with the release of the lastest trailer for swtor, someones mention that the basic star wars story never repeats. A few posts later, a poster posted this.
"As far as Star Wars goes you have to understand that the universe is supposed to be stagnant for a reason. Most people don't understand exactly what is going on with it, having sort of created their own versions of it in their head without understanding it. To some extent I think people blame Star Wars unfairly, when it's what it was always supposed to be.
See, Star Wars is a universe of pre-destination. The Force is not so much an energy field that people tap into through their will, but a living metaphysical entity, kind of like God, that pulls the strings of the universe. Star Wars is guided between cycles with good and evil both getting turns to rule the universe in between periods of balance. This is why there are prophecies that come true, like the whole thing with Anakin "bringing balance to the force" which was misunderstood, basically it was time for an era of good to end, and he was being used as The Force's pawn to bring it down. The thing is though that before the universe goes into full "evil mode" it's supposed to go through a period where the two forces are balanced, which is where Star Wars left off. See, this is why Vader actually killed The Emperor, it was pre-destnied, it wasn't time for an "evil empire" yet. He killed the good guys, killed the bad guy, and left things with one really strong force user who wasn't property trained (Luke) who could go either way.
The thing in Star Wars is that people BELIEVE they have free will though, and The Force works through manipulation to force people to do what it wants in terms of the big picture. That is why Anakin was such an emo wreck, he wanted to be a good guy, but the universe pretty much decided "you WILL bring down the Jedi" so every time he had his ducks in a row, the universe would cause something to happen... like him finding his mother being held by sand people, which caused him to start channeling some serious Dark Side.
This is also incidently why the force goes "cloudy" at specific points, and powers wax and wane, it's all based on what it wants. Jedi and Sith don't win based on personal skill or badassitude, but due to predestination, with their powers basically working to the degree the univerese wants. Of course the manipulations can be complicated, and it isn't always one sided, as enabling a good guy to win/survive during an coming era of evil (or vice versa) can set things up for it's overall plans down the road, after all The Force is trying to maintain the illusion of free will for whatever reason.
The whole Mitochloria thing is simply what The Force works through, think of it cooresponding to points of articulation on a puppet. Someone The Force wants to work through a lot... like Anakin, has a lot of points, less important guys have less of this for it to work through. It has a physical prescence because again, The Force is trying to maintain an illusion.
Generally speaking only one person in the canon or quasi-canon has figured this out, and that's Kreia from "Knights Of The Old Republic 2" which was ghost written by Geore Lucas (based on his notes and input, etc...). This kind of spells it out rather unsubtly, but people tend to forget about it. In that game Kreia was trying to kill The Force in order to restore free will. For her the first step was to wipe out all the Force users, but due to the problems with finishing the game details like how she planned to destroy a metaphysical entity that pretty much controls everything were glossed over due to the way she was defeated. Of course the simple fact that she started spouting prophecy in her final moments itself raises the question as to whether she herself was a giant tool and never had a chance of doing what she set out to do. After all her actions directly lead to the contact between The Republic and Sith Empire, which we know ends with the destruction of The Empire and the end of their era of evil.
At any rate, the reason why Star Wars deals with the same basic characters and situations in differant forms, and technology stays stagnant, and so on, is because of this basic truth. Tech doesn't really advance beccause the universe is periodically wiped out due to massive warfare with new empires (of good or evil) erasing the signs of their predecessors, sort of like how the Jedi committed Genocide on the Sith and wiped out all the records to the point where come the movies nobody REALLY knew what a Sith was anymore for all intents and purposes. Once in a while you see an ancient super weapon that is a step or two ahead of what people generally have... left over from a previous era (and probably preserved by The Force for later use in manipulation) but by and large you pretty much stick with the same general level of cruisers/space fighters/guns/etc... in slightly differant looking packages.
From the perspective of the people who live obliviously in this universe some cool stories can be told, but the idea does have it's problems. Likewise this is also why so much of the EU becomes garbage is that the guys writing it start playing around in introducing things to the universe that don't belong, leading to retcons later on and so on. A lot of fairly "common sense" stuff doesn't really happen because we have a giant Metaphysical entity sitting there preventing it from happening.
