Why are there so few quality RPGs?

[Casual Shinji]

Then again, RPG's like The Elder Scrolls and Fallout consume so much time; Would you really want that many more games just like 'm?

 

[neonsword13-ops]

HUURDUR LET'S MAK SHOOTER! DERP!

Everyone loves shooters for some reason. It's just a trend, it will wear down in about NEVER.

There needs to be more variety in the market.
Go to a Wal-mart and look at the xbox titles.
I can bet you more than half of the games for sale are shooters.

It kind of just proves how many idiots buy the same game over and over again with just some new wall paper and a different smell. Games like Catherine, you've heard the news, sold more than 200,000 copies the fist week. That's different and it wasn't even all that hyped. Games like Call of Duty always outsell the previous titles because it's the same thing with a different multiplayer. That's it.

I sigh for humanity.

 

[thenamelessloser]

In a nutshell, all the ideas are gone. They've done basic Western medieval fantasy, western sci-fi fantasy, eastern medieval fantasy, eastern sci-fi fantasy. All of the other scenes that an RPG inhabits. Where do you take it from there? It's widely believed that all the ideas combined to make all these separate genre's have been used. It's not easy for a games company to reuse those ideas and make them better. Because 1, they can't copy ideas. And two, they often turn out to be worse.

This can't be the reason, if so there would be a lot less FPS games as well. I myself dislike guns I don't get why people find them entertaining. Even though some of my favorite games do have guns lke Deus Ex. I tried to play one of the supposedly best straight FPS games, Half life 2 and found it completely dull. This may have more to do with me than others.

I think the reason why not many quality RPGs are made is mostly cause video games take a lot of money and resources so companies want to make what sells more. Also the expectation everything will be voiced makes RPGs much more expensive to make I think. Also, the fact of the matter is video games like I think other forms of entertainment do try to appeal to the lowest common demonator (note this doesn't necessarily mean dumb) simply because they want the most potential buyers as possible. Also RPGs have a tendency to be longer games, how many people have the time to play that many games that are dozens of hours long?

 

[krazykidd]

RPGs were always niche.

You probably just didn't notice it since there were so few big-name developers and so few people actually playing games. Shooters have more mainstream appeal, and it has grown exponentially more profitable to target that group now that gaming is so big.

Except there are still tons of fantastic RPGs being developed every year. Maybe you're just not looking, or maybe you're one of those people who categorically refuse to play anything developed in Japan. If that's the case, I can't sympathize.

Wait wait really tons ? I love Jrpgs but i will like to see these tons of games so i can buy them! Id say prolly 1 or 2 every 2 yeArs , but maybe i just didn't see them?

OT: Rpgs take so much time and money to make developpers dont even bother, but because of this , when ever a rpg comes out everyone buy it because they are scarce

 

[Robert Ewing]

In a nutshell, all the ideas are gone. They've done basic Western medieval fantasy, western sci-fi fantasy, eastern medieval fantasy, eastern sci-fi fantasy. All of the other scenes that an RPG inhabits. Where do you take it from there? It's widely believed that all the ideas combined to make all these separate genre's have been used. It's not easy for a games company to reuse those ideas and make them better. Because 1, they can't copy ideas. And two, they often turn out to be worse.

This can't be the reason, if so there would be a lot less FPS games as well. I myself dislike guns I don't get why people find them entertaining. Even though some of my favorite games do have guns lke Deus Ex. I tried to play one of the supposedly best straight FPS games, Half life 2 and found it completely dull. This may have more to do with me than others.

I think the reason why not many quality RPGs are made is mostly cause video games take a lot of money and resources so companies want to make what sells more. Also the expectation everything will be voiced makes RPGs much more expensive to make I think. Also, the fact of the matter is video games like I think other forms of entertainment do try to appeal to the lowest common demonator (note this doesn't necessarily mean dumb) simply because they want the most potential buyers as possible. Also RPGs have a tendency to be longer games, how many people have the time to play that many games that are dozens of hours long?

