Okay, one thing. Was that cheap jab at the game really necessary? "Glorified dating sim" screams of talking about a game that you don't have extensive knowledge of and that you are just looking for a reason to bash it.xXxJessicaxXx said:
Why is Catherine getting such great reviews.
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I understand where you are coming from. I had a female friend who felt the same way about Duke Nukem Forever.xXxJessicaxXx said:
PureAussieGamer said:
THIS!
Exactly this!
To equate Catherine with Duke Nukem is borderline criminally ignorant and it really is what she's doing here. I couldn't have asked for a better jumping point lol. She's basically calling a naked painting that is a work of art pornography here just because both contain nudity, only in game form, I hope I don't need to say any more to show why this is a bad idea.
As I said, the game's depth stems from the PSYCHOLOGICAL aspects of it. It explores the way a male psyche works when under the power of the female charm. The actual nudity is just the physical expression and typical trigger of it. I don't know where you got that part about it's actual worth being the half naked women, but I never said anything of the sort.xXxJessicaxXx said:
The worth of the game is in it's exploration of the herbivorous male archetype when pursued by aggressive women. Also the music rules and the puzzles are fun. Nudity is handled with tact and class like in any high level media that has cheap thrills as parts of itself without actually loosing any of the depth. (Blade Runner comes to mind for this)
I refused to play another game with Anime Cutscenes, they always make me facepalm with their corniness.
I can agree with you about the game being for men only. Let's be real, most women aren't interested in weak wishy-washy guys like Vincent both here in America and Japan. Vincent was designed to appeal to hardcore gamers (ie dorks and nerds). Vincent isn't really the star here, the star is Catherine the hypersexualized vixen.xXxJessicaxXx said:
These captcha suck, there is no spam. They found another way to force us to watch more ads. SolveMedia is horrible and will drive people away.
Whatever makes you feel better about playing it. There is no reason why they had to objectify women like they did for the sake of the story. It's just pandering to fanboys and sex appeal. I haven't even seen any media for the game yet that doesn't have Catherine with half her clothes hanging off and thats what puts me off.Dreiko said:
It's really no different from Duke Nukem from a my point of view. They should be more tasteful about things like the art you reference. It's like Mass Effect 2 advertisments all featuring Miranda in her lingerie, there is no need for it.
I think I am going to have to agree to disagree with you here and move on as you seem to not be getting my point at all.
If that's the actual reason, it's a stupid one, it just reverses the problem. Now the in-engine cutscenes are too low...RedEyesBlackGamer said:They are still louder than the other scenes. I think I know why. The animated cutscenes in Persona 4 (The dev team's last game) were criticized for being too low. They were very hard to hear. I think this is them overcompensating for that. I can just see a designer now: "That loud enough for ya?"Kakulukia said:I'm getting it as soon as the paycheck comes in. I think it's the first Japanese game that's genuinely interested me this generation.
I have one quick question for those who played the full game, though: did they fix the volume issues from the demo? The pre-animated cutscenes were SOOO much louder than the in-engine ones I'm almost afraid to play the demo at night for fear of waking the neighbors during cutscenes...
Guess I'll have to keep the remote handy... or play with headphones.
xXxJessicaxXx said:
I get what bugs you, I don't get why you can't momentarily overlook that and give the game a go for an hour or two and see what comes out of it.
Oh and please don't equate it to duke, that's the shallowest game ever made, sex doesn't mean anything in that game, it's just there to make 12-yo boys buy it.
I think it's getting such great reviews because it's doing something different. In a time where a lot of devs go for the 'safe' option (copy and pasted FPS/RPG etc someone's taking a risk and doing something a bit left of centre. I just think that's something we, the consumer, should support as well if the industry, which has been feeling a little stagnant to me, is ever going to develop.
someone's taking a risk and doing something a bit left of centre. I just think that's something we, the consumer, should support as well if the industry, which has been feeling a little stagnant to me, is ever going to develop.
I just played through it to see what the fuss was about, and yes, it is maybe one of the best narratives in gaming history. The puzzle gameplay is interesting, if you are into that sort of thing, which I am, but the story really drives the game.
