Unsatisfied with ME3 ending and EC?

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sobaka770

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So now that the EC has been out and we got what we wanted, and by that I meant those people who actually like the original endings and not the 99% of us, it?s time to make a stand. Personally I still find the ending of Mass Effect a big joke, and a personal insult despite the 90+hours of gorgeous storyline that precedes it. The big problem for me is that both the horrible ending and the beautiful universe is done by the same company. (sad face) So how do I deal with the situation?

The original ending is such a nonsense thematically and contradicts in so many ways the spirit of the game that I have no choice than to REJECT it and come up with one of my own. So the next long wall of text will describe an ending which I devised and you can use in a somewhat D&D guided way if you feel like it?s a better ending than the original one.

DISCLAIMER: I have come up with this in about an hour of pure imagination and it took me forever to write. I do not pretend that it doesn?t have plot holes, or that it will blow your mind off by its complexity etc. etc., it?s just the way I think the story should have ended. It?s my way to deal with the void that was left by the original one.

I try to take into account your choices throughout the game and I remove completely the whole Bioware sequence on the citadel and the choices it offers. It draws a lot from the endings of the ME1, ME2 and DAO. You will need your imagination and some time to read through.

I hope you like it.

START HERE

1.

It starts with the VI explaining the catalyst in the end of the Cerberus Mission. The catalyst is still the Citadel itself. The VI goes on to tell that the races that devised the weapon against the reapers were always hurdled by the fact that reapers are so much more advanced than they are and to defeat them reaper technology itself needed to be used, and such a complex technology is unachievable in one cycle.

The story of the crucible begins when during one of the cycles there was an organic race so advanced that it knew about the reaper arrival long before the extinction began. They discovered a truly dead remains of the derelict reaper and understood that the citadel and mass effect relays were all parts of the same technology. They didn?t know about indocrination or whether they were hostile or not, but they started to be wary of using a technology above their level of comprehension and taking it for granted. They sought for a way to understand and disrupt this technology if necessary.

They started the crucible as the weapon that would destroy such reaper technology. They chose citadel as the source because it actually is reaper tech, as well as the center of the Mass Relay network and as usual the main hub of their civilization making it the obvious choice.

After a few cycles, ending with the prothean one, the final model of the working weapon has been devised using the data from multiple reaper invasions. It works very simply: once the crucible is attached to the citadel it uses its power and unleashes a pulse throughout the whole relay network and destroys the reaper signal, effectively wiping them out.

2.

We now finish the Cerberus HQ mission and continue with the London mission up until the infamous Harbringer scene of the final assault.

You and your squad dodge the beam (or die if you can?t) and all 3 of you make it to the citadel. (as there is no loyalty in ME3 it doesn?t make sense to kill off any of your squadmates at this point) At some point during the run you see the beam heading in Anderson?s direction and hear static in your headpiece.

You?re beamed up and end up in a pile of corpses. The citadel has been retaken by the reapers and the keepers were once again indocrinated and now work throughout the whole station to make extra husks from human bodies. You tell Hackett that you?ve made but hear only static as the battle rages on and the crucible is close to docking with the yet-closed citadel.

You proceed to kill the newly made husks as well as the now-hostile keepers and make your way to the main console in the Presidium (the same one that saren used as it?s been shown to be able to open and close the citadel wings). You reach the council room and there....

The wings of the citadel start to open without you doing anything. Shepard tries to reach Hackett but hears only static. The Crucible docks.

You enter the Presidium and see that the husks around you are all docile. They don?t move or attack you. You ignore them and run towards the console only to see that the Illusive Man is there. He is the one who allowed the Crucible to dock.

3. FROM HERE ON THE MULTIPLE PATH STORY BEGINS BASED ON YOUR IN-GAME CHOICES

The Illusive Man smiles at you and welcomes you to the place of his triumph. He shows you a small object that he holds in his hand, the result of the work into controlling the reapers: a device that can take control of the indocrinated at short-distance. After the Cerberus HQ has been destroyed, the Illusive Man made a bold move and escaped to the Citadel. When the reaper forces attacked, they couldn?t kill him because they couldn?t approach him without being put under his control. At the same time, the power of the device being so limited he couldn?t take control of the entire station, just one - two rooms.

