Why I Didn't Like Mass Effect 2

[LebbyLegs]

So there are my reasons that I didn't like ME2. Please comment enlightening me as to why you thought the game was an orgasmic experience of jesus proportions, or why you were underwhelmed, or engage in a healthy debate about my points
Thank you, and remember this is all my opinion

I skipped the side quests in ME1, and then ME2 came out two days later, and skipped them too. It was an orgasmic experience. It turns out that the choices in ME1 matter, but I didn't miss anything for skipping them in ME2. When I did a replay it was really boring, yes. Mass Effect 1 had all sorts of surprises if you replayed it, but not ME2. I skipped the planet scanning (or did very little) my first run through, so I was fine. Two people died for me, but I put Thane in the vents. Thought he was going to die in 6 months anyway, so it didn't matter, but then I remembered Legion. I also skipped going around talking too people, everyone except Miranda.

As for just shooting in side missions, I must agree. It turns out the side missions are important in ME1, as I went into ME2 not knowing who Cerberus was. I found myself agreeing and loving the Illusive Man the whole way through, and then I played the side missions of ME1 and thought he was a disgusting bastard.

I don't know about this angst. Could you clarify?

As for choices, I completely agree, to save programming time, they put all choices into the same cut scene. Then they slightly changed each one depending on what you're choice was. It certainly didn't make going back to make a new save file worth it.

Personally I think the amazing final mission is what made it so great for everyone. Can you really tell me you didn't get goosebumps when you saw the reapers coming?

Indeed I did get goosebumps, and dont get me wrong, I will get ME3.
I think ME2 Suffered from being the middle. It wasn't a strong start, or an epic ending, it was the meandering middle.
I think ME3 could be an absolutely amazing experience, and seeing Earth under attack just gave me chills
2 Whole games, One dead reaper (at the cost of a fleet) and one dead Reaper Embryo... I look forward to seeing how ur meant to wipe 100's in one game

 

[Cryo84R]

Every time someone 'romances' Tali, a species goes extinct.

 

[LawlessSquirrel]

Even though I disagree with your conclusion, I more-or-less agree with your reasoning. I personally found ME2 to be a better game, but ME1 was fantastic in it's own right. I just can't make myself replay the first game, but I've replayed the second twice.

The characters I thought were much better, and obviously more plentiful. Overall, much more enjoyable. HOWEVER, in Mass Effect, the characters would banter and chat along missions quite frequently, or in elevators. I really missed this in Mass Effect 2.

In the first game, I would forgo the useful character in favour of the character that would have the most interest in whatever task I'm undertaking, like taking Liara to some prothean site despite her not being the most useful there. In ME2, the only squad-mate of importance was the one you were there for, the others just occasionally make a joke mid-dialogue.

Another issue was how annoying it was when characters ran out of dialogue on the Normandy in ME2. I know there's only so much dialogue they can include, but it's frustrating to talk to someone to only get one response over and over again. They could have had a couple of options and just switch them out at random or something.

On that same note: the DLC characters. I hated Zaeed, loved Kasumi. They fit in well with everything though, and worked out overall, but they never spoke to you outside of missions other than a click-hear anecdote sort of way. There's no difference really, but the lack of a branching dialogue makes me worried that the characters will have no consequence in the future.

I also agree with you on the missions. Most are very well done, but the gameplay feels very cut-and-paste. This was my biggest issue in my first play-through. It just came across as repetitive, like every known force in the galaxy hired the same three mercenary groups to shoot at you. At least the combat's better, and there are some great missions if you find them, but they seem a bit dependant on firefights most of the time.

Anyway, other than those issues, I found Mass Effect 2 to be the superior game. I get your complaint about your choices not seeming significant, but what I enjoyed was knowing that everything would come back in the third game, and seeing how the events of the first game are slowly shaping up. Wrex, for example, is easily replaced by Wreav, but Wreav wants war, while Wrex is uniting the clans. No effect in ME2, but bound to be important in ME3.