I think there is a lot less good FPS's... All the main ones are about Former soviet countries going batshit crazy over nuclear warheads. But even the most diverse FPS's have been done and done again. The games industry is going the way of the films industry where there is a lot less creativity, so new and creative ideas are prized even higher (such as braid, limbo, minecraft.) Which is why they sell almost as well, and generate a similar sized fanbase as the real top dogs such as COD4 and Battlefield. I'm not saying all creativity is doomed to be gone forever, i'm just saying it's not reared it's head yet. Maybe Modern warfare free will completely revolutionize the FPS genre, I don't think it will, but it might... Right?

 

[Wayneguard]

You just have to go back in time. The 90s were a golden age for RPGs. Though I'm not a fan of baldurs gate, those two are highly regarded. There's arcanum. The Fallouts. Then there's Ultima... really old. I know what you mean though; it seems that the drunken fratboy market is a more profitable mark than the CRPG market o_0

Also, there is the Gothic series and Eco Draconis. I've never played either but they look right up my alley. And then there's the witcher.

 

[Blackpapa]

Also RPGs have a tendency to be longer games, how many people have the time to play that many games that are dozens of hours long?

Seeing the statistics for MMORPGs I'd say a metric fuckton and then some.

Of course the MMORPG and the WRPG audience aren't necessarily the same people - but time isn't that big of an issue.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

I would imagine because making RPGs is so much more expensive than making those brainless adrenaline fragfests.

 

[Zantos]

We can't blame shooters for this. The reason shooters sell well and thus get made is because the fans generally like the basic formula and are less demanding on the company to do it exactly how they like. Compare that the very vocal group of RPG fans who are always railing against this and that and the other. They don't provide the guaranteed return of investment because the fans are liable to rage and boycott the slightest thing, so they're less likely to front the initial funding.

A good example of this is the recent Bethesda announcement that the armour would be cut down to, what was it, three pieces? People were deciding not to buy the game on that fact. This was so they would be able to have more NPCs onscreen due to various technical limitations, and they wanted to have more because in Oblivion people got angry due to the cities feeling barren and empty with not enough people wandering around.

 

[aegix drakan_v1legacy]

In a nutshell, all the ideas are gone. They've done basic Western medieval fantasy, western sci-fi fantasy, eastern medieval fantasy, eastern sci-fi fantasy. All of the other scenes that an RPG inhabits. Where do you take it from there? It's widely believed that all the ideas combined to make all these separate genre's have been used. It's not easy for a games company to reuse those ideas and make them better. Because 1, they can't copy ideas. And two, they often turn out to be worse.

You don't always need a new setting, you know. You can still make an original and memorable high fantasy RPG (for example). Just make it your own type of high fantasy world.

Look at Radiant Historia: It's high fantasy alright. Magic, Mana flow, some guns and steampunk, but still mostly swords spells and kingdoms. But it still feels fresh and original.

Plus, there is a setting we have not explored much: The Modern day "urban" RPG. You know, Like Earthbound, and TWEWY? I'm surprised we haven't seen more of those.

There is still plenty of originality to be found. We've just become conditioned to shrug off the more typical stuff like "Join rebels, overthrow evil empire" and "chosen one who must save world from impending Lovecraftian horror by gathering 3 magic muffins".

 

[NathLines]

They are often reliant on a good story and sadly enough, a lot of people don't see gaming as a valid medium for storytelling so there's not as much money to make there. They are also more expensive to make(loads of voice acting, big environments, lots of different equipment).

Multiplayer shooters are the cheapest type of game to make that also has a big chance to sell very well. While an RPG needs to constantly introduce new environments, equipment and voice acting, a multiplayer shooter doesn't.

 

[Weaver]

I'd wager it's because RPGs are very hard to make and a poorly made RPG is really boring.

 

[mireko]

RPGs were always niche.