He proceeds to tell you that this device is the key to controlling the reapers. With proper input the impulse provided by the Crucible can be altered in conjunction with the Cerberus device to place them under his control instead of destroying them. That?s why he moved to the control room once the battle of Earth began and allowed the Crucible to dock.

He asks you to join him. Choose a) or b)

(Options begin. I try to be as coherent as possible but it may be rough for some. Hang in there! Use your imagination.)

a)
You tell the Illusive Man that he can?t stop you and that the humanity will take its dominant place in the Galaxy only not under Illusive Man?s guidance, but Shepard?s. You have this option if the renegade score is high however you need to have almost maxed out renegade score for the Illusive Man to back down and willingly give the Cerberus Control Device to you. If you truly think you?re max RENEGADE go to R1) else read on.

If your renegade score is not that high he laughs at you and orders the husks under his control to attack you. Go to c)

b)
You decline the Illusive Man?s offer once again and tell him that it?s wrong. If your Paragon score is almost at maximum, he sees the error of his ways takes his gun and shoots the docile husks under his control in the head. After this he destroys the Control Device. If you truly think you?re max PARAGON go to P1) else read on.

If your paragon score is not that high, the Illusive Man laughs at your sense of honour and unleashes the husks on you.Go to c)

c)
You defeat the Illusive Man?s forces. It?s a standoff between him pointing a gun at you and you and your team - back at him. Now you get to choose between d) or e)

d)
You tell him to give you the Cerberus Device. You can always choose this option. The Illusive Man looks at the device in his hand and tells you that there was only one man destined to have such power, and it wasn?t Shepard. He shoots himself and you take the device from his body. At any point in the conversation you can press the trigger and shoot the Illusive Man yourself. Now choose between f) and g)

e)
You tell him that his way of thinking is wrong and controlling the reapers is never going to work. You can always choose this option. The Illusive Man seeing that it?s futile to fight you, throws the device on the ground, crushes it with his foot and then shoots one of your squad (not the LI) and then shoots himself not to see his plans go awry. At any point during the conversation you can take an aimed shot and shoot the Illusive Man?s hand with the device in it. He will get staggered, shoots one of your squadmates (not the LI), the device in his hand is destroyed and your surviving teammate finishes the job by killing the Illusive Man Go to M1)


f)
You throw the Cerberus Device on the ground and destroy it. Go to M1)

g)
You decide to use the Cerberus Device and to control the reapers. If you saved the Collector?s ship go to i), if you didn?t go to h)

h)
The technology of the Cerberus Device is incomplete doesn?t allow reaper control, only husks. The Crucible is overloaded and explodes. The faulty pulse it emits destroys the relays. In one blinding flash the whole known universe including the Reapers is destroyed. Black screen. END HERE

i)
The sequence initiates and the reapers start shooting at the Citadel to prevent the pulse. If your military strength is below 2000 go to j), if it?s between 2000 and 3000 go to k) and if it?s 3000+ go to l).

j)
Reapers shoot and destroy the citadel before the Crucible may fire. Your war effort was insufficient. You die. Reapers win. END HERE

k) The Crucible fires the pulse. However seconds before the reapers shoot the citadel and blast the Presidium chambers. You try to escape the explosion but you get wounded by the debris. Your last squadmate/LI gets you out of the debris. The wound is fatal. You plead him to assume control and do what he can. At this point if your squadmate is the LI he/she kisses you. Then he/she goes to the console and as you die you witness the reapers leaving earth and flying into the sun.
You can now read the PARAGON ENDING STORIES

l) You assume control and reapers can?t damage the station. You can now choose to fly the reapers into the sun and read the PARAGON ENDING STORIES or promote the standing of humanity in the Galaxy and read the RENEGADE ENDING STORIES


M1)
Illusive Man is dead. The Cerberus device that could potentially control the reapers is destroyed. You approach the console and manage to contact Hackett. You tell him that the mission is a success and that you?re starting the pulse. The reapers are now starting a desperate attempt to shoot down the citadel before the Crucible can fire. You ask Hackett to defend the station at all costs. Evaluate your military strength. If your military strength is below 2000 go to M2), if it?s between 2000 and 3000 go to M3) and if it?s 3000+ go to M4)