Also, there's a hell load of choices and arcs that are easy to miss. I missed a lot on my first playthrough, and not by rushing. For example, the 9 (or 10) romance options, the 4+ wars you can start or prevent, etc. There's more if you get the DLC, but if you weren't happy with the game it's probably not worth expanding it.

Arg, long post is long.

 

[LebbyLegs]

Even though I disagree with your conclusion, I more-or-less agree with your reasoning. I personally found ME2 to be a better game, but ME1 was fantastic in it's own right. I just can't make myself replay the first game, but I've replayed the second twice.

The characters I thought were much better, and obviously more plentiful. Overall, much more enjoyable. HOWEVER, in Mass Effect, the characters would banter and chat along missions quite frequently, or in elevators. I really missed this in Mass Effect 2.

In the first game, I would forgo the useful character in favour of the character that would have the most interest in whatever task I'm undertaking, like taking Liara to some prothean site despite her not being the most useful there. In ME2, the only squad-mate of importance was the one you were there for, the others just occasionally make a joke mid-dialogue.

Another issue was how annoying it was when characters ran out of dialogue on the Normandy in ME2. I know there's only so much dialogue they can include, but it's frustrating to talk to someone to only get one response over and over again. They could have had a couple of options and just switch them out at random or something.

On that same note: the DLC characters. I hated Zaeed, loved Kasumi. They fit in well with everything though, and worked out overall, but they never spoke to you outside of missions other than a click-hear anecdote sort of way. There's no difference really, but the lack of a branching dialogue makes me worried that the characters will have no consequence in the future.

I also agree with you on the missions. Most are very well done, but the gameplay feels very cut-and-paste. This was my biggest issue in my first play-through. It just came across as repetitive, like every known force in the galaxy hired the same three mercenary groups to shoot at you. At least the combat's better, and there are some great missions if you find them, but they seem a bit dependant on firefights most of the time.

Anyway, other than those issues, I found Mass Effect 2 to be the superior game. I get your complaint about your choices not seeming significant, but what I enjoyed was knowing that everything would come back in the third game, and seeing how the events of the first game are slowly shaping up. Wrex, for example, is easily replaced by Wreav, but Wreav wants war, while Wrex is uniting the clans. No effect in ME2, but bound to be important in ME3.

Also, there's a hell load of choices and arcs that are easy to miss. I missed a lot on my first playthrough, and not by rushing. For example, the 9 (or 10) romance options, the 4+ wars you can start or prevent, etc. There's more if you get the DLC, but if you weren't happy with the game it's probably not worth expanding it.

Arg, long post is long.

But Valid

 

[Infinatex]

So if I hated ME 1 does that mean I might like this?

Yes. I didn't like ME 1 until the end and I loved ME 2 all the way through. Awesome game.

I think I will get the PS3 version when it's released then!

 

[IBlackKiteI]

snip

OK, I'm confused. I'm not sure what the purpose of this topic is. Why should I, or anyone else for that matter, care about your opinions of Mass Effect 2? I liked it. A lot of other people like it. You don't. Are you surprised that your opinion differs from the majority? Because simple logic dictates that this is no unnatural occurrence. I mean, you can theoretically flip a coin ten times and get "heads" each one, but that doesn't mean that that coin is actually more likely to land on heads. Since the physical properties of the coin haven't changed, it is obviously still a 50-50 chance, no matter how many times it lands on "heads". This applies to your Mass Effect 2 problem as well, in that no matter how many OTHER people enjoy the game, that doesn't make it any more likely that you will enjoy it.

So I ask again, what's your point?

Ahhh I remember you from a while ago, you went on a big rant similar to your post right here when I said I disliked Mass Effect.

Considering your arrogance you are either a Mass Effect fanatic or, judging from your posts everywhere you're just ignorant, plain and simple.

