To gain a relationship but lose a friend =/ (V2)

[o0BigDave0o]

This is part 2 of my recent thread on whether I should be with this girl but lose my close friend. Below is the extract from my older post about how things are;

Heres the story

For the last 2 years i have been helping a couple get together and form a relationship. The man in this relationship would give the world to this women if he could. Both of them loved each other for a while and even had sex a few months ago. However, the way they have both been in recent months has changed things. They constantly argue, shout and abuse each other causing depression, guilt and they have even self harmed (one attempted suicide last week but luckily survived). Its got to the point where they are hurting each other more then loving each other.
I don't know if i should continue helping them anymore...

It gets worse...

It seems the girl in the relationship now has lost all love for this guy. however, he won't leave her alone over it and is becoming a problem in her life. Now because i have been so deeply involved in this relationship, the girl in the relationship now loves ME! I didnt expect that to happen but it has.
So hears the thing. The girl Loves me and has become my closest friend( and before you ask YES i do love her secretly back but we have not had any relationship stuff at all) and the guy im helping has become my best friend.

So now, I love this girl and she loves me, this other guy has ruined his chances but still wants to be with her badly. since he is my best friend, i would not know how to tell him that the girl he loves now loves me and that i may consider dating her...

I could gain a relationship with this girl but lose my best friend in the process...

Now just to clarify

yes i love this girl, she is beautiful, she is worth it and she lives 20 miles away. age difference is only 2 years. ( im 17 shes 15)
the guy is my best friend but has become a liability over this mess, he has got on both of our nerves and is becoming a problem to both of us. the girl is scared of him atm about wat he would do next.



[end of older post]


Now, many of the problems have got to me regarding the ethical concerns over the matter. Currently, me and this girl are getting on great, we are always friendly towards each other and always look forward from hearing from one another. The guy on the other hand now "hates" me. He still talks to me as a friend but finds it hard to hold a conversation. He says he has lost trust in me and that if I am helping him and the girl anymore, it would stir things up. He obviously is envious, and feels betrayed by me, =( I didn't betray him though.

Now however,the guy is causing many problems between me and the girl, as well as our friends. He constantly argues with both of us and makes me feel guilty for my actions, even though i haven't done anything yet. He has started living in a fantasy that the girl still likes him. she mocks him and says how petty he is at trying since he never will get another chance, however, he won't listen and is determined to keep fighting for her. He has become slightly stalkerish and has started to scare her more then care for her.

About a week ago, i plucked up the courage to say my feelings for her, she was, of course, shocked by it, but kinda expected it aswell. she couldn't give me an answer there and then, and she still hasn't. She says she wants to say things face to face, i dunno what these things are; whether its her saying yes or no :/

Now, in 3 weeks time, during the half term break, both of them are coming down to mine to stay for the night. They won't be sleeping in the same room for obvious reasons and I will be keeping a close eye on both of them. The girl said she wanted to talk to me face to face in private about the whole relationship thing. Now i dunno how it'll work out, whether its good or bad. Either way, the guy, my friend, will be hurt by it. If she says yes and we start dating, he will hate me and probably leave as quickly as possible. if she says no, then both of us will have a bad few days.

so heres the jist; If i date this girl, i will lose my best friend as he will never forgive me. if she says no, then both me and him will be unhappy (but i can cope, he can't) TBH, i don't wanna lose either of them, i love her, but he's a great friend. Is it really worth going for her.

I was gonna pull the plug on the whole coming down thing since i thought it'll cause problems, but she insisted it should continue.

Now i'm a strongly ethical person, i feel whatever i do will hurt someone. I could say no to her to protect my friend but lose out myself. but at the same time, neither of us will gain. I could really do with some help and guidance from you guys.

Thanks

)

 

[Abseith]

hey not sure how helpful this will be but ill give it a shot

if the guy is really being that bad to you both should you really still be considering him as your best friend I don't want to sound harsh here but if he wants to act like a petulant little child then fuck him tbh you don't need that and neither does this girl

and you were right to tell the girl how you feel its only fair she knows and can think through on how she feels I didn't do that to a girl I was crazy about and regret it deeply so well done for getting through that at least if nothing else

now onto the ethical side of things

the only ethics I see are ones you put on yourself your afraid of hurting anybody but wont think how much hassle the guy has caused or see the chance at something good with the girl because it'll hurt the guy forget him if you see this girl in 3 weeks and she says yes you have every right to go for it and don't wonder what hell do if he's truly a friend give him time to cool off and hell be your friend again and if not he wasn't worth a damn in the first place

I genuinely hope this helps and hope all goes well for you in 3 weeks time

 

[o0BigDave0o]

hey not sure how helpful this will be but ill give it a shot

if the guy is really being that bad to you both should you really still be considering him as your best friend I don't want to sound harsh here but if he wants to act like a petulant little child then fuck him tbh you don't need that and neither does this girl

and you were right to tell the girl how you feel its only fair she knows and can think through on how she feels I didn't do that to a girl I was crazy about and regret it deeply so well done for getting through that at least if nothing else

now onto the ethical side of things

the only ethics I see are ones you put on yourself your afraid of hurting anybody but wont think how much hassle the guy has caused or see the chance at something good with the girl because it'll hurt the guy forget him if you see this girl in 3 weeks and she says yes you have every right to go for it and don't wonder what hell do if he's truly a friend give him time to cool off and hell be your friend again and if not he wasn't worth a damn in the first place

I genuinely hope this helps and hope all goes well for you in 3 weeks time

I see your point fairly clearly and you are right, but its something i need to consider. I'm just worried he might do something stupid if she dates me.