M2)
Reapers shoot and destroy the citadel before the Crucible may fire. Your war effort was insufficient. You die. Reapers win. END HERE

M3) The Crucible fires the pulse. However seconds before the reapers shoot the citadel and blast the Presidium chambers. Your last squadmate or LI gets thrown out of the room and perishes. You can?t save him/her. You try to escape the explosion but you get wounded by the debris. You avoid being buried underneath but your wound is fatal.
You crawl back towards the control panel with a window overseeing Earth. As you die you witness the destruction of the Reapers as the signal spreads through the Mass Effect Relay network.
You can now read the PARAGON ENDING STORIES


M4) Citadel is unharmed from the last-effort reaper attack. The pulse is sent through the relay and you and your surviving teammate witness the victory against the reapers. If it?s your LI you look at each other but don?t kiss instead mourning the loss of your other teammate.
You can now read the PARAGON ENDING STORIES


P1)
MAX PARAGON ENDING. Be certain that it?s what you want.
You?re now at Crucible control. The Illusive Man is right beside you. The husks are dead and your teammates seize him and relieve him from his gun.
Hackett is online and you tell him that everything goes as planned. You tell him to protect the Citadel at all costs. You initiate the sequence.
The reapers in the last effort start shooting at the Citadel to prevent the pulse. If your military strength is below 2000 go to P2), if it?s between 2000 and 3000 go to P3) and if it?s 3000+ go to P4).

P2)
Reapers shoot and destroy the citadel before the Crucible may fire. Your war effort was insufficient. You die. Reapers win. END HERE

P3)
The Crucible fires the pulse. However before it can do so the reapers shoot the citadel and blast the Presiduim chambers. The Illusive Man gets thrown out of the room and perishes. You can?t save him. You try to escape the explosion but you get wounded by the debris. Your teammates are unharmed and drag you out. You know that the wound is fatal. You ask them to bring you to the console where you can have the last sight of your home planet. As you die you witness the destruction of the reapers and the victory for all the alien races.
If your LI is in the squad he/she holds you as you pass and tells of his/her love for you. If it?s a woman, then she tells you that she?s pregnant. If it?s Tali she also removes her mask and tries to feel her skin against yours one last time.
End game stories begin.
You get a heroic burial on Earth. All your surviving squadmates make a speech. As the credits roll, Liara?s message to the stars plays again.
Read the PARAGON ENDING STORIES

P4)
Reapers can?t touch the citadel. As the signal propagates, the Illusive Man?s eyes flash. You realise that he sacrificed himself by destroying the Cerberus Indocrination Contol device.He smiles at you and tells you that you were right before he dies after having implanted himself with Reaper technology.
You witness the destruction of the reaper forces with your squadmates. This is the ultimate victory.
If your LI is in the squad you kiss. If it?s Tali she removes her mask for this.

End game stories begin.
You and your LI go to your LI?s home planet and establish a life there for a while. You help rebuild your LI?s planet and are also a member of the new council which now increased in size to include Krogan (if you cured the genophage), Quorian and Geth (depending on your resolution of Rannoch).
Read the PARAGON ENDING STORIES



R1)
MAX RENEGADE ENDING. Be certain that it?s what you want.

You?re now at Crucible control. The Illusive Man is right beside you. If your team has aliens in it (not Kaidan or James) you may now choose to kill them in cold blood, or make Illusive man restrain them otherwise.
Hackett is online and you tell him that everything goes as planned. You tell him to protect the Citadel at all costs. You insert the Cerberus Device into the console and initiate the sequence.
If you saved the Collector?s ship go to R3), if you didn?t go to R2)

R2)
The technology of the Cerberus Device is incomplete doesn?t allow reaper control, only husks. The Crucible is overloaded and explodes. The faulty pulse it emits destroys the relays. In one blinding flash the whole known universe including the Reapers is destroyed. Black screen. END HERE

R3)
The sequence initiates and the reapers start shooting at the Citadel to prevent the pulse. If your military strength is below 2000 go to R4), if it?s between 2000 and 3000 go to R5) and if it?s 3000+ go to R6).