Hmm. Ok. First of all, I am not a "Mass Effect fanboy". In fact, if you look at my post, you'll find that nowhere do I say the OP is WRONG in his disliking of ME2. Just the opposite. My POINT was not that ME2 is some kind of perfect masterpiece(It certainly isn't, nor is the first game), it was that this topic doesn't really have any discussion value, since there's really nothing to say past "everyone's entitled to an opinion".

So unless you think that people aren't entitled to their opinions, I'm not sure where you get off calling me arrogant or ignorant. I don't think I badmouthed you or the OP, so I'm not sure why you felt the need to insult me. Maybe you've misinterpreted my tone, but I assure you, I'm not angry at the OP for disliking ME2, or you for disliking ME1. If I gave you that impression, I'm honestly sorry, albeit a bit confused.

So, to recap: The only point I've ever been trying to get across is that people are entitled to their opinions, I don't resent you or the OP for having an opinion different from mine, and frankly I'd like to know why you think I'm arrogant or ignorant.

Do you really not realise that it seems like you are just talking down to the guy?

Admittedly my reason for originally replying to this is mainly because of your response to a thread of mine from a while back, your response was quite like this and undeniably offensive. I then saw that all of your recent posts were quite similar, basically criticising others having opinions which differ from yours.

Obviously it would be stupid to continue on this in a different thread, but if you seriously aren't just trying to be a jerk rewriting things before you post them so you don't sound like one is a good idea.

 

[Xaositect]

All absolutely spot on complaints that I fully agree with (bar most counts - Garrus SUCKS in ME2 - Im not a furry who wants to bone him, so I get no dialogue at all).

After everything I was promised for ME2, all I got for it was "visceral shooter combat" being constantly shoved down my throat.

Still, since the game is virtually dedicated to shooter combat, they can pretty much ignore it in ME3 and concentrate on the story, characters and improving other aspects of gameplay and combat.

I mean they would be hypocrites if they didnt, and clearly would simply WANT their games to be that dumbed down.

 

[Alien Mole]

Y'know, I feel Jacob would've been better if he'd just been a bit more distant. He's supposed to be this awesome ex-pirate (corsair, is it?) and a gifted leader of men - he's your third in command (Miranda's XO, right?) so it's good to have him on your side and things, but he's the quintessential 'straight man' as well, right? I.e. the dependable one that doesn't get loaded down with a backstory full of ridiculous twists that would shatter any but the greatest minds?

That's what you're supposed to feel about him, anyways. The problem, I think, is that he's so accessible. Yes, you briefly have to earn his trust but I felt that once that was established he essentially became a non-character. I think it would've helped if he were a bit more reluctant to share things with you (no traumatic reason, it's just who he is) and you had to work at getting close to him a bit more, so you'd want it more as well. It wouldn't be a trust issue - he'd always be on your side, just as the 'cool, professional, distant but in charge' variant of 'generic soldier guy' than 'generic soldier guy classic.' I think it'd have been enough to just occasionally show him interacting with the crew in ways that show they respect him and think he's awesome or something. He just sort of falls flat in isolation - I was honestly surprised that he was a viable choice in the end mission for... well, the thing he was a viable choice for, not wishing to spoil anything.

 

[Xaositect]

Y'know, I feel Jacob would've been better if he'd just been a bit more distant. He's supposed to be this awesome ex-pirate (corsair, is it?) and a gifted leader of men - he's your third in command (Miranda's XO, right?) so it's good to have him on your side and things, but he's the quintessential 'straight man' as well, right? I.e. the dependable one that doesn't get loaded down with a backstory full of ridiculous twists that would shatter any but the greatest minds?

That's what you're supposed to feel about him, anyways. The problem, I think, is that he's so accessible. Yes, you briefly have to earn his trust but I felt that once that was established he essentially became a non-character. I think it would've helped if he were a bit more reluctant to share things with you (no traumatic reason, it's just who he is) and you had to work at getting close to him a bit more, so you'd want it more as well. It wouldn't be a trust issue - he'd always be on your side, just as the 'cool, professional, distant but in charge' variant of 'generic soldier guy' than 'generic soldier guy classic.' I think it'd have been enough to just occasionally show him interacting with the crew in ways that show they respect him and think he's awesome or something. He just sort of falls flat in isolation - I was honestly surprised that he was a viable choice in the end mission for... well, the thing he was a viable choice for, not wishing to spoil anything.

