The Victims of Homosexuality

[Krion_Vark]

Well put. Though I don't think I've seen anyone on these particular forums make homophobic comments, that's exactly the sort of thing that needs to be said to people that think the internet veil of anonymity is their free pass to do whatever the hell they want.

This video was made by students at my university. I recognise some, and a few I'm good friends with, including some that I didn't even know were gay. Anyway, it made me feel all tingly inside.

There was actually a person warned for a post mentioning how he thought that homosexuals were mentally ill on one of the Mass Effect threads so yeah it has happened here.

 

[Maze1125]

So what if I said that the people who kill themselves because someone else thinks who they are is morally wrong need to just.... grow up?

Be offended. Offend other people. Why do you care what others think? They are not you. They are who they are. You can only control your reactions, not theirs. Do what you want, if they hate you for it then they wouldn't have been friends anyway.

So... just deal with it? Not by killing yourself or being a melodramatic teenager about it, just by ignoring those people.

The veil of anonymity goes both ways. They say what they want without consequence, you can ignore what they say without consequence.

That is an incredibly stupid and short-sighted thing to say.
Homosexuals aren't just abused on the internet, they're abused in real life, often by close family members. What "veil of anonymity" do they have then? How exactly do they ignore it?

 

[girzwald]

I'm probably going to get some flack for this, but my religion is against homosexuality. That being said, I do not agree with all the hate mongering morons who think that just because they think something is wrong, they can persecute and torment them. They cannot. That is not your right. People, no matter their faults, are human beings. And as such I will treat anyone like a person, with compassion and understanding, whether I agree with their lifestyle or not. You can't change my beliefs, so don't even try, but when people try to take away the freedom to do what they want, that makes me angry. So I am fully in favor of bills that give more rights to people, such as gay marriage, because I don't think it's the governments business to oppose peoples immortal right to choose.

Now, before you bombard me with a flurry of "but they don't get to choose" comments, because I know you will, while I do think it's a choice, I obviously don't think people just get out of bed one day and say "well, I'm gonna be gay." It doesn't work like that. It's something they tend to deal with their entire lives, and I am in no way saying it's easy to fight it. But I can tell you multiple stories of people who were gay and changed their lives. Too many people assume that because most people can't or won't do it, that no one can. I've seen incredibly gay men turn around and raise entire families. It's possible no matter how much you deny it. They weren't "brain washed", as most people will be convinced of, they were given options to help them and they chose to do so. Once again, it all comes down to choice, and being given those choices. Anyway, I'll stop here and wait for the inevitable flux of people disagreeing with me.

OK, I'm getting mixed messages here, so I'm going to tread carefully. Let me start by asking you this, just to clarify: Do you think homosexuality is inherently and morally wrong?

Whats to be confused about? Or is the confusing part that he said he doesn't agree with all the hate mongering morons? Is that where the confusion comes in? Cause thats pretty much the only thing I ever see anywhere, including these boards. "I don't like homosexuality" "HOMOPHOBE!" "No, I just think its morally wrong" "YOU BIGOT!" "Look, you can do whatever you want in your own bedroom, just me personally and my religious convictions think its a sin to act upon homosexual tendencies" "HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTTEEEEEEEEEE MONNNNNNGEEEEEERRRRRRRRRRRRRR!"

Cause thats what it usually boils down to. Anyone who has anything but praise and acceptance for the homosexual lifestyle is labeled a hater no matter what they say.

 

[Xhoyl]

I'm probably going to get some flack for this, but my religion is against homosexuality. That being said, I do not agree with all the hate mongering morons who think that just because they think something is wrong, they can persecute and torment them. They cannot. That is not your right. People, no matter their faults, are human beings. And as such I will treat anyone like a person, with compassion and understanding, whether I agree with their lifestyle or not. You can't change my beliefs, so don't even try, but when people try to take away the freedom to do what they want, that makes me angry. So I am fully in favor of bills that give more rights to people, such as gay marriage, because I don't think it's the governments business to oppose peoples immortal right to choose.