R4)
Reapers shoot and destroy the citadel before the Crucible may fire. Your war effort was insufficient. You die. Reapers win. END HERE

R5)
The Crucible fires the pulse. However before you manage to establish control the reapers shoot the citadel and blast the Presiduim chambers. Your squadmates get thrown out of the room and perish. You can?t save them. You try to escape the explosion but you get wounded by the debris. The Illusive Man drags you out of it, but you know that the wound is going to kill you. ?Humanity First? you say and look at the Illusive Man who drags you back towards the console and from there assumes control over the reaper forces. As you die you get to witness the dawn of the new age for humanity under the Illusive Man?s guidance.
End game stories begin.
If your LI was a human, he/she takes control of the Normandy and adds your name to the memorial wall. If it was an alien, you see him/her working as a slave on rebuilding Earth and cursing your very name as a big statue of Illusive Man and Shepard together is being erected nearby.
Read the RENEGADE ENDING STORIES

R6)
Reapers can?t touch the citadel You assume control of the Reaper forces and declare the new dawn for humanity after the rubble that?s left of Earth.
End game stories begin.
If you romanced a human squadmate, then you get to share your victory with your LI who you call up to the Presidium room. Otherwise your alien LI can?t stand the betrayal and kills him/herself. You think about him/her with slight regret when you hear the news, but then you raise your head high and your eyes flash red. You can?t have any regrets because you?re an human soldier and in your eyes humanity comes first.
Read the RENEGADE ENDING STORIES




PARAGON ENDING STORIES
Quorians and/or Geth return to Rannoch to rebuild. Asari return to Thessia. Citadel keepers free from indocrination move the citadel to the Serpent Nebula.
If you cured the Genophage then the Krogan rebuild Tuchanka, and start aiming at colonizing a few worlds. If not, there are so few Krogan remaining that they are offered to relocate to Citadel. The move that Korgan refuse and remain on Tuchanka, hoping to preserve what remains of their race.
The Earth is being rebuild with help from most alien races as the planet where the fate of the galaxy was decided.
The name Shepard now resonates throughout the whole galaxy as a symbol of hope, faith and victory. END HERE

RENEGADE ENDING STORIES The aliens forced to rebuild Earth and are enslaved. All the worlds that are still viable for living are under human control and have reapers stationed on them to promote peace.
The asari are refused the plea to rebuild Thessia. Quarians are permitted to return to Rannoch (depending on your in-game choices) but once again under tight human and reaper supervision. The geth get reaper tech update and are now also under direct control.
If the genophage has been cured, then the Krogan are declared as potentially dangerous species and their breeding is under tight control. They are not allowed to carry weapons.
Turian Military is disbanded and those who refused to lay down arms are destroyed. All military ships that are not alliance or reaper are also decommissioned from all races or destroyed in fight. END HERE
 

sobaka770

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I envy you. I can get over a film, or a book because they are what they are. But a game which is partially shaped by my choices and promises to deliver based on these choices and then dumps me is a hard pill to swallow.

This fiction actually helps me to get over it, so I just put it here because maybe someone else feels the same way. If people enjoy the choice given by the original developer I respect that. But most time I see people saying that it's an okay ending or they got over it.

That doesn't strike me as praise.
 

Shavon513

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sobaka770 said:
Personally I still find the ending of Mass Effect a big joke, and a personal insult despite the 90+hours of gorgeous storyline that precedes it.
Totally agree. Not even touching the Extended cut. It just reinforces the same mediocrity that made the ending, and the same mediocrity that will put Bioware under for good unless they change.

Edit: Just finished reading the rest of your post. +5 approval points!

It's nice some people can create better endings for their Shepard. I, however, can't get past the betrayal part. Over-dramatic? Yeah, maybe. But I do believe the fans deserved better than what those writing hacks gave us. They have effectively ruined the franchise for me and any desire to ever replay the Mass Effect series ever again, EC or no.
 

sobaka770

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Just used the same lines from ME1 where renegade makes you kill people and go with Udina/human council. Think of something better? Feedback appreciated :)
 

Loop Stricken

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But Mass Effect's Renegade/Paragon system was the worst of the three. Regegade was entirely racist dickhole, and Paragon was quadless pacifist.
 

sobaka770

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Worst of which three? You always have paragon renegade choices in all three games.

