Why is it so imporant for video games to be considered art?

[krazykidd]

The question is in the title . Why is it so important for video gakes to be considered art? Does it really matter? If they are considered art , then what? Gamers could pride themselves at being art fans? I just don't see the importance of videogames being considered an artform or not .

Now i am not saying i don't see games as art but art or not i will continue playing videogames . Is it just so the media would see gamers as somethin more than childish adults? If you are ashamed of gaming and need validation from the outside world for you hobby, i think theres a problem .

Discuss

 

[ChupathingyX]

Is it just so the media would see gamers as somethin more than childish adults? If you are ashamed of gaming and need validation from the outside world for you hobby, i think theres a problem .

Discuss

Kind of.

It isn't simply just pride, it's got more to do with people being idiots and claiming every game with a sex scene is trying to destroy the minds of the children around the world.

You don't see that with movies; yet if a high-profile game has sex then it was obviously developed by Satan.

Also, if games were considered art then hopefully the censors would back off and stop cutting stuff out because once again we need to think of the children whenever a violent game is made despite that red sticker on the box that says "15 +".

 

[Zhukov]

I wouldn't say it's important exactly, but it would be nice.

As for why... well, if can just don my +5 Hat of Cynicism for a moment, I suspect that, as you suggest, many gamers would prefer their hobby be viewed in the same light as reading a classic work of literature, rather than as the childish waste of time that many people currently see it as.

 

[Dirty Apple]

Also, if it's considered an art form, then I believe it acquires a certain amount of protection. Basically, external validation is the path to legitamacy in mass media.

 

[krazykidd]

Also, if it's considered an art form, then I believe it acquires a certain amount of protection. Basically, external validation is the path to legitamacy in mass media.

But thats my question. Why do we need it to be "legiimate" to mass media? And i'm curious what kind of protection are you talking about? Do you mean have more freedom to put certain content that some may not like in a game?

 

[Kahunaburger]

Also, if it's considered an art form, then I believe it acquires a certain amount of protection.

This. Censorship bad.

Also, I think it's less "important that games are considered art" and more "games are things made by people for other people to experience, therefore they are obviously art."

 

[Erana]

Psh. Most peoples' perception of art is decades, if not centuries behind the contemporary state of the art world. For one, people seem think that art is particularly definable.

What too many people are looking for isn't for games to be art, its for people to not have to bear the social stigma of "nerd" for a pass time they claim should be equivalent for cinema and the likes.

That just pisses me off, its so fucking selfish.

I want to see games as art because it is a new medium with a mind-blowing level of artistic potential. I can feel my heart swell for the seemingly endless possibilities.
If video games became acknowledged as a form of art, more people would be willing to view games on a different level, willing to challenge what is there and push the limits of what can be done to communicate emotion, make commentary, and generate discussion which leads to new revelations about the medium and ourselves as human beings. Just as art should.

 

[krazykidd]

Psh. Most peoples' perception of art is decades, if not centuries behind the contemporary state of the art world. For one, people seem think that art is particularly definable.

What people are looking for isn't for games to be art, its for people to not have to bear the social stigma of "nerd" for a pass time they claim should be equivalent for cinema and the likes.

That just pisses me off, its so fucking selfish.

I want to see games as art because it is a new medium with a mind-blowing level of artistic potential. I can feel my heart swell for the seemingly endless possibilities.
If video games became acknowledged as a form of art, more people would be willing to view games on a different level, willing to challenge what is there and push the limits of what can be done to communicate emotion, make commentary, and generate discussion which leads to new revelations about the medium and ourselves as human beings. Just as art should.

That was very well written and made a lot of sense , thank you for that.

 

[Erttheking]

Mainly because people keep viewed it as a childish waste of time and we all want to be more like Yahtzee.

 

[DioWallachia]

Psh. Most peoples' perception of art is decades, if not centuries behind the contemporary state of the art world. For one, people seem think that art is particularly definable.

What people are looking for isn't for games to be art, its for people to not have to bear the social stigma of "nerd" for a pass time they claim should be equivalent for cinema and the likes.

That just pisses me off, its so fucking selfish.

I want to see games as art because it is a new medium with a mind-blowing level of artistic potential. I can feel my heart swell for the seemingly endless possibilities.
If video games became acknowledged as a form of art, more people would be willing to view games on a different level, willing to challenge what is there and push the limits of what can be done to communicate emotion, make commentary, and generate discussion which leads to new revelations about the medium and ourselves as human beings. Just as art should.

Oh boy, i am so going to enjoy this.....

You forget that there are still people that want games to remain obscure because they feel that being mainstream = to being dumbed down.

Using the "Games are Art" card however fixes this problem. Why? well....