You probably just didn't notice it since there were so few big-name developers and so few people actually playing games. Shooters have more mainstream appeal, and it has grown exponentially more profitable to target that group now that gaming is so big.

Except there are still tons of fantastic RPGs being developed every year. Maybe you're just not looking, or maybe you're one of those people who categorically refuse to play anything developed in Japan. If that's the case, I can't sympathize.

Wait wait really tons ? I love Jrpgs but i will like to see these tons of games so i can buy them! Id say prolly 1 or 2 every 2 yeArs , but maybe i just didn't see them?

OT: Rpgs take so much time and money to make developpers dont even bother, but because of this , when ever a rpg comes out everyone buy it because they are scarce

Okay, "tons" was probably a bit of an exaggeration. Still:

2011 sees the release of Dark Souls, Disgaea 4, Innocent Sin (in English), Trails in the Sky (in English), Wizardry: Labyrinth of Lost Souls (guess), Tactics Ogre and Devil Survivor Overclocked.

2010 saw the release of P3P, Strange Journey, Valkyria Chronicles II, ZHP, Sakura Wars V, Etrian Odyssey III, Cladun: This is an RPG, Nier, Resonance of Fate, Radiant Historia, Record of Agarest War (haven't played, have heard it's good though).

2009 saw Demon's Souls and The Dark Spire. I'm probably forgetting something here.

2008: Persona 4, Valkyria Chronicles, Tales of Vesperia.. don't remember any others. I lose track of release dates after a few years. There are also some games I like that I wouldn't necessarily recommend (Atelier Rorona springs to mind).

 

[Weaver]

RPGs were always niche.

You probably just didn't notice it since there were so few big-name developers and so few people actually playing games. Shooters have more mainstream appeal, and it has grown exponentially more profitable to target that group now that gaming is so big.

Except there are still tons of fantastic RPGs being developed every year. Maybe you're just not looking, or maybe you're one of those people who categorically refuse to play anything developed in Japan. If that's the case, I can't sympathize.

Wait wait really tons ? I love Jrpgs but i will like to see these tons of games so i can buy them! Id say prolly 1 or 2 every 2 yeArs , but maybe i just didn't see them?

OT: Rpgs take so much time and money to make developpers dont even bother, but because of this , when ever a rpg comes out everyone buy it because they are scarce

Okay, "tons" was probably a bit of an exaggeration. Still:

2011 sees the release of Dark Souls, Disgaea 4, Innocent Sin (in English), Trails in the Sky (in English), Wizardry: Labyrinth of Lost Souls (guess), Tactics Ogre and Devil Survivor Overclocked.

2010 saw the release of P3P, Strange Journey, Valkyria Chronicles II, ZHP, Sakura Wars V, Etrian Odyssey III, Cladun: This is an RPG, Nier, Resonance of Fate, Radiant Historia, Record of Agarest War (haven't played, have heard it's good though).

2009 saw Demon's Souls and The Dark Spire. I'm probably forgetting something here.

2008: Persona 4, Valkyria Chronicles, Tales of Vesperia.. don't remember any others. I lose track of release dates after a few years. There are also some games I like that I wouldn't necessarily recommend (Atelier Rorona springs to mind).

I thought you were posting examples of "fantastic RPGs"?. I know it all boils down to opinion, but listing Tales of Vesperia and Valkyria Chronicles (which is a tactical strategy game IMO) as "fantastic RPGs" seems to be a huge stretch to me. I actually thought Vesperia was one of the worst games in the tales series.

 

[mireko]

I thought you were posting examples of "fantastic RPGs"?. I know it all boils down to opinion, but listing Tales of Vesperia and Valkyria Chronicles (which is a tactical strategy game IMO) as "fantastic RPGs" seems to be a huge stretch to me. I actually thought Vesperia was one of the worst games in the tales series.

VC is effectively an SRPG. It's a lot like Resonance of Fate, just with a larger battlefield, more units and less equipment.

