The Unsolved Mysteries Of 40K: A Good Old Discussion

[TheRightToArmBears]

Could anyone tell me whats going on with Eldar?

I haven't had anything to do with Warhammer of any kind for a good few years, and the Eldar were always my favorites.

 

[EscapeGoat_v1legacy]

I've got a mystery- what's the deal with Roboute Guilleman? Are his wounds really healing? If so, how? In fact, what's happened with all the other missing Primarchs?

All the loyalists primarchs are either dead or missing. Guilleman is permanently in stasis as far as I know and would die if he wasn't so no he is not really healing though I have heard some claims he is. As to the Traitor Primarchs or as I call them the Real Loyalists are pretty much all Daemon Lords except for Horus who at the last second got killed by the Emperor.

I realise they're all missing, dead or turned to Chaos, but what I meant to ask was what happens if one or more of the missing Primarchs returns?

Well, a clue is to be offered by none other than Leman Russ. He said, with his final words no less:

"I Shall Be Back. For The Wolftime."

Which has been interpreted to mean the End of Days, Ragnarok, the final battle of Chaos versus Humanity and the Universe itself. Therefore, I hypothesise that if any or all of the missing Primarchs returned, it would herald this final battle.

Also, this isn't strictly just from Leman Russ. I read somewhere, and I wish I could remember where, that Lion El'Jonson resides at the deepest point of the Rock, asleep with the Watchers in the Dark, waiting for the final battle, when he will awaken and lead the Dark Angels to redemption.

Also, to add to the Roboute Guilliman thing - I think he is healing, personally. I know he's in stasis, and therefore cannot possibly heal, nor return from beyond death, but, working on the theory that the Star Child is the Emperor's soul, and will inevtiably return, revitalising both the Emperor and His powers, surely it will allow him to call forth his sons from their final resting places? Maybe not, but then, 'tis my opinion.

 

[pigeonreaper]

I've got a mystery- what's the deal with Roboute Guilleman? Are his wounds really healing? If so, how? In fact, what's happened with all the other missing Primarchs?

All the loyalists primarchs are either dead or missing. Guilleman is permanently in stasis as far as I know and would die if he wasn't so no he is not really healing though I have heard some claims he is. As to the Traitor Primarchs or as I call them the Real Loyalists are pretty much all Daemon Lords except for Horus who at the last second got killed by the Emperor.

I realise they're all missing, dead or turned to Chaos, but what I meant to ask was what happens if one or more of the missing Primarchs returns?

Well, a clue is to be offered by none other than Leman Russ. He said, with his final words no less:

"I Shall Be Back. For The Wolftime."

Which has been interpreted to mean the End of Days, Ragnarok, the final battle of Chaos versus Humanity and the Universe itself. Therefore, I hypothesise that if any or all of the missing Primarchs returned, it would herald this final battle.

Also, this isn't strictly just from Leman Russ. I read somewhere, and I wish I could remember where, that Lion El'Jonson resides at the deepest point of the Rock, asleep with the Watchers in the Dark, waiting for the final battle, when he will awaken and lead the Dark Angels to redemption.

Also, to add to the Roboute Guilliman thing - I think he is healing, personally. I know he's in stasis, and therefore cannot possibly heal, nor return from beyond death, but, working on the theory that the Star Child is the Emperor's soul, and will inevtiably return, revitalising both the Emperor and His powers, surely it will allow him to call forth his sons from their final resting places? Maybe not, but then, 'tis my opinion.

The thing about him being in stasis- I know that any sort of healing under stasis is normally impossible, but we can safely say normal rules don't apply to the Emperor and his sons.

I agree with you that if any or all of the missing Primarchs return, it will be at the end of days, but what is the Starchild theory? I've only faintly heard of it.

 

[MCGT]

Whatever Happened to Malal? Malal was the fifth Chaos god, and represented Chaos' destructive tendencies, even to itself; as such, the followers of Malal would go around attacking other followers of Chaos.

Apparantly a GW employee who held the rights to him left the company and now they can't mention him anymore.

 

[EscapeGoat_v1legacy]

The thing about him being in stasis- I know that any sort of healing under stasis is normally impossible, but we can safely say normal rules don't apply to the Emperor and his sons.

I agree with you that if any or all of the missing Primarchs return, it will be at the end of days, but what is the Starchild theory? I've only faintly heard of it.

Rules don't apply to the Emperor or His Sons? I like the sound of that!

The Star Child theory runs thusly:

The Emperor is a reincarnation of the Shamans, ancient beings who guided Mankind using the Warp, when it was pure. When the time came, the Shamans sacrificed themselves so that their souls might bind together and create a being anew. Thus, the Emperor was born.

With the rebellion of Horus, the Emperor's soul and body were shattered, torn asunder due to his son's betrayal and the damage he had sustained. His body was left on Terra, to fuel the Golden Throne, so that Mankind might continue to thrive. His soul, however, melted into the Warp, and is now known as the Star Child.

Just as the Shaman's death created a new being, with the death of the Emperor, and Mankind's need for a new saviour, the Star Child will return, born anew, and shall rekindle the Holy Light of the Emperor, and usher forth a new age of prosperity for Mankind.