Now, before you bombard me with a flurry of "but they don't get to choose" comments, because I know you will, while I do think it's a choice, I obviously don't think people just get out of bed one day and say "well, I'm gonna be gay." It doesn't work like that. It's something they tend to deal with their entire lives, and I am in no way saying it's easy to fight it. But I can tell you multiple stories of people who were gay and changed their lives. Too many people assume that because most people can't or won't do it, that no one can. I've seen incredibly gay men turn around and raise entire families. It's possible no matter how much you deny it. They weren't "brain washed", as most people will be convinced of, they were given options to help them and they chose to do so. Once again, it all comes down to choice, and being given those choices. Anyway, I'll stop here and wait for the inevitable flux of people disagreeing with me.

OK, I'm getting mixed messages here, so I'm going to tread carefully. Let me start by asking you this, just to clarify: Do you think homosexuality is inherently and morally wrong?

*sigh* when I said my religion was against it, I thought that would be clear. If you want some specifics on why, one of the big faucets of my religion is marriage and procreating to have large families (if you can guess which religion it is, you get a cookie) and as a result, being gay is the exact opposite of those beliefs. Now, there's obviously more to it than that, but I'm not going to give a sermon or anything, that's not my intention. The point is that hate mongering is pointless and wrong. So we can agree on that at least.

 

[Luke3184]

This thread has actually given me a warm fuzzy feeling where my heart used to be.... Thank you all, you're awesome people, especially the OP! Now pretend I gave you a hug and let's never talk of it again.

 

[Westaway]

I have to disagree with you about those in bold. Being overweight ... [is a]definite life choices, and cost the state money in associated health risks.

You think so? Try a little experiment sometime you're in the grocery store. The goal is to get as much actual food as possible for as little money as possible. Seems pretty easy to folks who have the disposable income to buy a $60 game every month or even every week, right?

The twisted, depressing fact is that a healthy diet is considered a luxury in the U.S. these days, and is priced accordingly.

I don't see why my taxes should pay for the terrible choices that these people make.

Your taxes will ALWAYS pay for other peoples's terrible choices. Usually, said people will be the clowns in charge (regardless of whether they wear a red or blue jersey). Get used to it.

I just made a delicious shrimp and pasta dish. Restaurant quality. I paid $9 for all the ingrediants. I learned from a book. Buying the same dish, but frozen, less tasty and more fatty would cost around.$15. Makimg food is cheaper and easy. There is no excuse besides actual sicknesses.

 

[Xhoyl]

I'm probably going to get some flack for this, but my religion is against homosexuality. That being said, I do not agree with all the hate mongering morons who think that just because they think something is wrong, they can persecute and torment them. They cannot. That is not your right. People, no matter their faults, are human beings. And as such I will treat anyone like a person, with compassion and understanding, whether I agree with their lifestyle or not. You can't change my beliefs, so don't even try, but when people try to take away the freedom to do what they want, that makes me angry. So I am fully in favor of bills that give more rights to people, such as gay marriage, because I don't think it's the governments business to oppose peoples immortal right to choose.

Now, before you bombard me with a flurry of "but they don't get to choose" comments, because I know you will, while I do think it's a choice, I obviously don't think people just get out of bed one day and say "well, I'm gonna be gay." It doesn't work like that. It's something they tend to deal with their entire lives, and I am in no way saying it's easy to fight it. But I can tell you multiple stories of people who were gay and changed their lives. Too many people assume that because most people can't or won't do it, that no one can. I've seen incredibly gay men turn around and raise entire families. It's possible no matter how much you deny it. They weren't "brain washed", as most people will be convinced of, they were given options to help them and they chose to do so. Once again, it all comes down to choice, and being given those choices. Anyway, I'll stop here and wait for the inevitable flux of people disagreeing with me.

OK, I'm getting mixed messages here, so I'm going to tread carefully. Let me start by asking you this, just to clarify: Do you think homosexuality is inherently and morally wrong?

