Why do current RPGs not have scythes?

[CultistRat]

In Monster Hunter (Freedom Unite in my experience) there are scythes, but they're classified as long swords.

 

[Souplex]

Because scythes aren't weapons. They're farming tools. Only an idiot would fight with a scythe.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.70517-Scythes#694172
The real question is why do RPGs neglect polearms and axes? Historically they were the most commonly used melee weapons. Swords were the equivalent of an officers pistol.

Because of this attitude. Everyone looks down at the bare efficiency of a weapon, not the psychological aspects behind it. Think about it: You have someone come at you with a scythe, you can assume one of two things: They are either an idiot, or they are a bloody genius. Why the latter? Because the only person who could use such a weapon competently in combat is someone who is trained with it. Someone who knows dozens of ways to kill with it, and someone who chose it specifically for some sort of tactical advantage. An advantage You. Don't. Know. That's the most deadly weapon of all: The Unknown. That's the ridiculous thing about RPG combat, everyone thinks about the soldiers weapons, the generalities. Polearms, axes, crossbows, guns, even swords. Things that everyone used.

But that's not what made a man dangerous, the most dangerous warriors were the ones using weapons you didn't understand. How do you think net and trident gladiators even survived to begin with? That's not a common style of combat in the field of war, so it gave them an edge despite being strategically infeasible. If, and only if, you understood the combat style, it was easy to defeat, depending on what the net and trident are made of. But you face someone like that for the first time, and they actually know what they are doing? You are going to die. That's why education and knowledge are always your strongest weapons when fighting.

By that logic I should just beat people to death with a giant dildo. After all; someone coming at you with a giant dildo must be an idiot, or a master warrior who can actually defeat you with said giant dildo.

 

[masseyguy911]

I, too, am miffed about a lack of polearms and axes as weapons in games. They're rather fun. But, why do axes often get categorized as blunt weapons? Can someone explain this to me?

Game Developer #1: Okay, we've got our skill system set up for Swords, Two-Handed Weapons, and Blunt Weapons.
Game Developer #2: What about an axe? It's not a sword, it's not two handed, and it's not blunt.
Game Developer #1: Ah, screw it, roll it in with Blunt. The category is looking a little thin with all that useless cleric-fodder anyway.

Oh and as to why axes are in the blunt category, is because you use an axe much like a blunt weapon, like a hammer.

 

[Judgement101]

A scythe is a profoundly stupid weapon, that's why they abandoned them.

untrue! but they werent used as sweeping weapons like you see in some anime's or movies, the blade would have been turned 'upward' as in making the stick even longer, and it would end up being a sort of proto-polearm able to hook someone with. the problem with it was that it wasent verry controllable and you could just as well stab your friends as allies XD

So essentially it's not a scythe, it's closer to a glaive, a halberd or a naginata. And that's why they aren't in RPG's, because with a farming scythe with the blade locked in 'grim reaper position' you can maybe, MAYBE stab one person in the side or cut them by moving it behind them and pulling. That's one person dead, every other opponent inside your weapon's protective area (two handed, no shield) and a very good chance your falling opponent will wrest the scythe from you.

Also please note if you do 'hook' someone with a scythe and pull it's unlikely to cut them if they're wearing any kind of armour, the force on the blade is insufficient to generate enough pressure. What you end up with is an enraged soldier being pulled towards you and your weapon stuck behind him. You are dead.

A scythe has a very thick handle and makes no sense as a weapon of choice, it's very much in the same category as a board with a nail in it; improvised weaponry for a section of society just glad to have something sharp.

EDIT:

Also it's important to actually look at a real scythe from fieldwork. Most scythes people picture are fantasy scythes, in the same way as a fantasy dagger is laughable, fantasy scythes are made to look gothic and not to function as farming implements.

THIS is a functional scythe, straight away I can pick out several glaring flaws with this as a weapon, four at least.

Ok then. Hit them over the head with the other side using the blade for weight and then hack them to death when the fall.

