Vaping. Your Thoughts?
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They aren't smoking, vaporising water laced with nicotine and some flavorings is not the same as burning tobacco soaked in various chemicals.T_ID said:
Water vapor, that thing you breath in all the time. nasty! while the long term effect of nicotine addiction have not really ever been measured since the tar and other horrible toxic shit was killing people before that was a problem, it is not in sufficient concentrations to be poisonous.
So what exactly is your problem with it?
A lot of the products are candy flavored; an acquaintance of mine who is an ED doctor has seen children poisoned from drinking the cartridges. He's also seen a couple cases of poisoning from people falling asleep with them, and having the device leak all over their skin; the nicotine concentration was so high it was like slapping twenty nicotine patches all over their body.
Oh, you can't just say something like that and the not-Queen Michael said:
Ah. I see.MrHide-Patten said:
My thoughts on vaping?
1) If you are not dependent on Nicotine do not start. Vaping is not "cool" it just shows weakness and how so many are addiction prone. It is not a habit you want to start. If you ask the majority of people addicted to nicotine what is the one thing they would change about their life, and usually that answer is to have never started nicotine products. Nicotine is one of the hardest habits to quit, so best advice is to not start.
2 If you are or were a smoker, vaping is not a substitution for quitting, so you should still strive to get yourself nicotine free. It can be a tool to help you quit if you choose to make it be, but ultimately quitting has to be your goal to make that a reality. Bottom line is it only controls you as long as you allow it to, and only you can take back that control.
1) If you are not dependent on Nicotine do not start. Vaping is not "cool" it just shows weakness and how so many are addiction prone. It is not a habit you want to start. If you ask the majority of people addicted to nicotine what is the one thing they would change about their life, and usually that answer is to have never started nicotine products. Nicotine is one of the hardest habits to quit, so best advice is to not start.
2 If you are or were a smoker, vaping is not a substitution for quitting, so you should still strive to get yourself nicotine free. It can be a tool to help you quit if you choose to make it be, but ultimately quitting has to be your goal to make that a reality. Bottom line is it only controls you as long as you allow it to, and only you can take back that control.
Well, I've met plenty of people who were vaping. A couple coworkers of mine started doing it. And frankly, I prefer it over smoking. I hate cigarette smoke, but the vaporizers actually smell rather pleasant. So if only for that, it's preferable.
It may not be healthy, but I figure it has to be better than smoking. So, if someone smokes and wants to switch, or is considering smoking but goes for vaping instead, let them. Who am I to judge?
It may not be healthy, but I figure it has to be better than smoking. So, if someone smokes and wants to switch, or is considering smoking but goes for vaping instead, let them. Who am I to judge?
I think it's not as ideal as not smoking, but since expecting a 100% smoke-free society seems to be impossible at this point, if I had a choice I'd prefer people vaped than smoked regular cigarettes. The secondhand smoke isn't nearly as bad, or at the very least isn't as pungent. And as far as I know, beyond perhaps boxes or wrappers, they don't produce litter like cigarette butts everywhere.
Back in May I moved into a new apartment, and the building was supposed to be completely smoke-free, but the moment I walked into the room it reeked of cigarette smoke. The woman from the leasing office was like "Yeah, it might have been somebody outside smoking, they aren't supposed to smoke that close to the building." Mmhmm, I thought. Surely enough, five days straight with all the windows open and 3 bottles of Fabreeze later the smell hadn't improved a bit. In fact, I began to notice it got distinctly worse in the evening, right between 6 and 7:00. That was when I realized somebody must be smoking IN the building, and it was coming down to my ground-level apartment through a return air shaft.
One night it was so bad I actually had to stay at a hotel. I had a migraine to start with, and that combined with hardly being able to breathe had me at the point of tears. The leasing office didn't want to interrogate their other paying tenants, so with help from my dad we gave them an ultimatum that they were going to have to find another place for me or I was going to go with another company. I hadn't yet unpacked all my stuff, moving again wouldn't be too hard. Finally after four weeks of this they got me another place in the same complex, but in a different building, and that one didn't stink. Even after I moved there was a period of several weeks where I was trying to get all of my stuff to stop stinking. I had to wash all of my sheets and clothes, spray down all of my furniture with Fabreeze, and spray and wipe out my baskets and other miscellaneous containers.
Ugh. I get it, smokers make their own life choices and I'm fine with that. But PLEASE understand how much that shit stinks, and how invasive it is to those who aren't desensitized to it. If you think you can hide it or nobody's going to notice, you are wrong.
Back in May I moved into a new apartment, and the building was supposed to be completely smoke-free, but the moment I walked into the room it reeked of cigarette smoke. The woman from the leasing office was like "Yeah, it might have been somebody outside smoking, they aren't supposed to smoke that close to the building." Mmhmm, I thought. Surely enough, five days straight with all the windows open and 3 bottles of Fabreeze later the smell hadn't improved a bit. In fact, I began to notice it got distinctly worse in the evening, right between 6 and 7:00. That was when I realized somebody must be smoking IN the building, and it was coming down to my ground-level apartment through a return air shaft.
