The Devil

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Random Argument Man

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Samurai Goomba said:
"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."
Could someone explain me this one. Is it suppose to mark atheist or the christians that only beleive in god? Is it some kind of metaphor? Should we beleive that there is no symbol of evil for someone? Is it some kind of philosophical sentence that makes you think?
 

kaziard

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The infamous SCAMola said:
Abedeus said:
The infamous SCAMola said:
If God is so cool with free will and all then why does he punish people with Hell?
Because someone already said it.

The good thing about free will: You get to do what you wat
Tha bad thing: You have to deal with the choices of every other wanker out there.
If there were no rules, how would people learn? It would be wasted. Besides, some rules are to stay. Without them, the world would die in chaos. Very, very fast.

It doesn't mean you CAN'T do them. You can, but may not. It means that while you may kill someone, you will have to pay for his death. And God damn it, quote right, you broke apart my post and made it look like I asked why God doesn't destroy the devil.
Yes, but then why doesn't he punish the baddest ************ out there i.e. Satan?

And if Satan is against God, then why does Satan punish people who go against God's rules?
He DID punish satan, i.e he banished him to hell for all eternity. dunno if he thought that would be worse than destruction or not, who knowes? maybe he loves satan too much to kill him, he was a faithful angel almost to the end.
 

Abedeus

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The infamous SCAMola said:
Abedeus said:
The infamous SCAMola said:
If God is so cool with free will and all then why does he punish people with Hell?
Because someone already said it.

The good thing about free will: You get to do what you wat
Tha bad thing: You have to deal with the choices of every other wanker out there.
If there were no rules, how would people learn? It would be wasted. Besides, some rules are to stay. Without them, the world would die in chaos. Very, very fast.

It doesn't mean you CAN'T do them. You can, but may not. It means that while you may kill someone, you will have to pay for his death. And God damn it, quote right, you broke apart my post and made it look like I asked why God doesn't destroy the devil.
Yes, but then why doesn't he punish the baddest ************ out there i.e. Satan?

And if Satan is against God, then why does Satan punish people who go against God's rules?
Maybe it's like this:

God: See, you betrayed me. Now you will stay forever in Hell, punishing people who break my laws.
Satan: WHAT?! WHY?!
God: Because that'll be your punishment. Failure to do so will result in horrible pain.
Satan: Screw you... AAGH!! I have an ass cancer now?!
God: Yes. You will be in an eternal pain, unless you do your job.
Satan: DO NOT WAAAAAAAANT!!


...Or just Satan wants to punish people because he's spiteful. Don't forget, he makes people do bad things to watch other people suffer. He likes to see the pain.

About punishing the Devil - I think that being degraded, then banished from the Heaven, being feared by every human and being blamed for every little thing is more than enough. Like I said, killing him would only end his suffering.
 

kaziard

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Random argument man said:
Samurai Goomba said:
"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."
Could someone explain me this one. Is it suppose to mark atheist or the christians that only beleive in god? Is it some kind of metaphor? Should we beleive that there is no symbol of evil for someone? Is it some kind of philosophical sentence that makes you think?
i think its meant to mean that if people believed there was no ultimate punishment afterwards then they wouldnt be afraid of killing, raping, watching high school musical etc. remember that christianity is basically a religion based on fear of being royally screwed in the end.....well at least it was in teh old days
 
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Abedeus said:
...Or just Satan wants to punish people because he's spiteful. Don't forget, he makes people do bad things to watch other people suffer. He likes to see the pain.
Ah, but now you're saying that Satan makes people do bad things, which would mean that there is no free will and God failed in his task.
 

Abedeus

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kaziard said:
Random argument man said:
Samurai Goomba said:
"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."
Could someone explain me this one. Is it suppose to mark atheist or the christians that only beleive in god? Is it some kind of metaphor? Should we beleive that there is no symbol of evil for someone? Is it some kind of philosophical sentence that makes you think?
i think its meant to mean that if people believed there was no ultimate punishment afterwards then they wouldnt be afraid of killing, raping, watching high school musical etc. remember that christianity is basically a religion based on fear of being royally screwed in the end.....well at least it was in teh old days
No. People who worship God of fear are probably going to Hell anyway. Because they are doing it wrong.

