Wii U to be quickly outdated?

[him over there]

Oh god that quote reeked of "objective quality guys". YEah, Nintendo deserves no credit at all for having the best selling system of this generation.

Yes it doesn't deserve credit for having the best selling console of this generation. Because it's not a console of this generation by any meaningful definition. PS2 sold well post 2005, and ended up selling a further 50 million units, topping out at 150 million units sold, still not the victor of the 7th generation.

The Atari Jaguar claimed to be a 5th gen console. This was bullshit. Same with the Wii claiming to be 7th gen. It's just many people don't seem to understand that.

Wii is an overclocked gamecube, no more powerful than the Original Xbox, with new controllers (just like Kinect or PS Move). That doesn't make it 7th gen. Deal with it.

It did not compete with 7th gen consoles. No one asked themselves:
"Hmm, I really love Arkham Asylum/Modern-warfare-3/GTA4/Red-Dead-Redemption but should I get it on Wii or Xbox 360?"

Because none of those games ever came close to getting a Wii release. The few cross-platform games between Wii and 360 were utterly broken messes on Wii as such much had to be cut out and stripped down they weren't worth your time nor money.

Is WiiU pulling the same crap here? I think so. They might do well, only because they are good con-men selling old mutton as lamb.

No it was directly competing with the 360 and PS3 because consumers had to make a purchasing decision between the two. I chose the wii over the 360, I had to because it was competing for the privilege of being my home console this generation. Also what do you mean con-men? that would assume they are scamming people. They are simply selling a less powerful but cheaper machine with a niche, if you call that a scam that's pretty sad.

 

[him over there]

From a technical standpoint, yes; the Wii U will be/is (most likely) outdated. However, from a practical standpoint, it can be argued that the Wii U is still relevant. One of the problems that the games industry is facing right now is that development costs are absolutely ridiculous; either games are a big hit (Call Of Duty, Uncharted, Halo, etc.) or they are a colossal failure that sinks their respective studios (Eat Sleep Play with Twisted Metal, 38 Studios with Amular, Realtime Worlds with APB). A new graphics standard would most likely just sink more and more studios while putting more and more pressure onto developers to change their games so that they achieve mass appeal.

Dev costs are not out of control. They choose what to spend, it isn't the hardware forcing them to spend more.

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/08/19/crytek-crysis-cost-22-million-next-engine-due-2012/

Crysis cost $22,000,000

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenmue

Adjusted for inflation, Shenmue cost $64,000,000.

Not to mention that many new tools such as the unreal engine 4 are coming out and many have already been developed so the process is becoming cheaper. Tools for greater efficiency are already being created.

 

[Snotnarok]

It's slightly more powerful than todays consoles? The consoles that are totally out of date circa 3 years ago? The system is outdated before it's being put out much like the wii which is only slightly more powerful than a gamecube, and that power is for processing the wii controls.

 

[him over there]

Not to mention that many new tools such as the unreal engine 4 are coming out and many have already been developed so the process is becoming cheaper. Tools for greater efficiency are already being created.

That is another thing. APIs are becoming more efficient over time.

http://wiiudaily.com/2012/06/nintendo-confirms-wii-u-launch-games-will-run-at-720p/

Launch games for the Wii U will be 720P. Nintendo is focusing on 60FPS rather than a lower framerate at 1080P. They say they are not against using 1080P though.

At Nintendo we have different teams working on different games that take into consideration the resolution. If they think that by focusing on 720p and a certain framerate to get a certain experience, than that's ultimately how they make their decisions. We might consider using 1080p, but, for example, if we want to get 60 fps, at a particular stage of development, it may seem 720p is more realistic.

Yeah, and I sort of just realized this but isn't this whole thread based on the assumption that the PS4 and whatever the hell the 360s new iteration is will be extremely close to a high end pc? I mean they could pull it off but that would require either a far higher price or to sell the consoles at a loss and make them back on games. The former is extremely risky considering it didn't take before the recession and the later would require that former console gamers haven't defected to PCs in the large gap between now and the next launch.