In the first you controlled every word Shepard said and Paragon/Renegade meant be nice and save everyone or let people die and put humanity first. That's maybe a very limited choice but you could end up in the middle and be a bit of both.

In the second it's more about being a jerk to everyone, or being nice but if you wanted to save the whole alien crew you'd still have to go mainly Paragon e.g. for romance etc. And the most Renegade choice is to save the Collector ship and give it Cerberus, guess what that implies.

In the third you have the same system only now your Shepard speaks what the writers tell him most of the time, and only occasionally give you control. I had almost no Renegade points and could still choose the Renegade option in all dialogue. The point is in all three games you always had this alignment and for better or for worse it makes sense to stick with it for the sake of cohesion.
 

RaikuFA

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So I guess the EC didn't make you get over it?

Do I need to whip out the PA comic?
 

sobaka770

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I did write originally ME1 as in my opinion it's the most defined. I would also argue that being renegade in ME2 is implying giving power to Cerberus which doesn't bode well for aliens either. Look I just made this because I thought it was more satisfactory than the original voodoo magic out-of-nowhere setup.
I also said there might be plot holes and it's in the eye of the beholder. You don't have to like it. I know imagining and writing this helped me cope with ME3 ending. Maybe it will also help some people who enjoy fan-fiction. It's the best I can do.
 

Earlybuddy

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Shavon513 said:
sobaka770 said:
Personally I still find the ending of Mass Effect a big joke, and a personal insult despite the 90+hours of gorgeous storyline that precedes it.
Totally agree. Not even touching the Extended cut. It just reinforces the same mediocrity that made the ending, and the same mediocrity that will put Bioware under for good unless they change.
My main complaints about the ME3 ending was that the choices that were proposed to you, the Catalyst character and well basically the endings were just thrown in your face with little time to understand everything.

That was corrected. The Catalyst takes its time to explain everything, you get to tell it that its reasoning is flawed, and basically there is more time to ponder on the decisions you are about to make.


The cutscenes were copy-pasted, only changed color, and showed nothing of what would happen to the rest of the galaxy.

That was corrected. You now additionally see your choice affect a Husk's behavior, along with epilogue stills that change depending on your choice.


The endings did not reflect your choices through the series and the last game.

That was also corrected, in various ways. On top of the different epilogue stills you get depending on your choice (Destroy, Control or Synthesis), you get to see characters who survived, and those that died don't show. Those stills change to reflect what your Shepard did during the whole franchise.


The ending was broken in that characters just left your side during the race to the beam, and the Normandy was seen fleeing battle for no effin reason.

That was also corrected. Added cutscenes explain how it all went down, and it is done seamlessly.


So to everyone still complaining. I personally think your complaints just show how dissapointed you are that the series ended, and how you personally thought some characters acted out of character, not to your liking or whatever.
There are some things that cannot be controlled. Bioware had a vision for some of the characters, they had a vision for how it should end. They failed to explain their vision properly the first time, but the extended version corrects what was broken. If you're still not happy, I'm sorry to say it's now no longer Bioware's fault, but rather your own feelings about the characters and the universe of Mass Effect.
That is okay, but we can no longer argue that the endings are broken, and I think that's what matters most.
 

sobaka770

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Earlybuddy said:
Shavon513 said:
sobaka770 said:
Personally I still find the ending of Mass Effect a big joke, and a personal insult despite the 90+hours of gorgeous storyline that precedes it.
Totally agree. Not even touching the Extended cut. It just reinforces the same mediocrity that made the ending, and the same mediocrity that will put Bioware under for good unless they change.
My main complaints about the ME3 ending was that the choices that were proposed to you, the Catalyst character and well basically the endings were just thrown in your face with little time to understand everything.

That was corrected. The Catalyst takes its time to explain everything, you get to tell it that its reasoning is flawed, and basically there is more time to ponder on the decisions you are about to make.


The cutscenes were copy-pasted, only changed color, and showed nothing of what would happen to the rest of the galaxy.

That was corrected. You now additionally see your choice affect a Husk's behavior, along with epilogue stills that change depending on your choice.


