer myself.
We better be quiet about this! This could change THE WORLD. Mum's the word right? hahaGriffolion said:
I consider consoles to be "entry level" video gamer equipment. Fine for people on a budget, people getting started in the medium or people with minimal technical expertise. I suppose that makes me a snob. Ok, yep, I'm a snob.
With good reason, mind you. A good gaming PC, while expensive and usually technically daunting, is vastly superior to current generation gaming consoles in every conceivable way, including library of games available. For a recent example, I was playing Black Ops on the same release day as my XBox friends. At a higher frame rate, higher resolution, and thanks to Steam, for less money. (less pricks shouting obscenities into their headsets, too)
I didn't read all of the 1000+ comments on this thread but I don't honestly get all the people saying things like "at least PC's are ok for sims and RTS games". Seriously? The PC has had simultaneous release of every cross-platform shooter there is with the few platform specific exceptions, like anything past the first Halo game, which is only available for Xbox. Can't get the latest Final Fantasy either, but that's what PS3s are for.
Now, I should point out that I do happen to own and operate all three current generation consoles. I got the PS3 for the aforementioned Final Fantasy, XBox for the kids and the Wii as a joke. In addition, for one reason or another, I own a few titles for multiple platforms. For example, I've got these games for both PC and PS3: Dragon Age, Fallout 3, Oblivion, Battlefield: Bad Company 2 and Mass Effect 2.
Switching between the PC and PS3 on all these games feels like they've been extremely dumbed down for the console. Many features are just outright missing on the PS3 versions of several of those games. (most notably the Bethesda ones) The biggest difference was with Dragon Age - that crappy "command wheel" made me want to throw my six-axis through a window.
PC games get far more support, typically more DLC options and are the only platform that can allow community generated mods for popular games.
These are current, triple-A games I'm talking about, not Facebook games or WoW. (even though WoW made and continues to make more money than every triple-A game released in the last 10 years combined, but whatever - PC's dead, right?) I could go on and talk about how PC gaming is the wellspring of innovation for this medium, and how consoles are stagnantly producing the same shooters over and over with the ancient Unreal engine (developed FOR THE PC) but I've rambled enough.
Sorry Bob, I usually agree with most of what you say, but I just really don't see how PC gaming is dying. Your big argument seemed to be about the lack of desktop PC portability - my PS3 and 50" LCD ain't that portable either. And when I want to sit down in the living room and watch movies or TV shows, I usually fire up my PS3, have it connect to my Windows Media Server in another room via gigabit LAN and browse through terabytes of collected content.
So, hell, even my consoles use PCs.
With good reason, mind you. A good gaming PC, while expensive and usually technically daunting, is vastly superior to current generation gaming consoles in every conceivable way, including library of games available. For a recent example, I was playing Black Ops on the same release day as my XBox friends. At a higher frame rate, higher resolution, and thanks to Steam, for less money. (less pricks shouting obscenities into their headsets, too)
I didn't read all of the 1000+ comments on this thread but I don't honestly get all the people saying things like "at least PC's are ok for sims and RTS games". Seriously? The PC has had simultaneous release of every cross-platform shooter there is with the few platform specific exceptions, like anything past the first Halo game, which is only available for Xbox. Can't get the latest Final Fantasy either, but that's what PS3s are for.
Now, I should point out that I do happen to own and operate all three current generation consoles. I got the PS3 for the aforementioned Final Fantasy, XBox for the kids and the Wii as a joke. In addition, for one reason or another, I own a few titles for multiple platforms. For example, I've got these games for both PC and PS3: Dragon Age, Fallout 3, Oblivion, Battlefield: Bad Company 2 and Mass Effect 2.
Switching between the PC and PS3 on all these games feels like they've been extremely dumbed down for the console. Many features are just outright missing on the PS3 versions of several of those games. (most notably the Bethesda ones) The biggest difference was with Dragon Age - that crappy "command wheel" made me want to throw my six-axis through a window.
PC games get far more support, typically more DLC options and are the only platform that can allow community generated mods for popular games.
These are current, triple-A games I'm talking about, not Facebook games or WoW. (even though WoW made and continues to make more money than every triple-A game released in the last 10 years combined, but whatever - PC's dead, right?) I could go on and talk about how PC gaming is the wellspring of innovation for this medium, and how consoles are stagnantly producing the same shooters over and over with the ancient Unreal engine (developed FOR THE PC) but I've rambled enough.
Sorry Bob, I usually agree with most of what you say, but I just really don't see how PC gaming is dying. Your big argument seemed to be about the lack of desktop PC portability - my PS3 and 50" LCD ain't that portable either. And when I want to sit down in the living room and watch movies or TV shows, I usually fire up my PS3, have it connect to my Windows Media Server in another room via gigabit LAN and browse through terabytes of collected content.
So, hell, even my consoles use PCs.