When do you "Forgive" a game for its negatives?

[Raggedstar]

I can write 5 pages on MSWord worth complaining about Jak 2 yet have almost nothing bad to say about the first (despite liking the sequel more). Portal I can't find any flaws with yet it doesn't make my Top 5 games, and my Top 5 (Jak 2 included there) has a lot of flawed games that I love. I guess I'll stick with the "I forgive it if it's fun/engaging" camp.

I mean, Shadow Of The Colossus is a beloved game and regarded as a classic and benchmark for art in video games. However, the controls are ass, the original had nearly unplayable frame rate issues at times, the camera-man has a grudge against you, the two lion colossi can stun-lock you to death, hitting weakpoints can be unreasonably frustrating (mostly the PS3 version), and there is the odd glitch here and there. Yet people still love it for story, uniqueness, artistic direction, colossi designs, among other notable feats the game made. Some people are hung up on the flaws of the game (because let's admit that they can be hard to get used to), so it's obviously a personal taste with what can be "forgiven" or looked past.

 

[soren7550]

Perfect Dark Zero, since I love Joanna Dark (this has more to do with the novels and comics than the game, but still), and the multiplayer is pretty damn fun when you're playing with people, especially when you have a huge killstreak, as the announcer goes apeshit.

Also, I look sexy as fuck cosplaying as Joanna, so she gets some additional love for that as well:

This is the sexiest I will ever be.

 

[The]

Playstation All-Stars. The overall game is lacking and feels like it still had a lot of unused potential, but the combat is solid enough and it feels good to play as a Playstation character after years of playing Smash Bros.

 

[lunavixen]

Mirror's Edge I guess.

The level design was overly linear (and that's coming from someone who has nothing against linear games, but in a game where the central mechanics involve movement, you need some wriggle room), the combat was kinda bad and the story sucked seven flavours of arse.

However, I "forgive" it simply because those few sequences where you're hurtling along, making jumps, vaulting obstacles and running along walls while excessively trigger happy law enforcement officers shoot at you were fucking intense. Also, the combat could be pretty fun. Goomba-stomping SWAT cops never gets old.

Oh, and it looked awfully pretty.

Mirror's Edge for exactly the same reasons as you. Though the combat is meant to be unweildy, you're a runner not a powerhouse and the guys shooting at you are trained.

Uhhh, I would also say Bayonetta, the story has more plot holes that Jarlsberg cheese, but I like it and I like Bayonetta as a character (and the others as well becuase they are really well fleshed out (pun not intended)), the combat is difficult without becoming inaccessible on the lower difficulty settings.

I could list a few more but I can't be bothered, sufficed to say, if a game has enough good points that overshadow the bad ones then I can forgive the game for the bad things

 

[Kal-Adam]

I am willing to forgive a games flaws when I still enjoy the games when these flaws come up.

 

[lacktheknack]

"Am I having fun?"

Yes: YAY!

No: Blegh, I don't wanna play anymore.

I've disliked masterpieces because of a very few flaws (Bioshock's kill-everything gameplay, for instance) and forgiven tragic mistakes ("The Experiment"s horrific pacing and painfully slow protagonist) based entirely on whether or not I was enjoying myself.

 

[lacktheknack]

Depends on the flaws as others have said. I have personally given up on Bethesda games for that reason. It's only so many times you can forgive random freezes before you put the game down and say, "Enough is enough." I beat Fallout 3 and New Vegas. I did not and do not want to play Skyrim for that reason.

Oh, you reminded me of another reason I can forgive flaws: If the modding community fixes them.

See: Bethesda Unofficial Bug Patches.

 

[LAGG]

I've disliked masterpieces because of a very few flaws (Bioshock's kill-everything gameplay, for instance) and forgiven tragic mistakes ("The Experiment"s horrific pacing and painfully slow protagonist) based entirely on whether or not I was enjoying myself.

You can bypass quite a bit amount of the wanderer enemies in Bioshock if you want. Sure there's no knock-ouw ability so you have to not be spotted or they'll chase you to hell and beyond. I think even in the second game too, only Infinite is a Horde-Mode spin-off.

