Vanquish: Japan's commentary on Western gaming?

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Phoenixmgs_v1legacy

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Sep 1, 2010
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I just finished Vanquish and it's one hell of game, but I can't help feeling that this is just Shinji Mikami's commentary on Western gaming. It's got every element that a big selling Western game has: big guns, big manly military men acting manly, a cover system, big scale set-pieces, and more.

The dialogue is just ridiculously cliche that it has to have been done on purpose and the 2 main characters seem to be having a gravelly voice competition, several times during the game several squad-mates (including one of the main characters) yells "HOORAH!!!" Speaking of your squad, the squad performs exactly like in a CoD game, they are capable of killing some baddies but you are going to have to do almost all the work. Vanquish has pretty much every space marine cliche you can think of along with the standard super simplistic squad mechanics.

Pretty much every single Western shooter has to have health regen now. Remember way back when The Getaway did it for the first time and everyone thought it was stupid. Well, Vanquish actually takes the unrealistic-ness of health regen and turns it into something that makes logical sense within the game. Pretty much once the main character Sam gets hit enough, his special suit overheats and he has to take cover and wait for the suit to cool off (aka health regen). If he gets hit enough when the suit has overheated, he then dies.

What else do Westerns shooters have to have that aren't FPSs? That's right, a cover system. But Vanquish just has a cover system for that sake of having it because you don't use cover in the normal sense (you know, to play whack-a-mole); cover is there just to jump over it in slow-mo and kill some baddies and to take smoke (I'm not kidding). Also, slow-mo/bullet time is another staple of Western gaming that is recreated in Vanquish, and is perhaps the coolest slow-mo ever seen in gaming. Vanquish takes the Western staples of slow-mo and the cover mechanic and demonstrates how to do it right.

Big name Western shooters love to do sci-fi, and most games try to make some epic sprawling story that usually fails at what it tries to accomplish. What does Vanquish do? It takes us back to the good old 80s. If you not going to be able to pull of some sci-fi epic, then go back and give us a classic America-is-awesome 80s tale with a bit of a twist. In Vanquish, you are killing a bunch of RED Russian robots, and all their weak points are RED; it's like a sci-fi Red Dawn, you gotta love it. The plot is even left open for an obvious sequel like several big Hollywood blockbusters.

What is the West obsessed with when it comes to cut-scenes? Everyone is now trying to do interactive cut-scenes for some reason. What's the point of being able to walk about during some dialogue or story exposition? Isn't a well directed static cut-scene with good cinematography better than just being able to walk about? Vanquish shows you how stupid this trend really is as the game lets you walk about in first person mode to during several intel communications. You can only just walk and it feels extremely limiting because the Sam is wearing an awesome suit that allows him to quickly slide through the battlefield and initiate slow-mo.

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Vanquish pretty much takes all of these standard Western shooter staples and executes all of them with such ease. Then, the game adds in the rocket boosting all over the battlefield and slow-mo to create a truly fun and different experience. The game throws in boss battles and grandiose set-pieces to top it off. In my opinion, Vanquish is basically a big, bombastic message to the West in how to take the standard mechanics of shooters and make something extremely fun, awesome, and unique instead of making the same game over and over.
 

-Seraph-

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May 19, 2008
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I haven't played the game, but I've seen enough of it to get where you are coming from. Seems like an interesting analysis of the game, and hell...you could be on to something. It could also be mere coincidence, but I wouldn't put it past them to make some sort of commentary on the run of the mill shooters that keep coming out as safe bets.
 

SalamanderJoe

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Well the guy did say Vanquish is his take on Gears of War...so yes I guess it is. Mind you so was Quantum Theory but that wasn't really Japan's take on GOW...that was just Gears of War.
 