 

[Abseith]

then the only other thing i think you could do is sit him down and both you and the girl talk to him and tell him what's happening and his role in it and if he doesn't like it then he doesn't have to stay in either of your lives because you don't want him there anymore

 

[rutger5000]

From the info you gave me I've got the impression your friend just have to grow up. The guy has to face reality or at least your view of it. Tell him you want to date the girl, and that you're going to ask her out regardless of what he says. Because in your eyes he and the girl are over. Yeah it's a bit hard, but it's honest and what the guy should hear. Only one relationship in your life will last a lifetime, all other will eventually break up. That's part of life, and as a guy your supposed to learn how to deal with it.
He might as well learn it from you.
So be a real friend, and show him not to be pathetic, instead of being a fake friend who will allow everybody to be unhappy for the sake of evading confrontation.
Sometimes being a friend means being there when your friend needs support, sometimes being a friend means sharing great moments and sometimes being a friend (especially for guys) means that you have to show the guy not to be a whinny assh*le.
That's my advice, and from my point of view also the ethical thing to do.

 

[The Man With the Soap]

Pistols at dawn?

Sorry, I always open with a joke. Helps lighten the mood. In all seriousness, though, if you want it, go for it. This guy doesn't sound like he's winning any awards in the best boyfriend department, so it's your turn. Don't be afraid to get back in the game.

You don't want to end up bitter. We have enough of those people, myself included.

 

[MrJoyless]

If you do not value the friendship of your friend then by all means step on them and have a relationship with the ex you introduced to him...were you friends with this woman before they got involved with your friend? how long have you known each other? do you and your friend still hang out or are they a high school friend that you happen to hang out with in college? are you willing to burn a bridge with a person you have known for a really long time?

in all honesty i can say you should stay away from this chick, if not to save you and your friends relationship, then at least to stay away from a girl who obviously has issues (thinking its ok to date a guys friend whom you recently stopped a 2 year relationship).

i dont want to sound like an ass or anything but i think i might be too late. if this feeling you have for this person is worth dropping everything you have had with your friend then by all means go for it...otherwise maybe you should look towards her last relationship as an indication of how she manages her personal life...if your friend would do anything for her...and she still left him...what is saying she wont do the exact same thing to you...

 

[bluepilot]

I think that what is happening to all of you is too much. I mean none of you have hit 20 yet but you are already dealing with lots of heavy stuff

I am not trying to patronize you or anything because you do sound really thoughtful and mature, but even at my age I would have a really hard time coping with your situation

Therefore I think that you should put the relationship on hold and make sure that the girl and your friend get some councilling because it seems like they are going through a hard time too

I think that starting a relationship with the girl would just make it all too complicated and taking a step back would be better

 

[That_Swedish_Guy]

To be honest with you, I've always found that your real friends will stick with you no matter what you do. It gets more complicated once you inclued realationships, but go with your heart.

 

[zombiesinc]

About a week ago, i plucked up the courage to say my feelings for her, she was, of course, shocked by it, but kinda expected it aswell. she couldn't give me an answer there and then, and she still hasn't. She says she wants to say things face to face, i dunno what these things are; whether its her saying yes or no :/

I honestly hope she says no, at least for now. Thing is, she's still obviously caught up between the two of you. Even though she's not with this guy, there's still drama between the three of you, and he hasn't backed off. These things, along with her feelings regarding the entire situation, need to be dealt with before she even considers getting into a relationship with anyone else. Of course she may say yes, 'cause she doesn't want to be alone, does have feelings toward you, or wishes for emotional support during this, but I don't feel that'd be a good idea. She may become too dependent on you to make her feel happy, or worse, once she's moved past all this she may realize that she didn't feel as genuinely as you did.

Now, in 3 weeks time, during the half term break, both of them are coming down to mine to stay for the night. They won't be sleeping in the same room for obvious reasons and I will be keeping a close eye on both of them. The girl said she wanted to talk to me face to face in private about the whole relationship thing. Now i dunno how it'll work out, whether its good or bad. Either way, the guy, my friend, will be hurt by it. If she says yes and we start dating, he will hate me and probably leave as quickly as possible. if she says no, then both of us will have a bad few days.

Why, oh why are they both staying at your place when they visit? I don't think this is a good situation, at all. Not only is he causing this girl grief and struggling to accept the reality of the situation, but she's meant to give you an answer regarding the two of you... the situation sounds like it's more likely to go bad than good, not even considering her answer toward you. If this situation cannot be avoided, I would suggest to encourage her to wait on her answer. Mainly for the reasons stated above, but also in the interest of avoiding additional drama.

Regardless of what does end up happening, if this friend of yours does indeed back away out of frustration or hurt regarding the two of you, it sounds like it's for the best, at least for a while. He needs space to accept the situation as it is, and start to move on.

As it stands, I feel it's in everyone's best interest that you leave these two alone while they're dealing with their own problems. Even though they're no longer together, it's obvious there's still a lot of tension and struggle between the two of them. If this girl would prefer you didn't leave her alone, I suppose you could give her any support you wish... I just don't feel it'd go well right now. Eventually, and once your friend backs off, yes, but until then, no.

 

[o0BigDave0o]

Well luckily now, the guy has backed off for a bit, and he is debating whether he will still come down or not. he probably won't. He hasn't been a great friend recently and I am really judging my friendship towards him. The girl on the other hand is coping ok, me and her are great together and we can't wait to see each other in a few weeks. Maybe i should wait though, see how things play out.