The endings did not reflect your choices through the series and the last game.

That was also corrected, in various ways. On top of the different epilogue stills you get depending on your choice (Destroy, Control or Synthesis), you get to see characters who survived, and those that died don't show. Those stills change to reflect what your Shepard did during the whole franchise.


The ending was broken in that characters just left your side during the race to the beam, and the Normandy was seen fleeing battle for no effin reason.

That was also corrected. Added cutscenes explain how it all went down, and it is done seamlessly.


So to everyone still complaining. I personally think your complaints just show how dissapointed you are that the series ended, and how you personally thought some characters acted out of character, not to your liking or whatever.
There are some things that cannot be controlled. Bioware had a vision for some of the characters, they had a vision for how it should end. They failed to explain their vision properly the first time, but the extended version corrects what was broken. If you're still not happy, I'm sorry to say it's now no longer Bioware's fault, but rather your own feelings about the characters and the universe of Mass Effect.
That is okay, but we can no longer argue that the endings are broken, and I think that's what matters most.
Yes I have a very different problem with the endings that cannot be rectified by not changing them completely.

My main issue that the whole three choices give you a blank slate where previous choices that you made for your main protagonist who you control through the entire game don't matter. Sure they let you decide everything (and by that I mean take on of three choices or die) and they sure play out differently for everyone but Shepard. I can't accept that Bioware can make me shape future for everyone but the character I control and in a way, it's important because as I stated I didn't just go full paragon/renegade just so that in the end they say "Oh it was a stupid system anyway, let's not make it relevant". In first ME if you kill the whole colony on Feros you're ruthless and determined, whether you kill the council or save it you're always in control. In ME3 you always cry after you fail on Thessia and whether you're a badass or a saviour you always end up choices all of which reek of tacked-on syndrome and they are all available to you.

It's about the same problem when in ME1 I would always choose Shepard's words while in ME3 he would just speak and feel whatever writers imagined for him.That being said as usual. I'm glad you like what you've got. :)
 

Earlybuddy

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sobaka770 said:
Yes I have a very different problem with the endings that cannot be rectified by not changing them completely.

My main issue that the whole three choices give you a blank slate where previous choices that you made for your main protagonist who you control through the entire game don't matter. Sure they let you decide everything (and by that I mean take on of three choices or die) and they sure play out differently for everyone but Shepard. I can't accept that Bioware can make me shape future for everyone but the character I control and in a way, it's important because as I stated I didn't just go full paragon/renegade just so that in the end they say "Oh it was a stupid system anyway, let's not make it relevant". In first ME if you kill the whole colony on Feros you're ruthless and determined, whether you kill the council or save it you're always in control. In ME3 you always cry after you fail on Thessia and whether you're a badass or a saviour you always end up choices all of which reek of tacked-on syndrome and they are all available to you.

It's about the same problem when in ME1 I would always choose Shepard's words while in ME3 he would just speak and feel whatever writers imagined for him.That being said as usual. I'm glad you like what you've got. :)
I agree that crying on Thessia makes no sense if you think of your Shepard as a renegade character who's tough and emotionless, but then again, they couldn't have stopped the scene to let you decide whether you're going to cry or not. And a Renegade character could cry, so it's not like they could have just decided for you whether your Shepard cries/sulks or not based on your paragon/renegade level.
This just goes to show that Mass Effect is a game. It is programmed, and some scenes had to be automated.
I think people also usually forget that as much as Shepard is a blank slate in the first game, he already has backstory, and you have to build on it. So while it's your Shepard, it's still a soldier no matter what, and his decisions and reactions do not all depend on your thinking or feelings.
One could argue that the three (four) endings kind of restrain your choices and kill your freedom of decision (which is why the fourth ending was implemented), but I will add that sometimes in life, you are left with a number of choices, and you are limited to these.

The Crucible was designed by ancient civilizations. Nobody knew what it would do. So in the end, you find out very late that its functions are not all to your pleasure. And that's fine. That's not something Shepard can control, and that is part of the story. By adding the refusal ending, they let Shepard basically dump the Crucible, letting him not face these choices with which he may not be all that happy about.