People who worship God out of love will go to Heaven. Because they trust in God and know that he won't punish them if they don't do bad things.

The infamous SCAMola said:
Abedeus said:
...Or just Satan wants to punish people because he's spiteful. Don't forget, he makes people do bad things to watch other people suffer. He likes to see the pain.
Ah, but now you're saying that Satan makes people do bad things, which would mean that there is no free will and God failed in his task.
I worded it poorly. He suggests people to do bad things. If you are of weak will, you will give in and commit a sin. Then HE gets you.
 

fletch_talon

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Random argument man said:
Samurai Goomba said:
"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."
Could someone explain me this one. Is it suppose to mark atheist or the christians that only beleive in god? Is it some kind of metaphor? Should we beleive that there is no symbol of evil for someone? Is it some kind of philosophical sentence that makes you think?
I believe is being quoted a lot due to it being a line in a movie (evidentally one I've never seen). As for an actual meaningto it, personally it seems like a way of saying that if we don't acknowledge the existance of Satan (symbolically: temptation to do evil things) then we find it harder to stay strong in the face of temptation.

Therefore should Satan exist, the smartest thing he could do is make it seem as though he didn't, thus making it easier to manipulate people without their underlying fear of him getting in the way.
 

CJ1145

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To the OP, it's because he enjoys torturing bad people. He tempts them to become evil, so they will reside with him in the lake of fire. If it was just his job it wouldn't matter. It matters that he enjoys it.
 

kaziard

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Abedeus said:
kaziard said:
Random argument man said:
Samurai Goomba said:
"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."
Could someone explain me this one. Is it suppose to mark atheist or the christians that only beleive in god? Is it some kind of metaphor? Should we beleive that there is no symbol of evil for someone? Is it some kind of philosophical sentence that makes you think?
i think its meant to mean that if people believed there was no ultimate punishment afterwards then they wouldnt be afraid of killing, raping, watching high school musical etc. remember that christianity is basically a religion based on fear of being royally screwed in the end.....well at least it was in teh old days
No. People who worship God of fear are probably going to Hell anyway. Because they are doing it wrong.

People who worship God out of love will go to Heaven. Because they trust in God and know that he won't punish them if they don't do bad things.

The infamous SCAMola said:
Abedeus said:
...Or just Satan wants to punish people because he's spiteful. Don't forget, he makes people do bad things to watch other people suffer. He likes to see the pain.
Ah, but now you're saying that Satan makes people do bad things, which would mean that there is no free will and God failed in his task.
I worded it poorly. He suggests people to do bad things. If you are of weak will, you will give in and commit a sin. Then HE gets you.
can you explain to me the meaning of "god -fearing" as in every context it is seen as a plus, i.e in an old play i read back in 2nd year a minister said "dont worry child if you are truely a god-fearing disciple he will protect you....or something along those lines xD
 

fletch_talon

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CJ1145 said:
To the OP, it's because he enjoys torturing bad people. He tempts them to become evil, so they will reside with him in the lake of fire. If it was just his job it wouldn't matter. It matters that he enjoys it.
Then at least he does it for a reason (albeit a selfish and shallow one) God on the other hand condemns people to Hell for no reason. What's that you say? He sends them their to teach a lesson? Yet what use is a lesson when life is over, those who are sent to hell are supposedly their for all eternity so a lesson means nothing as they will have no chance to change their ways. All hell is good for is discouraging people from doing wrong in life, and it only does that as:
a) A concept, it doesn't have to exist in order to have effect, or
b) A real consequence that can be seen/proven/known, so that there is no doubt in people's minds that such a place exists and that you will be sent their should you fuck up royal.
 

itsnotyouitsme

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yeah, im sure satan wasn't always a bad guy, till god put him in hell for all eternity, i would be pissed too.
 

