Thoughts on the Demise of Spaceflight Simulators

[seitori]

I was re-energized when Starlancer came out, but Freelancer didn't have enough of a Privateer feel to it to sell well. The game also took WAY too long to be released, and the hype died when it came out three whole years after Starlancer.

As you may or may not know, the Freelancer that shipped wasn't the game that they set out to create. After Chris Roberts left Digital Anvil mid-development, they essentially scrambled to retrofit a full single-player game onto a universe designed for a rich multiplayer experience. In a way, Freelancer's single-player campaign was no better than a mod. If you still have your saves from it, go explore a bit and you'll find a lot of areas with lots of detail that were never used in the campaign. I remember one zone in particular that was in a nebula or a gas cloud or something that had poor visibility and a number of mining depots, but it was a few jumps away from anywhere you would have normally gone. That mod linked earlier looks interesting, I just hope I can run it on my copy (it's a pre-release beta that I received back when I worked in the industry).

I agree with the sentiment that FreeSpace set the bar too high. I think it's mainly due to the way capital ship combat was completely redefined in the second game with sick beam cannons. That may have been why the Star Wars titles never took off later--the games were good at presenting scale but you kind of wondered what the point of those tiny "turbolasers" were.

I do also recommend Darkstar One though it's quite average. Nexus: The Jupiter Incident, while not a yoke-and-rudder space sim, also sated my hunger for space combat for a little while.

 

[Vanilla Gorilla]

Beyond the red line has me salivating, the demo (which they released about 2 years ago) is still fun to pick up, having the semi-realistic space physics makes me very excitable. I dont suppose anyone remembers colony wars for PS1? One of the few space sims to appear for a console, it wasn't brilliant but as another space sim nut it made me very happy, especially since my PC at the time was atrocious.

 

[Crazyshak48]

Yeah, I'm signed up for the Jumpgate Evolution Beta, and last I heard, it's coming out on March 2nd, so hopefully not too long of a wait. And I have Nexus: The Jupiter Incident, which is still one of my favorite space games, even if it isn't a joystick-dogfighter type. It's got a few bugs, and the multiplayer is a massive pile of shit with a side of bacon, BUT the campaign is engaging and challenging enough to make up for it. Plus the Angelwing is one of my favorite ships ever

Still, I have high hopes for Jumpgate. I had a reasonably good experience with the real-time flight with Star Wars Galaxies: Jump to Lightspeed, and if JGE can make a real game out of that, then I think we're onto something.

 

[savandicus]

As someone who played the x wing games i must agree with you. Those games were really quite fun and your post has made me wish i had a joystick these days. Spaceflight genre really is probably an untapped market these days.

Hint hint Any game companys reading, make a spaceflight game

I do hope a new decent one gets made at some point, the genre really does need reviving because it definately has alot of charm and a different set of skills to other games. Also immersion is insanely easy since 5 seconds in you'll be leaning with your joystick trying to dodge to the side

 

[Crazyshak48]

I've played EVE for almost four years now, and it has just been a downhill spiral. The gameplay is indeed fine, but more than anything, I'm growing increasingly tired of the politics in the game, the corruptness (I think that's a word) of the developers, and the fact that you have to essentially be part of one of the two big coalitions to get anywhere in the game unless you're an isk farmer. One of those coalitions is organized, the other is not, but both are run by douche bags, so I'm getting increasingly tired of it. And even with its gameplay, it still doesn't satisfy me much due to its slow pace. I fully intend to abandon it for JGE in March and Star Trek Online in the fall.

 

[Jinx_Dragon]

Am I just a old gamer or something that I remember the likes of the frontier series?

That was gold right there, even in all it's hexagon based graphics it stood head and shoulders above the rest, above almost everything that has come since. I can't help but think if someone took that game idea, gave it a fresh coat of graphics and implemented some necessary changes it would rise from the ashes once more. Changes such as more weapons, ships that where more then just a icon but had proper hard points and cargo space, better AI, better trade systems and so forth... It would make a really great, replayable, space based game.

At least till you are so rich it isn't funny and then start getting bored. But hey, add in the means to own whole planets or set yourself up as a pirate lord to terrorise the federation, independent worlds and of course the empire and the game will never get old. Then if people start getting to powerful throw in some ancient alien technology that wipes out their home made empire... just to watch them cry!

Of course, they probably would want something that can be made into a MMO which eliminates the time speedy option so you are spending weeks passing through nothing but open space, in the course of a few seconds.

This means all battles would take place around the inhabitable worlds, where the local inhabitants can watch the fire works, instead of far out at the rim of the system. You know, out of the way of scanners and other detection systems where it is more likely for pirates to actually get away with killing and pillaging trade ships. This also means making it so even the largest government would have only the equivalent of peas to throw at you, cause we all know the largest ships in the empires fleet can always be brought down by a single torpedo fired from a single jet sized fighter and they will whine so badly if it isn't so....

Like wise they would prefer a 'jet fighter' play style like most space games do these days. As opposed to... I don't know... programming how craft would function in space! Dumbing it down for the crowd too stupid to realise there is no such thing as wind resistance and that alone opens up a whole three dimensional world of possabilities. People unable to realise they can actually go in any direction without having to curve or even face that direction.

Too many people are used to 'top gun' get behind them and fire tactics. They would whine so badly the first day they are strafed by a enemy who suddenly went upwards, cut back on forward thrust, turned so their biggest gun was to bear and opened fire as they strafed cross their fire path. All because they where trying to curve around so they could once more fly towards their enemy instead of just drifting through space like some drunken asteroid.

Space battles are actually quite messy... I demand they remain so!