Aiddon_v1legacy

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Nov 19, 2009
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interesting idea; most of the game's plot is so steeped in cliche it makes me wonder if Mikami didn't do it on purpose. Vanquish may not be genre redefining like RE4 was, but it somehow takes a ton of basic elements of the TPS and makes them fun, exciting, and original unlike most games that DO NOTHING WITH THE TPS. Most of the set pieces in Vanquish are downright inspired and the QTE sequences make the ones in GOW3 look mundane
 

RatRace123

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Dec 1, 2009
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I'm not so sure it's a "commentary" as much as it is a "rip-off".
Not that I'm saying a rip-off can't be good.
 

Axzarious

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Feb 18, 2010
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Well, from what I see, Vanquish looks really impressive compared to what north america has been putting out. Different ideas, a different take, actually DOING SOMETHING DIFFERENT AND ADDING A UNIQUE SPIN OR TWIST ON ALREADY EXISTING THINGS and not something gimmicky.

I'll definately try it.
 

Phoenixmgs_v1legacy

Muse of Fate
Sep 1, 2010
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The Great Googly said:
I dont doubt that Vanquish is a good game but I have a feeling that the OP is majorly biased toward Japanese developers and just wants to be confrontational and claim that Japan can make better games than western devs.

I looked up the reviews for vanquish and while they were good they in averaged around an 8.5-9. nothing to really suggest that Vanquish was genre redefining at all either.

Most of the OP's post makes me believe he was trolling to stir up a debate about Japanese and Western developers.
I'm not trolling for anything; however, it kinda does piss me off that games like MoH, Halo, and CoD will sell more than Vanquish, which is something great and different. I'm one of the millions that played the hell out of CoD4, but after I quit playing it, I was like I'm not going to put a ton of hours into next year's CoD (or other FPS) because it's just the same game, there's no real change or evolution of gameplay. Western shooters are just more of the same almost all the time, and I was mainly aiming at this issue than towards Western games in general. I have the same issue with Fallout: New Vegas, I loved Fallout 3 but New Vegas is just more Fallout 3, not that it's bad, it's just nothing to get really excited for.

To be honest, I've probably enjoyed more Japanese games this gen than Western games, but I have loved Uncharted 2, Mirror's Edge, Bioshock, Batman:AA, Fallout 3, Warhawk, MLB The Show, and a few others. I bought Castlevania with Vanquish and Castlevania is not a Japanese developed game. My most anticipated games this fall were/are Vanquish, Castlevania, Majin and the Forsaken Kingdom, and Enslaved. No Japanese or Western tilt there, I just get excited for new and different games. And, just the other day I watched the Bioshock Infinite trailer for the first time and Oh My God!!! it looks ridiculous good.
 

Iwata

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Feb 25, 2010
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Straying Bullet said:
Iwata said:
Oh look, it's another "japanese games are better WAAAAAH" thread...
Read the comment above you from the OP and act little more mature this time. I think he is rather civilized and proper with his opinion and why he thinks in such manner.
My friend, I read the OP. And he is indeed civilized.

None of that invalidates what I said.

Also, OT, I found the game to be interesting, but the thing is, I was in on the joke from day one. And I don't like that the game is laughing AT us, not WITH us. I'll stick to the otherwise-bland Eat Lead: The Return of Matt Hazzard for my videogaming in-jokes.
 

Pikka Bird

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Mar 9, 2008
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Phoenixmgs said:
Pretty much every single Western shooter has to have health regen now. Remember way back when The Getaway did it for the first time and everyone thought it was stupid.
Halo:CE did it before The Getaway. Granted, it was two-tiered (powered armor on top of actual non-regenerating health), but the mechanic amounted to about the same in the end.

...and I'm sick of it. Even old schoolers like Duke Nukem has regenerating health now. Blech.
 

josemlopes

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I dont think so, I disliked the game because the dialog feels too japanese. The fact that in the demo his teammates are being killed and he is having a smoke
Watch 6:00, that isnt coming from the West, mechs, giant spider robots with multiple rocket launchers and lazers, those annoying screams and the hero is just chilling with a smoke. That could only come from Duke Nukem but the context of the game is completely diferent. Duke Nukem is kind of like a god in his game.
 

shaneriding

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Jul 15, 2010
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"I'm one of the millions that played the hell out of CoD4, but after I quit playing it, I was like I'm not going to put a ton of hours into next year's CoD (or other FPS) because it's just the same game, there's no real change or evolution of gameplay. Western shooters are just more of the same almost all the time, and I was mainly aiming at this issue than towards Western games in general. I have the same issue with Fallout: New Vegas, I loved Fallout 3 but New Vegas is just more Fallout 3, not that it's bad, it's just nothing to get really excited for."

