Why is 'Freedom of Speech' so misunderstood?

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twistedmic

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Sep 8, 2009
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If this belongs in Religion and Politics I apologize for mis-posting it, and ask the mods to post it in the correct forum.
But my question is this: Why Freedom of Speech, aka the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America, so misunderstood? And I don't mean just on the internet, people on t.v. news and talk shows misunderstand it too.
So many people think that 'Freedom of Speech' means that they can say what ever they want, wherever and whenever they want without consequences. And if they do get in non-legal trouble (i.e. suspended from school, suspended/banned from a forum or fired from a job) they complain about having their right to free speech violated.
'Freedom of Speech' means that the United States Government cannot pass any laws to limit speech, and cannot arrest people for what they say. Threats of violence or death, and slander and lible are not protected by 'Freedom of Speech'


Slander definition- noun
1.
defamation; calumny: rumors full of slander.
2.
a malicious, false, and defamatory statement or report: a slander against his good name.
3.
Law . defamation by oral utterance rather than by writing, pictures, etc.

Libel definition- noun
1.
Law .
a.
defamation by written or printed words, pictures, or in any form other than by spoken words or gestures.
b.
the act or crime of publishing it.
c.
a formal written declaration or statement, as one containing the allegations of a plaintiff or the grounds of a charge.
2.
anything that is defamatory or that maliciously or damagingly misrepresents.

Free Speech means that I can go up to anyone on the street and call them a jack-ass prick and I won't get arrested. I might get hit, but I won't get arrested.

I can publicly announce that I think President George W. Bush or President Barrack Obama, to be fair and give an example from both political sides, is a raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniac (though I don't feel that way towards either man) and I won't get arrested, though I may suffer some fallout and catch some flack for my beliefs. If I were to say that either of them was a raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniac, then I might get into trouble for slander or libel, depending on which medium I made that announcement in. That's how Glenn Beck gets away with the crazy crap he says, by 'asking question' instead of making statements.

And I realize that people might feel strongly about this topic, but please keep this thread civilized and respectful.
 

Palademon

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Mar 20, 2010
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Wow, I didn't know that people thought it meant anything other than the definition you explained.
 

shadyh8er

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Apr 28, 2010
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They don't bother to actually read the laws, so they get all big-headed because of it.
 

Redingold

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twistedmic said:
I can publicly announce that I think President George W. Bush or President Barrack Obama, to be fair and give an example from both political sides, is a raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniac (though I don't feel that way towards either man) and I won't get arrested, though I may suffer some fallout and catch some flack for my beliefs. If I were to say that either of them was a raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniac, then I might get into trouble for slander or libel, depending on which medium I made that announcement in. That's how Glenn Beck gets away with the crazy crap he says, by 'asking question' instead of making statements.
I don't follow this. How is saying that they are raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniacs not a defamation of character or a false, malicious statement? If that's not slander, why would it be to say that they were?

EDIT: Yeah, I got this now.
 

Aris Khandr

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Oct 6, 2010
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Mostly because the school system doesn't spell it out for people. So they hear about this "right to freedom of speech" thing, and think it gives them carte blanche to make an idiot of themselves. Then scream oppression when the consequences come back to them.

That said, I love reading rants from people who claim to be suing Microsoft or Sony or whomever because they strung a dozen vulgarities together over their microphones online and are now banned. Idiocy should be painful.
 

Woodsey

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Aug 9, 2009
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Freedom of speech is a wonderful idea, and completely fucking stupid in practice.

As soon as you start inciting hatred, adding to racial tensions, and flat-out lying to promote your own ideas (which often relate to the former two examples, and stuff like them), people have every right to shut you up.
 

Realitycrash

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Dec 12, 2010
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It's their democratic right to be Nazis, even if their goal in life is to remove the right for other people not to be Nazis. Sadly, we must live with it.
 

Gigano

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Oct 15, 2009
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Didn't know anyone thought "freedom of speech" was a carte blanche to death threats and libellous accusations.

In Europe though, it is not merely a negative obligation for the state to not intervene against politically/societally relevant speech without due cause, but also to a small degree a positive obligation to ensure that such statements are possible (by having plurality on state monopoly TV stations, investigate crimes against people uttering unpopular opinions etc.).