 

[Irony's Acolyte]

A scythe is a profoundly stupid weapon, that's why they abandoned them.

untrue! but they werent used as sweeping weapons like you see in some anime's or movies, the blade would have been turned 'upward' as in making the stick even longer, and it would end up being a sort of proto-polearm able to hook someone with. the problem with it was that it wasent verry controllable and you could just as well stab your friends as allies XD

So essentially it's not a scythe, it's closer to a glaive, a halberd or a naginata. And that's why they aren't in RPG's, because with a farming scythe with the blade locked in 'grim reaper position' you can maybe, MAYBE stab one person in the side or cut them by moving it behind them and pulling. That's one person dead, every other opponent inside your weapon's protective area (two handed, no shield) and a very good chance your falling opponent will wrest the scythe from you.

Also please note if you do 'hook' someone with a scythe and pull it's unlikely to cut them if they're wearing any kind of armour, the force on the blade is insufficient to generate enough pressure. What you end up with is an enraged soldier being pulled towards you and your weapon stuck behind him. You are dead.

A scythe has a very thick handle and makes no sense as a weapon of choice, it's very much in the same category as a board with a nail in it; improvised weaponry for a section of society just glad to have something sharp.

A normal human with a scythe sucks,a skilled superhuman can combine both the staff and blade parts and fully utilize every bit of the weaopn, calling it a board with a nail in it is a bit disingenuous.......

A skilled superhuman wouldn't need to use a scythe, he would use his fists. Plus what would you rather choose? An impratical weapon that would take some serious practice to even learn how to use it as a proper weapon or a sword which was specific made for easy use?

 

[greendrag13]

...

...

A guess on the reason of sword-heavy RPGs. Swords took more metal and were harder to make than most other weapons. This meant that rich people tended to have the swords, and no one wants to play an RPG as the peasant.

Ok, I can see that. But, how often do you play an RPG as a rich person? I mean before you start amassing wealth from pots and monsters carrying loose change.

RPGs tend to treat you special, on account of you being a hero. Most tend to keep you perfectly cleaned and groomed, and it's amazing how many people rely on you to do things for them. Check out the local poor in your next RPG, how many beggars or farmers have swords?

 

[traineesword]

Because scythes aren't weapons. They're farming tools. Only an idiot would fight with a scythe.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.70517-Scythes#694172
The real question is why do RPGs neglect polearms and axes? Historically they were the most commonly used melee weapons. Swords were the equivalent of an officers pistol.

Because of this attitude. Everyone looks down at the bare efficiency of a weapon, not the psychological aspects behind it. Think about it: You have someone come at you with a scythe, you can assume one of two things: They are either an idiot, or they are a bloody genius. Why the latter? Because the only person who could use such a weapon competently in combat is someone who is trained with it. Someone who knows dozens of ways to kill with it, and someone who chose it specifically for some sort of tactical advantage. An advantage You. Don't. Know. That's the most deadly weapon of all: The Unknown. That's the ridiculous thing about RPG combat, everyone thinks about the soldiers weapons, the generalities. Polearms, axes, crossbows, guns, even swords. Things that everyone used.

But that's not what made a man dangerous, the most dangerous warriors were the ones using weapons you didn't understand. How do you think net and trident gladiators even survived to begin with? That's not a common style of combat in the field of war, so it gave them an edge despite being strategically infeasible. If, and only if, you understood the combat style, it was easy to defeat, depending on what the net and trident are made of. But you face someone like that for the first time, and they actually know what they are doing? You are going to die. That's why education and knowledge are always your strongest weapons when fighting.

By that logic I should just beat people to death with a giant dildo. After all; someone coming at you with a giant dildo must be an idiot, or a master warrior who can actually defeat you with said giant dildo.

no, you are misinterpreting the logic. That would only work if you are genuinly a master warrior with massive skill in the usage of a giant didlo as a weapon... which you aren't. or well, by that logic, you would be an idiot with a giant dildo and nothing more, only being able to slowly swing it down and upwards, not utilizing its full power as a weapon.