Whats to be confused about? Or is the confusing part that he said he doesn't agree with all the hate mongering morons? Is that where the confusion comes in? Cause thats pretty much the only thing I ever see anywhere, including these boards. "I don't like homosexuality" "HOMOPHOBE!" "No, I just think its morally wrong" "YOU BIGOT!" "Look, you can do whatever you want in your own bedroom, just me personally and my religious convictions think its a sin to act upon homosexual tendencies" "HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTTEEEEEEEEEE MONNNNNNGEEEEEERRRRRRRRRRRRRR!"

Cause thats what it usually boils down to. Anyone who has anything but praise and acceptance for the homosexual lifestyle is labeled a hater no matter what they say.

This made me laugh. If you don't have acceptance for it YOU ARE BY DEFINITION A HATER you fucking moron. Praise? Fair enough, don't have to agree with it but as soon as you refuse to accept it in others You are (and I hope I'm not overstating this point) BY DEFINITION A HATER!
God, If you're homophobic at least admit it, don't try and cover it up with moronic reasons as to why people who aren't homophobes are persecuting you.

Lover the sinner, hate the sin. Ever hear that quote? It's exactly what I'm saying. Because I don't agree with them doesn't mean I don't love them as people, and wish the best for them. I don't think any less of them because of it, they just have a weakness like all of us. No one is a perfect person.

 

[DailonCmann]

This is absolutely true, but it needs to be extended to a wider net of people. You think homosexuals get it bad, try transgender, or androgynous, or asexual, or furry, or non-molesting pedophile/zoophile, or rape fetishist/sadomasochist, or moving away from sexual interests: fat people, or smokers, or Asperger's people, or those with body modifications.

None of those harm other people any more than homosexuals and the gender/sexual ones don't even choose to be what they are, but it's still widely acceptable to hate on any of those in both real-life and online, to say that it's weird or sick or disgusting or weak or just wrong or that it's fucked up or that it must be a sign of a deeper mental instability. Your words have real effects people. If someone isn't harming anyone-else, let them get on with their life and save your vitriol for people who those who are actively hurting others, it's not like they are in short supply.

There's a difference between all of these and being gay. Those simply break social taboo and the in some cases, they should not be encouraged and understood the same way homosexuality is. People who get off on the thought of raping someone or having sex with children should be chastised for that if they choose to publicly say that. That's sick. And not sick like two consenting adults making love, it's morally reprehensible. I get that they didn't choose to be that way, but you don't go public with certain things in your life. It's absolutely not the same. Not all life-styles are equal. A gay guy and a guy who wants to have sex with children are not on the same level.
As for fetishists and furries, these things simply don't have a place in today's modern society. They are so misunderstood and the niche that they inhabit is so small, that the internet should be the place that they stay until society becomes acclimated to their existence.
People with body mods, I'll say this right now, do not deserve the same treatment as those who do not. They made a conscious descion to say "I'm not a part of this society," which is fine. Just don't expect to get hired by that big firm.
Smoking and fat people are being held to a different level because those lifestyles are unhealthy and sometime unhealthy to those around them. Things should be taken into account however and here more than any other point, your argument makes sense.
As for Asperger's syndrome, as with any other mental problem, it's protected under law from discrimination.
TL; DR - Your point in a logical fallacy, every culture's practices are not morally okay just because it's something different.

 

[Don Savik]

I'm probably going to get some flack for this, but my religion is against homosexuality. That being said, I do not agree with all the hate mongering morons who think that just because they think something is wrong, they can persecute and torment them. They cannot. That is not your right. People, no matter their faults, are human beings. And as such I will treat anyone like a person, with compassion and understanding, whether I agree with their lifestyle or not. You can't change my beliefs, so don't even try, but when people try to take away the freedom to do what they want, that makes me angry. So I am fully in favor of bills that give more rights to people, such as gay marriage, because I don't think it's the governments business to oppose peoples immortal right to choose.

