Why do sci-fi writers do this?
- Thread starter Owen Robertson
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They recently introduced another one that achieved a higher level of technology than the Forerunners and these guys are called the Precursors. Google Precursors Halo and have a look yourself.Reaper195 said:
Parental issues on the point of a writer? It may well be easier to write a story about expanding out into someone else's old power than forging new horizon's. Also, it allows for the "Don't ask how it works; we don't know either" excuse about the science.Owen Robertson said:
Also, perhaps, drama?
Furthermore:
Your professional attitude toward writing really helps put your point into perspective.Owen Robertson said:
Actually there are 3 super advanced, ancient civilizations from the Halo Universe. The Forerunners who had super-advanced technology that allowed them to achieve all the wonderful things they did. Ancient humanity who were on the same level as the Forerunners but regressed to the level we know of in real life after the Halo Rings fired. And the Precursors that were said to be on such a level of evolution that they could warp reality itself.
What is special about these types of ancient civilizations is that it allows convenient plot devices that can expand on the in-story universe and characters, and even solve situations that the protagonists can't fix on their own. Beyond that though in my mind the real appeal of super-advanced civilizations/aliens, whether long-since extinct or currently active and whom influence the plot directly, is that it humbles the humans and allows them to realize how small a fixture they are in a larger universe and that there is so much more out there to experience. It gives the humans a goal, a benchmark, to reach in their evolution that gives them hope for the future that their efforts in expanding their civilization aren't meaningless.
What is special about these types of ancient civilizations is that it allows convenient plot devices that can expand on the in-story universe and characters, and even solve situations that the protagonists can't fix on their own. Beyond that though in my mind the real appeal of super-advanced civilizations/aliens, whether long-since extinct or currently active and whom influence the plot directly, is that it humbles the humans and allows them to realize how small a fixture they are in a larger universe and that there is so much more out there to experience. It gives the humans a goal, a benchmark, to reach in their evolution that gives them hope for the future that their efforts in expanding their civilization aren't meaningless.
I don't find it lazy at all. Why couldn't a universe (well galaxy anyways) that essentially started from scratch only end up having 1 dominant race? Just the way evolution worked that cycle. This time around we get 25 or so races.itchcrotch said:
That's not getting into things like there may have been other lesser races that we know nothing about, races the Protheans may have destroyed, races that died off due to war or plagues or whatnot.
I'd only cry lazy if the mass effect only had humans, thereby kinda insinuating there is only ever 1 race. but that would be just boring.
Because it's realistic. On Earth, cultures rebuilt their cities on the ruins of previous civilizations. Troy as rebuilt about a dozen times, as as Uruk, and Athens. Whern you consider the mathematics of it, there should have been thousands of previous civilization out there among the stars. Most of them would have collapsed somehow, so their technology remains.Owen Robertson said:
It also allows for quick technological development without cultural changes, as well as tech for the humans and aliens to fight over.
Despite how used it is, I do still love that way of doing it.
I agree it would be nice to see a few more plots that don't depend on finding the right Ancient Alien Toaster before the bad guys do.
"Precursor" Civilizations are pretty much just all-purpose plot grease. Take the good old-fashioned myths of Atlantis and throw on some Alien paint and you've got a "new" variation on this useful-but-tired trope.
In addition to all the other reasons others have already given, you get to have your cake and eat it too when it comes to "macguffins". A Fantasy-style ancient magic artifact of great power but with the added flavour of also being "advanced" and futuristic at the same time for example. In video games it provides a ready-made set of power-ups, Quests, plot-lines and even currencies.
Much more powerful civilizations that have still fallen, been defeated, or were wiped out also can be used as simple set dressing to make the Bad Aliens of the piece more menacing because another alien race with much fancier toys was wiped out "X thousand years ago" and presumably the Bad Aliens are even more powerful now while humans aren't even at par with the dead guys.
Even less advanced extinct alien civilizations could still be the focus of the story in much the same way as ancient human civilizations are the "focus" of the Tomb raider and Uncharted games.
Plus it's a great way to make comments about human nature and its good/bad/greedy/occasionally wise varieties.
There are other ways to do all of that of course. The only problem is that writing is basically a "non-issue" to most Publishers and as good as video game writers are getting when they do have room to stretch their legs a little, the QUALITY of the writing is nowhere near what is available in other media so anything that makes the process easier is leaped at.
"Precursor" Civilizations are pretty much just all-purpose plot grease. Take the good old-fashioned myths of Atlantis and throw on some Alien paint and you've got a "new" variation on this useful-but-tired trope.