 

[Lunar Shadow]

Hmmmmmm gunblade+scythe......Gunscythe.....awesomeness!

...considering how gunblades are supposed to work (they're more like gunpowder-driven vibroblades), seems like that would be superfluous on a scythe. If you've already pierced someone, they're completely at your mercy already.

Super human strength when applied to a weaopn class is can make anything awesome in a fight.

Damn straight!

I meant the gun barrel would be the pole of the scythe. You could shoot at someone and when the dodge you chage up and stab them. (bullet comes from the top of the pole near the blade)

They have those, it's called a long rifle with a bayonet on it. (Though it is more of a short spear)

But the bayonet would have to be curved and stick out

Nevermind, for some reason I read "spear" instead of "scythe"

 

[SoldieroFortune]

To people who are countering with "It doesn't have to be realistic!":
Gunblades aren't realistic, but that doesn't stop them form being stupid.

Spoiler: So stupid...

I have a gunblade ...

Spoiler

 

[tehroc]

The only farming tool that works as a weapon is the mythical Hoe of Destruction from Ultima 7. Insane mage got tired of enchanting swords and other proper martial weapons.

 

[Judgement101]

To people who are countering with "It doesn't have to be realistic!":
Gunblades aren't realistic, but that doesn't stop them form being stupid.

Spoiler: So stupid...

I have a gunblade ...

Spoiler

Actually that seems like a pretty good idea to me.

 

[archvile93]

Because scythes aren't weapons. They're farming tools. Only an idiot would fight with a scythe.

Exactly, why go into a fight with scythe, a FARMING tool, when you could use... oh lets say a halberd, you know something thats actually made to be used as a weapon?

It's sharp and can cut stuff. Sound like a perfect weapon. Also, knives were cooking tools and are considered weapons.

Take into consideration weight and balance. Yes it can cut but only with slashing motions, and like an axe all the weight is in the blade so it's poorly balanced and unweildy to use in even the most experienced fighter's hands. A sythe was designed for very simple sweeping motions which even the stupidest soldier could deflect and perry (spelling?). Also, Knives used for fighting are specifically designed for such.

 

[Hobo Joe]

I've never really thought about that; though now that it comes to mind there is a very distinct lack of any two-handed weapons entirely!

 

[Therumancer]

Has anyone noticed that most rpgs don't have scythes as a weapon choice? (None modded games) It sort of annoys me because almost everyone loves a scythe as a weapon. So I was wondering what do you think the reasons for the lack of scythes is?

Plenty do, "Record Of Agarest War" has Scythes as a weapon class, and the final character you can recruit in "Trinity Universe" uses a Scythe as a weapon.

The trademark character from Spectral Souls "Hiro" also uses a Scythe as her primary weapon. She was in "Chaos Wars" back in like 2008 (PS-2 release), and I believe is unlockable with a lot of gymnastics as a character in "Spectral Force 3".

I could probably think of others given time, it seems like it's not an uncommon weapon to run into in RPGs to be entirely honest.

 

[DocBalance]

Because scythes aren't weapons. They're farming tools. Only an idiot would fight with a scythe.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.70517-Scythes#694172
The real question is why do RPGs neglect polearms and axes? Historically they were the most commonly used melee weapons. Swords were the equivalent of an officers pistol.

Because of this attitude. Everyone looks down at the bare efficiency of a weapon, not the psychological aspects behind it. Think about it: You have someone come at you with a scythe, you can assume one of two things: They are either an idiot, or they are a bloody genius. Why the latter? Because the only person who could use such a weapon competently in combat is someone who is trained with it. Someone who knows dozens of ways to kill with it, and someone who chose it specifically for some sort of tactical advantage. An advantage You. Don't. Know. That's the most deadly weapon of all: The Unknown. That's the ridiculous thing about RPG combat, everyone thinks about the soldiers weapons, the generalities. Polearms, axes, crossbows, guns, even swords. Things that everyone used.

