The Walking Dead Season Two - It's pretty bad. [Spoilers]

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Exterminas

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Since the season is nearing it's end, I now feel confident to voice some complaints about it. Granted, I only think the game is bad in the sense that it is not as good as the first season, but as these things go this might be the Back-When-It-was-new-It-was-better-phenomenon.

My main reason for disliking the second season is that it is unfocused. There are too many characters which get too little characterization.

Here, let me walk you through it:

In the first episode, I started out with Carista and Omid. So I thought "Hey, this will be about Clem and them!" - But five minutes in both of them were gone.

Then I met that dog and thought "Hey, maybe this will be about Clem and that Dog!" - But five minutes later, that dog was gone.

Then I met these new people, particularly the uncle and his moronic nephew. Also I think, Luke shows up in that first group. I thought "Hey, maybe this will be about Clem and those guys!" - But five minutes later, one of them croaks, depending on who you choose. A silly choice, really, since I don't know either of them by that point.

You also meet the rest of the group and get absolutely bombarded with names and relationships, some really convoluted and involving absent characters, like Carver, Alvin and that pregnant lady whose name I can't remember.

Around the time of episode three I finally understood that the game probably wants to be about Clem and Luke, perhaps even Clem and Kenny. But really, they just keep tossing in new characters, the majority of which dies a few minutes later, and expect us to care and keep track of them.

The first season was awesome because it focused on a single group of people with basic relationships. You knew from the first episode who was important and who was not. They were careful about adding new characters to the permanent rooster and that paid off. At least I feel that way.
 

SquidVicious

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Some valid points, although I've found that I have warmed up to the new group a little more than a few other people I know who have been playing the game. The two biggest gripes I have with the season are that the overall conflict doesn't really seem to have anything to do with Clem. Like, if all she was trying to do was get back out on her own to find Christa, then I'd get it, because every day she's not out looking for her is a day she can get further away, but it honestly seems like Clem's okay just taking on this new group and their problems. My other complaint, and I feel a lot of other players share this one, is the complete abandonment of any kind of puzzle. Compare TWD Season 2 or The Wolf Among Us to TWD season 1 where you had to figure out how to turn off a generator, or how to open a gate, or how to start up a train. None of those puzzles were particularly challenging, but they did at least require me to sit down and use my brain. So far the closest thing to a puzzle anything TellTale has put out this year has been the interrogation of Dee (or was it Dum, I can't remember) in Episode 2 of The Wolf Among Us, and even that seemed to be based more on luck or trial and error if you don't mind save scumming. Either way, I'd prefer a little more interactivity than just dialogue choices.
 

Zhukov

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LoathsomePete said:
My other complaint, and I feel a lot of other players share this one, is the complete abandonment of any kind of puzzle. Compare TWD Season 2 or The Wolf Among Us to TWD season 1 where you had to figure out how to turn off a generator, or how to open a gate, or how to start up a train. None of those puzzles were particularly challenging, but they did at least require me to sit down and use my brain.
I'm glad the ditched the puzzles. They added nothing. Just got in the way.

Tell me, if someone were to ask you what the best part of the game was, or what the defining moment was, would you be likely to answer, "Well, I fucking loved the part where I had to flick switches in a particular sequence to start up a train."
 

Ubiquitous Duck

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I think there is a good flipside to it though, because one of my major gripes with the tv series, especially series/season 2, is around the over-safety and lack of a sense of danger, because none of the main cast are in danger/dying.

It can be good to build up relationships, but also unrealistic to the crazy setting to always be safe as a group.

I think injecting some chaos is good.

Granted, I don't think it's as good as the first series, but living up to that, at least for me, was nigh impossible, so I think they have made good so far.

I'm enjoying it and can't wait for more. They did a hell of a lot better than the TV show did with its second series/season.

Credit to them for trying something different than replicating the first season/series and I think they are doing a good job.
 

Exterminas

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Zhukov said:
LoathsomePete said:
My other complaint, and I feel a lot of other players share this one, is the complete abandonment of any kind of puzzle. Compare TWD Season 2 or The Wolf Among Us to TWD season 1 where you had to figure out how to turn off a generator, or how to open a gate, or how to start up a train. None of those puzzles were particularly challenging, but they did at least require me to sit down and use my brain.
I'm glad the ditched the puzzles. They added nothing. Just got in the way.

Tell me, if someone were to ask you what the best part of the game was, or what the defining moment was, would you be likely to answer, "Well, I fucking loved the part where I had to flick switches in a particular sequence to start up a train."
I think the battery-puzzle and the resulting puns was hillarious.

Also, the puzzles helped gloss over the fact that for all their pretense to choice the Telltale-Games are really just movies where you get to press a button every now and then, without allowing for any choice on your part what so ever. (Aside from some very small details)

Added to that: The First Walking Dead actually had some very impactful choices. Like who got to survive the incident in the pharmacy. Are there any characters like that around? I assume if you pick the other guy in the first episode, you get to drag him around a little, but I didn't get much interaction with the person that survived my choice either, so it is probably just a question of what character you have standing around in the background.
 

