Who decides what's "canon"?

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

SNIP

Maybe as a fanfic writer myself, I view headcanon as...if not sacrosanct then at the very least worth consideration. It sits ill with me that poor ideas, idiocy and for lack of a better term, brain-storm tr0lling, get the protection of headcanon.

 

[Secondhand Revenant]

SNIP

Maybe as a fanfic writer myself, I view headcanon as...if not sacrosanct then at the very least worth consideration. It sits ill with me that poor ideas, idiocy and for lack of a better term, brain-storm tr0lling, get the protection of headcanon.

Ah, yeah, I can see that if you're someone who writes fanfic and is the least bit serious about doing it well. Can understand resenting it more in that situation.

 

[Addendum_Forthcoming]

If they wanted to do a war story about the Rebels, it would have been better to make the story more self-contained. That way, they wouldn't have to complicate a simplistic story of Rebels secretly stealing the plans into a contrived two hour action movie. The retcons and fanservice are inexcusable. It's a boring movie by mediocre writers.

Ehhh, I didn't mind enough and I don't see why Disney can't change a few details when the previous owner had zero respect for what he previously created. I didn't think the movie was boring, mediocre writing perhaps, but the battles were well co-ordinated, well scripted enough. I think you're being uncharitable given that's still the consensus amongst people who don't like the movie. Amazing final act.

If the movie just started on the idea of these characters already together, and you learning about them in medias res that would have been better. More action, because I feel like the action was pretty spot on. Introduce the characters in between battles rather than kicking the drama can along.

Frankly I still think Jedi has the worst writing yet of any of the movies. And not only that I had real problems how the handled Luke in Jedi as well.

 

[Saelune]

SNIP

You know...

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Officially canon decided by whoever owns the IP. However Fanon is decided by the fan. Personally I'll go with whatever's official unless it's really stupid. For example in my personal fanon the Doctor Who episodes "Flesh and Stone" and "Time of the Angels" never happened.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Official Cannon I'd determined by the current IP holder of the media. If it's public domain, like Sherlock Holmes, canon is determined by the last IP holder or by the original author, depending.

Past that, all this "headcannon" and "fanon" and whatever else just used to be called theories, or bullshitting, or occasionally navel gazing, or shower thoughts.

Prime example is Dragonball GT, while it isn't cannon, a few components of it such as SSJ4s are retained in some games here and there because they were liked by people, but we all knew that GT wasn't cannon so when they ignored it and went the Super way, it was obvious and accepted. On the other hand, when people tried to pretend that the original Ghostbusters movie was not cannon in the new remake, shit hit the fan really fast because, well, no, it was.

Technically speaking *pushes up nerd glasses* there's nothing that's happened yet in Super that would definitely render GT non-canon.

 

[Scarim Coral]

Usually cannon is officially declared by most of the creators (like recently there was abit of a dispute on SU) or someone with alot of money (like Disney making a new Star Wars Canon while Geroge Lucas is just fiddling with his thumbs whe this was happening).

 

[SlumlordThanatos]

Usually cannon is officially declared by most of the creators (like recently there was abit of a dispute on SU) or someone with alot of money (like Disney making a new Star Wars Canon while Geroge Lucas is just fiddling with his thumbs whe this was happening).

And then you have Games Workshop, and their mantra: "Everything is cannon. Not everything is true." In layman's terms, every story in GW's universes can be interpreted as in-universe propaganda, and may or may not be telling the 100% truth.

Example: C.S. Goto messily torturing and killing Taldeer in the original Dawn of War tie-in novel he wrote, only for her to show up alive and well in a subsequent expansion of the game itself. Everything is cannon, not everything is true.

The ultimate license to be lazy and to handwave anything that the fanbase or the creators don't like. It's actually pure genius in a sick, twisted, lazy sort of way.

 

[happyninja42]

The creator gets to decide what canon is. As the term canon, as it's commonly used refers to the "official theme/story/direction of some IP" which implies it being separate from what the audience might think of the material.

And if I was a creator of something, I would take great issue with someone trying to tell me that the story I made meant something other than what I intended. If it's some story where I intentionally "leave it to your own interpretation" ok fine, that's one thing. But not every story is "open to interpretation". Sometimes the creator is telling a very specific story, with an intended meaning and resolution. And I don't care how much some fan thinks it means X, if I wrote it to mean Y, he's wrong. There is no ambiguity in it. He took the wrong message from the story.

Now he can still say "I don't like your story, and prefer my own interpretation of the events." And that's 100% fine, and I as the creator wouldn't give a shit either way. But if he tries to say that he's got the "truth" of the IP, then I have an issue, because then he's putting his own fan theory forward, despite input from the creator.

That's my thoughts on it.

 

[McElroy]

And sometimes when the creators don't give a shit about the canon, a Schrodinger's Canon is formed.

 

[Redlin5_v1legacy]

Official canon - IP owner/authors
Headcanon - you
In subjective, personal terms, headcanon > official. But objectively, official canon rules the roost. Sorry but there's no debate about that.
But in my world? Indiana Jones rode off into the sunset with Henry Sr. and Marcus Brody and that was the end of the canon. No, there were never aliens or crystal skulls... nope. didn't happen.

This.