The idea that cartoons and comics are silly and for children / Aquaman sucks / video games are violent / Latin America writer always make Magical Realism works / Italians make pasta / French are cowards and horny as fuck, and lets not forget the new stigma associated to literature that is: "All books are fantasy related to sparkling vampires"

This has been ingrained in the brains of the dumb masses that it would need a miracle to clear that up, and "ART" in the minds of the masses = to one thing: "My brains hurts when i think"

All this is a wild guess but the pieces are there to put together and makes sort of sense if you think about it. The "Games Are Art" will serve as a filter to make sure that ONLY a few people who know about the subject are able to support and pay for video games.
This is of course selfish as fuck, but you got to understand that games got the blessing and the curse of not being mainstream. By remaining obscure, gamers can have their games by develop by people who know what they are doing and not being forced to go for mass appeal for the lowest common denominator, but of course, if people think that the more graphics = more emotion = more artsy then you need to understand how the world works.

Portal and The Binding of Isaac have prooven that you can achieve artistic merit by just doing your job correctly without needing a shitload of money. TBOI shows that for a cheaply made game, you can have the history narrated by the gameplay and therefore you can reach many interpretations

TL;DR: You need to understand that to change the view of video games that people have, then you have to change the meaning of "Art" and therefore, you need to change how EVERYONE thinks. This will benefit movies/comics/books/games in general and everyone will win. If there are no dumb idiots that producers NEED to appeal to, then you medium will not be dragged down to hell for it.

 

[DioWallachia]

Mainly because people keep viewed it as a childish waste of time and we all want to be more like Yahtzee.

They want to be an Asexual Misanthrope Supreme that play bad mainstream games for the rest of his career?

 

[Lucem712]

I think it's simply because it shares all the qualities of other art forms. And it's not as if classifying art will suddenly make it all artsy, turtleneck-y from that point on, it just gives the validation that it deserves as a medium.

 

[DaSpoony]

It's because they are.

And the truth is important.

 

[TheProffesor]

It's more legally important than anything. If games are art, we have first amendment protection from censorship under the constitution.

 

[DioWallachia]

It's more legally important than anything. If games are art, we have first amendment protection from censorship under the constitution.

Games made only in America or anywhere else?? Maybe that is why they dont want FPS that deal with the war on terror and such (like Six Days In Fallujah) They dont want to humanize the enemy now would they? They cant invade if the soldiers feel gulty about it (and that was ultimately the case)

 

[Erana]

Psh. Most peoples' perception of art is decades, if not centuries behind the contemporary state of the art world. For one, people seem think that art is particularly definable.

What people are looking for isn't for games to be art, its for people to not have to bear the social stigma of "nerd" for a pass time they claim should be equivalent for cinema and the likes.

That just pisses me off, its so fucking selfish.

I want to see games as art because it is a new medium with a mind-blowing level of artistic potential. I can feel my heart swell for the seemingly endless possibilities.
If video games became acknowledged as a form of art, more people would be willing to view games on a different level, willing to challenge what is there and push the limits of what can be done to communicate emotion, make commentary, and generate discussion which leads to new revelations about the medium and ourselves as human beings. Just as art should.

Oh boy, i am so going to enjoy this.....

You forget that there are still people that want games to remain obscure because they feel that being mainstream = to being dumbed down.

Using the "Games are Art" card however fixes this problem. Why? well....

The idea that cartoons and comics are silly and for children / Aquaman sucks / video games are violent / Latin America writer always make Magical Realism works / Italians make pasta / French are cowards and horny as fuck, and lets not forget the new stigma associated to literature that is: "All books are fantasy related to sparkling vampires"

This has been ingrained in the brains of the dumb masses that it would need a miracle to clear that up, and "ART" in the minds of the masses = to one thing: "My brains hurts when i think"

All this is a wild guess but the pieces are there to put together and makes sort of sense if you think about it. The "Games Are Art" will serve as a filter to make sure that ONLY a few people who know about the subject are able to support and pay for video games.
This is of course selfish as fuck, but you got to understand that games got the blessing and the curse of not being mainstream. By remaining obscure, gamers can have their games by develop by people who know what they are doing and not being forced to go for mass appeal for the lowest common denominator, but of course, if people think that the more graphics = more emotion = more artsy then you need to understand how the world works.

Portal and The Binding of Isaac have prooven that you can achieve artistic merit by just doing your job correctly without needing a shitload of money. TBOI shows that for a cheaply made game, you can have the history narrated by the gameplay and therefore you can reach many interpretations

TL;DR: You need to understand that to change the view of video games that people have, then you have to change the meaning of "Art" and therefore, you need to change how EVERYONE thinks. This will benefit movies/comics/books/games in general and everyone will win. If there are no dumb idiots that producers NEED to appeal to, then you medium will not be dragged down to hell for it.

I have no idea what you're saying. "I'm so going to enjoy this," what?
I mean, I kind of get what you're saying, but you totally missed my point, so have fun reveling in your grave misconception.

All I did in my post was that I pointed out that wanting games to be art so you don't want to be called a nerd is selfish, then had an artgasm.

 

[Cavan]

What people are looking for isn't for games to be art, its for people to not have to bear the social stigma of "nerd" for a pass time they claim should be equivalent for cinema and the likes.

That just pisses me off, its so fucking selfish.

