When Math suddenly makes sense

[Brian Tams]

I hated math when I was in school. Hated. It. I was awful at it, never understanding even the most basic premise, and barely scraped out a C in High School just so I could graduate. It was a never ending nightmare.

Now, I'm in College and taking College Algebra, and for some fucking reason Math has become easy. I don't know what the hell happened, but I'm breezing through this class. We've had three tests so far, and I've aced them all, something that has never happened for me. I don't know if its because I have a Professor that gives a damn about teaching her students, or if some mysterious puzzle piece has found its rightful place in my brain, or if its something else. But I find myself actually... liking math. Its a weird emotion for me.

I entered college to pursue a journalism degree, but my Professor is trying to convince me to switch to Math, and I'm seriously considering it.

Has anyone else experience this sudden flipping of the Math light switch? Because its a really weird (but satisfying) moment for me. I've never just suddenly understood a subject like this before.

 

[josemlopes]

Yeah, math is always important one way or the other but most importanly the teacher is a very key element to the success of the student as it usually is a matter of interest and effort from the student and if the teacher cant motivate them to give a damn at the moment of learning then no one will (the parents can try at home but as soon as the student arrives school and starts taking a lesson from someone that doesnt care much he will just stop giving a fuck about it).

Good for you for having a teacher that managed to motivate you to show interest on the subject.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Not maths, but when I was learning SQL, the teacher, for weeks would say "Don't worry if it doesn't make sense at all, just keep doing it."

Which really pissed me off, but the week before the test I suddenly was able to do it fairly easily for no reason.

Still say he wasn't a great teacher, though.

 

[Foolery]

I feel most instructors teach math in a way that does more harm than good. At least that's been my experience. I've always felt they focus too much on the solution and the not the process. And a huge lack of examining the 'why' behind mathematic principles. I guess that's just how I am. If I know the reasoning, purpose, and history of how people came to conclusions about 'why' certain things work certain ways, I'm far more likely to understand.

 

[Amethyst Wind]

I hated math when I was in school. Hated. It. I was awful at it, never understanding even the most basic premise, and barely scraped out a C in High School just so I could graduate. It was a never ending nightmare.

Now, I'm in College and taking College Algebra, and for some fucking reason Math has become easy. I don't know what the hell happened, but I'm breezing through this class. We've had three tests so far, and I've aced them all, something that has never happened for me. I don't know if its because I have a Professor that gives a damn about teaching her students, or if some mysterious puzzle piece has found its rightful place in my brain, or if its something else. But I find myself actually... liking math. Its a weird emotion for me.

I entered college to pursue a journalism degree, but my Professor is trying to convince me to switch to Math, and I'm seriously considering it.

Has anyone else experience this sudden flipping of the Math light switch? Because its a really weird (but satisfying) moment for me. I've never just suddenly understood a subject like this before.

I had an inverse happen to me, entirely due to a teacher change. When I was 17 and studying Statistics, our regular teacher injured herself for the entire year (fell down and messed up her nerves, heavy stuff). The sub we got in was terrible. Wouldn't shut up about inane nonsense and couldn't teach to save his life. My grade plummeted from an A to an E.

I still scraped a C overall, but to do that I needed to get an A grade the next year.

Having a teacher who can actually teach works wonders.

 

[Barbas]

Not maths, but when I was learning SQL, the teacher, for weeks would say "Don't worry if it doesn't make sense at all, just keep doing it."

Which really pissed me off, but the week before the test I suddenly was able to do it fairly easily for no reason.

Still say he wasn't a great teacher, though.

All the best teachers reek of cigarette smoke, dress like flood victims and make it clear by their mannerisms that they find everything terribly interesting. This applies doubly-so to professors.

OT: This described my own experiences with mathematics fairly accurately. It was constant frustration until I discovered how to make the numbers dance to my tune, after which it was so satisfying to complete every equation. It was transformed from a subject I despised to something I thrived in. Mathematics is beautiful when it all clicks into place. Would that life made as much sense. If it is something that you are good at and enjoy doing, it would be a mistake not to continue with it somehow. As for switching your degree, though, it all comes down to which of the two you enjoy more.

 

[kurokotetsu]

Now, I'm in College and taking College Algebra, and for some fucking reason Math has become easy. I don't know what the hell happened, but I'm breezing through this class. We've had three tests so far, and I've aced them all, something that has never happened for me. I don't know if its because I have a Professor that gives a damn about teaching her students, or if some mysterious puzzle piece has found its rightful place in my brain, or if its something else. But I find myself actually... liking math. Its a weird emotion for me.