In addition to all the other reasons others have already given, you get to have your cake and eat it too when it comes to "macguffins". A Fantasy-style ancient magic artifact of great power but with the added flavour of also being "advanced" and futuristic at the same time for example. In video games it provides a ready-made set of power-ups, Quests, plot-lines and even currencies.
Much more powerful civilizations that have still fallen, been defeated, or were wiped out also can be used as simple set dressing to make the Bad Aliens of the piece more menacing because another alien race with much fancier toys was wiped out "X thousand years ago" and presumably the Bad Aliens are even more powerful now while humans aren't even at par with the dead guys.
Even less advanced extinct alien civilizations could still be the focus of the story in much the same way as ancient human civilizations are the "focus" of the Tomb raider and Uncharted games.
Plus it's a great way to make comments about human nature and its good/bad/greedy/occasionally wise varieties.
There are other ways to do all of that of course. The only problem is that writing is basically a "non-issue" to most Publishers and as good as video game writers are getting when they do have room to stretch their legs a little, the QUALITY of the writing is nowhere near what is available in other media so anything that makes the process easier is leaped at.
Absolutely. It's possible that in a few thousand years we'll all be speaking french.Jedoro said:
Actually, I'm pretty sure I read some fantasy books with that concept a few years ago already. The setting was just standard fantasy, with magic and swords and all that, but after a while the books started hinting about things that had happened a few thousand years ago that were extremely similar to bits from our recent history, and in the end you found some ruins and 'strange technology' that looked like 20th century stuff..except the ruins were ruled by the standard GlaDOS-type robots.tehlordofmyownworld said:
(Yet with less cakes.)
Apparently this was confirmed in Serenity, so you're right.Sean951 said:
However, this simply replaces my earlier incredulity with a series of new ones. How the hell does such a complex solar system remain tidally stable? How are planets and moons not periodically baked or frozen by the interaction of it's five stars? How do all these planets and moons have tolerable gravity and atmospheric density, terraforming or no?
My point was that space opera tends to do away with realism. How does a lightsaber work? It kind of doesn't, but damned if it doesn't look cool.
I'm not using this as an insult to space opera, it's simply a balance between prediction and broad narrative, and actually I think prediction is only possible or productive in near future settings. Any setting where people are flying around in space ships and moving between inhabited planets has a pretty tenuous claim to be predictive of any real or plausible future we can imagine right now, so you may as well have a little fun and have everyone dress and act like stock Western characters in space.
It was an exciting idea, once, and being an exciting idea, everyone felt they had to do it.
Why does everyone have to stick undead you have to shoot in the head in their stories?
Why does everyone have to have things beyond human understanding that like pissing off Euclid?
These ideas didn't start out as cliches, strange as it may seem, but they've been over-used to ridiculous extents.
Though, what really gets me is TV shows that have a whole bunch of ancient god-like races that explored the galaxy before humanity had crawled out of the primordial ooze etc etc...and they are mentioned in one episode only, and never seem to interact with each other.
Not a new thing, Conan the Barbarian kept running into pre-human civilisations that used to run the entire world nobody (including each other) had ever heard of before or since. One is believable, half a dozen is not.
...
As mentioned by others, they allow you to easily have "Today, but with alien tech" stories, though these tend to handwave teh difficulties of using advanced alien tech.
Why does everyone have to stick undead you have to shoot in the head in their stories?
Why does everyone have to have things beyond human understanding that like pissing off Euclid?
These ideas didn't start out as cliches, strange as it may seem, but they've been over-used to ridiculous extents.
Though, what really gets me is TV shows that have a whole bunch of ancient god-like races that explored the galaxy before humanity had crawled out of the primordial ooze etc etc...and they are mentioned in one episode only, and never seem to interact with each other.
Not a new thing, Conan the Barbarian kept running into pre-human civilisations that used to run the entire world nobody (including each other) had ever heard of before or since. One is believable, half a dozen is not.
...
As mentioned by others, they allow you to easily have "Today, but with alien tech" stories, though these tend to handwave teh difficulties of using advanced alien tech.
Discovery is the most interesting thing for a human mind. Being part of the discovery draws you in. Not to mention it ensures that the reader isn't separated from the world because they aren't clued up on the happenings that the main characters are.
It's a literary shortcut that makes the reader feel at one with the world they are coming to inhabit and I personally don't see the issue.
It's a literary shortcut that makes the reader feel at one with the world they are coming to inhabit and I personally don't see the issue.
Because we only have two ways to go with aliens. The past and the present.
Lost civilizations allow us to see tech that wasn't made by us but create a sense of mystery.
Lost civilizations allow us to see tech that wasn't made by us but create a sense of mystery.
That "aliens eating/destroying right angles" thing sounds a bit like Jack McDevitt's work.iaculum said:
