The Father vs The Mother

[R.Nevermore]

A rather unfortunate situation has lead me to question the legality of the expecting mother versus the biological father. Ill try and be as unbiased as possible.
My twin brother, about 6 or 7 months ago, knocked up his girlfriend at the time. About 3 months after that, he broke up with her. What a jerk right? Well no, the reasons for breaking up with her did not include the baby, but were due to her being controlling and unwilling to get a job to help support themselves and their upcoming child. I'm fact he expresses nothing but the utmost desire to be a big as possible part in the child's life as possible.
Well, he has since moved about an hours drive away. And the drama has gotten worse between them. Avoiding any possible personality smears, the mother has just announced today that she will not be calling him when she goes into labour, and she will refuse him any chance to support or be a part of his child's life.
Discussion questions
Is it legal for the mother to not notify the father in the event of labour, when he wants to be notified?
Should this be in the mothers rights?
What rights does the father have in this regard, if any?

Note: I live in Canada, so the legal systems may differ from your countries.

 

[Jayemsal]

A rather unfortunate situation has lead me to question the legality of the expecting mother versus the biological father. Ill try and be as unbiased as possible.
My twin brother, about 6 or 7 months ago, knocked up his girlfriend at the time. About 3 months after that, he broke up with her. What a jerk right? Well no, the reasons for breaking up with her did not include the baby, but were due to her being controlling and unwilling to get a job to help support themselves and their upcoming child. I'm fact he expresses nothing but the utmost desire to be a big as possible part in the child's life as possible.
Well, he has since moved about an hours drive away. And the drama has gotten worse between them. Avoiding any possible personality smears, the mother has just announced today that she will not be calling him when she goes into labour, and she will refuse him any chance to support or be a part of his child's life.
Discussion questions
Is it legal for the mother to not notify the father in the event of labour, when he wants to be notified?
Should this be in the mothers rights?
What rights does the father have in this regard, if any?

Note: I live in Canada, so the legal systems may differ from your countries.

He lost all his rights to the child when he decided to stop supporting her when she was pregnant.

We have no need for deadbeat dads in modern society.

 

[adamsaccount]

A rather unfortunate situation has lead me to question the legality of the expecting mother versus the biological father. Ill try and be as unbiased as possible.
My twin brother, about 6 or 7 months ago, knocked up his girlfriend at the time. About 3 months after that, he broke up with her. What a jerk right? Well no, the reasons for breaking up with her did not include the baby, but were due to her being controlling and unwilling to get a job to help support themselves and their upcoming child. I'm fact he expresses nothing but the utmost desire to be a big as possible part in the child's life as possible.
Well, he has since moved about an hours drive away. And the drama has gotten worse between them. Avoiding any possible personality smears, the mother has just announced today that she will not be calling him when she goes into labour, and she will refuse him any chance to support or be a part of his child's life.
Discussion questions
Is it legal for the mother to not notify the father in the event of labour, when he wants to be notified?
Should this be in the mothers rights?
What rights does the father have in this regard, if any?

Note: I live in Canada, so the legal systems may differ from your countries.

He lost all his rights to the child when he decided to stop supporting her when she was pregnant.

We have no need for deadbeat dads in modern society.

No need for me either but im still here, must be pretty gutting for him to miss out on that, i think the hospital should definetely be obliged to give the dad a ring when the babies getting close, whether or not hes in a relationship with the mum at the time.

 

[R.Nevermore]

A rather unfortunate situation has lead me to question the legality of the expecting mother versus the biological father. Ill try and be as unbiased as possible.
My twin brother, about 6 or 7 months ago, knocked up his girlfriend at the time. About 3 months after that, he broke up with her. What a jerk right? Well no, the reasons for breaking up with her did not include the baby, but were due to her being controlling and unwilling to get a job to help support themselves and their upcoming child. I'm fact he expresses nothing but the utmost desire to be a big as possible part in the child's life as possible.
Well, he has since moved about an hours drive away. And the drama has gotten worse between them. Avoiding any possible personality smears, the mother has just announced today that she will not be calling him when she goes into labour, and she will refuse him any chance to support or be a part of his child's life.
Discussion questions
Is it legal for the mother to not notify the father in the event of labour, when he wants to be notified?
Should this be in the mothers rights?
What rights does the father have in this regard, if any?

Note: I live in Canada, so the legal systems may differ from your countries.

He lost all his rights to the child when he decided to stop supporting her when she was pregnant.

We have no need for deadbeat dads in modern society.

He would not be a deadbeat dad seeing as though he wants to be a part of his child's life and support it in every possible way. He will be fighting for custody in fact. Hardly a deadbeat dad.

 

[Basement Cat]

If they aren't married he doesn't have any real legal rights, but she CAN probably try to sue him to secure child support.

The age of the two certainly effects how the courts would consider the matter. If they're both teenagers then she's probably shit out of luck if she expects him to slave for her without having any say or do in the child's upbringing.

 

[Aris Khandr]

Should be fairly easy to get court ordered visitation rights for him. And if she persists in attempting to exclude him after that, full custody would likely be the next step.

 

[Phasmal]

I don't think being the dad gives you a right to a ringside seat when the mother is in labour. I mean, it's not a right to watch a baby come out of someone's coochie, it's a privilege.
He obviously should fight for the right to see his kid, though.

EDIT: It would probably be in his best interest to try and be as... diplomatic as possible to this woman, even if she is being impossible and stubborn. For the best interest of the kid it's usually best to try and make peace.

 

[Colour Scientist]

Should be fairly easy to get court ordered visitation rights for him. And if she persists in attempting to exclude him after that, full custody would likely be the next step.

Unless she's an unfit mother, it's very unlikely that he would get full custody.

OP: It's unfair but he has no place in the delivery room if the mother doesn't want him present while she's giving birth. A woman can be in labour for anything up to 12 hours and it can be, and often is, very messy, very painful and exhausting. That's without complications so he has no grounds there.

As for custody, if he's supporting the child then he will easily get a court order for visitation rights. To be honest, unless she's a total douche, his ex probably won't let it get that far. It doesn't happen in every case, despite what the Internet would have you believe, women do usually want what's best for their child rather than just looking for money and revenge.

Emotionally and physically she's probably all over the place, especially if it was unplanned, which could be why things seem like they will be difficult at the moment.

 

[R.Nevermore]

Oh absolutely right. Delivery room access is a non-issue. He would like to be there but realizes its not happening, nor is it even in the child's best interest to stress the mother like that. But she is telling him she will not even notify him that the child is coming, or even that the child is born afterwards. He just wants to be I. The hospital, waiting room or delivery room, as long as he can see his child.

 

[Wadders]

What? She wont get a job to support their child? Well, shes pregnant isn't she? Seems fair enough to me, especially as she gets more heavily pregnant.

I can understand his wish to be part of his childs life, and without any knowledge of the laws about this sort of thing, I would hope he would be within his rights to be there or there about when it is born, or at least see it soon after.

Beyond that, I would guess things become a lot harder. Wear fucking condoms people.

 

[Phasmal]

Oh absolutely right. Delivery room access is a non-issue. He would like to be there but realizes its not happening, nor is it even in the child's best interest to stress the mother like that. But she is telling him she will not even notify him that the child is coming, or even that the child is born afterwards. He just wants to be I. The hospital, waiting room or delivery room, as long as he can see his child.

If I was him I would talk to her family or friends and try to appeal to reason, they might be able to talk her round.
It may involve some apologising he doesn't mean, or some sucking up, but in the long run, it's better.

 

[HardkorSB]

the reasons for breaking up with her did not include the baby, but were due to her being controlling and unwilling to get a job to help support themselves and their upcoming child.

To be fair, having a job, especially a stressful minimum wage job (which is most likely what she would get, I presume) while being pregnant, isn't very good for the development of the child.

 

[The Wykydtron]

Weeeeelll since i've never had a dad and in fact have never once seen him from second one and only learned his first name when I was eight fucking teen I think my answer is sort of obvious.

Y'know i'm waiting for him to try to contact me now that i'm out of the pesky bratty child stage, I bet there's a decent chance of it happening. It would give me a cheap laugh at worse.

As for the question, fuck it it's not my place to judge nor do I particularly want to. But fuck dads man. They suck. REALLY suck :3

I still don't get why people don't take the perfectly logical abortion in that situation. They're not ready for a child, probably never really wanted a child at this point to begin with, never planned for one and the home life is sketchy at best so why on Earth would you have a child when you have the option not to?

Y'know if my own mother had taken my own advice back then I would never have been around to type this. Fuck there goes my pro-abortion argument. It was looking so decent as well...

 

[Jayemsal]

A rather unfortunate situation has lead me to question the legality of the expecting mother versus the biological father. Ill try and be as unbiased as possible.
My twin brother, about 6 or 7 months ago, knocked up his girlfriend at the time. About 3 months after that, he broke up with her. What a jerk right? Well no, the reasons for breaking up with her did not include the baby, but were due to her being controlling and unwilling to get a job to help support themselves and their upcoming child. I'm fact he expresses nothing but the utmost desire to be a big as possible part in the child's life as possible.
Well, he has since moved about an hours drive away. And the drama has gotten worse between them. Avoiding any possible personality smears, the mother has just announced today that she will not be calling him when she goes into labour, and she will refuse him any chance to support or be a part of his child's life.
Discussion questions
Is it legal for the mother to not notify the father in the event of labour, when he wants to be notified?
Should this be in the mothers rights?
What rights does the father have in this regard, if any?

Note: I live in Canada, so the legal systems may differ from your countries.

He lost all his rights to the child when he decided to stop supporting her when she was pregnant.

We have no need for deadbeat dads in modern society.

He would not be a deadbeat dad seeing as though he wants to be a part of his child's life and support it in every possible way. He will be fighting for custody in fact. Hardly a deadbeat dad.

I'm speaking from personal experience here.

I had a roommate whose story matched your brother's nearly to a T.

He abandoned her after getting her pregnant, and after the child was born, demanded to be a part of the child's life.

5 months after she allowed him to care for the child alone, that child drowned in a pool in the back yard while he was in his room getting high.


