Why would anyone be excited over WoW Legion?

[Evilsausage]

You have to be a serious Wow Fanboy to think WoW legion will be good.
Im a old time fan of WoW and it just breaks my heart to se how they keep ruining the game.

The game continues to get dumbed down with more and more skills getting removed

The shitty garrison system still remains but in the class halls. It will remain as unsocial as WoD was.

level scaling in zones, WoD was too easy when even group missions could be soloed. Now you can't even challange yourself by going to higher level areas. When a game offers no challange it just become dull.

No weapon loot, yup you can't find weapons anymore....one of the main joys of WoW was finding loot from a boss. I predict everyone will be running around with ashbringers from the class halls.

Over time the WoW expansions has gotten less and less content. both with the expansion and with content patches. Take WoD for example, it had like 50% less instances and raids then Burning crusade had. Blizzard is clearly putting less and less resources into the game and Legion sure wont be different.
Since WoW today is so much easier you will run out of stuff to do real fast.


They won't really fix any of the old problems. Professions will remain dull, everything gets more and more streamlined and conveniant, the game will remain just as unsocial as WoD, same boring faceroll instance runs with randoms who don't talk back and PvP will be boring due to the lack of skills.


How can anyone seriously be excited for Legion?

 

[Aeshi]

The game continues to get dumbed down with more and more skills getting removed

And people continue to use "Dumbed down" as a fancy way of saying "I don't have a big complex-looking toolbar to make me look smart." I'm willing to be that just like last time the game got "dumbed down" most of the removed abilities were so situational as to be useless anyway (oh no, not Frost Resistance Totem! I totally used that on a regular basis!)

The shitty garrison system still remains but in the class halls. It will remain as unsocial as WoD was.

As opposed to... what exactly? The days where every capital was stuffed with a combo of people sitting by the flight master talking in LFG who weren't going to respond to anything that wasn't either a Group Invite or "/w inv me!" and unresponsive Bank alts moving between the AH, Bank & Mailbox?

level scaling in zones, WoD was too easy when even group missions could be soloed. Now you can't even challange yourself by going to higher level areas. When a game offers no challange it just become dull.

Having choice as to what order you want to do the zones in is a bad thing now? I remember TBC and WoTLK got quite a lot of complaints that they were too linear compared to Vanilla.

No weapon loot, yup you can't find weapons anymore....one of the main joys of WoW was finding loot from a boss. I predict everyone will be running around with ashbringers from the class halls.

Ok fair enough, that sounds kinda crap.

Over time the WoW expansions has gotten less and less content. both with the expansion and with content patches. Take WoD for example, it had like 50% less instances and raids then Burning crusade had. Blizzard is clearly putting less and less resources into the game and Legion sure wont be different.

Only because back in Burning Crusade's day you could create a new instance by copy-pasting a current one, changing the enemy models and calling the result a new instance. About half of TBC's dungeons (and 1 or 2 of its raids) were testament to that. Today's gamers have slightly higher standards.

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

Yeah, remember when we had dozens of skills and talents to choose from and yet you would never get a spot in a raid unless you had THE ONE accepted raid build for your class? Remember when only about 2% of the playerbase ever got to see any of the end-game content?

 

[Evilsausage]

And people continue to use "Dumbed down" as a fancy way of saying "I don't have a big complex-looking toolbar to make me look smart." I'm willing to be that just like last time the game got "dumbed down" most of the removed abilities were so situational as to be useless anyway (oh no, not Frost Resistance Totem! I totally used that on a regular basis!)

Some abilities i can understand, but overall the game feels really shallow now.
These changes also didn't exacly improve the game balance either, PvP at launch of WoD was probably the worst ever since early vanilla. Also many talents where completly pointless. Like Ice Barrier...ooo 30k dmg absorb in battles with people that has 300k hp.

As opposed to... what exactly? The days where every capital was stuffed with a combo of people sitting by the flight master talking in LFG who weren't going to respond to anything that wasn't either a Group Invite or "/w inv me!" and unresponsive Bank alts moving between the AH, Bank & Mailbox?!