That's the theory as I understand it, although if there's any mistake or differences, I'm sure the community will pick up on it.

EDIT: I've just thought, there is one thing I'm confused about.

Are the Alpha Legion actual traitors, or are they fighting for Mankind covertly? I read that they never use Daemons, which would suggest that they aren't completely under Chaos' control, and their battle-cry is "For the Emperor!", but if they are Loyalists, why did they turn traitor during the Heresy? Also, is the Primarch Alpharius, or Omegeon? Or are they one and the same? They are seriously the most confusing Chapter I've ever read about.

 

[DJShire]

wow, the nerd funk is strong in this thread

 

[Rusty Bucket]

I have a question. How is it possible for the Grey Knights to be this cool? Seriously, if they got any cooler, the universe would explode.

EDIT: I've just thought, there is one thing I'm confused about.

Are the Alpha Legion actual traitors, or are they fighting for Mankind covertly? I read that they never use Daemons, which would suggest that they aren't completely under Chaos' control, and their battle-cry is "For the Emperor!", but if they are Loyalists, why did they turn traitor during the Heresy? Also, is the Primarch Alpharius, or Omegeon? Or are they one and the same? They are seriously the most confusing Chapter I've ever read about.

Basically, no one really knows anything about them. After the horus heresy, they legged it east instead of going into the eye of terror with the rest of them. They're barely ever seen active, and the 'For the Emperor' thing could be a mockery or an indication of loyalty. As for the Primarch, both of them. They were twins. Alpharius is believed to be killed by Roboute Guilliman shortly after the horus heresy.

If you want to know anything about the lore, go here

 

[Brett Alex]

wow, the nerd funk is strong in this thread

You're on a website devoted to videogames. Did you really expect anything different?

 

[Hunde Des Krieg]

Is it wierd that the history of a universe that doesn't exist is far more interesting than real history? This is really interesting, but at the same time, hopelessly nerdy.

 

[Dys]

Well ultrajoe, you see, it is the black library.
Everything. EVERYTHING

The accumulated lore, yes, but it lacks appropriate conclusions from such lore. It maintains 'Canon Mysteries' and merely serves as a repository for the data accumulated by the series. We may know that Russ disappeared into the Eye of Terror, resurfacing for a summer campaign, but where did he go afterwards? We know that Tigerius claims he can commune with the emperor, but could he be lying as an agent of chaos?

We know every part of the human body, but still it has mysteries that astound us. The presence of science does not do away with scientists.

We can still wonder. But thank you for your valued contribution.

I was joking Joe, I like that you took it seriously but I don't seriously think the black library is relevant to EVERYTHING in 40K lore, it is just a conviniant dues ex machinma they sometimes use.

None of the 40K races are anywhere near extinction for those of you claiming the tau and eldar are struggly. Nobody really knows the deal with the tau, but it is known that the imperial fleets that tried to land on their homeworld all lost in unpredicted, extreme and contained warp storms. Whoever or whatever is influencing the tau (through the etherals) isn't a being to be taken lightly. As for the eldar, they have craft worlds and are able to manipulare the orks, humans and even tyranids to a degree. It would simply be impossible to wipe out every craft world without others springing up, even their number seem to be evening out a bit.

 

[Brett Alex]

Nobody really knows the deal with the tau, but it is known that the imperial fleets that tried to land on their homeworld all lost in unpredicted, extreme and contained warp storms. Whoever or whatever is influencing the tau (through the etherals) isn't a being to be taken lightly.

I entirely forgot about that until you mentioned it.

Weren't the first two ethereals twins or identical or something?

 

[Dys]

Nobody really knows the deal with the tau, but it is known that the imperial fleets that tried to land on their homeworld all lost in unpredicted, extreme and contained warp storms. Whoever or whatever is influencing the tau (through the etherals) isn't a being to be taken lightly.

I entirely forgot about that until you mentioned it.

Weren't the first two ethereals twins or identical or something?

No idea, it just stuck in my mind that unusually savage warp storms conveiniantly wiped out an entire imperial fleet the first time they went near the planet tau. I do remember something about all etherarals being identical at the start, might whip out the codex and scan through it later.

 

[ward.]

Druchii are sadistic, they use torture and murder for art and pleasure. Skaven are just scheming little buggers all though I will admit some of them most definatley are evil (infact most races can have good guys and bad guys in.) Also on which page does it say Orcs are from spores?

That doesn't automatically make them evil, for the most part druichi society is pretty relaxed.
Skaven society on the other hand, is a brutal caste system that turns out a far higher body count then every other evil race combined.

I suppose it is because Skaven do tend to fight ALOT more with there own kind, but in terms of actual cruelty I would say Druchii plus the fact they feel all races are inferior to them, they started alot of the bloodiest wars in warhammer history and they wear other people's skin and sit on chairs of paralysed slaves and stuff.

So have skaven, not to mention some of the dirtiest wars (the black pox on the empire, red pox on bretonnia and now the yellow skull fever against the lizardmen).
Not to mention the entire race being cannibalistic and at least a tiny bit insane.

