We probably will. But if Osama is still alive and Obama lied about it, it will be a catastrophe.MajorDolphin said:
What evidence is there that Osama is dead?
- Thread starter retterkl
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Basically this. If they are lying and he sends out another tape proclaiming his not-deadness(?) then everyone involved in the lie is going to look like a complete moron and they will never be re-elected/fired.Shepard said:
I am pretty sure that he is dead, that part they did not fake. A lot of things here does however seem to have fallen into place very, very conveniently, the timing especially, with the run up for next years election beginning and polls not looking very good for Obama at the moment. IF they did not kill him now, they have probably come to the same conclusion many others in the world have, Bin Laden died a while ago, either in some of the early cave bombings or through some other, non-assassinational mean. So to still be able to cash in on the "bin Laden is dead" fame and glory, they make an assault, show a picture of what could be a dead bin Laden, and quickly do away with opportunities to confirm that it is him (they have already buried him AT SEA, allegedly due to Muslim traditions of fast burials and a belief that no country would want his body.).
In conclusion, man is in all likelihood dead (and good riddance I feel) but this might have been staged to avoid anti-climax of the "war on terror".
In conclusion, man is in all likelihood dead (and good riddance I feel) but this might have been staged to avoid anti-climax of the "war on terror".
I don't see any point in the US lying about this.
The whole situation over there has been pretty shaky ever since it started. A lot of people don't want troops over there, America has gotten multiple countries involved and each one has had men and women sacrificed in the pursuit to neutralise terrorism and for what? There's been very little to show for it; well, except for the countless stories of how it's getting worse, civilians getting shot up, Al-Qaeda using more dangerous explosives and giving the west some funny looks, that American kill squad and terrorist attacks in the west outside of 9/11.
If America were to lie about something like this would only lead to more mistrust and murder.
Though if I were Al-Qaeda I'd be getting a convincing double ready and setting up that recorder.
The whole situation over there has been pretty shaky ever since it started. A lot of people don't want troops over there, America has gotten multiple countries involved and each one has had men and women sacrificed in the pursuit to neutralise terrorism and for what? There's been very little to show for it; well, except for the countless stories of how it's getting worse, civilians getting shot up, Al-Qaeda using more dangerous explosives and giving the west some funny looks, that American kill squad and terrorist attacks in the west outside of 9/11.
If America were to lie about something like this would only lead to more mistrust and murder.
Though if I were Al-Qaeda I'd be getting a convincing double ready and setting up that recorder.
Well... to be fair if he is still alive and we faked his death he might not want to reveal the fact that he is still alive. If we believe that he is dead then the manhunt for him is over, meaning that Osama might be able to live out the rest of his days in relative safety. Although when one considers Osama's philosophy of martyrdom this becomes unlikely.Kortney said:
Also note that this news is quite recent. He may yet, if he's still alive, release such a video.
More on Topic: It's very probable that Osama is truly dead. He may have been killed just recently, or it might've been staged as per proper theatrics as Kakujin suggests.
Well I think it's a harder thing to believe that for a decade with a $25m bounty on his head that no one close to Osama turned on him or even reported him.
I am not questioning his death, personally I thought he was dead a long time ago, which is why i'm questioning the reliability of this whole arguement of the American's killing him in a firefight.
All i'm trying to say is that perhaps, rather then the US storming the house he was hiding in, one of his servants or a team of Al-Qaeda rogues turned on him, rang up the Americans and told them they'd killed him, then they get given $25m, amnesty, relocation and a package of silence. That would probably be the best way to get out of being a terrorist right? Kill the US's #1 most wanted and then allow the US military and Obama administration to take the glory.
+ i'm trolling
I am not questioning his death, personally I thought he was dead a long time ago, which is why i'm questioning the reliability of this whole arguement of the American's killing him in a firefight.
All i'm trying to say is that perhaps, rather then the US storming the house he was hiding in, one of his servants or a team of Al-Qaeda rogues turned on him, rang up the Americans and told them they'd killed him, then they get given $25m, amnesty, relocation and a package of silence. That would probably be the best way to get out of being a terrorist right? Kill the US's #1 most wanted and then allow the US military and Obama administration to take the glory.