SquidVicious

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Zhukov said:
LoathsomePete said:
My other complaint, and I feel a lot of other players share this one, is the complete abandonment of any kind of puzzle. Compare TWD Season 2 or The Wolf Among Us to TWD season 1 where you had to figure out how to turn off a generator, or how to open a gate, or how to start up a train. None of those puzzles were particularly challenging, but they did at least require me to sit down and use my brain.
I'm glad the ditched the puzzles. They added nothing. Just got in the way.

Tell me, if someone were to ask you what the best part of the game was, or what the defining moment was, would you be likely to answer, "Well, I fucking loved the part where I had to flick switches in a particular sequence to start up a train."
I never said the puzzles were the best part, I just enjoyed them because they allowed me to stretch my brain muscles a little bit, which creates a nice bit of juxtaposition when so much of the game has you in a passive role. I also liked how the puzzles managed to fit contextually with what was going on in the game. I don't think ditching them has made the experience poorer, it's just something I've noticed and found myself missing.
 

Casual Shinji

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I honestly don't even feel like bothering with Episode 3. After Episode 2 I felt very similar, in that apart from Clem I just didn't really give a shit about any of these characters. When Kenny returned I was actually glad, since he was a familiar face and it seemed like he turned over a new leaf. But as the episode progressed, and from the look of the Episode 3 preview, it appears like he's still as much of a distrusting asshole.

Season 1 had a solid heart with Lee juggling his responsibilities in keeping the group together, making tough choices, all the while trying to be a proper parent for Clementine. Season 2 just has Clem walking around not doing very much.
 

senordesol

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LoathsomePete said:
Zhukov said:
LoathsomePete said:
My other complaint, and I feel a lot of other players share this one, is the complete abandonment of any kind of puzzle. Compare TWD Season 2 or The Wolf Among Us to TWD season 1 where you had to figure out how to turn off a generator, or how to open a gate, or how to start up a train. None of those puzzles were particularly challenging, but they did at least require me to sit down and use my brain.
I'm glad the ditched the puzzles. They added nothing. Just got in the way.

Tell me, if someone were to ask you what the best part of the game was, or what the defining moment was, would you be likely to answer, "Well, I fucking loved the part where I had to flick switches in a particular sequence to start up a train."
I never said the puzzles were the best part, I just enjoyed them because they allowed me to stretch my brain muscles a little bit, which creates a nice bit of juxtaposition when so much of the game has you in a passive role. I also liked how the puzzles managed to fit contextually with what was going on in the game. I don't think ditching them has made the experience poorer, it's just something I've noticed and found myself missing.
Seconded. There was at least some degree of pacing in TWD1, here I feel like I'm just being spit place-to-place. I never have to solve any problems and forward thinking is never rewarded (for example: I thought to raid Carver's desk before switching on the intercom, but somehow I doubt that decision changed a single damn thing).

I want so bad for TWD to be great. I wouldn't call it 'bad', but the fact that it could be great makes it all the more painful that it's not. Panic, rash action, and indecision should be the main 'enemies' in the game not 'whoops, you meat for me to 'hold' A rather than rapidly tap it'. I want more puzzles like the motor inn in S1E1. Give me options to get out of my predicament and give me consequences for scuffing it! Don't just throw magic zombies at me.
 

Soviet Heavy

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Despite having never played the first season, doesn't the idea of abandonment go well with Clementine? If the idea is that she's always on her own, like fate is fucking with her, that's not a bad concept. I can't speak for execution, but that's what I take away from this.
 

Exterminas

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Soviet Heavy said:
Despite having never played the first season, doesn't the idea of abandonment go well with Clementine? If the idea is that she's always on her own, like fate is fucking with her, that's not a bad concept. I can't speak for execution, but that's what I take away from this.
I wish it was like that!

But instead of Clementine being on her own, we have to force her to hand around with this group of Zombie-Baits that have to be the most unstable group possible. Clem should just pick up Kenny or Luke and leave. The rest of them are really just walking deads.
 

Legendairy314

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I've been actually thoroughly enjoying the second season. For me, it got into the real meat of the series. The issues and choices have more impact than season 1 because it builds off of what made season 1 great. The first episode alone made me actually cry for the first time in a video game.

While I adored season 1, it was a little predictable and flawed in many places. The puzzles were chores that I didn't want to do and the characters had to go through the whole awkward "what's a zombie?" phase. This season has started to tackle the idea of new societies, end game plans, and the notion of trust. It's a lot more complex than the first season and I'm absolutely loving it.

This last episode in particular had me question the value of a strong but flawed community. In the end, I sided against it long before the game showed me what was going to happen. And it's the unpredictability of what will happen despite your actions that really enthralls me. Things happen despite my character's existence. We play a big role, but in the end, what will happen will happen.

I've kind of gotten tired of the typical wish fulfillment "Save the Universe!" mentality of games. The down to earth and realistic notions here really set it above other games. You're not here to win. You're here to survive for as long as possible. And, barring that, maintaining your humanity. How we weigh those two things is what makes this series great IMO.