One night it was so bad I actually had to stay at a hotel. I had a migraine to start with, and that combined with hardly being able to breathe had me at the point of tears. The leasing office didn't want to interrogate their other paying tenants, so with help from my dad we gave them an ultimatum that they were going to have to find another place for me or I was going to go with another company. I hadn't yet unpacked all my stuff, moving again wouldn't be too hard. Finally after four weeks of this they got me another place in the same complex, but in a different building, and that one didn't stink. Even after I moved there was a period of several weeks where I was trying to get all of my stuff to stop stinking. I had to wash all of my sheets and clothes, spray down all of my furniture with Fabreeze, and spray and wipe out my baskets and other miscellaneous containers.
Ugh. I get it, smokers make their own life choices and I'm fine with that. But PLEASE understand how much that shit stinks, and how invasive it is to those who aren't desensitized to it. If you think you can hide it or nobody's going to notice, you are wrong.
They aren't smoking. Very very different processes. Still, I can see how it would be invasive and so common courtesy dictates not to do it near people who ask you nicely not to.T_ID said:
What if you really like smoking, but are looking for a healthier, cheaper substitute?Lil devils x said:
The thing is Lilani, the majority of smokers really don't "make their own life choices" as a non addict would, they are instead addicted, a "junkie" that has difficulty functioning normally now without the nicotine. They are controlled by the " need" for nicotine, rather than actually wanting it.Lilani said:
Most people start smoking before their prefrontal cortex was fully developed and were still " wired" for risk taking they would not otherwise do once they had fully matured. The part of their brain that tells them " this is a stupid thing to do and I should not do it" is basically impaired during puberty, and the brain is usually not fully developed until around the age of 26. Most people start smoking before then, and by the time their brain is fully developed, they are already addicted and are no longer making a rational decision themselves, they are instead responding to a craving. They become so dependent, they often feel like they cannot relax, think, or feel like themselves without the nicotine. Many get physically ill without nicotine, withdrawal usually causes extreme anxiety. Commonly they can become nauseous, fatigued, dizzy, depressed, and violent during withdrawal. I do not see that as a matter of " choice" at that point but rather someone who is trapped by addiction.
I honestly do not blame them for smoking, as most were just young and ignorant of how it would affect their lives long term at the time they started, by the time they realize what it is doing to them, they are already trapped by addiction and it is very difficult for those addicted to help themselves. It is not an easy process to quit smoking, and for those who do, it is usually the hardest thing they ever accomplished.
I really think we need more tools and support available to help people quit smoking, and I see vaping as a very good possibility to help them get unhooked from nicotine if utilized properly, however, it also can go the other way and be seen as another tool to get those not addicted to nicotine hooked into a life of nicotine dependency. It all depends on how we choose to utilize this tool.
I have yet to meet anyone with a fully developed prefrontal cortex that actually "liked" smoking, but rather they liked the self treatment for their anxiety. Once you are actually addicted to smoking, it no longer is a " like" it is more like a " need" just to feel normal.Starbird said:
EDIT: Also, I disagree with your first response. People should not have to ask you nicely not to, you should be respectful of their space and go where there are not people close by to vape, just as you would with a cigarette. Same rules would apply, never vape in someones home without asking, do not vape in restaurants, the workplace ect.. Just as I would never spray air freshener on someone without their permission, I would not blow vapors on them either. That would just be extremely rude. LOL
My mother started vaping last year after 40 years of smoking. And this year she quit vaping too. She's free! So that can happen.
False. I'm pro-vaping and pro-people-doing-whatever-they-want but nicotine isn't a vitamin.Unkillable Cat said:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertglatter/2014/03/24/the-real-danger-of-liquid-nicotine/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicotine (Note in particular entry on 'toxicology')
In medical circles it's known to constrict blood vessels (last thing a man wants for his equipment, basically, to put it bluntly - and last thing man OR woman wants happening to their vessels anywhere) and raise blood pressure. Again, not exactly vitamin C.
However, it's relatively less harmful compared to smoking the burning tobacco. It's basically the same argument medical marijuana people have in Washington, Colorado, and California. We hear this all the time. Burning plant matter in your lungs = not good. Vaporized THC/CBD compounds; potentially medically helpful and needs more testing - certainly less harmful than coating your lungs with tar.
I heard a TV argument about this. I'm pretty much on the same side of people who say "If you don't smoke, don't start vaping, if you smoke, it's the lesser evil." I also really can't stand the smell of cigarettes so it smells nicer to me if someone is "vaping" instead.
That said, there were also people who said they have used it to get off their nicotine addiction by adding smaller and smaller amounts to the liqour over time and then stopping altogether, using "vaping" to stop. Anyone who "vapes" has any thoughts on this/tried it/wants to try it? Seriously interested!
That said, there were also people who said they have used it to get off their nicotine addiction by adding smaller and smaller amounts to the liqour over time and then stopping altogether, using "vaping" to stop. Anyone who "vapes" has any thoughts on this/tried it/wants to try it? Seriously interested!
