The "Family Values" trope.

[Pyrian]

Dear Mister K, when people say they want two men (or two women) to be allowed to marry each other, it is not an assault on your freedom to marry a (consenting) woman.

...Aaand, I think that about covers it. If you can accept that sort of principle, then no, we won't have a problem.

Because politically, "family values" has never been about supporting traditional families, it's always been about denying non-traditional families. And tolerance (in this context) has never been about denying traditional families, it's always been about allowing non-traditional families.

 

[DefunctTheory]

SNIP

First, people who are against 'family value' don't really give two shits how you live your life. What they care about is someone taking their own 'family values' and forcing them, through law or societal pressures, onto them.

This is one of those instances where, really, the phrase isn't related to the words that make it. It's like 'assault weapon,' just a flashy thing to say, short hand for 'my brand of bullshit you must suffer through.'

Second, you live in the Ukraine, yes? It seems like you may have a bigger issue in your life besides 'radical' feminist. I think you're obsessing over the ant hill in you back yard while your house is burning down behind you.

 

[Mister K]

Dear Mister K, when people say they want two men (or two women) to be allowed to marry each other, it is not an assault on your freedom to marry a (consenting) woman.

...Aaand, I think that about covers it. If you can accept that sort of principle, then no, we won't have a problem.

Because politically, "family values" has never been about supporting traditional families, it's always been about denying non-traditional families. And tolerance (in this context) has never been about denying traditional families, it's always been about allowing non-traditional families.

Off-topic: Don't forget to quote, please.
On-Topic: I understand all of that. My, lets call it anger, wasn't aimed at people who say that it is not so. It was aimed at those edgelords in this thread that are all like "family is overrated" "I am so much better without my family" "I am superior to those who have a family".

I am a firm believer in equality. In actual equality, without quotas for minorities, without witch hunts, etc, etc. However people that I've already described in my OP (people that say that all men should die, for example) piss me right off. They don't want equality. I am not sorry for sounding sexist right now when I say that when I look at photos of people (mostly women) who scream about genocide based on a gender principle aren't really attractive. They want vengeance. And revenge almost never brings common good. Or they are just morons, who knows. In short, they bastardize my belief in equality.

 

[CyanCat47_v1legacy]

family is defined by the emotional ties between the people in it. it is a primary group in which the members support one another in different ways and is the place in which the primary socialisation of the members usually occurs. while blood relations can be an important factor this is not necessarily a requirement. some may grow up with relatives they don't feel attatched to or grow up with non-relatives they love more than anyone else. my cousin is adopted from china and i have known her since before she could walk or speak. i literally could not possibly imagine her as not being part of the family. the communities that matter the most to us often share names but are radically different. if a religious congregation consisted of a bunch of homeless people who met in an empty shipping container to listen to the one person who owned a bible i would still count it as a church because a religious group and a social community is not defined by heirarchy or architecture

 

[Mister K]

SNIP

First, people who are against 'family value' don't really give two shits how you live your life. What they care about is someone taking their own 'family values' and forcing them, through law or societal pressures, onto them.

This is one of those instances where, really, the phrase isn't related to the words that make it. It's like 'assault weapon,' just a flashy thing to say, short hand for 'my brand of bullshit you must suffer through.'

Second, you live in the Ukraine, yes? It seems like you may have a bigger issue in your life besides 'radical' feminist. I think you're obsessing over the ant hill in you back yard while your house is burning down behind you.

Of course I have bigger issues (I did mention lilliput, didn't I?). Its just that this comment I've mentioned before pissed me off. A lot. And I needed to vent.

 

[Mister K]

Sigh, thought of a day:
"Stay away from political threads".

 

[Parasondox]

Chicken Noodle Soup

Pissed at 'radicals' no matter their cause?

To make a long story short, you can still have your cake and eat it too. These 'radicals' as you may call them, just want one basic thing. Too be treated like human beings and not monsters or something worthless. Why? Well treating people with respect no matter their sexuality or gender or race or anything is it a good thing, don't you think. We're had people attacked, just for being 'different'. Once again, no one wants to take your cake away. They just want to be able to have their cake too without feeling like they are monsters and an abomination on society and family. Both the majority and minority should be heard equally on some sort of platform. Then it's up to whoever listening to decide.

or...