 

[lacktheknack]

I've disliked masterpieces because of a very few flaws (Bioshock's kill-everything gameplay, for instance) and forgiven tragic mistakes ("The Experiment"s horrific pacing and painfully slow protagonist) based entirely on whether or not I was enjoying myself.

You can bypass quite a bit amount of the wanderer enemies in Bioshock if you want. Sure there's no knock-ouw ability so you have to not be spotted or they'll chase you to hell and beyond. I think even in the second game too, only Infinite is a Horde-Mode spin-off.

Not if you want to explore and find all the collectibles. It's not worth keeping them alive, they kept chasing me down.

 

[AuronFtw]

Honestly? Never. Any game with negatives always has them; they always get on my tits, and I can't ever ignore them, nor do I try to. I raided in WoW for close to 4 years, but despite that I was far from a Blizzard fanboi: I had gripes about many, many things and I filed easily over a thousand in-game tickets for bugs, exploits and various other broken mechanics. I still "enjoyed" it, but I never forgave a bug; IMO it's a sign of failure (or at least a huge blemish) if a company doesn't exert any effort to fix them.

Games *have* bugs, especially massive ones like MMOs or stuff like Elder Scrolls. But I hate when developers just seem to give no fucks. Bethesda is particularly guilty of this shit; when the longest page on the wiki for your video game is "list of bugs in ," you have fucking failed as a developer and you should be seriously ashamed and go home to reevaluate what the fuck you're doing wrong.



On the other hand, companies that go out of their way to push bugfixes through typically earn my respect. Blizzard is pretty good at it, as is Trion (creators of Rift MMO). As soon as a major bug pops up, those companies jump on them as quickly as a giant company can and get that shit fixed. Rift had an early one I remember where you could fall through the fountain in one of the towns, just glitch through the floor and fall forever. It was reported very very late friday, and the patch for it came through midday saturday. I was impressed as hell; that's some dedicated bug-fixing.

Anyway, tldr: I never forgive bugs. Even the greatest of games are often very bug-ridden (hurr ocarina of time), so while I am able to play them and enjoy them, the bugs are always there and they always annoy me. There's a point when hunting and fixing individual bugs becomes cost prohibitive for the devs, but many companies don't seem to exert any effort at all. Games are buggy pieces of shit for the most part :/

 

[GladiatorUA]

I can forgive most of the things that are not primary features and stuff I don't really want to experience. If I can avoid the annoying stuff it doesn't really matter.
Mediocre things can also be ignored if the game doesn't focus on them. Deadpool is a good example. Mediocre combat, repetitive enemies and jokes. But the game has enough variety and is short enough, which make combat and enemies not that bad. But it severely damages replayability.

 

[Ace Morologist]

So, do you have a game that it have many negative things to talk about, but you forgive it to be a good game for your taste?

Mass Effect 3. It just had that one bad thing I didn't like -- the ending -- but I like the rest so much that I'm inclined to forgive what I don't like. Same with Mass Effect 2, really.

To the general question posed by the title, it's the point at which you realize you're enjoying yourself despite the game's faults. That's when I forgive the faults and enjoy the game. (Ultra-tough-guy/grim-and-gritty Bionic Commando for the 360, I'm looking at you.)

--Morology!

 

[Mikeyfell]

You don't. You can't.
You judge a game (Or anything) as a collection of negatives and positives and decide whether or not you like it from there.

 

[Diddy_Mao]

Brutal Legend is a good example of my tendency to love a game based entirely on how damn entertaining the concept is regardless of how flawed the execution might have been.

The art design, story, voice acting and over all conceptof that game is so much fun that I will gladly play it despite the less than thrilling combat mechanics and wonky RTS game play.

 

[Longstreet]

When i am having fun.

It isn't that hard, it can have the worst control ever created, the worst story and the worst graphics. But if i am having fun with it, i do not care.

 

[SweetShark]

When i am having fun.

It isn't that hard, it can have the worst control ever created, the worst story and the worst graphics. But if i am having fun with it, i do not care.

