UK Police Seize Suspected 3D Printed Firearm Parts In Raid

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J Tyran

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tangoprime said:
Karloff said:
Cregan fired over thirty rounds, hitting each officer multiple times, and then threw a fragmentation grenade at the constables' bodies. Cregan was involved in organized crime, and claimed to have killed the constables because the police were hounding his family.
But... how? Guns are Illegal, and Grenades are too- wait, WAIT. He used a fucking fragmentation grenade!? You don't even hear of crazy shit like that here in the states.
This incident needs to be held in perspective though, as horrific and extreme as it was it was an isolated incident. Creagen was a hardened and habitual organised criminal that was probably already going to prison for the rest of his life when he set the ambush, he was wanted for double murder and his later trial found him guilty of killing two rival organised criminals. That alone with his record would have either led to a whole life order or an indefinite sentence with little chance of ever getting out, he simply wanted to kill some police officers. As he turned himself in afterwards it wasn't even a suicide by cop situation, he had nothing to lose and wanted to kill.

The grenades is unfortunately more common than you would think and they get seized every now and then here, thanks mainly due to the conflict in Northern Ireland. Criminal networks on the mainland UK set up extensive supply chains from Eastern Europe to the province to supply paramilitaries with weapons, as the conflict wound down those weapons suddenly had nowhere to go. Some paramilitaries also sold some weapons back to the black markets instead of decommissioning them.
 

LordMonty

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Organised crime is scary stuff. And that dude was an evil bastard. UK gun laws are tight and this sort of thing never happenes quite shocking for me to be honest.

Keeping these things out of the hands of criminals is key, no judgement on US gun control as you guys have way to many guns to make them all vanish over night but for the UK its the challenge of keeping them from becoming common place and easy to get hold of... as through 3D printing.
 

Karloff

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Zykon TheLich said:
Karloff said:
The Challenger raids are Greater Manchester's response to the murders of PCs Fiona Bone and Nichola Hughes, in September 2013.
Just a minor correction, that happened last year, not this year.
Nuts. My error. Adjusted. Thanks!
 

UNHchabo

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albino boo said:
The UK has has 0.4 gun homicides per 100000 and the US has 3.6. The fact that the UK has 900% lower number of gun homicides is clearly to do with the fact the guns are very tightly controlled.
First, I disagree with the idea of using "gun homicides" to measure whether gun control works. How about using the overall homicide rate?

Second, the numbers reported by the US and UK governments are not comparable, largely because of this: (source [http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm199900/cmselect/cmhaff/95/95ap25.htm])

Since 1967, homicide figures for England and Wales have been adjusted to exclude any cases which do not result in conviction, or where the person is not prosecuted on grounds of self defence or otherwise.
According to crime statistician John Lott [http://johnrlott.blogspot.com/2013/10/warning-about-how-homicides-and-crime.html], if the US used the same method of counting homicides, our rate would be about 30% higher than that of the UK, instead of 400% higher.

Not to mention the UK police being pressured to keep reported crime rates low [http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/10052668/Police-ordered-to-slant-crime-data.html]...
 

Thaluikhain

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Kalezian said:
thaluikhain said:
Zeren said:
It's just proof that gun laws don't stop people from getting guns no matter how strict they are.
They can make it hard enough that many won't, though.

Which only will affect people who follow the law.
Which includes people who are forced to follow the law by law enforcement. The UK law enforcement is pretty good (not perfect, though) at stopping illegal weapons use (with the notable exception of Northern Ireland).
 

GoaThief

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DVS BSTrD said:
Well that's because they actually take care of each other over there so fewer people are driven to violent crime in the first place.
So in essence, what you're saying is that strict gun control makes little to no difference and the way to combat violent crime, especially those that involve firearms, is to address inequality and provide decent care/quality of life for your citizens who in turn will be happier and less prone to turning to crime? I totally agree.

;)
 

GoaThief

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DVS BSTrD said:
GoaThief said:
DVS BSTrD said:
Well that's because they actually take care of each other over there so fewer people are driven to violent crime in the first place.
So in essence, what you're saying is that strict gun control makes little to no difference and the way to combat violent crime, especially those that involve firearms, is to address inequality and provide decent care/quality of life for your citizens who in turn will be happier and less prone to turning to crime? I totally agree.

;)
But guns it a hell of a lot easier to commit those crimes.
albino boo said:
The UK has has 0.4 gun homicides per 100000 and the US has 3.6. The fact that the UK has 900% lower number of gun homicides is clearly to do with the fact the guns are very tightly controlled.
The UK is more the size and nature of a state, however - have you got the figures for those? On mobile at the moment so it's awkward. Sources would be good too.