Just because something happens, doesn't mean it should.

 

[Mister K]

Chicken Noodle Soup

Pissed at 'radicals' no matter their cause?

To make a long story short, you can still have your cake and eat it too. These 'radicals' as you may call them, just want one basic thing. Too be treated like human beings and not monsters or something worthless. Why? Well treating people with respect no matter their sexuality or gender or race or anything is it a good thing, don't you think. We're had people attacked, just for being 'different'. Once again, no one wants to take your cake away. They just want to be able to have their cake too without feeling like they are monsters and an abomination on society and family. Both the majority and minority should be heard equally on some sort of platform. Then it's up to whoever listening to decide.

or...

Just because something happens, doesn't mean it should.

Never said that the cause is wrong. In my experience however, radical methods and ideas rarely bring needed results.

 

[DefunctTheory]

Spoiler

Chicken Noodle Soup

Pissed at 'radicals' no matter their cause?

To make a long story short, you can still have your cake and eat it too. These 'radicals' as you may call them, just want one basic thing. Too be treated like human beings and not monsters or something worthless. Why? Well treating people with respect no matter their sexuality or gender or race or anything is it a good thing, don't you think. We're had people attacked, just for being 'different'. Once again, no one wants to take your cake away. They just want to be able to have their cake too without feeling like they are monsters and an abomination on society and family. Both the majority and minority should be heard equally on some sort of platform. Then it's up to whoever listening to decide.

or...

Just because something happens, doesn't mean it should.

Never said that the cause is wrong. In my experience however, radical methods and ideas rarely bring needed results.

You say that, but here's the thing - If non-radical methods and ideas worked, then all our cultural problems would have been solved centuries ago. But, unsurprisingly, sitting around and sticking your nose up at anything different, or any people who get 'too uppity,' pushes people towards more and more radical methods and ideas until something works.

 

[Mister K]

Spoiler

Chicken Noodle Soup

Pissed at 'radicals' no matter their cause?

To make a long story short, you can still have your cake and eat it too. These 'radicals' as you may call them, just want one basic thing. Too be treated like human beings and not monsters or something worthless. Why? Well treating people with respect no matter their sexuality or gender or race or anything is it a good thing, don't you think. We're had people attacked, just for being 'different'. Once again, no one wants to take your cake away. They just want to be able to have their cake too without feeling like they are monsters and an abomination on society and family. Both the majority and minority should be heard equally on some sort of platform. Then it's up to whoever listening to decide.

or...

Just because something happens, doesn't mean it should.

Never said that the cause is wrong. In my experience however, radical methods and ideas rarely bring needed results.

You say that, but here's the thing - If non-radical methods and ideas worked, then all our cultural problems would have been solved centuries ago. But, unsurprisingly, sitting around and sticking your nose up at anything different, or any people who get 'too uppity,' pushes people towards more and more radical methods and ideas until something works.

While I agree with you, in short term, well, I and most of my country's people started living way worse. But hey, we showed them all, right?
"Who are they?"
"You know, they"

Snark aside, I hope in the end it will all work out. Both with our problems and your.

EDIT: P.S. Up untill todays venting I never undestood how tired I am.

 

[Mister K]

snip

No you are not the antichrist. Unfortunately to answer your question of what you are, I would get a warning, if not a suspension, so I'm not going to bother. However you are the perfect embodiment of the people that use "family values" as a weapon. NOBODY is telling you that you can't live your life however you want to. YOU can marry whomever you want and raise your kids according to the same brainwashing that you received, and nobody is trying to take that away from you. What people will NOT allow you to do is force your beliefs and way of life onto others that do not wish to live that way. And yes, it is YOU forcing your beliefs when you want to dictate who can and can't be married, who are considered "people" as opposed to writers' tropes, or what religions are "peaceful". Luckily closed-mindedness such as this is going the way of the dinosaurs and will be largely gone within a few generations.