Now, before you bombard me with a flurry of "but they don't get to choose" comments, because I know you will, while I do think it's a choice, I obviously don't think people just get out of bed one day and say "well, I'm gonna be gay." It doesn't work like that. It's something they tend to deal with their entire lives, and I am in no way saying it's easy to fight it. But I can tell you multiple stories of people who were gay and changed their lives. Too many people assume that because most people can't or won't do it, that no one can. I've seen incredibly gay men turn around and raise entire families. It's possible no matter how much you deny it. They weren't "brain washed", as most people will be convinced of, they were given options to help them and they chose to do so. Once again, it all comes down to choice, and being given those choices. Anyway, I'll stop here and wait for the inevitable flux of people disagreeing with me.

OK, I'm getting mixed messages here, so I'm going to tread carefully. Let me start by asking you this, just to clarify: Do you think homosexuality is inherently and morally wrong?

*sigh* when I said my religion was against it, I thought that would be clear. If you want some specifics on why, one of the big faucets of my religion is marriage and procreating to have large families (if you can guess which religion it is, you get a cookie) and as a result, being gay is the exact opposite of those beliefs. Now, there's obviously more to it than that, but I'm not going to give a sermon or anything, that's not my intention. The point is that hate mongering is pointless and wrong. So we can agree on that at least.

I could've sworn marriage was about 2 consenting adults who love each other spending the rest of theirs lives together. Wouldn't the most productive way to reproduce be assembly line orgy style? Or harems of concubines? I don't see the correlation between marriage and reproduction. And what about adopting kids? Is that not an easy way to acquire a large family? Or does that not count?

Not trying to sound rude or anything, but I'm just trying to see if you understand that what your saying makes no sense. Its sounds like this stigma that your religion created has no substantial backing on any of its claims.

 

[targren]

I just made a delicious shrimp and pasta dish. Restaurant quality. I paid $9 for all the ingrediants. I learned from a book. Buying the same dish, but frozen, less tasty and more fatty would cost around.$15. Makimg food is cheaper and easy. There is no excuse besides actual sicknesses.

Wow, you really don't get it, do you?

Here's a hint: Poor folk don't eat shrimp pasta dishes. Your $9 that you spent on one meal may well have been an entire day's food budget. Hell, you have to spend almost half that to just get a pound of fresh fruit, which has a nasty habit of spoiling. So you buy the shit in the can. Less good for you, but you can afford it. That's where the nasty frozen crap comes in. "Bad for you" is cheaper, even moreso in bulk but it has to keep.

 

[DailonCmann]

I'm probably going to get some flack for this, but my religion is against homosexuality. That being said, I do not agree with all the hate mongering morons who think that just because they think something is wrong, they can persecute and torment them. They cannot. That is not your right. People, no matter their faults, are human beings. And as such I will treat anyone like a person, with compassion and understanding, whether I agree with their lifestyle or not. You can't change my beliefs, so don't even try, but when people try to take away the freedom to do what they want, that makes me angry. So I am fully in favor of bills that give more rights to people, such as gay marriage, because I don't think it's the governments business to oppose peoples immortal right to choose.

Now, before you bombard me with a flurry of "but they don't get to choose" comments, because I know you will, while I do think it's a choice, I obviously don't think people just get out of bed one day and say "well, I'm gonna be gay." It doesn't work like that. It's something they tend to deal with their entire lives, and I am in no way saying it's easy to fight it. But I can tell you multiple stories of people who were gay and changed their lives. Too many people assume that because most people can't or won't do it, that no one can. I've seen incredibly gay men turn around and raise entire families. It's possible no matter how much you deny it. They weren't "brain washed", as most people will be convinced of, they were given options to help them and they chose to do so. Once again, it all comes down to choice, and being given those choices. Anyway, I'll stop here and wait for the inevitable flux of people disagreeing with me.

OK, I'm getting mixed messages here, so I'm going to tread carefully. Let me start by asking you this, just to clarify: Do you think homosexuality is inherently and morally wrong?