Also, I liked Vesperia. That game gave off a nice FFIX feel, had some interesting combat and some great characters. The main plot was lacklustre, yes, but that's the only major point I have against it. I haven't played the other Tales games, so comparing it to them doesn't enlighten me much.

 

[AgentBJ09]

Quality is subjective in RPGs. For me, content and gameplay are the two things that make RPGs good, especially the battle system. If the game requires too much grinding, it bores me very quickly. Story comes in third overall, unless it's non-medieval/space themed, which are the two most common kinds of RPG settings.

My personal favorites in this respect:

- Recettear - Dungeon Crawler and Item Shop Gameplay

- Shadow Hearts 1, 2 and 3 - Judgement Ring Battle System, and Side Quests for each character to earn new, specialized magic/skills and weapons.

- Puzzle Quest - Bejeweled gameplay with RPG elements.

- Vampire: The Masquerade - Real-Time Action, with some dungeon crawling.

- Sonic Chronicles - Turn Based action, with contextual actions for certain attacks. Plus, Sonic the Hedgehog in an RPG from Bioware.

- SMT: Strange Journey - You can ask demons to join you before you fight, and the game plays like Orcs and Elves/Wolfenstein RPG/Wizardry.

 

[NightRavenGSA]

'cause the cheap ones are... well cheap, and still explode...

Oh, those RPGs...
If you don't like it you can always go back to D&D you geek,
sincerely, the publisher

EDIT: (personaly I prefer the WEG Star Wars RPG)

 

[MetallicaRulez0]

Making RPGs is difficult, so only a handful of studios bother these days. The only good studio among them being BioWare. You could make an argument for Bethesda as well I guess, but I'd say they only make average RPGs, not good ones. Too many bugs and their gameplay is truly horrendous.

 

[Condiments]

Because making games is so expensive they can't afford to make things with true complexity and depth.

Pretty much this. It would just be so expensive to make an RPG with that kind of freedom with the production values of modern games. Any RPG's like that would have be indie, and frankly, there are very few indie developers who have seemed to taken to this particular niche.

Check out "Age of Decadence" and "Dead State" if you want good indie cRPGs that are on the horizon.

To the answer the OP's question, RPGs are amongst the most complex videogames to develop on the market. They have to operate on so many levels that very few developers outside of the ones already established will attempt them. Its much easier to develop linear corridors, than sprawling cities with tons of quests and interactive NPCs. They'll come out every once in a while, but they're fundamentally different than what they use to be.

 

[aegix drakan_v1legacy]

- Sonic Chronicles - Turn Based action, with contextual actions for certain attacks. Plus, Sonic the Hedgehog in an RPG from Bioware.

Please tell me you're kidding.... >_< I know we all have different taste...but......

The game started out just fine (just lacking polish), but from the halfway point on it started going down a very slippery slope into awfulness.

The battle system was great at first. Relatively fast, but with some depth. You'd attack to get some small damage in, use defend to heal your SP a bit, and use your special moves sparingly when in need of some heavy damage. By the end of the game though, it basically devolved into constantly spamming the same special moves (that take forever and require you to pass the Quick time event perfectly to do any damage), and you HAD to have either Tails of Cream on your team for healing and SP recovery or you were boned. Not to mention that it was really restrictive in terms of what party members were useful.

Likewise, the story started out great. Bioware did an EXCELLENT job with the characters, specifically knuckles and tails and eggman. Hell, they even made Big the Cat fun to talk to, and that's a hell of an accomplishment. ....But once you hit the second half, those brilliant moments of character interaction become so rare that it feels less like a sonic RPG, and more like a sci-fi RPG that just happens to have sonic in it.

And while I am willing to overlook a lack of polish...The sound effects and music all felt like they were all made the weekend before release. They just....sounded awful.

This game dissapointed me so much it's not even funny.

I've played many "pretenders" before (games that start off great, but then become horrible), but that one really made me sad.