Thoughts about skyrim, oblivion and thx for recommending I play kotor/mass effect

[Dendio]

I've tried out older games based on the comments users leave on the escapist. Most of the games have been good. I've played Bioshock, Mass effect and Kotor based off of recommendations and enjoyed them. Unfortunately I also tried oblivion and to this day cannot under stand why people speak of it so glowingly.

I didn't like elder scrolls for the following reasons:

1- This is the only game where I *needed* mods right out of the box to fix game breaking bugs and ugly character models.

2- The manual read like a textbook and the in game tutorial was either horrible or nonexistent

3- Extremely bland conversation system (kotors was way better and that game was way older)

4- The game began with me outside the sewers with no sense of direction. New to the game not knowing what to do or how to do it or why I was doing it or should care to do it.

5- The music was good but other than that the immersion really didn't deliver.

I admit I didn't give the game much of a chance, but the controls felt clunky. For example there was no real impact when I struck something with my sword. It felt like the sword was sliding off of my target. Casting wise the aim felt a little loose. It felt awkward to aim and walk around fps style.

All of these things considered I'm leery about skyrim. I expect it to release buggy and eventually be patched up by the community. I'm not one for excessive game modding and what I had to do to my copy of oblivion right out of the box was disappointing.


Im curious if anyone else shares these views? Escapist your thoughts?

 

[Ranorak]

Escapist your thoughts?

You have a different taste in games as I have?
Those points really never bothered me.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

1 - This is the only game where I *needed* mods right out of the box to fix game breaking bugs and ugly character models.

You don't NEED mods to play Oblivion. They do greatly enhance the experience though, as they allow you to tailor it to your preferences. As to bugs, yes, Bethesda is notorious for releasing buggy games. They are not, however, universally game breaking, and I've never had an issue finishing a Bethesda game due to bugs.

2- The manual read like a textbook and the in game tutorial was either horrible or nonexistent

Bethesda makes complex, open-world games. Bioware makes linear corridor talk n' shoots. Obviously one is going to require substantially more documentation. This is an odd complaint. If I buy a Flight Simulator, I don't then complain about the fat manual.

3 - Extremely bland conversation system (kotors was way better and that game was way older)

That's because KOTOR is an entirely different kind of RPG. You're comparing apples to oranges, and slamming the orange for not being appleish enough.

4 - The game began with me outside the sewers with no sense of direction. New to the game not knowing what to do or how to do it or why I was doing it or should care to do it.

Again, Bethesda makes non-linear, sandbox, open world RPGs. This is at the core of their appeal. To some people, walking out into an open world and NOT being lead by the nose through a series of quests is extremely compelling.

I gotta say, it seems like you didn't do a lot of research into what kind of RPG Oblivion was, because you're hammering it on its MERITS, and complaining that it's not "more like KOTOR".

I'm more than a little reminded of this...

 

[TheIronRuler]

If you want to exagerate you can say that they do th esame as paradox Interactive, which is to leave the play testing for the players and release a beta game. But they aren't that careless, they do have some major problems but you can't say that they sell you a beta version of a game.

 

[Jasta11]

1 - This is the only game where I *needed* mods right out of the box to fix game breaking bugs and ugly character models.

You don't NEED mods to play Oblivion. They do greatly enhance the experience though, as they allow you to tailor it to your preferences. As to bugs, yes, Bethesda is notorious for releasing buggy games. They are not, however, universally game breaking, and I've never had an issue finishing a Bethesda game due to bugs.

2- The manual read like a textbook and the in game tutorial was either horrible or nonexistent

Bethesda makes complex, open-world games. Bioware makes linear corridor talk n' shoots. Obviously one is going to require substantially more documentation. This is an odd complaint. If I buy a Flight Simulator, I don't then complain about the fat manual.

3 - Extremely bland conversation system (kotors was way better and that game was way older)

That's because KOTOR is an entirely different kind of RPG. You're comparing apples to oranges, and slamming the orange for not being appleish enough.

4 - The game began with me outside the sewers with no sense of direction. New to the game not knowing what to do or how to do it or why I was doing it or should care to do it.

Again, Bethesda makes non-linear, sandbox, open world RPGs. This is at the core of their appeal. To some people, walking out into an open world and NOT being lead by the nose through a series of quests is extremely compelling.

I gotta say, it seems like you didn't do a lot of research into what kind of RPG Oblivion was, because you're hammering it on its MERITS, and complaining that it's not "more like KOTOR".

I'm more than a little reminded of this...

Why do you come down on him like this? He never said that Oblivion sucked and was an horrible game, simply listed reasons why he himself does not like it. he is simply curious if others share his view.

And as a matter of fact, I do. While Oblivion has it's good moments (the Dark Brotherhood questline was really good), I find that it has so many fundamental flaws that it outweights the good. Of course, there's the horribly implemented level-scaling (which Bethesda largely fixed in Fallout 3 and will presumably keep in Skyrim), but also the extremely so-so writing (which is par for the course with Beth imo, they could never compete with the likes of Bioware or Black Isle/Obsidian), the laughably inept Radiant AI (which they unfortunately keep in Skyrim, and even expand, I just hope they fix it too), the largely dull combat, lack of real consequences for your choices (essential NPCs anyone? can't have a sloppy, inatentive, or sociopathic player being punished, no, New Vegas was so much better because of this), the aforementioned bugs (not, not excusable because of the massive world, Just Cause 2 had a world twice as big and very few bugs, it's because the engine sucks big time), and countless other nitpicks made the experience sometimes good, sometimes bad, and largely just OK on average.

