Um . . . you really don't seem to know what you're talking about. You get shit entertainment and good entertainment in every medium.
Why is it that the game industry is the only entertainment industry that's fucks people over?
- Thread starter Fonejackerjon
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As other people have mentioned, it's not.
Getting music production software to work on computers is a trial in patience. The DRM has DRM, and no, I'm not joking. You need to register on one website where you store your other codes so it can work on a physical key so you can get your software that you've purchased to work. God help you if you can't remember the login to get to your keys, and fuck you if you lost the code.
That's not to say the video game industry isn't shit, but there are other areas entertainment in which it's much worse.
Getting music production software to work on computers is a trial in patience. The DRM has DRM, and no, I'm not joking. You need to register on one website where you store your other codes so it can work on a physical key so you can get your software that you've purchased to work. God help you if you can't remember the login to get to your keys, and fuck you if you lost the code.
That's not to say the video game industry isn't shit, but there are other areas entertainment in which it's much worse.
I certainly agree with this. The gaming industry goes in for some truly shitty practices, and seems to exhibit a singular lack of care about whether we know about it.Asita said:
The closest I could think of... well, I could criticise the film industry's counter-productive approach to piracy, and I will, but it's still far from anti-consumer. What the game industry does counts, though.
I hate getting older and having to remind people (at this point, educate people) that games used to cost more than they do now.
N64 came out in North America with only two games at launch, Pilotwings and Mario 64. Both $80.
I paid either $80 or $85 for Final Fantasy III on the SNES(US, yes it's FF6 in every region now).
So that's like $100 or more in today's money accounting for inflation.
And that's not even counting how pricing goes in Japan then and now. Basically, it's whatever people will pay. It's not based on a standard, it's pure Laissez Faire free market demand=price in Japan. Whatever people will pay is how much they charge for games in Japan.
Games and the industry as a whole are not fucking anyone over. For one, look at Ubisoft. They're like Image comics in that they drop the price on *most* of their games to $40 a month after the game comes out the same way Image price drops their comics a month after they come out. I got probably 20-30 hours of enjoyment out of Blood Dragon and that was just a $15 standalone. (Then again, the ending to Prince of Persia 2008 was DLC, I'm not saying they're the perfect company)
Games haven't really changed their basic retail pricing structure in 15 years. Movies, cable TV and music have all drastically changed in that same time frame.
In all that time games only got better looking and usually have more streamlined, intuitive controls while remaining the same price.
I'd also like to point out that movie on VHS used to cost about $80-90 when they first came out because as a consumer you had to pay video store rental prices for 3-4 months, at least, before they'd release a consumer non-commercial version of the movie.
These threads to me always read as "Why are diamonds so scratchy?". We have it better than it's ever been.
I'd also like to point out that StriderShinryu made a really good point that I hadn't even thought of.
N64 came out in North America with only two games at launch, Pilotwings and Mario 64. Both $80.
I paid either $80 or $85 for Final Fantasy III on the SNES(US, yes it's FF6 in every region now).
So that's like $100 or more in today's money accounting for inflation.
And that's not even counting how pricing goes in Japan then and now. Basically, it's whatever people will pay. It's not based on a standard, it's pure Laissez Faire free market demand=price in Japan. Whatever people will pay is how much they charge for games in Japan.
Games and the industry as a whole are not fucking anyone over. For one, look at Ubisoft. They're like Image comics in that they drop the price on *most* of their games to $40 a month after the game comes out the same way Image price drops their comics a month after they come out. I got probably 20-30 hours of enjoyment out of Blood Dragon and that was just a $15 standalone. (Then again, the ending to Prince of Persia 2008 was DLC, I'm not saying they're the perfect company)
Games haven't really changed their basic retail pricing structure in 15 years. Movies, cable TV and music have all drastically changed in that same time frame.
In all that time games only got better looking and usually have more streamlined, intuitive controls while remaining the same price.
I'd also like to point out that movie on VHS used to cost about $80-90 when they first came out because as a consumer you had to pay video store rental prices for 3-4 months, at least, before they'd release a consumer non-commercial version of the movie.
These threads to me always read as "Why are diamonds so scratchy?". We have it better than it's ever been.
I'd also like to point out that StriderShinryu made a really good point that I hadn't even thought of.
Game PUBLISHERS are the ones screwing people over. If you look for products that avoid that issue, like indie titles on Steam, or GoG, games are better and cheaper than they've ever been.