And of course, it's ultimately an appreciation of whether the possibility of societally relevant discussion or a ban on libellous accusations should win out; If you claim that there are problems with police brutality in a certain precinct, that's an accusation against (some of) the officers of the police station in question, but one which should be stateable in a democratic society even without having certain proof of it. Otherwise such problems could seldom be discussed at all.
 

Verlander

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The concept of freedom of speech, and the American first amendment are different. When people talk about freedom of speech, it should mean freedom of speech. When people talk about the first amendment, it should mean that.

Just because people refer to the First Amendment as being "freedom of speech" doesn't mean it is.

Spot1990 said:
Like when the WBC were banned from preaching in England. I mean I hate those guys as much as anyone, but freedom of speech exists to defend unpopular speech. We don't need to defend things the majority agree with.

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
That's because Britain, like America, does not have freedom of speech
 

Dejawesp

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May 5, 2008
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Woodsey said:
Freedom of speech is a wonderful idea, and completely fucking stupid in practice.

As soon as you start inciting hatred, adding to racial tensions, and flat-out lying, people have every right to shut you up.
No. Just no.

People should have the right to have and express whatever opinion they have.

Nothing is a better cure against idiocy than letting angry and ignorant freely express their opinions out in the open were we can point out the fallacies and the irony.

And how else would be be able to recognize and properly appreciate the pearl of wisdom if not against the dark background of prejudice and ignorance?
 

Ice Car

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Jan 30, 2011
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Palademon said:
Wow, I didn't know that people thought it meant anything other than the definition you explained.
I'm with you. I never knew people thought otherwise.
 

NinjaDeathSlap

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Feb 20, 2011
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Mittens The Kitten said:
NinjaDeathSlap said:
people are dumb...
People are dumb? Relative to what? There isnt anything out there that's smarter than people.
Correction time...

THE MASSES are dumb, WHEN COMPARED TO THE FEW WHO HAVE TO LOOK AFTER THEM.

(you are forgetting that humans are actually the third most intelligent species on Earth. Stephen Fry said so himself...)
 

Concealed

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Nov 15, 2010
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Redingold said:
twistedmic said:
I can publicly announce that I think President George W. Bush or President Barrack Obama, to be fair and give an example from both political sides, is a raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniac (though I don't feel that way towards either man) and I won't get arrested, though I may suffer some fallout and catch some flack for my beliefs. If I were to say that either of them was a raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniac, then I might get into trouble for slander or libel, depending on which medium I made that announcement in. That's how Glenn Beck gets away with the crazy crap he says, by 'asking question' instead of making statements.
I don't follow this. How is saying that they are raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniacs not a defamation of character or a false, malicious statement? If that's not slander, why would it be to say that they were?
Because slander and libel are specific legal terms and you have to prove numerous things. Not the least of which is "that the plaintiff suffered some injury to his or her reputation as a result of the communication." I think it's pretty clear from that example that it's a hyperbolic insult that have little to no basis in fact, and as such no actual damage of any significance would result. Courts will always lean towards it not being slander or libel, since going the other way would result in numerous frivolous lawsuits and people too afraid to say what's on their mind.

Now it would be potentially slanderous/libelous to say or print (in a publicized manner) that Obama used to be a member of the Nazi party. That is assuming it doesn't fall into the realm of satire and or clear hyperbole.
 

Canadamus Prime

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Jun 17, 2009
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Redingold said:
twistedmic said:
I can publicly announce that I think President George W. Bush or President Barrack Obama, to be fair and give an example from both political sides, is a raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniac (though I don't feel that way towards either man) and I won't get arrested, though I may suffer some fallout and catch some flack for my beliefs. If I were to say that either of them was a raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniac, then I might get into trouble for slander or libel, depending on which medium I made that announcement in. That's how Glenn Beck gets away with the crazy crap he says, by 'asking question' instead of making statements.
I don't follow this. How is saying that they are raving, psychotic, Nazi-loving maniacs not a defamation of character or a false, malicious statement? If that's not slander, why would it be to say that they were?
It's all about the wording. For him to say he thinks President whoever is Nazi-loving etc. etc. etc. That's makes it an opinion and he can't be persecuted for having an opinion. However if he were to just go around saying that President whoever is a Nazi etc. etc. etc. as if it were fact, that makes it slander and he can be prosecuted for it.