*sigh* when I said my religion was against it, I thought that would be clear. If you want some specifics on why, one of the big faucets of my religion is marriage and procreating to have large families (if you can guess which religion it is, you get a cookie) and as a result, being gay is the exact opposite of those beliefs. Now, there's obviously more to it than that, but I'm not going to give a sermon or anything, that's not my intention. The point is that hate mongering is pointless and wrong. So we can agree on that at least.

I could've sworn marriage was about 2 consenting adults who love each other spending the rest of theirs lives together. Wouldn't the most productive way to reproduce be assembly line orgy style? Or harems of concubines? I don't see the correlation between marriage and reproduction. And what about adopting kids? Is that not an easy way to acquire a large family? Or does that not count?

Not trying to sound rude or anything, but I'm just trying to see if you understand that what your saying makes no sense. Its sounds like this stigma that your religion created has no substantial backing on any of its claims.

First of all, you can't change your sexuality, only repress it. This is terrible for your mental state as it instills deep feelings of shame and disgust. Your religion wants as families to be as big as possible so it can the religion can have more followers and thereby amass more donations. To pass any judgement on someone with a mindset coming from that point is no less than morally reprehensible.

 

[dvd_72]

Huh. I seem to be running into a lot of misleading titles today. Oh well.

It's been said before, but I'll say it for myself, and to add more weight behind the statement I guess, but I am appalled that we are talking about this. Not because it's wrong to talk about homosexuality, but that in the 21st century we need to still teach people who have access to modern views that homosexuality is not a sin, and that it is not immoral, or wrong in any way.

I wish we would stop talking about this not because we shouldn't talk about this, but because we shouldn't have the need to, and the need for these topics just doesn't bode well for our community!

 

[Sandytimeman]

snip

So what your saying is you can think someone is completely evil, and think that that's totally cool? I just don't see most conservatives or religious people acting in such a manner.

In fact just about any religion that has a tenant or law against homosexuality has lobbyist and politicians that are actively fighting to remove gay rights, or claim that homosexuality is a threat.

Shit most religions of the god of Abraham (IE Christianity, Jewish, and Muslim) faiths homosexuality is a capital offense.

 

[Lieju]

This is absolutely true, but it needs to be extended to a wider net of people. You think homosexuals get it bad, try transgender, or androgynous, or asexual, or furry, or non-molesting pedophile/zoophile, or rape fetishist/sadomasochist, or moving away from sexual interests: fat people, or smokers, or Asperger's people, or those with body modifications.

I have to disagree with you about those in bold. Being overweight and smoking are definite life choices, and cost the state money in associated health risks. I don't see why my taxes should pay for the terrible choices that these people make.

It's not as simple as that. Not everyone feels hunger the same way.
I had to take certain medication a while back, and the side-effect was that it made me hungry. I needed to eat much more and often to feel full, and gained weight.

After I stopped taking the medication, it went away, and I eventually went back to the normal body weight. I ate the same kind of food all the while, and didn't really make any change apart from how much of it I ate.

There is choice involved more than when it comes to stuff like sexuality, though.

 

[MC K-Mac]

Savage, the guy who originally came up with it, IIRC, completely denies the existence of bisexuality. You're either gay or straight, maybe you're going through a phase, maybe you're doing it for attention, but you absolutely cannot be bisexual.

Likewise, he is very dismissive of racial problems, and wants people to be concentrating on gay issues instead.

Now, that's hardly uncommon, activists are often very selective in what causes they fight for, and tend to be just as bad as everyone else in regards to the others, and it doesn't invalidate the good work he's doing in regards to the small section of people he sees as worthy of help, but it does mean he's neglecting or adding to other people's problems.

WTF??? When has Savage ever been dismissive of racial problems? Give a quote or take that back.

And "you absolutely cannot be bisexual" is stretching it. Savage sometimes pokes fun at bi's, but he doesn't deny their existence. Quote please.

 

[Bloodtrozorx]

I came in here prepared to fight and was pleasantly surprised by OP.

I couldn't agree more, I see it everyday here (State of Maryland, US) and its incredible to me that humans can preach peace and love out one side of their mouths and so much hatred out the other.