Never said that I am against equality and such, don't put words in my mouth. I am quite pro, to be perfectly honest. I am against people, who misuse their right of free speech to promote the same ideas as the ones OP disagrees with, albeit with reversed roles.

And I don't need to be brainwashed, since radical left side of youth does all the work without any input from the right.

Also, another question: I am pissed and angry because I have a great chance of not waking up tomorrow. What is your excuse? Someone hurt your feelings?

 

[DefunctTheory]

Spoiler

snip

No you are not the antichrist. Unfortunately to answer your question of what you are, I would get a warning, if not a suspension, so I'm not going to bother. However you are the perfect embodiment of the people that use "family values" as a weapon. NOBODY is telling you that you can't live your life however you want to. YOU can marry whomever you want and raise your kids according to the same brainwashing that you received, and nobody is trying to take that away from you. What people will NOT allow you to do is force your beliefs and way of life onto others that do not wish to live that way. And yes, it is YOU forcing your beliefs when you want to dictate who can and can't be married, who are considered "people" as opposed to writers' tropes, or what religions are "peaceful". Luckily closed-mindedness such as this is going the way of the dinosaurs and will be largely gone within a few generations.

Never said that I am against equality and such, don't put words in my mouth. I am quite pro, to be perfectly honest. I am against people, who misuse their right of free speech to promote the same ideas as the ones OP disagrees with, albeit with reversed roles.

And I don't need to be brainwashed, since radical left side of youth does all the work without any input from the right.

Also, another question: I am pissed and angry because I have a great chance of not waking up tomorrow. What is your excuse? Someone hurt your feelings?

Unless you're not going to wake up because a radical feminist is going to beat you to death in your sleep, then your anger is quite misplaced, and thus completely off topic.

If you want to talk about the problems your country actually has, I'm sure there's a couple people here that are game. What we're probably not game for is you using your country's admittedly dire problems as an excuse to throw a hissy fit about a group of 'radical' people who should just shut up because it's grating to your delicate, traditional sense of modesty and normalcy.

 

[mduncan50]

snip

No you are not the antichrist. Unfortunately to answer your question of what you are, I would get a warning, if not a suspension, so I'm not going to bother. However you are the perfect embodiment of the people that use "family values" as a weapon. NOBODY is telling you that you can't live your life however you want to. YOU can marry whomever you want and raise your kids according to the same brainwashing that you received, and nobody is trying to take that away from you. What people will NOT allow you to do is force your beliefs and way of life onto others that do not wish to live that way. And yes, it is YOU forcing your beliefs when you want to dictate who can and can't be married, who are considered "people" as opposed to writers' tropes, or what religions are "peaceful". Luckily closed-mindedness such as this is going the way of the dinosaurs and will be largely gone within a few generations.

Never said that I am against equality and such, don't put words in my mouth. I am quite pro, to be perfectly honest. I am against people, who misuse their right of free speech to promote the same ideas as the ones OP disagrees with, albeit with reversed roles.

And I don't need to be brainwashed, since radical left side of youth does all the work without any input from the right.

Also, another question: I am pissed and angry because I have a great chance of not waking up tomorrow. What is your excuse? Someone hurt your feelings?

Your entire post was a passive aggressive attack against LBGT marriage rights, and non "normal" families, so don't give me that bullshit that you're all about inclusiveness. Who exactly is trying to force you to marry a man and have a handicapped kid? Because that's the basis of your entire rant.

 

[Mister K]

Spoiler

snip

No you are not the antichrist. Unfortunately to answer your question of what you are, I would get a warning, if not a suspension, so I'm not going to bother. However you are the perfect embodiment of the people that use "family values" as a weapon. NOBODY is telling you that you can't live your life however you want to. YOU can marry whomever you want and raise your kids according to the same brainwashing that you received, and nobody is trying to take that away from you. What people will NOT allow you to do is force your beliefs and way of life onto others that do not wish to live that way. And yes, it is YOU forcing your beliefs when you want to dictate who can and can't be married, who are considered "people" as opposed to writers' tropes, or what religions are "peaceful". Luckily closed-mindedness such as this is going the way of the dinosaurs and will be largely gone within a few generations.