+ i'm trolling
I'm willing to believe because if Bin Laden were to come forward with another video it would be political suicide for Obama.
My god what do you want?Them to save off his beard and mail it to you?retterkl said:
OT: theres really no point in lying to us, I believe them, and if they are lying, well.......I'll be very upset.
even if they did kill him, he was known to be suffering from a long term illness, which was degenarate and would have killed him over time.
and if we did kill him, that's just ruining the lives of the electorates as we now have to live in fear that al queda will retaliate with another 9/11 or 07/07 attack.
as a briton im inclined to blame the US governmeent for this whole al queda problem, but the UK government is just as much to blame. this whole war started in the first gulf war when we ignored the plea by Osama Bin Laden for it not to be settled by western influence, we ignored him, led to him exiling himself and proclaiming a war on the western culture. then the UK and USA then sold arms to a number of terrorist cells, who joined the Al Queda.
his death means nothing by all means, he is just a figurehead, a replacable member of the side, the true leaders are most likely hidden. Plus his death will be labelled matyrdom and increase recruitment in the future.
and if we did kill him, that's just ruining the lives of the electorates as we now have to live in fear that al queda will retaliate with another 9/11 or 07/07 attack.
as a briton im inclined to blame the US governmeent for this whole al queda problem, but the UK government is just as much to blame. this whole war started in the first gulf war when we ignored the plea by Osama Bin Laden for it not to be settled by western influence, we ignored him, led to him exiling himself and proclaiming a war on the western culture. then the UK and USA then sold arms to a number of terrorist cells, who joined the Al Queda.
his death means nothing by all means, he is just a figurehead, a replacable member of the side, the true leaders are most likely hidden. Plus his death will be labelled matyrdom and increase recruitment in the future.
The UK didn't do anything here... Saudi Arabia turned down Osama's offer to allow his Mujahideen to defend northern Saudi from the Iraqis as they asked the US for military support. This lead to Osama publically speaking against the king for allowing infidels on sacred soil and ended with his exileship to Sudan.br1dg3 said:
The arms had already been sold by this time anyway. The Mujahideen were responsible for defending Afghanistan in the late 80s against the Soviets, and if you've seen Charlie Wilson's War then this is who all the American weaponry went to.
cos it'd be stupid for them to tell the world he's dead when he can pop up at any time and go "sup, bitches... still alive" to the shame and ridicule of the entire US government
It's fake.El Poncho said:
Someone posted this picture on their Facebook, apparently it's Osama's dead corpse.
Look at the bottom of the picture and top part. They don't match in skin color.
It's already confirmed to be fake by the media.
This is kinda the opposite of what I'm arguing with someone about.
He's saying Osama has been dead since 2002, that there was a "leak" a couple of months ago, and the U.S.A quickly faked his death to distract from the leak.
When I pointed out that they had nothing to gain, and we've been ignoring these info leaks since at least 2004, he just responded with why wouldn't they finally tell us he's dead? Hardly satisfactory, but anyway.
These cover up conspiracies never really make sense to me. Rarely is there even anything to gain from them, and has anyone stopped to think just how hard it would be to keep this quiet? If Osama's alive we'll see a video in a couple of days of him saying "I didn't die one week from yesterday" or whatever. Besides that, why lie about it?
He's saying Osama has been dead since 2002, that there was a "leak" a couple of months ago, and the U.S.A quickly faked his death to distract from the leak.
When I pointed out that they had nothing to gain, and we've been ignoring these info leaks since at least 2004, he just responded with why wouldn't they finally tell us he's dead? Hardly satisfactory, but anyway.
These cover up conspiracies never really make sense to me. Rarely is there even anything to gain from them, and has anyone stopped to think just how hard it would be to keep this quiet? If Osama's alive we'll see a video in a couple of days of him saying "I didn't die one week from yesterday" or whatever. Besides that, why lie about it?
A smart and crafty terrorist could just go and have an Osama double appear on TV and say "F you, I'm alive."
Seriously, i guess we can only take their word for it. It's not like they'll put his head on a pike and show it off at public squares a-la dark ages.
Seriously, i guess we can only take their word for it. It's not like they'll put his head on a pike and show it off at public squares a-la dark ages.