Back then WoW atleast felt like a world where you met people. Sitting in a garrion playing shitty minigames alone is not fun in anyway.
Back in the day Old WoW you met people, you needed to make a network of players to do instances. You got to know the people you played with and thats what made the experiance fun.
LFG cross realm system just brings the worst out of everyone. none talks, if anyone actually managed to screw up people just quit instantly to join a new group. All of it feels like a singleplayer game, if i really wanted a SP experiance I wouldn't play WoW.
I think thats the main reason people so many played on Nostalrius, it could offer stuff todays WoW just can't do.

Having choice as to what order you want to do the zones in is a bad thing now? I remember TBC and WoTLK got quite a lot of complaints that they were too linear compared to Vanilla.

I certainly don't mind having choices, but this takes away any sense of progression. your gonna be running around killing stuff that now will never ever challange you.

Only because back in Burning Crusade's day you could create a new instance by copy-pasting a current one, changing the enemy models and calling the result a new instance. About half of TBC's dungeons (and 1 or 2 of its raids) were testament to that. Today's gamers have slightly higher standards.

Im sorry but I don't remember that. Some instances had same setting like Shatterd Halls and Hellfire Ramparts. still these instances had their own layouts and bosses. You seriously think WoD does things better by just smacking on another difficulty level on their already few instances. If anything, thats lazy.
BCs instances and Heroics offerd alot of content and the game received great instances with patches, like Caverns of time instances and raids.

 

[PPB]

I'm excited for the lore and setting. I hated WoD for it's time-traveling and alternate universe shenanigans. I expect it will feel good to go back to Azeroth, especially to a place that was loosely featured in the RTS games but so far ignored in WoW. By all accounts the story is also moving forward, which I welcome as I think it's been somewhat stagnant for quite a while now.

As for gameplay issues, I can't say I'm fundamentally opposed to the game's current direction. I disliked the garrisons, but from what I'm reading so far the order halls are actually quite different so I doubt it will be as bad as it was in WoD. I also welcome the level scaling, it will make leveling alts less repetitive. And leveling in WoW has never been challenging, if anything it just used to be a bigger chore.

And yes, I've played vanilla. I can't say I miss grinding mobs in EPL to level up because there weren't enough quests or waiting an hour and spamming the chat to get a group for a dungeon, only to see it fall apart halfway through. I remember staying up until 2 AM to finish sunken temple of all places back in 2007 and ended up joining someone's guild in the process. Sure it's a fun memory and it was more social, but frankly it's not something I'd want to do again. I know weaving the RL flag in topics like this feels like a cheap way out, but life being what it is, I couldn't do that again even if I wanted to. The LFG system allowed me to do much more group content than I used to because of how quick and efficient it is, and as far as I'm concerned I'll take that over having marginally better social interactions online.

 

[Phasmal]

Well, I'm looking forward to it.

Yeah, I know it's not as complex as the old days, but I still enjoy it.
It certainly has gotten less social over the years, too, but I can't really say I miss it that much. The community was never the best, anyway.

WoW is better if you have someone to play it with, though. For me that's always been people I know in real life. I'm looking forward to playing the new content with my boyfriend. I still enjoy where WoW is at the moment anyway. Mostly I'm going around collecting achievements, titles, mounts and pets though.

If your complaint is that it's too easy, try healing. People say it's gotten harder, though I personally don't agree.

 

[remnant_phoenix]

So...I haven't been keeping up withe lore since Burning Crusade (which is when I quit playing), but didn't the big bad boss man of the entire Burning Legion get defeated at the end of the Burning Crusade story-arc? At the Sunwell? I forget his name, but I remember that Kael Sunstrider recharged the Sunwell with energy that he collected in Outland and then summoned him, and the heroes (player characters) defeated him. What is the titular Legion doing back so soon? And who, if anything, is leading them?

 

[Proto Taco]

The problem with WoW isn't that Legion is terrible, it's that their game model is terrible. Guild Wars 2 is the pinnacle of the WoW model of MMO development; it forces you outside into the world, it inspires cooperation as well as world PvP, it rewards exploration, has a hotbar and specs you can comb over to your heart's desire, and it scales your level DOWN so that it's always possible to die, even to that level 1 rabbit in the start zone. On top of all that it's gorgeous, controls well, and doesn't charge a monthly fee. It is literally the golden child of the WoW game model.

And it gets boring in a hurry. Holy crap, gearing, crafting, leveling, everything is a slog because once you've learned how to do it you're never called upon to creatively implement anything, you just do it over and over until you 'win'. It's awful. The WoW 'grind' model of MMO is awful, terrible, boring, pointless, and WoW's persistent flaws are its saving grace. If it weren't for all the balance issues in WoW people would realize in a hurry just how bland and monotonous the whole endeavor is and quit playing in droves.