TriggerUnhappy

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Lots of interesting theories, I think the fear comes from the belief that you'll be tortured for eternity if you go to Hell, and the fact that the Devil is trying to get you to go there would cause people's fear. On why the Devil isn't evil, only people:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9qAqwIW704
 

Samurai Goomba

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kaziard said:
Random argument man said:
Samurai Goomba said:
"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."
Could someone explain me this one. Is it suppose to mark atheist or the christians that only beleive in god? Is it some kind of metaphor? Should we beleive that there is no symbol of evil for someone? Is it some kind of philosophical sentence that makes you think?
i think its meant to mean that if people believed there was no ultimate punishment afterwards then they wouldnt be afraid of killing, raping, watching high school musical etc. remember that christianity is basically a religion based on fear of being royally screwed in the end.....well at least it was in teh old days
It's a quote at the end of The Usual Suspects, an awesome movie that everyone should either watch right now or report to me for a flogging. I said it because it seemed applicable, and because I wanted to upset super-serious religious debaters by presenting something that they would see as a legitimate opinion of mine they did not share, thus opening up even more of the lovely religious debate that I adore so much.

I do find it funny that some Christians believe in the idea of Heaven, but not the idea of Hell. It takes faith to believe either one, and they're both in the Bible. Even Jesus talked about Hell (or eternal pain/suffering, anyway). Seems like an all or nothing situation to me.

The Escapist is a predominately atheistic/agnostic website (substantiated numerous times by polls). Asking Escapists about the Devil is like asking John Belushi about organic vegetable gardens. Since I am religious, I choose to keep my unprovable (you really can't prove or disprove any religion, because disproving omnipotence requires omnipotence) views to myself.
 

Abedeus

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kaziard said:
Abedeus said:
kaziard said:
Random argument man said:
Samurai Goomba said:
"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."
Could someone explain me this one. Is it suppose to mark atheist or the christians that only beleive in god? Is it some kind of metaphor? Should we beleive that there is no symbol of evil for someone? Is it some kind of philosophical sentence that makes you think?
i think its meant to mean that if people believed there was no ultimate punishment afterwards then they wouldnt be afraid of killing, raping, watching high school musical etc. remember that christianity is basically a religion based on fear of being royally screwed in the end.....well at least it was in teh old days
No. People who worship God of fear are probably going to Hell anyway. Because they are doing it wrong.

People who worship God out of love will go to Heaven. Because they trust in God and know that he won't punish them if they don't do bad things.

The infamous SCAMola said:
Abedeus said:
...Or just Satan wants to punish people because he's spiteful. Don't forget, he makes people do bad things to watch other people suffer. He likes to see the pain.
Ah, but now you're saying that Satan makes people do bad things, which would mean that there is no free will and God failed in his task.
I worded it poorly. He suggests people to do bad things. If you are of weak will, you will give in and commit a sin. Then HE gets you.
can you explain to me the meaning of "god -fearing" as in every context it is seen as a plus, i.e in an old play i read back in 2nd year a minister said "dont worry child if you are truely a god-fearing disciple he will protect you....or something along those lines xD
God fearing is paranoic fear of God. It was one of the bad things in Christianity in the dark ages, in Medieval times. And it was really, really stupid.


Kukul said:
Abedeus said:
Kukul said:
If I was a Christian I'd be a heretic who believes Satan is just another person of the Holy Trinity (Holy Quartet?). If he's an enemy of God, why does God Almighty keep him around?
That or that he's equal to God like in Zoroastrianism.
Uhm. He doesn't keep him around? He banished him to Hell.
That's a detail. God let Satan exist and have influence on human lifes instead of destroying him without any effort...
Anyway, it's religion, it makes no sense, so you're just as right as I am.
Uhm. FREE WILL. And freedom to exist. God can't kill anyone. I mean, he can, but he doesn't do that. Because there would be no point in creating, as even the worst sinner can repent and (with enough remorse and sacrifice and so on) be saved. I'm not a preacher or anything, but it's just something like this:

Why create humans, if you know everyone will sin at least one time?
 

Chaingang

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Dec 22, 2008
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People fear him because they realize they do bad things, and they fear going to hell to be one of the tortured forever.
 

Ben Legend

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http://unsportsmanlikecomment.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/the-satan-pit-doctor-beast3.jpg

looks quite friendly to be honest