Valve haters, vs Valve fanboys. DRM and Why do some people hate Valve and steam?

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Chaos Isaac

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Jun 27, 2013
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I have a problem with Steam, 'cause it's pissy and is always trying to download something and slowing down my connection. I don't like it, but it's what Humble Bumble puts it's games through, so whatever.

I'm also not a huge fan of Valve as I don't find their games... that good. Not bad, but I sure don't go back and play them for fun unlike other games.
 

KungFuJazzHands

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Mar 31, 2013
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Nicholas Chandler-Yates said:
Why would Valve care about providing a DRM service?
Peace of mind for publishers. How many pubs do you think would even bother with Steam if it didn't offer some kind of DRM protection? Anyway, you pretty much answered your own question by stating:

"the only reason they even have DRM is because it makes it easier to get publishers to sign onto steam."

Although that's not entirely accurate -- DRM was omnipresent in Steam from 2004 onward precisely because some douchebag stole Half-Life 2's source code before the game could get a proper release -- it pretty much sums up why Steam still bothers with DRM protection in this day and age.

WHY just WHY would Valve value a DRM service over a storefront that makes them hundreds of millions of dollars?
Steam is a DRM service combined with a storefront client -- it's not like they have to decide on one or the other, therefore your financial concerns are moot. Keep in mind that Steam is a success in part because it offers multiple forms of mechanics with sideline DRM (server hosting, VAC, Steamworks, etc.) for publishers to use.

What POSSIBLE gain could providing DRM for publishers over providing a digital storefront for customers serve Valve...? No offense meant but I smell farts and it sounds like your ass is doing the talking for you with this statement.
You essentially keep asking the same question over and over, despite the fact that you answered it yourself within the first paragraph of your post. It really doesn't look like I'm the one with logic issues here, does it?

I should clarify something here -- when referring to Steam in the context of this discussion, I'm talking about the client version that made its first appearance with Half-Life 2. Before that, Steam was used solely as a content updater for various games, so I really shouldn't be making the claim that "Steam was designed as a DRM client from the beginning". My apologies for any unintended misrepresentation.
 

CardinalPiggles

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From what I've heard some people have had major issues with Steam's Offline mode, as well as customer support. I personally haven't but if I did I guess I would be pretty unhappy too.

Also Greenlight sucks. Ain't nobody got time for that.

ShinyCharizard said:
Well I don't hate Valve but I do hate steam. It has good sales sure but aside from that the program is horrendously bad. Slow to load, ugly UI, constant updates and inconsistent download speeds are my chief complaints with it. Also outside of the sales it's regular prices are absurd.
I'd just like to point out a few things. It's not slow to load for me personally, so maybe you should consider upgrading your HDD or CPU to something a bit faster, the UI can be re skinned by simply downloading a new one (or making one) and dropping it into a folder, the updates can be set to manually update only, and the inconsistent download speeds I completely agree with, it sucks that sometimes for no apparent reason it'll take twice as long as it normally does. Also there's no good reason to buy from Steam outside of a sale.

My personal grievance with Steam is because I'm running at a 1080p resolution everything is tiny when there is loads of space on the screen. I wish it would let me manually scale things or at least be able to magnify like my web browser does. At any time there is about 1/4 of my screen black and empty when everything else is tiny.
 

mezorin

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Generally, my reason for loving Steam is the convenience. I grew up in an area where there was no EBgames and no real convenient way to order in something fast and convenient, so I missed out on a lot of titles. Even to this day with consoles or handheld it can be hard, if not impossible, to track down some games. Piracy in the late 90s and early 2000s was legitimized simply because you could not find a copy of the game you want sitting on a shelf in the store, or order it in easily. Fast foward to today where if you are patient you can get a game pretty cheap on Steam Sale (or Origin/GOG/Amazon) and its an embarassment of riches. Gabe has the right idea that piracy is more of a question of service and market realities rather than cheap skates, and I am sure he has made legitimate software users out of a lot of people through Steam and its service. I feel that for everything Steam demands (ie online verification, license only software model), Valve at least gives something in return to make the whole thing as convenient, smooth, and pleasant as possible. But the core attitude of software as a service, and that service being as pleasant as possible for the customer being the core of Steam along with insane prices is what has kept my business.