....In fact, by that measure maybe they actually ARE improving the game. Maybe they really should roll back to Vanilla...

 

[The Madman]

So...I haven't been keeping up withe lore since Burning Crusade (which is when I quit playing), but didn't the big bad boss man of the entire Burning Legion get defeated at the end of the Burning Crusade story-arc? At the Sunwell? I forget his name, but I remember that Kael Sunstrider recharged the Sunwell with energy that he collected in Outland and then summoned him, and the heroes (player characters) defeated him. What is the titular Legion doing back so soon? And who, if anything, is leading them?

Kil'Jaeden is who you're thinking of, and he's never actually killed in the Sunwell raid. Players prevent him from entering Azeroth by closing the portal he's entering through with the help of the blue dragonflight. I assume he's still the guy running the show. His boss and arguably the main Warcraft universe antagonist would be Sargeras, but I very much doubt Blizz are bringing that big baddie out yet.

Guild Wars 2 is the pinnacle of the WoW model of MMO development;

Meh, having tried GW2 it's definitely no WoW. Maybe if pvp is your thing it's fantastic but I really disliked the way they decided to tinker with the classic trinity (tank/healer/dps) and felt playing any group pve content really suffered as a result. Plus of the two I'd actually say WoW is the better looking game despite its age, as if there's one thing Blizzard are unarguably amazing at, it's presentation quality.

Mind you I also haven't played either MMO in well over a year now so for all I know things have changed drastically.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

So...I haven't been keeping up withe lore since Burning Crusade (which is when I quit playing), but didn't the big bad boss man of the entire Burning Legion get defeated at the end of the Burning Crusade story-arc? At the Sunwell? I forget his name, but I remember that Kael Sunstrider recharged the Sunwell with energy that he collected in Outland and then summoned him, and the heroes (player characters) defeated him. What is the titular Legion doing back so soon? And who, if anything, is leading them?

1. That was Kil'jaeden that got defeated at the Sunwell. Kil'jaeden is a big mucky-muck in the Burning Legion, but not THE big mucky-muck. That would be Sargeras, who is a corrupted Titan. Kil'jaeden is a big, powerful demon lord. Sargeras is functionally a God.

2. You can't actually KILL a demon, either, at least not in our plane of existence. To kill a demon you have to destroy them inside the Twisting Nether.

The really unfortunate thing is that the Burning Legion isn't even the primary enemy. The Burning Legion, in its own fucked up way, is trying to 'help'. Sure, their help has a certain screaming finality about it, but the INTENTION is good.

OT: Legion is probably the best lore-dump Blizzard has left in their chamber, and carries with it the usual rashed of QoL improvements and addressing of the community's most virulent complaints. Like most modern MMOs/expansions, it will capture everyone's imaginations for somewhere between 2-6 months and then the entropy cycle will set in again. WoW is eleven years old now. It's going to get harder and harder for them to sustain any kind of new momentum. If it wasn't for the moribund state of the genre it would be hard to imagine them getting any traction at all.

 

[Tony2077]

So...I haven't been keeping up withe lore since Burning Crusade (which is when I quit playing), but didn't the big bad boss man of the entire Burning Legion get defeated at the end of the Burning Crusade story-arc? At the Sunwell? I forget his name, but I remember that Kael Sunstrider recharged the Sunwell with energy that he collected in Outland and then summoned him, and the heroes (player characters) defeated him. What is the titular Legion doing back so soon? And who, if anything, is leading them?

1. That was Kil'jaeden that got defeated at the Sunwell. Kil'jaeden is a big mucky-muck in the Burning Legion, but not THE big mucky-muck. That would be Sargeras, who is a corrupted Titan. Kil'jaeden is a big, powerful demon lord. Sargeras is functionally a God.

2. You can't actually KILL a demon, either, at least not in our plane of existence. To kill a demon you have to destroy them inside the Twisting Nether.

The really unfortunate thing is that the Burning Legion isn't even the primary enemy. The Burning Legion, in its own fucked up way, is trying to 'help'. Sure, their help has a certain screaming finality about it, but the INTENTION is good.