But that's not what made a man dangerous, the most dangerous warriors were the ones using weapons you didn't understand. How do you think net and trident gladiators even survived to begin with? That's not a common style of combat in the field of war, so it gave them an edge despite being strategically infeasible. If, and only if, you understood the combat style, it was easy to defeat, depending on what the net and trident are made of. But you face someone like that for the first time, and they actually know what they are doing? You are going to die. That's why education and knowledge are always your strongest weapons when fighting.

By that logic I should just beat people to death with a giant dildo. After all; someone coming at you with a giant dildo must be an idiot, or a master warrior who can actually defeat you with said giant dildo.

Dude, if you can turn a giant dildo into a deadly weapon, go for it. Then video-tape that shit, I wanna see this.

 

[masseyguy911]

There are many reasons designers wouldn't want a scythe as a weapon. First and foremost, it's not a weapon. Yes, things like knives can be both tools and weapons, but that's because cutting food and cutting foes require similar cutting motion. A scythe has a specific method to be used, and swinging it like a staff or axe makes no more sense than using a fishing rod as a sword. On the other hand, designers can get pretty creative and liberal when it comes to combat; I've seen weirder things used as primary weapons: string instruments, footwear, wrenches.

It's possible that the designers simply feel uncomfortable giving the good guy a scythe. As we all know, the scythe is usually a religious symbol for death, or the "Grim Reaper", and some designers might equate that to wielding Satan's pitchfork or something.

Another reason could be artistic. I remember once I was browsing some mods for TES4: Oblivion that added user-made weapons to the game. The blades and maces came in hundreds of different shapes, styles, and sizes. Then some of the modders tried including scythes, but every single scythe looked the same. Why is this?

Here's my theory: Designers like swords, axes, hammers, and staffs because there are various ways to design them. There are nigh-infinite ways to draw swords: lightsabers, the Master sword, Soul Edge, a katana. All swords. Think of all the ways you could visualize a staff. Visual artists resort to these weapon types because they're general and there's multiple ways to draw them. Having different visual styles for a single weapon type adds flavor and variety to a game. But, the scythe has a very certain shape and fixed curvature. The scythe in one game would look just like the scythe in the next game, and would be pretty boring.

You know... I like your theory, I got to admit it makes more sense than mine.
The visual design theory makes the most since, when you think of a scythe, you pretty much think of the same looking thing, unlike swords and such.

 

[Judgement101]

There are many reasons designers wouldn't want a scythe as a weapon. First and foremost, it's not a weapon. Yes, things like knives can be both tools and weapons, but that's because cutting food and cutting foes require similar cutting motion. A scythe has a specific method to be used, and swinging it like a staff or axe makes no more sense than using a fishing rod as a sword. On the other hand, designers can get pretty creative and liberal when it comes to combat; I've seen weirder things used as primary weapons: string instruments, footwear, wrenches.

It's possible that the designers simply feel uncomfortable giving the good guy a scythe. As we all know, the scythe is usually a religious symbol for death, or the "Grim Reaper", and some designers might equate that to wielding Satan's pitchfork or something.

Another reason could be artistic. I remember once I was browsing some mods for TES4: Oblivion that added user-made weapons to the game. The blades and maces came in hundreds of different shapes, styles, and sizes. Then some of the modders tried including scythes, but every single scythe looked the same. Why is this?

Here's my theory: Designers like swords, axes, hammers, and staffs because there are various ways to design them. There are nigh-infinite ways to draw swords: lightsabers, the Master sword, Soul Edge, a katana. All swords. Think of all the ways you could visualize a staff. Visual artists resort to these weapon types because they're general and there's multiple ways to draw them. Having different visual styles for a single weapon type adds flavor and variety to a game. But, the scythe has a very certain shape and fixed curvature. The scythe in one game would look just like the scythe in the next game, and would be pretty boring.

You know... I like your theory, I got to admit it makes more sense than mine.
The visual design theory makes the most since, when you think of a scythe, you pretty much think of the same looking thing, unlike swords and such.

You can design scythes to look different. Make the blade larger/smaller, pole longer/shorter, and the color of the blade different.