He wasnt a pirate, he was ex-alliance special forces. Corsairs was the name of their special forces unit (and it sucks... badly).

Jacobs main problem is that he is Kaidan, but black. With an insulting, and godawful romance added in instead of one like Kaidans from ME1 (at least from what I have seen and heard).

Jacobs the guy without any real problems at all,just like Kaidan, and if any do come along they stress the point that they are fine, can deal with it, and require no melodrama.

This wouldnt have been a problem for me if Kaidan didnt exist in ME1 (even if he is dead in some of my saves), but since he did, I already have, or had in some cases, that kind of solid, go-to guy whos got a cool read on everything.

Plus like the OP said, when you add in his "blackness", that ridiculous "hood" style handshake, and his attitude talking about going for drinks on the citadel, it just comes across as stupid, since for the majority of the game hes been talking and acting like any other character, black or not.

Most other characters were either boring or annoying in my books.

Zaeed and Kasumi are okay on the surface, fairly interesting. Scratch beneath their surface and youll find a yawning chasm of nothingness. I dont count stupid, repeating comments on the ship as proper characterisation.

Mordin is definitely one of the best. Good comic relief, although tied to one of the games many horrific and idiotic plotholes sadly, especially since hes one of the only uniquely placed characters in the game. Also his loyalty mission is pretty bad. Its essentially a load of pissy moralising about a situation which is an irrefutable "damned if you do, damned if you dont".

Samara was also one of my favourites, but I can easily see how for many other people she might just be a total bore. Still, she gets massive kudos for being one of two characters to introduce the only "not a shoot every last thing until it dies from it.... from behind cover" missions in the entire game, bar those pathetic 5 minute N7 ones which were garbage.

Thane isnt so bad. He bored the living piss out of my, and I didnt like the masturbating the game did over him either. Still, one of the few characters with actual decent content provided youre the correct gender I suppose. Not sure how it works with talking to him if your a femshep who turns him down... Again though, like Samara, he gets brownie points for giving players who dont care about "visceral shooter combat" being shoved down their neck all the time a breather from the rest of the game.

Grunt. Opposite of Samara for me. Absolutely boring character, but I imagine some found him interesting. He was never going to measure up after Wrex. Wrex is the only thing I like about the Krogan in the game. Most of the other stuff involving them, including the humour, just gets on my nerves. Grunt is about as deep as his name would suggest though.

Tali and Garrus suck balls. Sure, if you were one of those freaks who wanted to screw them in ME1, these characters are tailor made for your twisted preferences. I however just liked them in ME1 as characters, not as missed romance opportunities, so in ME2, I just get "calibrations" or "engine cleaning". These two are a prime examble of why character development sucked in ME2: too little of it, and in some cases, none at all.

Legion is amazing character potential that is just wasted on this game. By the time he arrives the game its almost over. The only thing I cared about him was that I didnt care about him, but knew I could if the writers in ME2 werent so lazy, and decided to just let the gameplay designers have their way with shoving in shooter combat all the time.

Jack... I hated her. Im sure many had fun cracking that vile, profanity laden, skanky looking exterior to find her warm heart. Me? I know Baldurs Gate II did that romance a million times better in the form of Viconia, so why bother with ME2s attempt? And since that was all there was to her, and I stuck with Liara from ME1, all I got from her was her loyalty missions and a few "fuck offs".

Miranda. Same as before. That similar pattern of "if you want content, youve got to bed these crappy characters". After I ran her errand, I didnt pursue any romantic dialogue, and was rewarded by no more dialogue afterwards.