What about comparing it to Norway, Sweden and another EU country such as Switzerland?
 

Slash2x

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CriticalMiss said:
albino boo said:
Zeren said:
It's just proof that gun laws don't stop people from getting guns no matter how strict they are.
The UK has has 0.4 gun homicides per 100000 and the US has 3.6. The fact that the UK has 900% lower number of gun homicides is clearly to do with the fact the guns are very tightly controlled.
Either that or we have shit aim.
As evidence by the fact it took 30 rounds and a FUCKING grenade to kill 2 people... In the US that would have been a whole gang of people at a *insert latest location of random act of violence*. Damn brits need to spend some time at the firing range.
 

frobalt

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I heard about this on the radio earlier. It's a bit unnerving to me since it's very close to where I work. The part of Manchester this is in is called 'Baguley' (silent 'u') which is where I work.

I've heard a few things on the radio happening around there recently as well!


Edit:

I believe the radio report on the story did mention that it turned out not to be gun parts but, I think, parts for models. Or something like that.
 

Scarim Coral

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Ultratwinkie said:
... that's a gun?

Is my paperclip a part of a more complex home made gun too? Maybe its part of a multi-platform super weapon floating in space, waiting to strike with laser-based fury.

Hell, isn't the reciever the thing that's legally a gun?
The image in the news is the trigger componment (saw the news this morning and they explain what that image is).

Either way the new development in firearm would mean the authority should now start thinking of a new way to counteract it since one of the benefit of a plastic gun is that it will avoid metal detection (if the bullet is plastic too). Sure you could say they could make a device to melt it but something tell me it will take alot of heat to melt that.
 

The Lugz

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Scarim Coral said:
Ultratwinkie said:
... that's a gun?

Is my paperclip a part of a more complex home made gun too? Maybe its part of a multi-platform super weapon floating in space, waiting to strike with laser-based fury.

Hell, isn't the reciever the thing that's legally a gun?
The image in the news is the trigger componment (saw the news this morning and they explain what that image is).

Either way the new development in firearm would mean the authority should now start thinking of a new way to counteract it since one of the benefit of a plastic gun is that it will avoid metal detection (if the bullet is plastic too). Sure you could say they could make a device to melt it but something tell me it will take alot of heat to melt that.
you can avoid metal detection fairly easily, and it's not really an issue when we can detect plastic just as well these days, a modern scanner is a fairly scary thing:


won't be long before these things can be used as an all in one check-up as you pass security..
 

Someone Depressing

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As someone who lives in Britain, and thus my bloodsteam is 50% grease and cigarrete ash, I can testify that the guns laws over here and viciously strict.

So the fact that this has been done only tells me that the society I've grown up in and learned to feel safe in isn't all that great.

But: Doesn't 3d printing use resin, a kind of heavily compacted plastic/hemp? With the heat and power behind a gun, could it really stand the challenge?
 

UltraPic

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Dec 5, 2011
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frobalt said:
I believe the radio report on the story did mention that it turned out not to be gun parts but, I think, parts for models. Or something like that.
It's a mod for the 3d printer put out by the company that makes them.
Another story, but with a few quotes from the dood who got busted http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-24669969
 

Daverson

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Nov 17, 2009
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Zeren said:
It's just proof that gun laws don't stop people from getting guns no matter how strict they are.
Erm...

So let me get this straight: You feel that a news story about how a law against the unauthorized manufacturing of firearms has successfully prevented the unauthorized manufacturing of firearms is proof that laws against the unauthorized manufacturing of firearms don't work?

You do realize that's like pointing at a duck and saying "This is clear proof that ducks do not exist!"

Or is your point simply that some people break laws? In which case, one could just as easily say "Welp, laws against murder aren't doing anything to stem the tide of murders, might as well legalize murder". I'd strongly recommend against that line of thought, because frankly, that's just dumb.

Ultratwinkie said:
... that's a gun?
Looks like a sear, part of the trigger assembly. [http://www.samachine.com/images/Sear%20Nose%20Bad%201.jpg] (Sorry for the large picture, it's the best one I could find. It's a slightly different design, but you can clearly see both the mounting hole and the nodule for the trigger spring. Admittedly, not necessarily part of a firearm, but if you find something like this and gunpowder in the same box, it's a reasonable guess it's not just part of a glue gun)
 

jackpipsam

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Jun 2, 2009
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Hopefully the Australian police will crack down on this as soon as this stuff comes into Australia.