Its very simple more people go to the movies than play games. Marvels Avengers sold 72 million tickets in the US alone, COD MW3 sold 26 million worldwide. So to make back the budget out of smaller sales figures you have to charge more.Fonejackerjon said:
Why? That's the million dollar question isn't it? The video game industry is the ONLY industry that not only fucks it's customers over all the time in every way it can but does it as blatantly as possible. Other industries do fuck over their customers all the time, but at least with them they at least try to act subtle about it and deny that they're doing that, the video game industry is the only one that doesn't even bother to hide the fact that it's fucking it's customers over to the point it actively flaunts the fact that it's doing this and gets away scot free.
The reason is there's an endless wellspring of idiots and blind fanboys that either don't know or don't care they are being fucked over will buy from these companies regardless of how much these companies do it. People just love to cry out that "then vote with your wallet" crap left and right as though it were that simple. For every one person that wises up and stops buying from these people there's a hundred more of those idiots just coming into some disposable income that will buy from these companies anyway. Those like us that do know we're being fucked over and do care are a microscopic minority in comparison, even if all of us together never bought a video game from these companies ever again it wouldn't change anything due to the aforementioned idiots. If people like us simply saying NO were enough to stop these people from fucking us over they wouldn't be doing it in the first place.
The reason is there's an endless wellspring of idiots and blind fanboys that either don't know or don't care they are being fucked over will buy from these companies regardless of how much these companies do it. People just love to cry out that "then vote with your wallet" crap left and right as though it were that simple. For every one person that wises up and stops buying from these people there's a hundred more of those idiots just coming into some disposable income that will buy from these companies anyway. Those like us that do know we're being fucked over and do care are a microscopic minority in comparison, even if all of us together never bought a video game from these companies ever again it wouldn't change anything due to the aforementioned idiots. If people like us simply saying NO were enough to stop these people from fucking us over they wouldn't be doing it in the first place.
It really isn't the only entertainment industry that fucks people over, though. Remember when Legend of Korra was taken off TV and moved to the Internet for its last season? Remember when Justin Beiber cancelled his concert two hours after it was supposed to start? Remember when Taylor Swift took her songs off of Spotify because she decided she wasn't making enough money from it? Remember when iTunes raised its price to $1.29 a song instead of $.99? Remember the way iTunes had that DRM on all of their songs so you couldn't play them on non-apple MP3 players? Remember the way cable companies charge you up the ass and make you bundle for services you don't want, and charge you even more when you try to cancel? Remember when cable companies tried to make it to where you can't fast forward through commercials on things you've DVR'd? Remember the way Nickelodeon gave M Night Shyamalan the rights to make an Avatar the Last Airbender movie and it completely sucked? Remember the way some DVDs and DVD players are region locked so you can't play imported films?Fonejackerjon said:
Games are not going to crash, not this year and not in the next several years. The games industry is more stable than it ever has been in the past. It's diverse, it's spread among many demographics and platforms, both big companies and independent studios are putting games out on equally accessible platforms. For every AAA Xbox or PS3 exclusive there are 5 or 10 indie games running around on Steam and GoG or the app stores. And then with digital distribution even consoles are more accessible to indie studios than ever.
Every industry has a constant coming and going of studios and labels. Every industry has juggernauts coming up with new ways to screw customers. It's nothing exclusive to games, and it's nothing which is any more of a threat to games than any other industry.
I can't say I'm with you on that one. Spotify makes a goddamn fortune and does not pay the artists anywhere near a fair amount. The Black Keys never had music on the service for just that reason. Spotify really does not respect musicians and I can't blame anybody for not wanting their work to be on there.Fonejackerjon said:
If we are talking about cost, songs are around £1 because they are only a few minutes long at most, movies are around £10 because they tend to be anywhere from around 1-3 hours long, games are £40/£50 because you can get countless hours out of them. Hell, I paid my £50 for Dragon Age, and I got the best part of around 120 hours in a single playthrough. Now that is value. That is about 41p per hour.
That being said though, if you get a bad song, big deal, that is £1 down the drain, but Im not going to cry about it. If you get a bad film, well that sucks, there goes £10, but oh well. If you get a bad game, there goes a good £40-£50, and that is a pretty substantial amount of money for a lot of people.
That being said though, if you get a bad song, big deal, that is £1 down the drain, but Im not going to cry about it. If you get a bad film, well that sucks, there goes £10, but oh well. If you get a bad game, there goes a good £40-£50, and that is a pretty substantial amount of money for a lot of people.
I'm guessing you meant to quote me, lol.bluepotatosack said:
That may be, but in the particular case of Taylor Swift, she's not exactly short on money. And in her case it's only encouraging piracy of her work. Spotify fills a particular niche of people who don't want to or can't pay for all of the music they want, yet don't necessarily want to go through all the effort of pirating everything. What Taylor Swift did felt less like an attempt to change an exploitative service and more like a temper tantrum. The fact that she hasn't looked back or talked about it since doesn't help, either.