WHat is College Algebra exactly? Group Theory? Linear Algebra? Basic groups and fileds? Divisibility? What exactly those the course have? Or just equiation solving and no theorem proofs?

Because if you really switched form high school math to real, actual Math work ti is quite an experience. It is noyt about finding a value nor memorizing. It is about logic and proofs and it is beautiful. Looking at the definitions, at tehr easons why ythe real numbers are commutative, that 1+1 doesn't have to be equal to 2, all the higher stuff math gets more fun the deeper you get.

I've always liked Math. ANd I'm currently working on my degree in Math. But I've had my moments. Like after first seeing some TOpolgy. I wasn't taht much into the continuty definition in Calculus (it si good, but it seemed a bit too tautological to me) but after reading it in Topology and see how it realtes to the basic stuff in a higher and more general level, well it was an enlightning and beatiful moment. Or when studying the logistic discrete model, finding where the chaos come from, the bifurcation point, well it is an epiphany.

Love Math.

 

[Coppernerves]

I found with mathetics you can shift various, largely meaningless symbols around according to various, largely meaningless rules, in the way prescribed as the solution to problems fitting certain patterns.

It's dull as hell, but it doesn't require much thought, (you can often get to the solution eventually just by randomly shifting the symbols according to the rules) and it gets you a perfectly respectable grade in exams (up to A level I found)

Mathematics is only interesting when you take the time to find the meaning of the symbols, which, by governing what they represent, govern the rules of their correct manipulation, (like magic in reverse), and you figure out not just what the rules are, but why they are necessary (or unnecessary as the case may be), not just how the solutions are carried out, but how and why they work.

The latter is seldom done in class, and when it is, it's usually touched on too briefly to become clear.

But a few weeks ago I taught myself Bayesian probability calculation, at my own pace, and it was awesome.

 

[kurokotetsu]

I found with mathetics you can shift various, largely meaningless symbols around according to various, largely meaningless rules, in the way prescribed as the solution to problems fitting certain patterns.

It's dull as hell, but it doesn't require much thought, (you can often get to the solution eventually just by randomly shifting the symbols according to the rules) and it gets you a perfectly respectable grade in exams (up to A level I found)

Mathematics is only interesting when you take the time to find the meaning of the symbols, which, by governing what they represent, govern the rules of their correct manipulation, (like magic in reverse), and you figure out not just what the rules are, but why they are necessary (or unnecessary as the case may be), not just how the solutions are carried out, but how and why they work.

The latter is seldom done in class, and when it is, it's usually touched on too briefly to become clear.

But a few weeks ago I taught myself Bayesian probability calculation, at my own pace, and it was awesome.

You've never done higher Math have you? The rules are everything. And you have to proof the rules.

Math is about theorems. And it requires sometimes more imagination than any "creative discipline". Trying to think for the first time of an n-dimensional space, or worse an infinite dimension sapce and trying to apply new rules, more general rules. Have you ever thought of a space of functions? How would you define distance between functions? And form there, can you make limits? Can you have the same properties you have in numbers?

I want to see a single "creative" mind to think that there are larger infinites than others. How would you think that? Ifnite is the largest thing there is. Excpeto it is not. And it can be proven easily.

Math is the most abstract and the most applicable thing you will ever find. Finite commutatie groups (an interesting and small, but very deep things) which are pure mathematical things and have been well studied. They are wierd things wre 1+1 doesn't equal 2 but 0, for example (Z2, that is an infra number). But yet these strange mathematical creatures are used in crystalography. How do you try to talk about totally abstract things (the paper exploring abelian finite groups is form 1879) and have that thing become useful. It is a thing of beauty, and much more than sifting things around.

Hell, one of the most interesting things. How do you know your problem has a solution? How can you be sure? ANd if it does, is it unique? How sensible it is to initial conditions? Those are the things that one does in real Math. Hell, there is a lot of theory just to assure yu that high school students may find a simple algebraic solution.

 

[MysticSlayer]

I entered college to pursue a journalism degree, but my Professor is trying to convince me to switch to Math, and I'm seriously considering it.

I'd be careful about jumping right in. College Algebra is a reasonably easy course compared to what mathematics majors generally have to face. If you don't mind taking a few courses outside of what is needed for your major and are really considering it, then try taking Pre-Calculus and possibly even Calculus. Those will start giving you a better idea of how math begins operating when you start getting higher, but given what I've heard from one of my friends who is a math major, those still don't even begin to compare to how challenging junior and senior level math classes can be.