The fact that it is about commitment issues and real-life choices was the selling point for me. It is drawn in bright colors instead of the by todays standard normal "dirt spectrum". In other words: It's a much needed breath of fresh air.
The objectifying is not really an issue since it would be exactly what's going on inside your head, should you end in same situation as the protagonist Vincent. I've been in a similar situation once or twice, and the social dynamics are actually quite believable (maybe except for the waitress Erica).
Does it deserve the great reviews? Definitely. Games are much more than gameplay, they are an artform, and as a piece of art Catherine shines.
The fact that it is about commitment issues and real-life choices was the selling point for me. It is drawn in bright colors instead of the by todays standard normal "dirt spectrum". In other words: It's a much needed breath of fresh air.
The objectifying is not really an issue since it would be exactly what's going on inside your head, should you end in same situation as the protagonist Vincent. I've been in a similar situation once or twice, and the social dynamics are actually quite believable (maybe except for the waitress Erica).
Does it deserve the great reviews? Definitely. Games are much more than gameplay, they are an artform, and as a piece of art Catherine shines.
I agree with Jessica. I have not played the game and was just searching for an interesting game when i found an article about this. Although the puzzle elements sound like they could be ok the whole concept is pretty off putting. I think you get pretty sick of the sexist overrtones in games - its a vindictive and lazy way of making a game.
From reading articles about this game, part of the problem that jumps out at me, apart from the blatantly obvious pornographic imagery, is the way they have represented the two women in the game. They create two unrealistic and one dimensional caricatures of women, which are defined from the male perspective. The 'main' character's girlfriend is defined by wanting to get married and having the one dimensional traits of being focused and grounded but apparently lacking in humour and "fun," (and a lack of sexuality, if that is possible, also seems to be implied). Then there is another caricature of a woman who appears to be only fun loving and sexualised, but sexualised in a way that actually suppresses her own sexuality in that she is satisfying the desires of men but not he own, which is again unrealistic and pretty disturbing.
Anyway by presenting his 'girfriend' as apparently a bit dull and seeking commitment, it is promoting the ridiculous superficial old idea that marriage means you will lose having fun, lose freedom and be "unsatisifed sexually." Whereas it is also encouraging you to think that adultery is understandable as it glorifies the other woman as representing "freedom" and "sexuality." Of course any idiot would realise that the have split one full person in half and that genuine marriage is complete.
For some reason he is a position where he gets to choose, while none of the female characters do - and the choice is all about him. It seems like an incredibly self-indulgant and self-pitying game. And of course it is annoying that it allows the main character to commit adultery and then continue to be dishonest by not revealing it. All his decision making would be void if he told katherine with a 'k' and allow her to choose whether she would still stick around with this twit...which obviously she wouldn't and so there would be no game...
From reading articles about this game, part of the problem that jumps out at me, apart from the blatantly obvious pornographic imagery, is the way they have represented the two women in the game. They create two unrealistic and one dimensional caricatures of women, which are defined from the male perspective. The 'main' character's girlfriend is defined by wanting to get married and having the one dimensional traits of being focused and grounded but apparently lacking in humour and "fun," (and a lack of sexuality, if that is possible, also seems to be implied). Then there is another caricature of a woman who appears to be only fun loving and sexualised, but sexualised in a way that actually suppresses her own sexuality in that she is satisfying the desires of men but not he own, which is again unrealistic and pretty disturbing.
Anyway by presenting his 'girfriend' as apparently a bit dull and seeking commitment, it is promoting the ridiculous superficial old idea that marriage means you will lose having fun, lose freedom and be "unsatisifed sexually." Whereas it is also encouraging you to think that adultery is understandable as it glorifies the other woman as representing "freedom" and "sexuality." Of course any idiot would realise that the have split one full person in half and that genuine marriage is complete.
For some reason he is a position where he gets to choose, while none of the female characters do - and the choice is all about him. It seems like an incredibly self-indulgant and self-pitying game. And of course it is annoying that it allows the main character to commit adultery and then continue to be dishonest by not revealing it. All his decision making would be void if he told katherine with a 'k' and allow her to choose whether she would still stick around with this twit...which obviously she wouldn't and so there would be no game...
