What's with "Iron Sights" in today's games?

[moretimethansense]

I find it ironic that someone who claims to use firearms IRL thinks that aiming from the hip with crosshairs is acceptable. I don't find that to be the case at all. There is only one way I fire my weapons -- front sight on the target. I don't hold two handguns in each hand like a jackass, wasting ammunition. I don't "shoot from the hip" either. That clown business belongs in movies.

Who the hell is taking about shooting from the hip or using two guns? I'm talking about a bloody video game, sighting in a target in real life is vastly different then a video game, breathing for example matters, the only time I ever saw breathing in a video game I wanted to hunt down the developers with a rusty butter knife to really make it hurt, judging the wind, and humans (or in my case animals) don't bounce around like humming birds on meth.

And the sights in the games I've see don't work the same as they do in real bloody life anyway, they are basically cross hairs with a different more annoying skin, I'd love to see a game that tried to get the sights "real", players would murder the developers, hell I've yet to see a scope{/b] done correctly in a video game, you do know they don't work as point and click right?

You do know wind that affects the bullet is quite impossible to implement with our technology right? Wind, at least from what i have seen, is merely decoration used for levels. It has almost no tangible effect with bullets.

Sorry but have to correct you there, wind is not "impossible to implement with our technology" there are games that have done it two examples being:
Sniper Elite
Sniper: Ghost Warrior

Both of these games have implemented both wind and gravity in to their gameplay, it is debatable how well they've done it, but they have done it.

Really? Wonder why they never mentioned that in any reviews or anything. You sure it was actual dynamic wind and not an imitation to actual dynamic wind?

If you mean did the wind chang direction and strength during the course of the level, then no, but I don't think that it's a lack of technology that stops them putting it in.

In COD4 there is a sniping mission where you have to compensate for the changing wind, it changes completely and randomly several times during a twenty second sniping sequence, it isn't realistic it's just annoying.
If they implemented dynamic wind many (not me) would complain as the shot they compensated for misses as the wind changed strength, also the wind doesn't change direction dramatically all that often so if they did a truly realistic version of the wind the only difference would be a slight ebb and flow during missions, in the end making an engine to simulate wind for a game would be more effort than many developers are willing to put in to a mechanic that would only have niche appeal anyway.

on a console shooter yes it would go unnoticed but a sandbox PC game would be a hit. It would be the wind equivalent to crysis. However it may lag like dynamic water does so that may be a limiting factor. A dynamic mechanic on a linear level would be a waste but not in a sandbox environment.

One problem with that though, How many sandbox shooters can you name?

 

[minimacker]

Personally, I like ironsights.
What I DON'T like is when a game forces it down your throat.

"Oh, you don't want to use our mechanic of blurry darkness? Well, enjoy having your weapon spread all over the screen, buddy."

You can notice this in Bad Company 2, where firing without using the ironsight mechanic causes your gun to become a saltpeter musket. What developers should do is to keep the same accuracy, but make the weapon sway more. Invisible Golden Eye free-aim style.

Basically, if your crosshair is a dot, then have the game add another invisible weapon crosshair that sways in a continuous motion AROUND YOUR crosshair. Like you see when having a scope in many games, that the view sways? Well, instead of having the whole screen sway, just have an invisible crosshair sway, and not your screen.

 

[moretimethansense]

Personally, I like ironsights.
What I DON'T like is when a game forces it down your throat.

"Oh, you don't want to use our mechanic of blurry darkness? Well, enjoy having your weapon spread all over the screen, buddy."

You can notice this in Bad Company 2, where firing without using the ironsight mechanic causes your gun to become a saltpeter musket. What developers should do is to keep the same accuracy, but make the weapon sway more. Invisible Golden Eye free-aim style.

Basically, if your crosshair is a dot, then have the game add another invisible weapon crosshair that sways in a continuous motion AROUND YOUR crosshair. Like you see when having a scope in many games, that the view sways? Well, instead of having the whole screen sway, just have an invisible crosshair sway, and not your screen.

I kinda like this idea, perhaps make it sway more dramatically if you are standing and/or moving?

 

[Crazycat690]

If VALVe puts in iron sights in the next Half Life(whenever it comes out, if ever) I will be a very unhappy little boy.

Bioshock also had mercy on us and killed ironsights.

But... Bioshock did have iron sight =) However it wasn't that important.

 

[ultrachicken]

Developers put iron sights in games because the majority of their customers like them. People who've never fired a gun before won't care if it isn't actually realistic, as long as it seems realistic.

Personally, I like ironsights.
What I DON'T like is when a game forces it down your throat.

You can notice this in Bad Company 2, where firing without using the ironsight mechanic causes your gun to become a saltpeter musket.

Actually, I find the bullet spray caused by firing from the hip to be useful, especially when using an LMG.

 

[Smooth Operator]

You do know wind that affects the bullet is quite impossible to implement with our technology right? Wind, at least from what i have seen, is merely decoration used for levels. It has almost no tangible effect with bullets.

Mate you are way off the mark there, adding a wind or gravity factor to the trajectory is the simplest thing possible, and the calculations for all that are millions of times less taxing then model animations.
Games simply don't have any of that because it's far less fun.

Yes adding a factor to a trajectory is easy, but not an actual dynamic wind like i am talking about. I never seen an actual dynamic wind that changed realistically. I seen a SET wind strength for levels but not anything that changed realistically and dynamically. At least not "true" dynamic as some are mere imitations of a dynamic wind.

You do understand that true wind can only exist in the real world?
Everything else is a mere imitation because you cannot present the real world with infinite accuracy in numbers, no matter how advanced the tech is.
So you are left with either a particle simulation, calculating billions of atom/molecule collisions to work out the bullet moved 3° off course, bit unpractical in my mind, and still only imitated.
Or you simply use a vector(or several of them) to dictate wind direction, simple to use, simple to implement, and even more simple making it dynamic, and when the direction and strength are imaginary it works just as well as the real world.

 

[Knusper]

I personally prefer it when it is just iron sights. When I can, I get rid of the crosshair, unless there is no iron sights, then I wouldn't have anything to aim with.

 

[Denamic]

This must be one of the most pointless discussion threads I've seen in a while.
You're arguing with opinions.
An opinion makes a horrible argument.

 

[tkioz]

Not to mention their mere presence suggests that you'll never shoot straight unless you are using them. This is one reason why I hated the Wii Goldeneye- the original was as much about running and gunning freely as Unreal Tournament was about headshotting a dude while leaping between skyscrapers in low gravity. Try THAT with Ironsights. Plus it makes every insane kill replay look essentially the same over much of the screen.

What ever happened to games like that? Ever since FPS games went mad with realism I've missed running around with twin pistols or a minigun jumping between buildings while blowing away anything in my path

Yes they don't make enough games like halo anymore.

Wait...what?

Indeed what? Halo is nothing like what I'm talking about, it's about one step above the current glut of shooters, but what I'm really talking about is games like UT where the action is frantic and fast paced, no running for 5mins to get an objective, no missing at 2 inches because of the bullet spread.

Jumping from one side of a space ship to another while firing a plasma cannon that turns your enemy to a skeleton, now that is fun.

Granted Bad Company 2 isn't that bad, and I'm having fun with it, but I give it a few more days before I get bored with it and uninstall it, after that it'll likely languish on my list of not-installed steam games like so many other games I've been gifted or grabbed when there on sale.

 

[Leadfinger]

Iron sights never run out of batteries.

 

[mParadox]

sniped

That's the point. Plus, in a game like Bioshock iron-sight were quite irrelevant. Always use the wrench.