OT: Legion is probably the best lore-dump Blizzard has left in their chamber, and carries with it the usual rashed of QoL improvements and addressing of the community's most virulent complaints. Like most modern MMOs/expansions, it will capture everyone's imaginations for somewhere between 2-6 months and then the entropy cycle will set in again. WoW is eleven years old now. It's going to get harder and harder for them to sustain any kind of new momentum. If it wasn't for the moribund state of the genre it would be hard to imagine them getting any traction at all.

i've played the games and I'm at a lost to who the big bad you are talking about is

 

[BloatedGuppy]

i've played the games and I'm at a lost to who the big bad you are talking about is

Which one?

Sargeras is the former Titan who, upon discovering the taint of the Old Gods near a World Soul, lost his mind and decided the only defense against the Void Lords was to purge the universe of life and begin anew. He shattered Mardum and released the endless demons stored inside, becoming tainted by Fel Energy in the process. Boom, he's a big bad demon now. Kil'jaeden and Archimonde are his lieutenants. Along with Velen they were the leadership of the Eredar before Sargeras corrupted them.

 

[Tony2077]

i've played the games and I'm at a lost to who the big bad you are talking about is

Which one?

Sargeras is the former Titan who, upon discovering the taint of the Old Gods near a World Soul, lost his mind and decided the only defense against the Void Lords was to purge the universe of life and begin anew. He shattered Mardum and released the endless demons stored inside, becoming tainted by Fel Energy in the process. Boom, he's a big bad demon now. Kil'jaeden and Archimonde are his lieutenants. Along with Velen they were the leadership of the Eredar before Sargeras corrupted them.

ok that helped so the old gods are just servants of a bigger bads called the void lords which i don't think have a connection to the warlock summon

 

[BloatedGuppy]

ok that helped so the old gods are just servants of a bigger bads called the void lords which i don't think have a connection to the warlock summon

Heh...correct, the Void Spawn that Warlocks summon are not to be confused with the Void Lords, who are creatures of pure entropy and shadow who seek to consume/pervert existence. The Old Gods are their physical proxies, sent out to embed themselves into and corrupt worlds. All the Old Gods are seeking a World Soul that they can corrupt, which would birth an Old God Titan that would basically obliterate all of creation and/or spiral it into nightmare. Sargeras wants to prevent this, and his solution is "purge the universe with demons". As far as mortals are concerned, it's sort of a pick your poison situation, alas.

 

[Tony2077]

ok that helped so the old gods are just servants of a bigger bads called the void lords which i don't think have a connection to the warlock summon

Heh...correct, the Void Spawn that Warlocks summon are not to be confused with the Void Lords, who are creatures of pure entropy and shadow who seek to consume/pervert existence. The Old Gods are their physical proxies, sent out to embed themselves into and corrupt worlds. All the Old Gods are seeking a World Soul that they can corrupt, which would birth an Old God Titan that would basically obliterate all of creation and/or spiral it into nightmare. Sargeras wants to prevent this, and his solution is "purge the universe with demons". As far as mortals are concerned, it's sort of a pick your poison situation, alas.

yep burning legion or the embodiment of evil well the mortals sure have there work cut out for them and if the plot throws them a bone or two

 

[Bilious Green_v1legacy]

I quit at the end of MoP when Blizzard basically gave the finger to all the ten man raiding guilds. From what I have seen, they've been making wall to wall terrible decisions ever since, so I don't see any reason to go back, even though I miss my old raiding buddies.

 

[Dolly]

Because Illidan. Because It's WOW. No matter how WOW changes - there always will be somebody who says: "Ohh, they made it worse!"
And I will stay as someone who plays all the addons, has a lot of fun with the world of wow and take another long break before next addon. That's the mmorpg of all mmorpgs - and I will myself wrong when I miss something as important as the new part of the world there.
(I am not a fan. Really.)

 

[Elijin]

Good or bad, it isnt hugely important where those changes fall anymore. Its a creature all on its own, with a decade of social links, habitual play and invested time behind it. At this stage, a long standing guild probably dwarfs most adult friendships in duration.

Its like asking why people still go to down to that sports bar on friday night even though they upped the price of beers and the service is worse. Its a social contract, not a solo leisure activity.

 

[Xerosch]

And once again the question can be answered with a simple answer: If you don't enjoy it, don't play it and let people who are excited for this have their fun.