I do enjoy fan creations and messing about with theories and 'what if' moments. There were even comics published by Marvel called the 'What If" series! But as much fun as that can be, the original creator or the designated owner after the creator has left the work determines canon.

Sometimes this is a good thing, as when George Miller came back to his old Mad Max series and

it kicked my ass and made me ask for more from its original creator.

The reverse example is of how the people who came to own Terminator and its canon made questionable choices...

I'll argue that the original storyteller, even if they sell the adaption rights for TV or film, have the final word on what is, hands down, the true course of the imagined world. Doesn't mean deviating ala GOT is a sin, it just means George RR Martin is the one you believe about character deaths in Westeros.

 

[Imperioratorex Caprae]

**SNIP**

In terms of adaptations, whether be it comic or literature, those canon's are, and always should be considered, separate unless the IP owner/Author deems the extended work canon (much like how pre-Disney Star Wars EU books were canon, with the caveat that Lucas could trump the books at any given time, much to the chagrin of great writers like Karen Traviss).
But usually the adaptations should be held as an alternate universe. It does not break the canon that came before, kinda how DC and Marvel have used various versions of their comic universes as separate but equal canons. The reason I say it like this is because it's ridiculous to me that people expect a movie adaptation to follow the story exactly, especially in comics. First off, books (non-comic) are difficult to adapt to screenplays because of the way the medium is presented, and headcanon-like perspectives on how characters look may not match up with the producer/director's vision of said adaptation. Comics have a more visual aspect, but because of their serial nature, have a large volume of stories being told, not all of them have been contiguous.
And not all adaptations are successful or even good, which is honestly subjective material for the most part. LotR was visually, to me as close to the books as one could get with a few glaring deviations, but the characters somehow looked and sounded exactly as they did in my head, or close enough to it that I ended up incorporating the movie versions.
Anyway, canon is a tricky thing, but there is always a delineation between official versions and headcanon, and people are absolutely welcome to their own viewpoints but it comes down to the original author or the current IP holders to actually determine what canon is. Doesn't mean they'll always make the right choices, doesn't mean we always agree with the directions and that's why in our own subjective sphere, headcanon > official but in the larger scheme, official > headcanon. A strange dichotomy, no?

 

[happyninja42]

But as much fun as that can be, the original creator or the designated owner after the creator has left the work determines canon.

Sometimes this is a good thing, as when George Miller came back to his old Mad Max series and

it kicked my ass and made me ask for more from its original creator.

Do people believe all the Mad Max movies are connected? Does George Miller even? Fury Road looks so different that I assume it's a reboot of sorts or a different version, like the different Bonds.

From what I've heard, Miller does consider them all to be part of the same person's story, but they are an anthology type situation. They aren't necessarily chronological. They are just 3 different stories of things that happened to Max at some point in his life in the Wasteland. So yes, I would say they are connected, if only loosely.

 

[jademunky]

The owner of the IP unfortunately.

Unless we are talking about the Terminator films, in which case nothing ever happened after T2 and all that crap about the blonde female terminator and evil John was just some fevered hallucination by someone who hated fun.

 

[Ogoid]

Do people believe all the Mad Max movies are connected? Does George Miller even? Fury Road looks so different that I assume it's a reboot of sorts or a different version, like the different Bonds.

The first two are definitely connected. Road Warrior's entire setting and story, as well as Max's entire character arc in it, are entirely predicated upon the events of Mad Max. Thunderdome less so, but still, there's nothing in it that conflicts with the previous films.

Fury Road, though... frankly, I think the less said about that one, the better.

On topic...

The owner of the IP unfortunately.

Unless we are talking about the Terminator films, in which case nothing ever happened after T2 and all that crap about the blonde female terminator and evil John was just some fevered hallucination by someone who hated fun.

This, basically. Which is why Watchmen has always remained a 12-issue series and nothing else.

 

[Redlin5_v1legacy]

But as much fun as that can be, the original creator or the designated owner after the creator has left the work determines canon.

Sometimes this is a good thing, as when George Miller came back to his old Mad Max series and

it kicked my ass and made me ask for more from its original creator.

Do people believe all the Mad Max movies are connected? Does George Miller even? Fury Road looks so different that I assume it's a reboot of sorts or a different version, like the different Bonds.

From what I've heard, Miller does consider them all to be part of the same person's story, but they are an anthology type situation. They aren't necessarily chronological. They are just 3 different stories of things that happened to Max at some point in his life in the Wasteland. So yes, I would say they are connected, if only loosely.

And I am glad he has the legal and creative right to come back to it. He's a much different filmmaker now than when he was paying people in beer in Australia to get his feature shot. I know if I ever get something that has sequel potential made, I'm hanging onto my copyright for dear life.

 

[jademunky]

This, basically. Which is why Watchmen has always remained a 12-issue series and nothing else.

See now, I really loved Watchmen, the film. I was genuinely shocked at how close it adhered to the story (no, not everything, yes they cut out that comic within the comic and the squiddier parts)

 

[WolfThomas]

Do people believe all the Mad Max movies are connected? Does George Miller even? Fury Road looks so different that I assume it's a reboot of sorts or a different version, like the different Bonds.

Personally I believe they're all legends of Max. So details smudge between films. Like an anthology as was mentioned.

The dumb thing is they have actually made a George Miller approved comic that places Fury Road after the Thunderdome.