 

[him over there]

Yeah, and I sort of just realized this but isn't this whole thread based on the assumption that the PS4 and whatever the hell the 360s new iteration is will be extremely close to a high end pc? I mean they could pull it off but that would require either a far higher price or to sell the consoles at a loss and make them back on games. The former is extremely risky considering it didn't take before the recession and the later would require that former console gamers haven't defected to PCs in the large gap between now and the next launch.

Yeah it's based on the assumption that they will take the loss-leader strategy again in this generation. This is not likely to happen, or at least to the same degree for a few reasons such as the companies making huge losses on hardware last gen (PS3,360), having powerful hardware melt the whole system (PS3,360) and the fact the Sony even said they weren't going to be investing to the same level as they did with the PS3.

http://www.industrygamers.com/news/sony-wont-make-massive-investment-in-ps4/

Saying that, they sort of backpedaled on that a few days ago.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-06-06-sony-on-ps4-weve-never-been-first-weve-never-been-cheapest-its-about-being-the-best

We've never been first. We've never been cheapest. It's about being the best

So they may be going big and expensive like last generation, because that worked out so well for them last time.

In all seriousness, due to Blu-ray being so cheap we won't see 599 US DOLLARS! again unless they go full retard.


Finally, look at that. Nintendo made a profit on their hardware and it was reliable, obviously that's why they were the worst this gen. >.>

Yeah, also is it weird I almost want the Wii U to be outdated? I mean it will lose AAA third party support but it would open up the ability for smaller developers that can't meet console demands and also want to do more than be the next big downloadable marketplace indie title. This is why I still played my wii, the other two consoles really only offer tiny indie games and A to AAA games. The wii provided a niche for B/C/D games to simply even exist on. Sure it took some searching to find the diamonds in the rough of terrible shovelware but it was worth it for unique gems like boom blox and Endless ocean.

 

[Il_Exile_lI]

Yeah, and I sort of just realized this but isn't this whole thread based on the assumption that the PS4 and whatever the hell the 360s new iteration is will be extremely close to a high end pc? I mean they could pull it off but that would require either a far higher price or to sell the consoles at a loss and make them back on games. The former is extremely risky considering it didn't take before the recession and the later would require that former console gamers haven't defected to PCs in the large gap between now and the next launch.

Yeah it's based on the assumption that they will take the loss-leader strategy again in this generation. This is not likely to happen, or at least to the same degree for a few reasons such as the companies making huge losses on hardware last gen (PS3,360), having powerful hardware melt the whole system (PS3,360) and the fact the Sony even said they weren't going to be investing to the same level as they did with the PS3.

http://www.industrygamers.com/news/sony-wont-make-massive-investment-in-ps4/

Saying that, they sort of backpedaled on that a few days ago.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-06-06-sony-on-ps4-weve-never-been-first-weve-never-been-cheapest-its-about-being-the-best

We've never been first. We've never been cheapest. It's about being the best

So they may be going big and expensive like last generation, because that worked out so well for them last time.

In all seriousness, due to Blu-ray being so cheap we won't see 599 US DOLLARS! again unless they go full retard.


Finally, look at that. Nintendo made a profit on their hardware and it was reliable, obviously that's why they were the worst this gen. >.>

You're right that MS and Sony probably won't go for as much of a loss leader like last gen, but they don't have to. They can still make devices that far outclass the current systems and Wii U and be able to price them much more consumer friendly without losing hundreds per unit, the reason obviously being the protracted nature of this generation. Consoles probably won't be as cutting edge at first release as they were last gen, but they will be big step from what we've got now. Also, if you want to know what we can expect from next gen, go look at some footage of Star Wars 1313. And before anyone says that will be for PC, not next gen, tell the last time Lucas Arts made a game that was PC only.

 

[him over there]

Yeah, also is it weird I almost want the Wii U to be outdated? I mean it will lose AAA third party support but it would open up the ability for smaller developers that can't meet console demands and also want to do more than be the next big downloadable marketplace indie title. This is why I still played my wii, the other two consoles really only offer tiny indie games and A to AAA games. The wii provided a niche for B/C/D games to simply even exist on. Sure it took some searching to find the diamonds in the rough of terrible shovelware but it was worth it for unique gems like boom blox and Endless ocean.

But didn't you hear? The Wii failed last generation and that's why it sold the least...

Shit, I mean: That's why it made the least profit on hardware...