I didnt mean to write such a long post on this issue, but I think Ive managed to demonstrate why the characters suck in ME2. Not "why you cant like them", as Im sure some fanboys would like to suggest. But you just cant argue that most characters offering nothing bar a romance, or a mission mainly driven by shooter combat means that a) they are hugely flawed in design, and b) are nowhere near as deep as people like to make out when hyping this game up. The game is character driven from a standpoint of simply aquiring them, and running their errandds. Its not at all character driven in the sense that they develop over the course of the game, and hold a unique place in the story. 90% of the characters in ME2 occupy an interchangeable role, and only develop outside of a "you havent ran my errand" or "you have ran my errand" basis.

TL;DR The characters in ME2 on your squad are definitely NOT what they are cracked up to be, if you listen to hype.

 

[GiantRaven]

Shepard is very invasive, so much it's awkward and unconvincing.
Do people like this exist? A guy who strolls into your work place and says "Mind if I ask you a bunch of deeply personal questions?"
My closest friends don't just announce that they want to ask for my life story, let alone people I work with.

I think this is where male Shepard's particularly bad/unemotional voice acting really helps the character. Shepard is clearly incredibly socially inept and his shipmates are humouring him out of sheer awkwardness.

 

[mattttherman3]

Mass Effect 2 is my favorite game, but your points are indeed valid. However, characters like Mordin, Jack, Thane, Legion were all pretty deep. As for reuniting with Wrex, easily one of my top 3 moments in the game.

 

[Xaositect]

I think this is where male Shepard's particularly bad/unemotional voice acting really helps the character. Shepard is clearly incredibly socially inept and his shipmates are humouring him out of sheer awkwardness.

I can never understand the denial central around female Shepard fans who seem to be unable to recognise that Jennifer Hale delivers her lines in a very similar manner to Mark Meer. With the added bonus of sounding fake (Jennifer Hale cant do tough sounding characters - I knew that 10 years ago with baldurs gate, and I still know it today).

The Shepard character NEEDS a level of neutrality in their tone. If they reacted like any of the other voice actors in most situations, it would put more players off, I guarantee. There are enough complaints with the transition from conversation wheel choice to the actual line spoken. Adding on "why does she seem to excited here" or "why is there a hint of sadness in his voice here, I didnt want that" will only make things worse.

 

[GiantRaven]

I think this is where male Shepard's particularly bad/unemotional voice acting really helps the character. Shepard is clearly incredibly socially inept and his shipmates are humouring him out of sheer awkwardness.

I can never understand the denial central around female Shepard fans who seem to be unable to recognise that Jennifer Hale delivers her lines in a very similar manner to Mark Meer. With the added bonus of sounding fake (Jennifer Hale cant do tough sounding characters - I knew that 10 years ago with baldurs gate, and I still know it today).

The Shepard character NEEDS a level of neutrality in their tone. If they reacted like any of the other voice actors in most situations, it would put more players off, I guarantee. There are enough complaints with the transition from conversation wheel choice to the actual line spoken. Adding on "why does she seem to excited here" or "why is there a hint of sadness in his voice here, I didnt want that" will only make things worse.

I've never actually played a female Shepard - I enjoy male Shep's voice acting too much. So yeah, no denial here.

 

[Frozen Donkey Wheel2]

*snip*
Do you really not realise that it seems like you are just talking down to the guy?

*another one*
...I then saw that all of your recent posts were quite similar, basically criticising others having opinions which differ from yours.

*and again*

Alright, yeah, I was being a bit pretentious. But not because I LOOOVE Mass Effect so much, but because I hate it when people use this site like a blog, putting up some random list of thoughts without leaving much room for discussion value. Like this topic.(By the way, the OP took far less offense then you did. Just, you know, FYI)

Now, on to the other bit of the conversation I didn't get rid of.....Dude, you're really getting on my nerves with this stuff. The first post I made on this topic, again, was just about how people are entitled to their opinions. You know, the EXACT OPPOSITE of "criticizing others for having different opinions". Then, you quoted me and called me a jerk out the blue. So I EXPLAINED that my post was only about how people are entitled to their opinions. Now, I'm doing it again. What part of "people are entitled to their opinions" are you not getting here? And if I'm coming off as a jerk again, it's only because I have literally explained this to you THREE TIMES now. I'd really appreciate it if you stopped accusing me saying something I PROVABLY did not say.