I'm not saying that your wrong, even if I'm not totally burned out with it yet, I just think it's more a matter of the whole universe having been fairly limited to begin with.
At any rate, what you might find interesting, especially if your initial reaction is to argue with me about how I'm wrong, is to re-experience a lot of the core works with what I say in mind. You'll find a lot of things suddenly "click" that didn't quite make sense before. Oddly enough this includes Emo-Anakin, nothing can undo the horrible writing, but you can understand the character a bit better when you get past the whole "Ultimate Bad Arse Vader" and "Final Redemption" ideas and start to think of him as a tool being manipulated by the universe. Everything, from The Emperor's lies, to his plotting against the emperor, to the way he developed through "Clone Wars" and the movies and his resistance to his fate without really understanding it kind of sells the character a bit better. He's not the "Vader" a lot of people created in their minds, but a pretty solid character.
Really Battlestar Galactica's "This has all happened before, it will happen again" schtick fits in perfectly with Star Wars. If anything think of Anakin as Gaius Baltar from the remake (although logically you could say Baltar is more like him given the age of Star Wars) except with Anakin being a generally good, and well intentioned person, as opposed to a self-serving douchebag, at his core, making him a bit more tragic. This includes the "WTF" reveals with the trippy space angels and religious revelations... albiet Star Wars never had any kind of a reveal like that except KoToR2 to some extent.
Thanks for reading for those who made it this far.
" by Therumancer.
In short the force seems to prevent free will by misleading people so they think they have it, when really they do not. Forceing entire the galaxey to repeat history again and again. The only person figure this out was Kreia from kotor 2, and try to get rid of the force to restore free will upon the galaxey. Rather sad ain't it? An entire galaxery forced to relive history forever unless all force users are killed and force is destoryed. It explains why the star wars story never really changes, but why only kreia? Or was she used as a tool by some other being?
Rather interesting isn't it what is seen as the highest thing of an entire galaxey also controls it to repeat history. Tis be worthy of shreding tears it be.
Edit: drats i put it in the wrong forum section, unless ye counts the star wars games...
"As far as Star Wars goes you have to understand that the universe is supposed to be stagnant for a reason. Most people don't understand exactly what is going on with it, having sort of created their own versions of it in their head without understanding it. To some extent I think people blame Star Wars unfairly, when it's what it was always supposed to be.
See, Star Wars is a universe of pre-destination. The Force is not so much an energy field that people tap into through their will, but a living metaphysical entity, kind of like God, that pulls the strings of the universe. Star Wars is guided between cycles with good and evil both getting turns to rule the universe in between periods of balance. This is why there are prophecies that come true, like the whole thing with Anakin "bringing balance to the force" which was misunderstood, basically it was time for an era of good to end, and he was being used as The Force's pawn to bring it down. The thing is though that before the universe goes into full "evil mode" it's supposed to go through a period where the two forces are balanced, which is where Star Wars left off. See, this is why Vader actually killed The Emperor, it was pre-destnied, it wasn't time for an "evil empire" yet. He killed the good guys, killed the bad guy, and left things with one really strong force user who wasn't property trained (Luke) who could go either way.
The thing in Star Wars is that people BELIEVE they have free will though, and The Force works through manipulation to force people to do what it wants in terms of the big picture. That is why Anakin was such an emo wreck, he wanted to be a good guy, but the universe pretty much decided "you WILL bring down the Jedi" so every time he had his ducks in a row, the universe would cause something to happen... like him finding his mother being held by sand people, which caused him to start channeling some serious Dark Side.
This is also incidently why the force goes "cloudy" at specific points, and powers wax and wane, it's all based on what it wants. Jedi and Sith don't win based on personal skill or badassitude, but due to predestination, with their powers basically working to the degree the univerese wants. Of course the manipulations can be complicated, and it isn't always one sided, as enabling a good guy to win/survive during an coming era of evil (or vice versa) can set things up for it's overall plans down the road, after all The Force is trying to maintain the illusion of free will for whatever reason.
The whole Mitochloria thing is simply what The Force works through, think of it cooresponding to points of articulation on a puppet. Someone The Force wants to work through a lot... like Anakin, has a lot of points, less important guys have less of this for it to work through. It has a physical prescence because again, The Force is trying to maintain an illusion.
Generally speaking only one person in the canon or quasi-canon has figured this out, and that's Kreia from "Knights Of The Old Republic 2" which was ghost written by Geore Lucas (based on his notes and input, etc...). This kind of spells it out rather unsubtly, but people tend to forget about it. In that game Kreia was trying to kill The Force in order to restore free will. For her the first step was to wipe out all the Force users, but due to the problems with finishing the game details like how she planned to destroy a metaphysical entity that pretty much controls everything were glossed over due to the way she was defeated. Of course the simple fact that she started spouting prophecy in her final moments itself raises the question as to whether she herself was a giant tool and never had a chance of doing what she set out to do. After all her actions directly lead to the contact between The Republic and Sith Empire, which we know ends with the destruction of The Empire and the end of their era of evil.
At any rate, the reason why Star Wars deals with the same basic characters and situations in differant forms, and technology stays stagnant, and so on, is because of this basic truth. Tech doesn't really advance beccause the universe is periodically wiped out due to massive warfare with new empires (of good or evil) erasing the signs of their predecessors, sort of like how the Jedi committed Genocide on the Sith and wiped out all the records to the point where come the movies nobody REALLY knew what a Sith was anymore for all intents and purposes. Once in a while you see an ancient super weapon that is a step or two ahead of what people generally have... left over from a previous era (and probably preserved by The Force for later use in manipulation) but by and large you pretty much stick with the same general level of cruisers/space fighters/guns/etc... in slightly differant looking packages.
From the perspective of the people who live obliviously in this universe some cool stories can be told, but the idea does have it's problems. Likewise this is also why so much of the EU becomes garbage is that the guys writing it start playing around in introducing things to the universe that don't belong, leading to retcons later on and so on. A lot of fairly "common sense" stuff doesn't really happen because we have a giant Metaphysical entity sitting there preventing it from happening.
I'm not saying that your wrong, even if I'm not totally burned out with it yet, I just think it's more a matter of the whole universe having been fairly limited to begin with.
At any rate, what you might find interesting, especially if your initial reaction is to argue with me about how I'm wrong, is to re-experience a lot of the core works with what I say in mind. You'll find a lot of things suddenly "click" that didn't quite make sense before. Oddly enough this includes Emo-Anakin, nothing can undo the horrible writing, but you can understand the character a bit better when you get past the whole "Ultimate Bad Arse Vader" and "Final Redemption" ideas and start to think of him as a tool being manipulated by the universe. Everything, from The Emperor's lies, to his plotting against the emperor, to the way he developed through "Clone Wars" and the movies and his resistance to his fate without really understanding it kind of sells the character a bit better. He's not the "Vader" a lot of people created in their minds, but a pretty solid character.
Really Battlestar Galactica's "This has all happened before, it will happen again" schtick fits in perfectly with Star Wars. If anything think of Anakin as Gaius Baltar from the remake (although logically you could say Baltar is more like him given the age of Star Wars) except with Anakin being a generally good, and well intentioned person, as opposed to a self-serving douchebag, at his core, making him a bit more tragic. This includes the "WTF" reveals with the trippy space angels and religious revelations... albiet Star Wars never had any kind of a reveal like that except KoToR2 to some extent.
Thanks for reading for those who made it this far.
" by Therumancer.In short the force seems to prevent free will by misleading people so they think they have it, when really they do not. Forceing entire the galaxey to repeat history again and again. The only person figure this out was Kreia from kotor 2, and try to get rid of the force to restore free will upon the galaxey. Rather sad ain't it? An entire galaxery forced to relive history forever unless all force users are killed and force is destoryed. It explains why the star wars story never really changes, but why only kreia? Or was she used as a tool by some other being?
Rather interesting isn't it what is seen as the highest thing of an entire galaxey also controls it to repeat history. Tis be worthy of shreding tears it be.
Edit: drats i put it in the wrong forum section, unless ye counts the star wars games...