Could anyone tell me whats going on with Eldar?

I haven't had anything to do with Warhammer of any kind for a good few years, and the Eldar were always my favorites.

They haven't changed much, they're still trying to create a new god to fight slaanesh, they had a hand in the creation of the tau and eldrad sacrificed himself, might still be alive but trapped in the warp though.

 

[DJShire]

wow, the nerd funk is strong in this thread

You're on a website devoted to videogames. Did you really expect anything different?

Nope, just being derisive

 

[Red Right Hand]

I'd like to know who the Old One's were, ie: what they looked like and how powerful they really are. I mean, they were able to summon all these races into existance, I wonder if one could kill a C'Tan? Plus when that Void Dragon on Mars wakes up, can the Empire stop it? It'd be a great battle, but it would wake up right next to the Emperor meaning right next to every gun man can muster and (apparently) the Emperors amazing psycic ablities.

Well the VD was supposedly locked away by the emperor, and a guardian tasked every 10,000 years to guard it. A special book was needed to perform this process. 10,000 years ago, someone stole this book, as explained by the book 'Mechanicum' from the horus heresy series. My bet is on Tzeench or the Deceiver pulling the switch on that one.

Weren't the Tyranid Hive Fleets avoiding Necron tomb worlds, like, by massive distances where possible? Whats up with that?

My bet? They can feel the necrons, and know that there's no point biting metal. But there is a lesser stated theory that the Necrons go after Nids like no other species. Tyranids are the ultimate expression of life, and would you want to go near a race of bitchin life-reapers if you were everything they swore to destroy? Or could a Hive-mind C'Tan be using the Tyranids as another form of Necron to wipe life from the map completely? See, my theories aren't complete bunk!

Didn't the original lore for the Tyranids feature Genestealer cults... people who worshipped something and got turned into Genestealers? Or something? I'm not that up on my Tyranids...

Tyranids go Alien style on imperial civilians, and those hybrids then subvert and weaken planet through terrorism and sabotage before the main fleet arrives. A prime example of Face Full Of Alien Wing Wong

Now they are a large chapter, thought to be the largest, broken into several mini-chapters ("Crusades"), EACH ONE lead by an Emperor's Champion! There are thought to be at least 13 of these groups! HOLY SHIT! If they all went to the Eye of Terror with Imperial Guard support and maybe some other chapters (some Grey Knights and maybe other Ordo Malleus...) Chaos would be FUCKED!

The black templars think the exact same thing. They see the force restrictions placed on space marines as a stupid rule that is damning the imperium. They now approach legion-size and give the finger to the regents of terror. Chaos needs to die, in their opinion, and if that means breaking the chapter size limit by 20,000, then so be it.

Does the codex state anything about cyphers motives?

I honestly don't know, does anyone here have that codex and could fill us in?

Wow dude, your like a walking 40k encyclopedia, much better than wikipedia!!!

PS why can't Leman Russ come back, he was totally one of the coolest space marines. Also I hate that bullshit where you can make up what happened to the two lost legions, you don't go to a film and then tell the director exactly what you want to see, you don't play a game and then change one anonymous aspect of it, so why can't some 40k guys pull their fingers out and tell us more about them!

 

[PurpleRain]

Could anyone tell me whats going on with Eldar?

I haven't had anything to do with Warhammer of any kind for a good few years, and the Eldar were always my favorites.

They haven't changed much, they're still trying to create a new god to fight slaanesh, they had a hand in the creation of the tau and eldrad sacrificed himself, might still be alive but trapped in the warp though.

I haven't heard about them helping out the Tau. They go together well. Well, at least to me, The Eldar and the Tau are the only two 'good' races. The Dark Eldar on the other hand... man, they screwed things up for the Galaxy.

"Who created this demon-god of pleasure? Come on, confess."
(Dark Eldar raise their arm sheeplishly)
"Seriously? I mean, really? It tore a hole in the universe. You just wiped out a good two thirds of your entire race. What were you thinking?"
"We're sorry. Won't happen again."

 

[Saskwach]

I'd like to know who the Old One's were, ie: what they looked like and how powerful they really are. I mean, they were able to summon all these races into existance, I wonder if one could kill a C'Tan?

Ah, the Old Ones. The only substantive info I've ever found on them (still slim) is from the first Necron codex. In it you get an idea of how they worked things. For example, they used a much calmer Warp to travel great distances in a single step; they favoured a sort of techno-magic over proper tech; and I'm not even sure they went for spaceships at all, preferring magic gate things, IIRC. There's a suggestion somewhere that if you ever want to run a game involving the degenerate last survivors of the Old Ones you should use Lizardmen models, esp. SLann (again, IIRC re: the Slann). So they look something like that.

 

[Fudj]

On the point of the Golden Throne starting to break down, there is the theory that the Emperor would re-incarnate anyways, but would still take time for him to grow up, which would leave the human parts of the webway unprotected, im thinking there might be a Horus Cloning coming up soon, and that he will be the Horus who was alive in the last few seconds of his life when he relised his mistake.

I think One of the unknown Primarchs will in some way be linked to the Blood Ravens, as they have no clue to their heritage.