I just started reading the series recently, its fucking amazing. Game of Thrones is the best fantasy novel I've read since LOTR (possibly even better)GrimTuesday said:
Tolkien, Overrated?
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Just like Shakespeare, if you actually study his writing you really do find out just how beautifully crafted it is.
Tolkien's descriptions are like LSD for the imagination. Yes they are very descriptive but you can just tell he was trying his hardest to portray the world he had going on in his head for the benefit of the reader.
Tolkien's descriptions are like LSD for the imagination. Yes they are very descriptive but you can just tell he was trying his hardest to portray the world he had going on in his head for the benefit of the reader.
tolkien is, well overrated is the wrong word because as many people have stated fantasy stories as we know them pretty much exist due to this man, but while I love some of the shorter books like the hobbit (easily my favourite book as a child) I find the lord of the rings really can overstretch things sometimes which can make them a truly difficult read. They aren't helped by the fact it is now massively out of it's time and has some pop-culture references that your grandparents probably wouldn't get. the story of the lord of the rings is one filled with amazing detail, interesting sub-plots and supporting characters not to mention one of the most epic adventure/underdog stories ever told and it will always be a pillar of the literary world, but I think after some 80 years the style of writing is starting to stagnate.
To be honest, the Fellowship of the Ring was dull up until the Mine of Moria. After that, well... <3
I find that with older fantasy books it takes a while to figure out the characters. It's just the way they wrote in those days, but in more modern fantasy works and literature in general I feel like I know the characters.
Probably my best example of this would be The Belgariad, which is much the same as LOTR, only the characters are more... real.
The cantankerous wizard, the overprotective aunt, the spoiled princes... all wonderfully drawn.
I find that with older fantasy books it takes a while to figure out the characters. It's just the way they wrote in those days, but in more modern fantasy works and literature in general I feel like I know the characters.
Probably my best example of this would be The Belgariad, which is much the same as LOTR, only the characters are more... real.
The cantankerous wizard, the overprotective aunt, the spoiled princes... all wonderfully drawn.
Yeah I am, really looking forward to it xD I'll have to see how far through I can get with the novels before then though...GrimTuesday said:
I hear a lot of people say that this is why they dislike Tolkien, yet I can't see that in his writing. Do you think you could give me an example of what you're talking about? I don't doubt you, or anyone else, but people saying this about Tolkien is one of the things that shied me away from reading LOTR in the first place. However upon reading LOTR I did not find it to be entirely accurate.GrimTuesday said:
Well I loved the hobbit but could never get into his other books. It was his over description and the elegant way his writing flows that got me sucked in.
Well I'm assuming the other books were just as good, I just never had the heart to go out of my way for them.
Well I'm assuming the other books were just as good, I just never had the heart to go out of my way for them.
As a novelist, Tolkien is overrated. That is not to say, however, that I dislike his novels; on the contrary, I adore them. It has to be said, though, that he was not a novelist, first and foremost, and it shows; The Lord of the Rings is overly descriptive, has serious pacing issues, and there are so many references to events in The Silmarillion, which wasn't published for 20 years after LotR, that it can be more than a little daunting.
Where he is not, and could never be overrated, is in his world-building, which has had an astonishing amount of influence on modern fiction; practically every epic fantasy novel, film, game and comic is indebted to his work. It's certainly telling that the best high fantasy films are adaptations of The Lord of the Rings. He wrote his novels not so much for the sake of telling a story, but more as a way of putting his world to paper and making it, in a sense, real; this is the reason why The Lord of the Rings can be a little tiresome to read. He created a history for Middle-earth which goes back thousands of years; he gave it gods and a detailed cosmology; he wrote creation stories for all the races, and explanations of why they are the way they are; he drew up maps of his world and gave it realistic and consistent geography; as such, the depth and complexity of his world simply cannot be overstated. It is this world-building which created the fantasy genre as we know it today, and in this regard it is impossible for his work to be overrated.
Where he is not, and could never be overrated, is in his world-building, which has had an astonishing amount of influence on modern fiction; practically every epic fantasy novel, film, game and comic is indebted to his work. It's certainly telling that the best high fantasy films are adaptations of The Lord of the Rings. He wrote his novels not so much for the sake of telling a story, but more as a way of putting his world to paper and making it, in a sense, real; this is the reason why The Lord of the Rings can be a little tiresome to read. He created a history for Middle-earth which goes back thousands of years; he gave it gods and a detailed cosmology; he wrote creation stories for all the races, and explanations of why they are the way they are; he drew up maps of his world and gave it realistic and consistent geography; as such, the depth and complexity of his world simply cannot be overstated. It is this world-building which created the fantasy genre as we know it today, and in this regard it is impossible for his work to be overrated.
Just so you know, There is a 15 minute inside look on tonight before the season finale of Boardwalk Empire (I just realized it starts in 38 minutes) but I don't know if you will be getting it over there. If not I'll have it up in this user group http://www.escapistmagazine.com/groups/view/Winter-is-Coming.ThirdEye95 said:
Sadly I don't have any copies of the books handy at the moment as my brother took them on his way out.laststandman said:
Personally, I love how Tolkien goes into so much detail. He is a very descriptive man, but not to the point that is becomes boring. There are many books I have read that I cannot get into because of that reason, but Tolkien's writing is simply beautiful. It flows like a river from page to page, in my opinion. Of course, everyone is entitled to theirs.
Was it George MacDonald? Or was that just C.S. Lewis's biggest influence?Fumbleumble said:+1 internets to the first person who says what his biggest literary influence was.
(..and no googling)