Never said that I am against equality and such, don't put words in my mouth. I am quite pro, to be perfectly honest. I am against people, who misuse their right of free speech to promote the same ideas as the ones OP disagrees with, albeit with reversed roles.

And I don't need to be brainwashed, since radical left side of youth does all the work without any input from the right.

Also, another question: I am pissed and angry because I have a great chance of not waking up tomorrow. What is your excuse? Someone hurt your feelings?

Unless you're not going to wake up because a radical feminist is going to beat you to death in your sleep, then your anger is quite misplaced, and thus completely off topic.

If you want to talk about the problems your country actually has, I'm sure there's a couple people here that are game. What we're probably not game for is you using your country's admittedly dire problems as an excuse to throw a hissy fit about a group of 'radical' people who should just shut up because it's grating to your delicate, traditional sense of modesty and normalcy.

Some people refuse to read. I said that I am not only fine with equality, I am PRO it. I dislike people who are the same right-wing assholes, only from the left side of political spectrum.

But no, I dared to threaten YOUR sense of "I am always right". It was I who DARED to "gasp" post something that is not with agreement with YOUR view of the world. And I am a bad guy, suddenly. Go figure. Do you feel yorself right now, being surounded by people who agree with you, attacking the only person who dared to disagree? (sic: right means both correct and the opposite of left).

My arguments weren't always logical and on-topic, that I agree with, but I've already mentioned many times that it is not equality that I disagree with, but with assholes. From both camps. It's just that left ones are a LOT more vocal. They grate my nerves.

 

[Mister K]

snip

No you are not the antichrist. Unfortunately to answer your question of what you are, I would get a warning, if not a suspension, so I'm not going to bother. However you are the perfect embodiment of the people that use "family values" as a weapon. NOBODY is telling you that you can't live your life however you want to. YOU can marry whomever you want and raise your kids according to the same brainwashing that you received, and nobody is trying to take that away from you. What people will NOT allow you to do is force your beliefs and way of life onto others that do not wish to live that way. And yes, it is YOU forcing your beliefs when you want to dictate who can and can't be married, who are considered "people" as opposed to writers' tropes, or what religions are "peaceful". Luckily closed-mindedness such as this is going the way of the dinosaurs and will be largely gone within a few generations.

Never said that I am against equality and such, don't put words in my mouth. I am quite pro, to be perfectly honest. I am against people, who misuse their right of free speech to promote the same ideas as the ones OP disagrees with, albeit with reversed roles.

And I don't need to be brainwashed, since radical left side of youth does all the work without any input from the right.

Also, another question: I am pissed and angry because I have a great chance of not waking up tomorrow. What is your excuse? Someone hurt your feelings?

Your entire post was a passive aggressive attack against LBGT marriage rights, and non "normal" families, so don't give me that bullshit that you're all about inclusiveness. Who exactly is trying to force you to marry a man and have a handicapped kid? Because that's the basis of your entire rant.

Nope, it was , if I were to use your language, an attack on the same assholes as right wing has, only left ones. Because, judging by their comments and posts throughout the social networks and such, you can't really be a modern progressive person if you aren't someone not white, male, etc. In case you did not notice, I disagree with both radical lefties and radical righties.

 

[mduncan50]

snip

No you are not the antichrist. Unfortunately to answer your question of what you are, I would get a warning, if not a suspension, so I'm not going to bother. However you are the perfect embodiment of the people that use "family values" as a weapon. NOBODY is telling you that you can't live your life however you want to. YOU can marry whomever you want and raise your kids according to the same brainwashing that you received, and nobody is trying to take that away from you. What people will NOT allow you to do is force your beliefs and way of life onto others that do not wish to live that way. And yes, it is YOU forcing your beliefs when you want to dictate who can and can't be married, who are considered "people" as opposed to writers' tropes, or what religions are "peaceful". Luckily closed-mindedness such as this is going the way of the dinosaurs and will be largely gone within a few generations.