If I compare it as a sandbox game, Just Cause 2 is better, as are GTA and Read Dead Redemption. As an RPG, every single Bioware release bar DA2 is better, and every single Black Isle/Obsidian release bar none is better, to only name these two companies. It's not that I or others don't like the genre, it's that even in it's genre it's a very lacking game from my (our?) point of view.

So yes, I prefer having a focused, interesting, and (gosh!) linear experience rather than being dumped in a world of boring, dumb NPCs and generic dungeons. And saying Beth games are complex (how, exactly?) while Bioware is shoot and talk shows the very same bias that you denounded in your comic. Double standards much?

 

[BloatedGuppy]

So yes, I prefer having a focused, interesting, and (gosh!) linear experience rather than being dumped in a world of boring, dumb NPCs and generic dungeons. And saying Beth games are complex (how, exactly?) while Bioware is shoot and talk shows the very same bias that you denounded in your comic. Double standards much?

The hell?

Bioware games are amongst my favorite games of all time. Most particularly the Mass Effect and Baldur's Gate series. Just because I can acknowledge their limitations doesn't mean I don't appreciate their merits. You should try it some time.

 

[Jasta11]

As I said, it's not a question of limitations, but a question of merit that bugs me with Oblivion. Dumb AI is not a limitation. Badly implemented gameplay is not a limitation. Largely forgetable NPCs are not a limitation. Poor writing is not a limitation. I am very much aware that an open world means you have to do some sacrifices and can't have as much focus and details as a more linear game, but it's most defninitely not an excuse for every single problem the game has.

 

[Wintermoot]

some points are valid like the necessity for mods (I think the community fixed more bugs then Bethesda).
but I still like it I like the fact that you have to explore every nook and cranny although I also get that players get lost (a common complaint by my friends)

 

[DeadlyYellow]

They are not, however, universally game breaking, and I've never had an issue finishing a Bethesda game due to bugs.

Ah, the good ole "As long as it worked for someone" mentality. Is there nothing you can't hand-wave away?

 

[spartan231490]

I've tried out older games based on the comments users leave on the escapist. Most of the games have been good. I've played Bioshock, Mass effect and Kotor based off of recommendations and enjoyed them. Unfortunately I also tried oblivion and to this day cannot under stand why people speak of it so glowingly.

I didn't like elder scrolls for the following reasons:

1- This is the only game where I *needed* mods right out of the box to fix game breaking bugs and ugly character models.

2- The manual read like a textbook and the in game tutorial was either horrible or nonexistent

3- Extremely bland conversation system (kotors was way better and that game was way older)

4- The game began with me outside the sewers with no sense of direction. New to the game not knowing what to do or how to do it or why I was doing it or should care to do it.

5- The music was good but other than that the immersion really didn't deliver.

I admit I didn't give the game much of a chance, but the controls felt clunky. For example there was no real impact when I struck something with my sword. It felt like the sword was sliding off of my target. Casting wise the aim felt a little loose. It felt awkward to aim and walk around fps style.

All of these things considered I'm leery about skyrim. I expect it to release buggy and eventually be patched up by the community. I'm not one for excessive game modding and what I had to do to my copy of oblivion right out of the box was disappointing.


Im curious if anyone else shares these views? Escapist your thoughts?

For what it's worth, I never had any problem with bugs on oblivion, and neither did any of my friends who played it on 360. As for your other comments, different strokes for different blokes, I guess. I loved that game, combat was fun, I liked the fps style aiming instead of just clicking on a target and hitting them if your skill is high enough.
As for feeling no sense of direction, you should have had a) a map with your location and the location of your quest objective. and b) a compass that had a red arrow marking the direction of your quest objective.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

Ah, the good ole "As long as it worked for someone" mentality. Is there nothing you can't hand-wave away?

Who is hand waving? I see you neglected to quote the part where I said Bethesda is NOTORIOUS for releasing buggy games. I bash on them as much as anyone. I've been putting up with that nonsense since Daggerfall. And Oblivion was fucking POLISHED compared to that rubbish.

 

[DeadlyYellow]

Who is hand waving? I see you neglected to quote the part where I said Bethesda is NOTORIOUS for releasing buggy games.

It wasn't neglect. It was irrelevance. If it has no bearing on what I am saying, then why bother including it?

I see no reason to waste page space on pointlessly lazy regurgitations of entire posts when I am only addressing a small fragment. If you need to call on it to back you up, then perhaps you're misunderstanding what I am saying.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

I see no reason to waste page space

And yet you continue to, by quoting me out of context and being needlessly argumentative whilst doing so. Well done.

 

[DeadlyYellow]

quoting me being needlessly argumentative

Hey, I'm an asshole. What did you expect?