Honestly, I don't really have a problem with it, mostly due to it not having the stench that smoking cigarettes does. It's also not as bad for the body, so there's that as well. However, I do see the potential danger of non-smokers being more inclined to try it out for these reasons, even though it is still ultimately harmful.
So yeah, it's a terrific alternative for smokers out there, but non-smokers should still stay away.
So yeah, it's a terrific alternative for smokers out there, but non-smokers should still stay away.
Gives a mentally unhealthy amount of thc... oh you mean cigrets vapers!
Eh I got one years ago, not so much to quit smoking, but so I could have placebo smoke in my parents house. It is supposedly healthier, but still carcinogenic smoke is never healthy. I quit for around a year, I had already thrown out the vaporizer before hand, I kept a piece of round pressure treated wood for placebo a few weeks, gave me as much enjoyment as the placebo vape honestly.
Eh I got one years ago, not so much to quit smoking, but so I could have placebo smoke in my parents house. It is supposedly healthier, but still carcinogenic smoke is never healthy. I quit for around a year, I had already thrown out the vaporizer before hand, I kept a piece of round pressure treated wood for placebo a few weeks, gave me as much enjoyment as the placebo vape honestly.
I wonder how wide-spread the nicotine free e-cigarettes are? The ones we have at my 7-Eleven are essentially just scented water, no nicotine at all...
I'd prefer people use the vapour cigarettes, they smell better for one, for two they're healthier. By a lot. It would probably be better not to start at all, though.
I'd prefer people use the vapour cigarettes, they smell better for one, for two they're healthier. By a lot. It would probably be better not to start at all, though.
Well, if all else fails, I can always give being a hireling in England a shot.Unkillable Cat said:
I'm always outdoor when I smoke either way, which makes it less of an ashy faff in general. Vaping would be useful during the harder parts of winter, though.Starbird said:
Some people are dreadfully inconsiderate when it comes to smoking boundries. It's not particularly hard to walk a few paces away into a bit of moving air, or so I thought.Lilani said:
Even worse are the people that flick their cigarette butts out the window. Bonus wanker-points if they're lit.
That's about my only issue with vaping, the dicks who think it's a good idea to humidify nicotine inside small rooms or near crowds. I admit I think it looks quite stupid but there's no harm in that, but when I'm working and stuck in a small area and someone wants to make the place smell like fake bubble gum with his steam punk styled e-cigg, well they can go to hell.Muspelheim said:
It might be less destructive to ones health, and easier to quit, but I still have some issues:
I've seen vaping proponents talk/act like vaping eliminates the second hand smoke issue because "it's not smoke, it's just water vapor". Yeah... water vapor with nicotine in it. It may not be as stinky (though as others have pointed out, this is very dependent on vape oil flavor and thus isn't always the case) or carcinogenic, but you're still dosing the people around you without their permission to some degree. I haven't seen any data yet addressing second hand vapor in terms of nicotine transmission.
The way companies are exploiting the lack of regulation in their marketing is skeevy as hell.
The increased complexity of dosing compared to lighting a cigarette as well as the special vaporizer device would make them even more prone to ritualization and fetishization that cigarettes in the long run. Cigarettes have had a long time to establish themselves culturally, so they're still way way ahead of vaping in this regard, but anyone who's known serious potheads, drinkers or other addicts knows the role ritualization/fetishization of process and paraphernalia plays. We've already got a market in cosmetic hardware customization (as well as mass manufactured cosmetically themed vaporizers) springing up to feed this. I feel like if this ball is allowed to really get rolling culturally, it can easily cancel out the alleged easier quitting process vaping is supposed to have. In fact I wonder how much of vaping being easier to quit actually is down to it not yet having caught up with the amount of supporting behavioral/cultural baggage cigarettes have.
I've seen vaping proponents talk/act like vaping eliminates the second hand smoke issue because "it's not smoke, it's just water vapor". Yeah... water vapor with nicotine in it. It may not be as stinky (though as others have pointed out, this is very dependent on vape oil flavor and thus isn't always the case) or carcinogenic, but you're still dosing the people around you without their permission to some degree. I haven't seen any data yet addressing second hand vapor in terms of nicotine transmission.
The way companies are exploiting the lack of regulation in their marketing is skeevy as hell.
The increased complexity of dosing compared to lighting a cigarette as well as the special vaporizer device would make them even more prone to ritualization and fetishization that cigarettes in the long run. Cigarettes have had a long time to establish themselves culturally, so they're still way way ahead of vaping in this regard, but anyone who's known serious potheads, drinkers or other addicts knows the role ritualization/fetishization of process and paraphernalia plays. We've already got a market in cosmetic hardware customization (as well as mass manufactured cosmetically themed vaporizers) springing up to feed this. I feel like if this ball is allowed to really get rolling culturally, it can easily cancel out the alleged easier quitting process vaping is supposed to have. In fact I wonder how much of vaping being easier to quit actually is down to it not yet having caught up with the amount of supporting behavioral/cultural baggage cigarettes have.