Never said that I am against equality and such, don't put words in my mouth. I am quite pro, to be perfectly honest. I am against people, who misuse their right of free speech to promote the same ideas as the ones OP disagrees with, albeit with reversed roles.

And I don't need to be brainwashed, since radical left side of youth does all the work without any input from the right.

Also, another question: I am pissed and angry because I have a great chance of not waking up tomorrow. What is your excuse? Someone hurt your feelings?

Your entire post was a passive aggressive attack against LBGT marriage rights, and non "normal" families, so don't give me that bullshit that you're all about inclusiveness. Who exactly is trying to force you to marry a man and have a handicapped kid? Because that's the basis of your entire rant.

Nope, it was , if I were to use your language, an attack on the same assholes as right wing has, only left ones. Because, judging by their comments and posts throughout the social networks and such, you can't really be a modern progressive person if you aren't someone not white, male, etc. In case you did not notice, I disagree with both radical lefties and radical righties.

What you "say" you believe, and what you are actually saying are amazingly far apart.

 

[Mister K]

snip

No you are not the antichrist. Unfortunately to answer your question of what you are, I would get a warning, if not a suspension, so I'm not going to bother. However you are the perfect embodiment of the people that use "family values" as a weapon. NOBODY is telling you that you can't live your life however you want to. YOU can marry whomever you want and raise your kids according to the same brainwashing that you received, and nobody is trying to take that away from you. What people will NOT allow you to do is force your beliefs and way of life onto others that do not wish to live that way. And yes, it is YOU forcing your beliefs when you want to dictate who can and can't be married, who are considered "people" as opposed to writers' tropes, or what religions are "peaceful". Luckily closed-mindedness such as this is going the way of the dinosaurs and will be largely gone within a few generations.

Never said that I am against equality and such, don't put words in my mouth. I am quite pro, to be perfectly honest. I am against people, who misuse their right of free speech to promote the same ideas as the ones OP disagrees with, albeit with reversed roles.

And I don't need to be brainwashed, since radical left side of youth does all the work without any input from the right.

Also, another question: I am pissed and angry because I have a great chance of not waking up tomorrow. What is your excuse? Someone hurt your feelings?

Your entire post was a passive aggressive attack against LBGT marriage rights, and non "normal" families, so don't give me that bullshit that you're all about inclusiveness. Who exactly is trying to force you to marry a man and have a handicapped kid? Because that's the basis of your entire rant.

Nope, it was , if I were to use your language, an attack on the same assholes as right wing has, only left ones. Because, judging by their comments and posts throughout the social networks and such, you can't really be a modern progressive person if you aren't someone not white, male, etc. In case you did not notice, I disagree with both radical lefties and radical righties.

What you "say" you believe, and what you are actually saying are amazingly far apart.

*shrug*
As you wish.

Spoiler

 

[Silvanus]

Because, judging by their comments and posts throughout the social networks and such, you can't really be a modern progressive person if you aren't someone not white, male, etc.

This is entirely baseless. There's not a single comment here indicating anything of the sort in any form, and frankly, I've never seen one, anywhere. I don't believe you. Nobody has expressed that you can't be a "progressive person" if you're not a minority. That's blatantly ridiculous.

 

[Mister K]

Because, judging by their comments and posts throughout the social networks and such, you can't really be a modern progressive person if you aren't someone not white, male, etc.

This is entirely baseless. There's not a single comment here indicating anything of the sort in any form, and frankly, I've never seen one, anywhere. I don't believe you. Nobody has expressed that you can't be a "progressive person" if you're not a minority. That's blatantly ridiculous.

Of course it's ridiculous. It was a joke. But I guess I am a primitive monster and primitive monsters are too dumb and primitive to joke, right?

Although, I've seen countless posts about how men should be wiped out, how white people are the problem. Yet, nobody dares to say that they are being unreasonable, because people don't want to see threats in their inbox from people they dared to disagree with.

No, I am not talking about this site.