If it isn't broken then why try and fix it? Millions of people do and will play these games because they are fun. Its the typical mass marketed stuff.

If people like different niche games then fine but there is a reason they sell so well, they are clearly fine as they are.
 

aPod

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Jan 14, 2010
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Phoenixmgs said:
I'm not trolling for anything; however, it kinda does piss me off that games like MoH, Halo, and CoD will sell more than Vanquish, which is something great and different. I'm one of the millions that played the hell out of CoD4, but after I quit playing it, I was like I'm not going to put a ton of hours into next year's CoD (or other FPS) because it's just the same game, there's no real change or evolution of gameplay. Western shooters are just more of the same almost all the time, and I was mainly aiming at this issue than towards Western games in general. I have the same issue with Fallout: New Vegas, I loved Fallout 3 but New Vegas is just more Fallout 3, not that it's bad, it's just nothing to get really excited for.
Well, tell me if i am wrong, isn't that exactly what a sequel is? more of the same?

It's illogical to look at any form of media that is a sequel and expect it to be original, the very fact that is is a sequel should dispell any rumors or hopes you had of such nonsense.

I really don't get why you think because a Japanese developer made Vanquish which you basically claimed was typical western blah but it's original because its from a Japanese developer... which judging from you Original Post that really is the only think revolutionary about it. How is that a good thing when you see fit to put down games Like Call of Duty eleventy and Fallout New Vegas?

I'm sorry, i'm just confused.
 

Phoenixmgs_v1legacy

Muse of Fate
Sep 1, 2010
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Pikka Bird said:
Even old schoolers like Duke Nukem has regenerating health now. Blech.
NOOOOOO!!!! not Duke too.

aPod said:
Well, tell me if i am wrong, isn't that exactly what a sequel is? more of the same?

It's illogical to look at any form of media that is a sequel and expect it to be original, the very fact that is is a sequel should dispell any rumors or hopes you had of such nonsense.
The Metal Gear Solid series is probably my favorite game series and each game is very different from one another, lots of gameplay mechanics are added. Hell, MGS2 is one of the best looking games on PS2 and they could've just made a sequel using MGS2's game engine, but they took their time and created a brand new game engine for MGS3. Uncharted 2 is another example (and it's not Japanese either) where a sequel is so much more than just more of the same. I found the first Uncharted very average; I bought it on launch day and I was definitely disappointed. However, Uncharted 2 is so much better than Uncharted it's not even funny. I read the GameInformer preview of the next Batman game and they are really adding a lot to the gameplay, now in combat you can you the spray gel explosive thing in combat. These are examples of how you do a sequel so it's just not more of the same.

aPod said:
I really don't get why you think because a Japanese developer made Vanquish which you basically claimed was typical western blah but it's original because its from a Japanese developer... which judging from you Original Post that really is the only think revolutionary about it. How is that a good thing when you see fit to put down games Like Call of Duty eleventy and Fallout New Vegas?

I'm sorry, i'm just confused.
What other TPS puts you in a suit that can rocket slide all across the battlefield and slow down time? If that's not new, then I don't know what is.
 

Dr. Whiggs

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Jan 12, 2008
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Phoenixmgs said:
The dialogue is just ridiculously cliche that it has to have been done on purpose and the 2 main characters seem to be having a gravelly voice competition,
So it's exactly like Japanese games except the men don't have hormone imbalances?
 

SeriousSquirrel

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Mar 15, 2010
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Would I be suprised if this theory proved true? No. However, I wouldn't be suprised if it's just a studio cashing in on the current crazes. It would be clever though...

EDIT: I've heard nothing but awsome-ness about this game, planning on getting it pretty quick