Origin's main short comings with me are that EA made many of its flag ship titles (read: Battlefield 3/4 and Mass Effect 3) non steam in order to promote their service, but also that I've had a lot of problems when it comes to how clunky the Origin point of sale system is. I have litterally gone to buy something on sale, get an error or other weird things going on, and after ten minutes of mucking about I simply threw my hands up and said "I give up, EA doesn't want my money". Customers should never get to the point where it is too much of a hassle to buy something in your store, especially pre purchase. If you are trying to convince somebody to buy something, you should make it extremely convenient and pleasant for them to want to pay you for a service even if its harder for the company, its the reason why you do not see body scans and TSA like searches at a super market check out lines. Its better to have a few people get away with shop lifting than treat every legitimate paying customer in your store feel like a terrorist in the hopes of making the bad guys have five whole extra minutes of inconvenience, and its better to spend the extra money to almalgamate all your studios' registration systems and/or pay walls than to make players jump through endless hoops. In EA's defense, Origin has become much more tolerable in the last year and hopefully they are learning some lessons, and if anything having another big boy digital download service should keep both Valve and even console only DL services honest as competition is always a good thing.


TL;DR version: Steam is convenient and often cheap. I like convenient and cheap. If Steam DRM bothers you, there are other services out there (like GOG.com or Humblebundle) to suit your fancy that are competitively priced, so go nuts.
 

Aesir23

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While I don't hate Steam, there are a number of things that annoy me but only one of which is directly applicable to Steam itself.

The one that is actually applicable to Steam is that if I buy a retail copy of a game then I absolutely must have Steam. If I don't want it then I can't install the game. That and it takes forever to install a large game via Steam even if I have the retail copy, it requires some slight hoop jumping to be allowed to install from the disk.

Aside from that, it's not so much annoyance with Steam as with its fanboys. I've seen other companies get torn to shreds for certain things while Steam is somehow exempt from those criticisms when they do the same thing. So essentially just how rabid the fans can be, but there's always a rabid portion of any fanbase.

That said, I do think Steam is a pretty decent service. The sales are an excellent way to get good games if you don't have much money at your disposal and I love some of the free games they've put up on occasion (the section of free games aside). I also like how they give an opening to smaller developers with their Greenlight program. It's given me the opportunity to purchase some excellent indie titles that I probably would not have found otherwise.
 
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Aesir23 said:
While I don't hate Steam, there are a number of things that annoy me but only one of which is directly applicable to Steam itself.

The one that is actually applicable to Steam is that if I buy a retail copy of a game then I absolutely must have Steam. If I don't want it then I can't install the game. That and it takes forever to install a large game via Steam even if I have the retail copy, it requires some slight hoop jumping to be allowed to install from the disk.

Aside from that, it's not so much annoyance with Steam as with its fanboys. I've seen other companies get torn to shreds for certain things while Steam is somehow exempt from those criticisms when they do the same thing. So essentially just how rabid the fans can be, but there's always a rabid portion of any fanbase.

That said, I do think Steam is a pretty decent service. The sales are an excellent way to get good games if you don't have much money at your disposal and I love some of the free games they've put up on occasion (the section of free games aside). I also like how they give an opening to smaller developers with their Greenlight program. It's given me the opportunity to purchase some excellent indie titles that I probably would not have found otherwise.
Yep theres a few problems with steam, refusing to sign a new TOS and banning your account seems ruthless. I would actually love for EA to pull their heads out of their asses and turn Origin into what steam is now, It would result in more competition, which would be better for the consumer in the long run.

then again, Sony-Microsoft competition has resulted in marginal gains for console gamers (xbox 180), and more and more it is obvious that there is a duopoly going on that both companies intend to have more or less similar policies. I would not like to have a console environment with just sony or microsoft... oh god what a dystopia that would be...
used games? NOPE.
cheaper digital? NOPE.
offline play? NOPE.
game sharing? ... you get the idea...

hell microsoft tried to pull all this anti consumer BS *with* competition... who knows what they would try to get away with if sony was out of the picture.

Funny Steam doesn't allow any of these things either (except cheaper digital... thats kinda the point), yet the vast majority of users don't begrudge them for it... go figure. I could give a coupe reasons why but really the thing is, Microsoft wanted to bring all those policies in, something steam had already done, but steam had given something in return, yet Microsoft just wanted the money.