Really? I think that, dollar for dollar (or pound for pound, if you will) video gaming is probably the cheapest hobby in existence.Fonejackerjon said:
I mean, hell, I spent $40 on X-Com: Enemy Unknown ($60 if you also factor in Enemy Within) and I've sunk nearly 200 hours into that game. I've sunk well over 200 hours into Skyrim ($40), and I have plenty of games that I got dozens of hours of entertainment on that I bought off GOG for $5 or $10. If you break that down, let's say 220 hours on Skyrim at $40, that's about 18 cents an hour.
Compare that to a movie, especially if you go see it in the theater. I get about 2 hours of entertainment for around $8 (or a lot more depending on what time you go), and that's assuming you don't buy any crazily overpriced food or drink. That's $4 an hour, 20x more expensive than a video game.
Now obviously you have to factor in buying a video game system, but assuming you play PC games, you're going to own a PC anyway, and considering that an XBone or PS4 also doubles as a DVD player and streaming device, I think gaming still comes out on top.
I did indeed!Lilani said:
And it's true that Taylor Swift could definitely do more to address her reasons I still think it's an understandable move. I'm not investing a huge amount of time into this right now, so though unfortunately I couldn't find how payouts from Spotify breaks down (although from a few thousand plays my band got on there, we've received a check for 50 cents so far) I did find Pandora's payout. One million listens translates to royalties of $60. That then needs to be split between publishers, songwriters, et al. That's kind of pitiful.
First of all, it's important to note that we're talking about AAA games, so we should also talk about popular music and Hollywood films.
Music albums and films on BR/DVD of such kind are an afterthought - musicians make most of their money from live concerts and filmmakers make most of their money from theatrical screenings. Video games, on the other hand, go straight for home gaming platforms, and must make all of their profit from that.
That's why you really can't compare between these entertainment industries.
I do agree that prices are ridiculous at this point. It's a rare case in which I buy a game for more than $10, as I'd rather wait for discounted sales. I have a huge backlog of games as it is.
Music albums and films on BR/DVD of such kind are an afterthought - musicians make most of their money from live concerts and filmmakers make most of their money from theatrical screenings. Video games, on the other hand, go straight for home gaming platforms, and must make all of their profit from that.
That's why you really can't compare between these entertainment industries.
I do agree that prices are ridiculous at this point. It's a rare case in which I buy a game for more than $10, as I'd rather wait for discounted sales. I have a huge backlog of games as it is.
I just paid $10 for a 100 hour game. Persona 3, Persona 4, SMT Nocturne, and Dark Souls put me in the hole $50. That's 300-400 hours of entertainment for less than the cost to go to the movies. I don't feel ripped off, that's an amazing deal, even at full price. Comic books are far worse in terms of value. Those are some of my favorite games, and they cost me nothing. Indie games are even cheaper, meaning that there's a great diversity of cost for everyone.
Sorry OP, if you think the gaming industry is the worst, you are really naive. I know you said "entertainment" in the title, but take a moment to look at the pharmaceutical industry, or the insurance industry. Fucking people over is what any large entity will do, regardless if they've made a business of entertaining people or not.
If you think the video games industry is the only one that screws over it's consumers, then sir I have a bridge to sell you.Fonejackerjon said:
Growing Pains...Fonejackerjon said:
Music can be bought cheap, but that was after a company the size of Apple make it possible. Before that, the music industry was on a roll to make discs and special editions that amounted for more than 20 $, plus making serious lobbying to outlaw those "damn pirates" and the technologies that were "killing the poor musicians and artists", like mps3.
Films are relatively cheap on DVD, until you realize they expect you to buy into the new technology and make everything obsolete. It is a relatively new phenomenon that movies include an online code. And that without taking into account theatrical releases. To put it simply, going to the cinema is not cheap... movie tickets can rise well over 20 $ per person. If we take into account that Hollywood takes 90% of the earnings from the cinemas during the first week, you realize that it is not ONLY you that they are screwing over.
Well, no. The gaming industry is not the worst by far. But it is the one with the highest concentration of retards. This is the one industry where a dev or publisher can come out and say "You'll need constant connection to our online servers that are as stable as a guy with vrolick syndrome in a rugby game to play this single player game" and people will still buy the game. And this translates into publishers not giving a single fuck about trying to be subtle. They can dream up any form of butt-fucking, implement it, drown in money and then mutter an "apology" from their caviar pools on theyr golden yachts before doing it again. And most gamers will simply say "more please". See, gaming isn't the worst, but it is the least restrained.