People rated it high because they liked it. While the puzzles can be soul crushingly difficult, I felt like the champion of the universe when I beat them. As for judging as an outside who hasn't been following the hype, it would be better if you'd ignore the clashing of we want the same old games and the it's new and therefore awesome crowds. And as for repetition, well ALL games are repetitive.
elyawatson said:
You haven't played the game, how do you know he doesn't tell her?
The game has 8 different endings depending on how you play it, there's not just one turn of events you know, you shouldn't rush to judge how a story turns out before you actually go and experience it.
Actually, the "best" ending is when the main character dumps BOTH women for a life without their pressures and demands, so it really does go through with the theme of women's charms being oppressive towards males who have no real way of resisting them without denying their nature.
This was a side point, and whether or not he may tell her at the very end is not of great interest. The representation of the female characters seems to be the real issue with this game.
Some people genuinely like it.
Shocking, I know, but true!
Still, I don't see it as "Art" or the "Breath of fresh air in gaming" that other people see. I see a decent story with a bit of depth turned into a game and marketed in the most objectifying way possible. It's like advertising an art gallery by saying "Lookie here! This painting has a woman in it!"
Shocking, I know, but true!
Still, I don't see it as "Art" or the "Breath of fresh air in gaming" that other people see. I see a decent story with a bit of depth turned into a game and marketed in the most objectifying way possible. It's like advertising an art gallery by saying "Lookie here! This painting has a woman in it!"
I just got the game and have been enjoying it immensely. The narrative so far is rather good and it is interesting to see such a simple premise (a man having to decide his life, which can be a LOT of different things from a responsible adult to a reckless playboy) seem so fresh. As for the erotic element, it is neither sexist nor objectifying (at least not in an offensive way) and comes off as an actual mature representation of the element of sex in daily life as opposed to just tits on a screen (unlike most games feebly attempting to be mature). If you want to see a game that IS sexist, go look at The 3rd Birthday.
I'm not one to treat objects as women either, but I'm flabbergasted that people want to fixate on that one aspect, which if the game is played through to completion, is almost a moot point anyway. This game is mature, and I mean mature as in "a poignant and mature representation of universally-resonating relationship anxiety problems. Not to say that it's something universal to every single testosterone-fueled individual, but a fear of commitment or taking a relationship to "the next level" is a fairly common occurrence. This game handles this theme in the most creative of ways, and the polish downright shines on this work of art.
The puzzle nightmares themselves are, as pointed out in the game, metaphoric trips through a subconscious rife with anxiety, pushing and pulling the blocks that stand in ones path, striving to climb ever higher. The bosses in these levels are the very manifestations of Vincent's inner turmoil that chase him through his nightmares.
The game-within-a-game, Rapunzel, allows the player to hone their skills for the block-moving madness that befalls Vincent while he slumbers, but with a fun retro-arcadey vibe that suits it perfectly.
Stories unfold in the most organic of ways - through Vincent's relationships with his fellow sheeply adventurers and real-life compatriots. By the end of my playthrough I had learned a great deal about these characters and genuinely cared to discover more about their virtual little lives.
So blah blah blah, I know it isn't a game for everyone, nor will I insult your intelligence if you don't care for it, but I found it to be completely engrossing and tons of fun. And I've still got at least seven more playthroughs to go.
The puzzle nightmares themselves are, as pointed out in the game, metaphoric trips through a subconscious rife with anxiety, pushing and pulling the blocks that stand in ones path, striving to climb ever higher. The bosses in these levels are the very manifestations of Vincent's inner turmoil that chase him through his nightmares.
The game-within-a-game, Rapunzel, allows the player to hone their skills for the block-moving madness that befalls Vincent while he slumbers, but with a fun retro-arcadey vibe that suits it perfectly.
Stories unfold in the most organic of ways - through Vincent's relationships with his fellow sheeply adventurers and real-life compatriots. By the end of my playthrough I had learned a great deal about these characters and genuinely cared to discover more about their virtual little lives.
So blah blah blah, I know it isn't a game for everyone, nor will I insult your intelligence if you don't care for it, but I found it to be completely engrossing and tons of fun. And I've still got at least seven more playthroughs to go.