I think you're being a bit unfair in why you think people want it.

I am not even slightly artistic, I don't give a crap about it and I generally consider it a waste of time (as a gamer calling anything a 'waste of time' is a bad joke, I know how it looks to other people who are not gamers while I am 'wasting' my own time)..I think the idea of feeling untold joy and getting mooney eyed for the possibilities something like a classification change can bring is delusional at best and pathetic at worst.

I do however support the games as art, and I don't think both personally respecting and pushing towards other people being respected for the product they create is selfish or something to be ashamed of. The legal side to it is the most significant part, the social ideas won't change anywhere near as quickly.

People will still make games how they want to, some will fall under the new classification and some won't. A classification won't somehow change all the established rules for what boundaries are and aren't being pushed..and somebody with great ideas isn't going to stop because his media isn't strictly speaking art.

That may or may not end up affecting how much I respect myself or how much respect I feel other people should give me(either individually or as that general squishy pale mass you were directing that at)..which is part of your point Erana, but I don't feel like that's really part of the main thing. People will still be considered nerds the same way people who are really into any other form of art arn't generally considered to be social animals on the basis of their obsession with the artistic.

 

[BRex21]

It's more legally important than anything. If games are art, we have first amendment protection from censorship under the constitution.

Games made only in America or anywhere else?? Maybe that is why they dont want FPS that deal with the war on terror and such (like Six Days In Fallujah) They dont want to humanize the enemy now would they? They cant invade if the soldiers feel gulty about it (and that was ultimately the case)

You underestimate the power and influence the USA has over our global culture. Aside from being a huge market, they have demonstrated massive influence over global politics and an the ability not to mention willingness, to enforce their laws worldwide.
Videogames achieving first amendment protection in the USA would have worldwide benefits.

More on topic, games being taken seriously as an artform is important to me mostly to end this social stigma that they are a toy for kids, that you cant be grown up and enjoy playing videogames. D+D, comic books and videogames were something i had to hide from my parents in my older teens because they feared i wasn't "growing up" yet they enjoy watching movies and reading books, hell my sister enjoys acting, i dont really see how that should be a more legitimate use of her time than me picking up my keyboard or controller.

 

[Erana]

What people are looking for isn't for games to be art, its for people to not have to bear the social stigma of "nerd" for a pass time they claim should be equivalent for cinema and the likes.

That just pisses me off, its so fucking selfish.

I think you're being a bit unfair in why you think people want it.

I am not even slightly artistic, I don't give a crap about it and I generally consider it a waste of time (as a gamer calling anything a 'waste of time' is a bad joke, I know how it looks to other people who are not gamers while I am 'wasting' my own time)..I think the idea of feeling untold joy and getting mooney eyed for the possibilities something like a classification change can bring is delusional at best and pathetic at worst.

I do however support the games as art, and I don't think both personally respecting and pushing towards other people being respected for the product they create is selfish or something to be ashamed of. The legal side to it is the most significant part, the social ideas won't change anywhere near as quickly.

People will still make games how they want to, some will fall under the new classification and some won't. A classification won't somehow change all the established rules for what boundaries are and aren't being pushed..and somebody with great ideas isn't going to stop because his media isn't strictly speaking art.

That may or may not end up affecting how much I respect myself or how much respect I feel other people should give me(either individually or as that general squishy pale mass you were directing that at)..which is part of your point Erana, but I don't feel like that's really part of it. People will still be considered nerds the same way people who are really into any other form of art arn't generally considered to be social animals on the basis of their obsession with the artistic.

Yeah, I was kind of making unfair umbrella statements there... Part of it is that I'm just so sick of hearing of all these arguments made by people who don't really give a damn about art or refuse to acknowledge the international artistic context in which games as art would entail.
Now, I shouldn't just turn around and make sweeping generalizations about the art world, but I could pretty easily sort through most games today and say which would probably be considered not art, a genuine work of art, or something throuroughly a work of art but very kitschy.
Then people would respond along the lines of "hey, I don't give a fuck about what you say; everyone's entitled to their own opinion" and nothing's accomplished.

In order for something to be accepted as the lauded, protected "high arts," I hate to admit it, but the general public's opinion doesn't matter. This is both because the institution of the fine art world is so self-centric, but also because most people aren't willing to give a damn about what fine art enthusiasts are talking about, while for some reason at the same time accepting that whatever gets put in a gallery is somehow, definitively art.
And until this gap is bridged, it will remain this way, and people preaching to the masses aren't doing anything.

Yeah, its terribly fucked up, but that's how things are, and I am just so put out with people who refuse to make the effort to get to know what they're talking about when that's the only way they could actually change things argue incessantly, and then completely ignore what I'm saying, despite me being one of the few people here who have literally spent weeks of their lives studying, discussing and contemplating the nature of art and trying desperately to figure out where I could fit into this whole convoluted mess.

And now cue the people calling me a self-righteous *****. Because a lifelong love of video games, combined with years of art education are worthless and I clearly don't know what I'm talking about. Yeah.