Also, considering if there is a math-based major outside of mathematics that you would like. Your university's College of Engineering no doubt has many, and the Computer Science program, whether it is a department in the College of Engineering or part of the Math Department, is also a good choice. Basically, try to understand if there is anything you would want to do with it or consider what you could do with other majors that use a lot of math and/or us a lot of math-based logic.

This isn't to discourage you, just to give you some ideas of what to think about before making the switch. My Pre-Calculus and Calculus 1 professors both tried to get me to change to mathematics, so I have given the same questions a lot of thought in the past.

Has anyone else experience this sudden flipping of the Math light switch? Because its a really weird (but satisfying) moment for me. I've never just suddenly understood a subject like this before.

For me, I've always been very proficient at math, but there have been concepts that took a while to fully pick up, and there is occasionally that "aha!" moment with them. I do agree that it is enjoyable. Oddly, the last time I remember that happening, the concept I an hour or more trying to fully understand wasn't even on the exam. Go figure.

There are times, though, where a professor effectively kills my interest in the subject. It's not really a fault with the subject. The fact that I can still do other math-based classes and love them is proof of that. But there are times when a professor is so horrible at communicating information that it ultimately becomes a waste of my time to listen to him. In those cases, I tend to find math a pain, but so long as I can remove the individual professor's influence on my perception, I can still enjoy it.

 

[Brian Tams]

snip

Yeah, I talked it over with one of my friends who's majoring in computer science about what the course work would entail, and decided it would be best if I just went ahead and finished my journalism degree (its not like I hate Journalism. I've really really enjoyed the classes I've been taking for it.)

But I'm not counting out possibly pursuing an Associates in a math related subject just for the hell of it.

 

[kurupt87]

The moment something clicks is a great moment, undoubtedly. If it's something you've been struggling with for a while then it's almost orgasmic.

Off topic; is it as jarring to the brain ear for Americans when a Brit says Maths as it is for us when you say Math?

 

[Weaver]

Welcome to math! I graduated from the mathematics faculty at my school (in Computer Science) and it's a really great field. It can be frustrating though . It's hard even if you're really good at it lol.

Note: I don't consider myself really good at it.

 

[Frezzato]

Algebra didn't become "easy" for me, but I found I appreciated it greatly once I saw an educational special on it at random (like 6 in the morning on public television). It wasn't just that algebra was invented by Muslim scholars, which is cool in itself, but the fact that you can solve equations with two unknown variables by drawing a graph on paper, that floored me. If only teachers had just come out and said that in grade school, I would have taken to algebra much quicker.

I feel most instructors teach math in a way that does more harm than good. At least that's been my experience. I've always felt they focus too much on the solution and the not the process. And a huge lack of examining the 'why' behind mathematic principles. I guess that's just how I am. If I know the reasoning, purpose, and history of how people came to conclusions about 'why' certain things work certain ways, I'm far more likely to understand.

Yes, you nailed it right there. I absolutely agree with you.

 

[DoPo]

Not maths, but when I was learning SQL[...]

Well, actualy, SQL is based on a branch of mathematics called relational algebra. Fun stuff. When I was learning SQL (well, "databases", more or less) we first learned some relational algebra. Not that I didn't get the hang of that but it...just felt weird - SQL always seemed easier to deal with for some reason. Just made more sense even when eventually I did wrote some code that dynamically constructed SQL to query some data stored in a weird way[footnote]After designing the database to hold the data, with normalised tables and whatever, the client just went "Wait, but ACTUALLY, this field here holds some extra information in some optional cases and sometimes this other field's meaning depends on another value" and just shat all over the hope of ever getting a decent model of the data. Of course, this is not the words the client used, but are useful in getting what the essence of the actual words was.[/footnote] SQL just...clicked.

Anyway, as for more "Math-y" Math - I did have an experience with it in high school. First a bit of a background - I was always OK at Math. Not a genius or anything but decent and could handle it. There were two occasions where I didn't, though:
1. Geometry. It...I dunno, didn't make sense. I could get some marks in it, but spatial relations just...well, it's there - I can see it, I can draw a triangle to scale, I can visualise and reproduce the shapes - I know them. But why the fuck should I describe them? And HOW do I describe them? It's like asking me to describe "how to walk" - I don't fucking know, I just do it. Geometry is all about describing, though, so I sort of sucked there. But when it came to doing the same things but with 3D shapes ("stereometry" was it called?) I just ruled. I suppose the extra dimensions just gave me a better way to describe the problems and the solutions or something - I don't know, I knew I didn't suck as much when it came to planes and intersection of them and so on.