I don't think you can enjoy the gameplay of the game "Deadly Premonition" [for me anyway].
The most people like the game because of the story and the unique characters.
I am 90% sure that most people played this game, suffered a "little" just to see the next part of the story....

And yes, I know what do you mean, but again, from my example, this is a Videogame. You should had fun with the gameplay of the game, not only for the story...

But I digress.....because I love games like "Saya No Uta" or "Juniper's Knot"...
At least the "gameplay" of these game wasn't unpleasant for me.

 

[Da Orky Man]

Mirror's Edge I guess.

The level design was overly linear (and that's coming from someone who has nothing against linear games, but in a game where the central mechanics involve movement, you need some wriggle room), the combat was kinda bad and the story sucked seven flavours of arse.

However, I "forgive" it simply because those few sequences where you're hurtling along, making jumps, vaulting obstacles and running along walls while excessively trigger happy law enforcement officers shoot at you were fucking intense. Also, the combat could be pretty fun. Goomba-stomping SWAT cops never gets old.

Oh, and it looked awfully pretty.

This.

Despite the numerous problems, ranging from too much glare to a story that was almost worth not putting in, those moments when you're in the zone, dodging through a hail of bullets and effortlessly gliding over any and all obstacles make it worth it. I have great hopes for Mirror's Edge 2.

 

[D-Class 198482]

When a game is too damn fun for me to hate it. Like, SR3 got rid of a LOT of location variety, but GOD DAMN I GOT TO BE A TRON DRAGON AND SKYDIVE IN A TANK AND MAKE A CHEESY 50'S SCI-FI MOVIE AND USE SUPER POWERS GIVEN TO ME BY AN ENERGY DRINK TO RESCUE A HULK VERSION OF JOHNNY GAT...

*huff huff huff*

Also, I can't hate a sandbox game that gives me an RC gun that lets me hijack cars remotely and run over pedestrians without getting a wanted level.

I like how to some people the over-the-top-ness is a bad thing, and to some people the over-the-top-ness is a glorious thing that needs to be praised.
I fully agree with you. SR3's crazy-ness is a glorious thing.

OT: I guess I gotta whip Mon-Musu Quest out again...
The game's a porn game. It's heavily based on porn, lots and lots of it.
But the story.
The characters.
The gameplay the hghbsndghbsgjh.
The porn bit would be a negative for most people, but...
THE STORY
THE CHARACTERS
THE GAMEPLAY
SAHGSAHBSDGYUH.

 

[SweetShark]

When a game is too damn fun for me to hate it. Like, SR3 got rid of a LOT of location variety, but GOD DAMN I GOT TO BE A TRON DRAGON AND SKYDIVE IN A TANK AND MAKE A CHEESY 50'S SCI-FI MOVIE AND USE SUPER POWERS GIVEN TO ME BY AN ENERGY DRINK TO RESCUE A HULK VERSION OF JOHNNY GAT...

*huff huff huff*

Also, I can't hate a sandbox game that gives me an RC gun that lets me hijack cars remotely and run over pedestrians without getting a wanted level.

I like how to some people the over-the-top-ness is a bad thing, and to some people the over-the-top-ness is a glorious thing that needs to be praised.
I fully agree with you. SR3's crazy-ness is a glorious thing.

OT: I guess I gotta whip Mon-Musu Quest out again...
The game's a porn game. It's heavily based on porn, lots and lots of it.
But the story.
The characters.
The gameplay the hghbsndghbsgjh.
The porn bit would be a negative for most people, but...
THE STORY
THE CHARACTERS
THE GAMEPLAY
SAHGSAHBSDGYUH.

Funny for saying this game, but I had plans to play it after I finish Tsukihime.
However there are also other two games. Do you suggest to start from the beggining?

 

[Yopaz]

Quite simple. If the game has problems that wont make the game any less enjoyable then I am willing to overlook them or maybe not even notice them.

I don't rant about those small things, I don't care about those small things as long as the big things are good. There's enough needless negativity on the internet over things we don't love I see no reason to get needlessly negative over the things I love in addition.