And I went through my recent posts, too. The only example of "putting people down for having different opinions" that I could find was against the WBC. I am, again, a little confused.

 

[MiracleOfSound]

To each his own. I preferred ME2 for two reasons; I thought the characters were more interesting, and the gameplay was ten million times better. I did prefer the story in the first one though. I'm not sure why.

Probably because all the exposition happened in the first one. Learning all about the science and politics of the ME Universe was totally fascinating and in ME2 it was just... already there.

Me1 had that 'wow' factor of showing you this entire new universe, while in ME2 they focused more on bringing drama to it.

That said, I loved both stories equally and see them as one as opposed to separate parts.

 

[LebbyLegs]

*snip*
Do you really not realise that it seems like you are just talking down to the guy?

*another one*
...I then saw that all of your recent posts were quite similar, basically criticising others having opinions which differ from yours.

*and again*

Alright, yeah, I was being a bit pretentious. But not because I LOOOVE Mass Effect so much, but because I hate it when people use this site like a blog, putting up some random list of thoughts without leaving much room for discussion value. Like this topic.(By the way, the OP took far less offense then you did. Just, you know, FYI)

Now, on to the other bit of the conversation I didn't get rid of.....Dude, you're really getting on my nerves with this stuff. The first post I made on this topic, again, was just about how people are entitled to their opinions. You know, the EXACT OPPOSITE of "criticizing others for having different opinions". Then, you quoted me and called me a jerk out the blue. So I EXPLAINED that my post was only about how people are entitled to their opinions. Now, I'm doing it again. What part of "people are entitled to their opinions" are you not getting here? And if I'm coming off as a jerk again, it's only because I have literally explained this to you THREE TIMES now. I'd really appreciate it if you stopped accusing me saying something I PROVABLY did not say.

And I went through my recent posts, too. The only example of "putting people down for having different opinions" that I could find was against the WBC. I am, again, a little confused.

I didn't mean for this to sound like a blog, I just wanted people to discuss my points and their opinion on them (I thought the forum 'Gaming Discussion' was suitable for this)
As for your disagreements, I appreciate BlackKite that your fighting a perceived wrong (perhaps even on my part, cheers ) But i believe That Frozen Donkey really didn't mean any harm, and was simply expressing his annoyance for another perceived wrong.

I can tell you're both intelligent cats, so theres really no need for the bickering right? Sorry to sound like a smug preacher, but I don't like conflict and certainly not on my thread

 

[Frozen Donkey Wheel2]

I didn't mean for this to sound like a blog, I just wanted people to discuss my points and their opinion on them (I thought the forum 'Gaming Discussion' was suitable for this)
As for your disagreements, I appreciate BlackKite that your fighting a perceived wrong (perhaps even on my part, cheers ) But i believe That Frozen Donkey really didn't mean any harm, and was simply expressing his annoyance for another perceived wrong.

I can tell you're both intelligent cats, so theres really no need for the bickering right? Sorry to sound like a smug preacher, but I don't like conflict and certainly not on my thread

Man, THANK you. I was starting to think I was missing something here. And anyway, you're probably right. "Gaming Discussion" is a pretty broad term, so this topic is actually right at home here. I overreacted in my first post. (Though not as much as SOME people-What? I didn't say anything. I don't know what you're talking about. I'll go now.)

 

[Korten12]

My only hate with ME2 was that Garrus would never finish his dang calibrations!

I mean seriously he only has 2 times when he actually talks to you! the rest is Sidonis and calibrations!

GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

It's soooo true!