2. OK, I forgot what type of Maths this was, but I know I just could...not...get...it. I was staring at the numbers (and letters in there) and it didn't make a lick of sense how to get what was there and turn it into whatever it was expected of me. I was looking at solved problems, too, and it might as well had been in Latin. Worst part was - a test was coming up and still nothing. And I suppose it goes without saying that the teacher was no help either. According to her "you just had to do this " but I NEVER GOT WHAT "THIS" EVEN WAS! And then, in the break just before the test a classmate of mine managed to make me see reason in the chaos. Just a couple of sentences were enough and I underwent enlightenment - it was suddenly reasonable. In essence, it was like him pointing out that what I thought was Latin, was actually English, I just misread a word which tripped me up.

 

[Eclectic Dreck]

I feel most instructors teach math in a way that does more harm than good. At least that's been my experience. I've always felt they focus too much on the solution and the not the process. And a huge lack of examining the 'why' behind mathematic principles. I guess that's just how I am. If I know the reasoning, purpose, and history of how people came to conclusions about 'why' certain things work certain ways, I'm far more likely to understand.

I'd tend to agree. Before college, math was simply a chore - a process you applied without understanding when or why the process would be useful. Oddly enough, my experience has generally been that I never really understand they why of it until the next class comes along. For example, differentiation and integration never seemed particularly useful until one day in physics I was looking at a graph and suddenly realized that the value I was looking for was the area under a curve.

It is a fair shame given that out of school, the precise how of a math problem is rarely relevant; the important part is recognizing when and why you'd want to use a technique.

 

[Hero of Lime]

I had the exact same situation going from high school to college, I hated math with a passion. Then I got to college, and it just clicked for me. I actually had some good math teachers back in elementary and high school, I just never cared. I got discouraged early in every year/semester and just did poorly in most of my math classes.

I would say it is a combination of you as a student caring to learn the material, coupled with the teacher doing a great job teaching. Which could be applied to most subjects of course.

 

[SKBPinkie]

I fuckin love math. Mostly because I can be a bit of an asshole about it when tests / exams come around.

I love finishing them as quickly as possible. In my sophomore year, I completed my 2-hour Advanced Calc. final exam in 18 mins.

Got 108/100, cause I finished the extra credit question as well. I was a bit of a smug asshole back then, and that has changed now, but I still love the speed of it.

 

[Brian Tams]

I feel most instructors teach math in a way that does more harm than good. At least that's been my experience. I've always felt they focus too much on the solution and the not the process. And a huge lack of examining the 'why' behind mathematic principles. I guess that's just how I am. If I know the reasoning, purpose, and history of how people came to conclusions about 'why' certain things work certain ways, I'm far more likely to understand.

I just realized that you hit the nail right on the head as to why I suddenly get it.
Instead of worrying about the numbers in the problem, I instead make sure that I'm applying the appropriate process to the question being asked. Its sort of like how in Zelda, you need to figure out what item you need to use before applying it to the puzzle at hand.

And then I just plug n' chug.

 

[Riverwolf]

I've always said, if God has a native language, it's mathematics.

For me it clicked when I was reading Randall Hyde's Write Great Code book so I could learn to be a better programmer. One chapter is devoted to binary arithmetic. One statement, however, resonated with me so much that I now regard it as one of the biggest keys to at least arithmetic and algebra (and which I paraphrase here since I currently don't have it): all arithmetic, distilled down, is addition. Subtraction is the addition of a negative number, multiplication is addition of the same number over and over, etc. It has helped me a great deal in terms of helping me distill problems down to their simple, if not space-consuming, forms (albeit in a computer programming paradigm, but that involves a LOT of math.)

The thing about math is that it requires a certain way to think that children and teenagers are not taught. That's always been the problem with the American public school system: we're not taught how to think, we're taught [/i]what to think. I've learned far more about history, for example, when I started doing the research myself than when I was in school, learning about original sources and even questioning some of their credibility based on potential bias (such as... NO! BAD RIVERWOLF! STAY ON TOPIC!)

My own self-teaching hasn't yet gotten to the point where I can write elegant and efficient programs (STILL having trouble with passing arrays around objects... FTR I'm an amateur C++ programmer, albeit not a very good one), and I don't know, yet, if I'll need to study the higher maths, but learning programming has definitely been a HUGE help in understanding math. I would definitely encourage anyone who might struggle with math to learn a programming language. After all, all programming is math to some degree.