 

[BogJuan]

Somebody mentioned Allegiance at www.freeallegiance.org and they are spot on. The original release was pretty badly promoted by Microsoft so the gave the game away for free soon after. It has but put through years of open source and was great when I started playing it 4 years ago and even better now. If you haven't yet you should check it out. Also, the learning curve is kinda high, not as high as Eve was, but still pretty high. So stick with it.

 

[LesIsMore]

This is a point I've been thinking about myself. I remember when PC Gamer dubbed TIE Fighter the best game of all time many moons ago, and when the Wing Commander series ruled the plains of my computer for many eons (laughable acting and god-awful film adaptation not withstanding). But there aren't any these days - at least none that are mainstream. And look here for more proof the genre is gone:

The Death of Microsoft Flight Simulator

Seriously, what happened? Was it the combination of LucasArts idiocy/full-3D that killed adventure games, or was it the demise of Origin?

 

[Trivun]

Not really a simulator, but I very much enjoyed the spaceflight aspect of the Star Wars Battlefront games, as well as the same thing in the SW Starfighter games. It was fun and challenging, controls were simple to use, and it looked great. I actually know (or rather, did a week long course on) flying a glider, including about 2 hours flying per day for 5 days, actually controlling the aircraft itself, and as part of the training we used a simulator connected to actual controls for an aircraft. I have to say that flying the actual glider (engine powered, by the way, gliding was just on landing) was a lot easier than using the simulator, although the design meant that the simulator should have been easier to use. Space simulators should make a comeback, given that space is increasing now in popularity again (for example, Mass Effect, Dead Space and some JRPG's that have space aspects). After the zombie craze is over we should start to see more demand again for space games, which could have simulator sections worked in somehow (for example, what's stopping the makers of Mass Effect adding space simulator action to allow travel between planets in Mass Effect 2?).

 

[Mystery00]

I don't think the genre is dead, it's just that there hasn't been a good space simulator for years.

It just needs something new and interesting to bring players back.

 

[Crazyshak48]

I've been thinking of trying to get X-Wing working again (I'm pretty sure I have it here somewhere), but after I upgraded my computer, I discovered it doesn't have a gameport anymore, and is incompatible with that type of connection anyway. So now I need to either findo uot if there is a USB adapter for the old style plug or try to find a USB joystick that is as good as my old Sidewinder.

For good USB joysticks, I highly recommend the Saitek ones. I have a Saitek X52, and its been great for the 4 years I've had it now. For something a little cheaper, their Cyborg series is supposed to be good too. Now, their programming software is very unintuitive and confusing at first, but once you get the hang of it, you can customize the controls however you please.

On a separate note, I got Mechwarrior 4: Mercenaries and Tachyon running, so that's helped sooth my twitchy joystick nerves a bit Still trying to get Freespace running though, and I can't wait for Jumpgate to start up next month.

 

[Crazyshak48]

Alright, I had a little bit of insight earlier today into the demise of the genre. I was checking out Gamestop, and as usual, the aviation section of the simulator list had but a single title, which was just some helicopter simulator that has yet to be released. Curious where some of the new releases such as HAWX were, I noticed eventually that this and similar titles such as Ace Combat were classified as "Flight Action" games.

I forget who said it earlier, about the whole casual gaming thing destroying the simulator genre, but I think they're right. I don't mind some of the arcade style flight games (I still love playing Ace Combat 5), but I wish they hadn't inadvertently demolished the old school in the process :/

 

[Kellerb]

you should try a space pilot game called freelancer. that was plain awesome.

 

[Oddobject]

I was a bit surprised that Freelancer wasn't mentioned more often in this thread. It's a solid game, and one with so many mods. My household still plays it regularly. Sure it can get a bit old after a few weeks, but then you just get a new mod and start over.

Then there's X3. A solid game once it's patched, but one with issues. For starters, the learning curve is nearly vertical. I say nearly because it's actually tilting back towards you like this \. If you haven't devoted a weekend to studying the overly large manual, it can be a bit like scaling a shear concrete wall covered in oil while rabid badgers attempt to chew off your legs. The combat can be frustrating. Trading can be a pain. And travel takes forever. That said, it's probably not for the casual gamer.

I won't get started on Eve here. It's a mess, plain and simple. Like playing a spreadsheet in space. XD

Just wait for Jumpgate Evo to come out. It looks solid enough to satisfy all of our desires for a decent space sim. look forward to seeing you all there.

 

[Esarai]

For people who liked the FreeSpace series, a while back volition released the source code to FS2, and a dedicated group of fans started the Source Code Project for upgrading and maintaining the FS2 engine. FreeSpace SCP is just like FreeSpace, but with modern graphics and greatly expanded capabilities for modders. You should take a look at it. A lot of work has gone into it, and the only prerequisite for installing it is that you have a functional copy of FS2. And you will get a load of great mods too, including the BSG Beyond the Red Line conversion.

go to http://www.fsoinstaller.com/ for the auto-downloader,
and http://www.hard-light.net/ for the most active FS community out there and a Wiki to answer your questions.

In case you have a demon computer than can handle it, this page details installation of the most advanced graphics yet:
http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php/topic,58230.0.html

Have fun

 

[Crazyshak48]

Fellow simulator heads and space cadets, fear not! I have decided to resurrect my thread after reading today's Extra Punctuation:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/columns/extra-punctuation/7141-Extra-Punctuation-Space-Flying-and-Space-Flying.2

Perhaps our cause is not hopeless, since even the mighty Yahtzee seems to like flight games (to a certain degree, anyway). Since developers seem to notice his opinion, maybe we'll see some new games come out. A small hope, but you never know.

In any case, just an update