So no, I dont care if he wants to be part of the child's life. He abandoned her when she needed him, and he therefore abandoned all rights to oversee the child along with her.

I've already seen one child die from the negligence of such people, I cannot condone risking it again.

 

[TheRightToArmBears]

I doubt there's much he can do about being there for the birth, but I'm sure he must be able to at least get visitation rights.

Le snip

This seems like a ridiculously unfair assessment. You don't know how things happened, do you expect him to stay in a bad relationship just because there is a baby involved? You simply do not know enough, you don't know if he tried to support her despite breaking up, but apparently he has no right to care for his own child?

 

[Jayemsal]

I doubt there's much he can do about being there for the birth, but I'm sure he must be able to at least get visitation rights.

Le snip

This seems like a ridiculously unfair assessment. You don't know how things happened, do you expect him to stay in a bad relationship just because there is a baby involved? You simply do not know enough, you don't know if he tried to support her despite breaking up, but apparently he has no right to care for his own child?

There is a certain level of commitment required to be eligible to raise a child.

I dont care whose blood test matches the kid, I care who is there to support them in the time of need, and from what you've said, he has not been there.

Past behavior is the greatest indicator of future behavior.

Also, No, I dont expect people to remain in a bad relationship because of a child, if she is not a good parent, she isnt worthy of having that child in her custody either.

I've no respect for these arbitrary "birth parent" ideas of right to the child.

 

[TheRightToArmBears]

There is a certain level of commitment required to be eligible to raise a child.

I dont care whose blood test matches the kid, I care who is there to support them in the time of need, and from what you've said, he has not been there.

Past behavior is the greatest indicator of future behavior.

Also, No, I dont expect people to remain in a bad relationship because of a child, if she is not a good parent, she isnt worthy of having that child in her custody either.

I've no respect for these arbitrary "birth parent" ideas of right to the child.

What I am saying is that you have no idea if he tried to be supportive, only that he broke up with her. I think you're making an unfair assessment without enough information.

 

[R.Nevermore]

I'm speaking from personal experience here.

I had a roommate whose story matched your brother's nearly to a T.

He abandoned her after getting her pregnant, and after the child was born, demanded to be a part of the child's life.

5 months after she allowed him to care for the child alone, that child drowned in a pool in the back yard while he was in his room getting high.


So no, I dont care if he wants to be part of the child's life. He abandoned her when she needed him, and he therefore abandoned all rights to oversee the child along with her.

I've already seen one child die from the negligence of such people, I cannot condone risking it again.

Woah!! Woah woah woah. Do you have any idea how insane that sounds?
'This sorta similar thing happened to a friend of a friend and one thing lead to another and now the kids dead. So clearly this means your brothers gonna be a negligent monster '

She was unwilling to look for a job whilst already 3 months pregnant? What a monster...

She was never willing to work. Before she got pregnant even. He was in college, and working a full time job. She literally worked on elaborate lies to fake going to work 4 days a week, and she would go downtown and hang out with her friends. I should mince less words, she was horrible. People seem to be under the impression that he left her when the goings got tough. He caught her in numerous lies, she contributed nothing to the relationship at all, and laid out guilt trips to keep him from ever leaving the house or even play games. Every moment had to be with her or it was a suicide threat with her.
Unfortunately society assumes that the man is always at fault in a situation like this. If a girl gets pregnant, is the man supposed to stay in an abusive relationship until the baby comes along?

 

[Jayemsal]

I'm speaking from personal experience here.

I had a roommate whose story matched your brother's nearly to a T.

He abandoned her after getting her pregnant, and after the child was born, demanded to be a part of the child's life.

5 months after she allowed him to care for the child alone, that child drowned in a pool in the back yard while he was in his room getting high.


So no, I dont care if he wants to be part of the child's life. He abandoned her when she needed him, and he therefore abandoned all rights to oversee the child along with her.

I've already seen one child die from the negligence of such people, I cannot condone risking it again.

Woah!! Woah woah woah. Do you have any idea how insane that sounds?
'This sorta similar thing happened to a friend of a friend and one thing lead to another and now the kids dead. So clearly this means your brothers gonna be a negligent monster '

She was unwilling to look for a job whilst already 3 months pregnant? What a monster...

She was never willing to work. Before she got pregnant even. He was in college, and working a full time job. She literally worked on elaborate lies to fake going to work 4 days a week, and she would go downtown and hang out with her friends. I should mince less words, she was horrible. People seem to be under the impression that he left her when the goings got tough. He caught her in numerous lies, she contributed nothing to the relationship at all, and laid out guilt trips to keep him from ever leaving the house or even play games. Every moment had to be with her or it was a suicide threat with her.
Unfortunately society assumes that the man is always at fault in a situation like this. If a girl gets pregnant, is the man supposed to stay in an abusive relationship until the baby comes along?[/quote]

See, this information is very important when you're explaining the situation to us.

You cant expect people to get an accurate grasp of the situation if you withhold information.

EDIT: and it wasnt "a friend of a friend" I saw the child die(I saw the corpse, rather) with my own eyes, I woke to the screams of a negligent father. Dont you dare try to imply I am exagerating.