The Reapers were beyond powerful. That is also not something that can be controlled.
In a rather discreet way, the game introduces you to this concept. Not everything can be changed, and there is always and inevitable end. Mordin can be saved, sure, but Thane Krios demonstrates Shepard that for some people, it's not possible.
You are not always in power of everything. In the first game, the humans are hardly respected. They have little power, and they struggle for more. Some things can't be helped, some things can. You can try to turn Saren to your side as much as you want, Saren will still ignore you, and at best, will commit suicide to stop hindering you. The Illusive Man does the same. You can't help it.

And that is a lesson to be learned from the Mass Effect franchise. The world is yours to be shaped, but it will always resist your actions in some way. Sometimes you won't be able to do a goddamn thing. In the end, what matters is the effort you put in changing things, and how you managed to steer that doomed boat set to hit an iceberg, in such a way that it is only slightly scratched.
 

Krion_Vark

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Earlybuddy said:
That was corrected. The Catalyst takes its time to explain everything, you get to tell it that its reasoning is flawed, and basically there is more time to ponder on the decisions you are about to make.
I actually remember that happening BEFORE the Extended Cut. I haven't done EC yet either and I remember telling the Catalyst his reasoning was flawed and having him explain everything quite well.
 

Jolly Co-operator

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Loop Stricken said:
So, you seem to have misspelt Racist as Renegade...
I agree. I think this was reasonably well written, but it paints Renegade Shepard more as being an outright evil human supremacist, rather than a ruthless, straight-to-the-point leader. I don't see why the cold Renegade ideals should be inherently tied to the Illusive Man's objectives.
 

sobaka770

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Shax said:
Loop Stricken said:
So, you seem to have misspelt Racist as Renegade...
I agree. I think this was reasonably well written, but it paints Renegade Shepard more as being an outright evil human supremacist, rather than a ruthless, straight-to-the-point leader. I don't see why the cold Renegade ideals should be inherently tied to the Illusive Man's objectives.
Maybe I'm a tad harsh I admit. But I will repeat once again that in both renegade endings in ME1 and 2 you were either a ruthless pro-human protagonist ( the choice to destroy council and de-facto make the humans THE council) or a supporter of violent pro-human ideals (give Collector ship to Cerberus). Both of these choices are depicted as highly Renegade.
 

Earlybuddy

New member
Sep 14, 2010
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Krion_Vark said:
Earlybuddy said:
That was corrected. The Catalyst takes its time to explain everything, you get to tell it that its reasoning is flawed, and basically there is more time to ponder on the decisions you are about to make.
I actually remember that happening BEFORE the Extended Cut. I haven't done EC yet either and I remember telling the Catalyst his reasoning was flawed and having him explain everything quite well.
No, before the extended cuts, you only had two dialogue options with the catalyst, and there weren't a lot.
With the extended cut edition, you get to ask the Catalyst about itself, the Reapers, those who made them and it, as well as why it never attacked the crucible for example and so on and so forth. It adds a lot more dialogue options with the catalyst.
 

Jolly Co-operator

A Heavy Sword
Mar 10, 2012
1,116
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sobaka770 said:
Shax said:
Loop Stricken said:
So, you seem to have misspelt Racist as Renegade...
I agree. I think this was reasonably well written, but it paints Renegade Shepard more as being an outright evil human supremacist, rather than a ruthless, straight-to-the-point leader. I don't see why the cold Renegade ideals should be inherently tied to the Illusive Man's objectives.
Maybe I'm a tad harsh I admit. But I will repeat once again that in both renegade endings in ME1 and 2 you were either a ruthless pro-human protagonist ( the choice to destroy council and de-facto make the humans THE council) or a supporter of violent pro-human ideals (give Collector ship to Cerberus). Both of these choices are depicted as highly Renegade.
You make a good point. I've always interpreted those choices a tad differently though. I always thought they were done as a means to an end (Killing Sovereign and preparing for the invasion, respectively), rather than an active desire for human supremacy.

Either way, I'll trust your judgement on that one over my own, seeing as I never even played the first game, and my playthroughs have been primarily Paragon.

Kudos on your ending by the way. You clearly put quite a bit of thought into it, and it was refreshing to see an alternate ending that wasn't just some variation of "OMG He's Indoctrinated!!!"