Shit, I mean: That's why it always broke down...

Shit, I mean: Fuck it

Wait!

That's why it only appealed to casuals...

Shit, I mean people who played the wii have zero brand loyalty...

Shit, I mean the only people who could possibly be interested in the wii U are little babies...

Yeah, I think the wii U is going to do fine this generation.

 

[Treblaine]

Oh god that quote reeked of "objective quality guys". YEah, Nintendo deserves no credit at all for having the best selling system of this generation.

Yes it doesn't deserve credit for having the best selling console of this generation. Because it's not a console of this generation by any meaningful definition. PS2 sold well post 2005, and ended up selling a further 50 million units, topping out at 150 million units sold, still not the victor of the 7th generation.

The Atari Jaguar claimed to be a 5th gen console. This was bullshit. Same with the Wii claiming to be 7th gen. It's just many people don't seem to understand that.

Wii is an overclocked gamecube, no more powerful than the Original Xbox, with new controllers (just like Kinect or PS Move). That doesn't make it 7th gen. Deal with it.

It did not compete with 7th gen consoles. No one asked themselves:
"Hmm, I really love Arkham Asylum/Modern-warfare-3/GTA4/Red-Dead-Redemption but should I get it on Wii or Xbox 360?"

Because none of those games ever came close to getting a Wii release. The few cross-platform games between Wii and 360 were utterly broken messes on Wii as such much had to be cut out and stripped down they weren't worth your time nor money.

Is WiiU pulling the same crap here? I think so. They might do well, only because they are good con-men selling old mutton as lamb.

No it was directly competing with the 360 and PS3 because consumers had to make a purchasing decision between the two. I chose the wii over the 360, I had to because it was competing for the privilege of being my home console this generation. Also what do you mean con-men? that would assume they are scamming people. They are simply selling a less powerful but cheaper machine with a niche, if you call that a scam that's pretty sad.

"the privilege of being my home console this generation"

You don't have to own just one console. The Xbox 360 now sells for less than the Wii sold for at launch.

I'll admit it's not the worst scam in the world, but it's still hugely disingenuous for Wii to act like it's a new and modern system when it isn't. It is secretly an overclocked gamecube from the previous generation. It is leeching off the reputation of PS3 and 360 that are well established 7th gen consoles. PS3 and 360 tout games like Arkham Asylum, Red Dead Redemption and Battlefield 3, NONE of which are on the Wii.

This isn't a new generation that is less powerful than the others, it's not like how the PS2 was less powerful than the Xbox. This is a whole generation BEHIND yet it's leeching off the reputation as if "well I'm done with my PS2, time to move on to then next generation. Wii!".

It's a trick in how it presented itself back in 2006 launch.

"ooh, Wii is $50 less than the $299 Xbox 360 Core. Good deal"

When really it should be presented as costing $100 more than the $150 Playstation 2 which it was far closer to in capability and you were likely to own already.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxCqJ3CA0qY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0AljWxGPQc

Was the Wii remote worth another $100? Sure Wii had a few good exclusives

 

[him over there]

Oh god that quote reeked of "objective quality guys". YEah, Nintendo deserves no credit at all for having the best selling system of this generation.

Yes it doesn't deserve credit for having the best selling console of this generation. Because it's not a console of this generation by any meaningful definition. PS2 sold well post 2005, and ended up selling a further 50 million units, topping out at 150 million units sold, still not the victor of the 7th generation.

The Atari Jaguar claimed to be a 5th gen console. This was bullshit. Same with the Wii claiming to be 7th gen. It's just many people don't seem to understand that.

Wii is an overclocked gamecube, no more powerful than the Original Xbox, with new controllers (just like Kinect or PS Move). That doesn't make it 7th gen. Deal with it.

It did not compete with 7th gen consoles. No one asked themselves:
"Hmm, I really love Arkham Asylum/Modern-warfare-3/GTA4/Red-Dead-Redemption but should I get it on Wii or Xbox 360?"

Because none of those games ever came close to getting a Wii release. The few cross-platform games between Wii and 360 were utterly broken messes on Wii as such much had to be cut out and stripped down they weren't worth your time nor money.

Is WiiU pulling the same crap here? I think so. They might do well, only because they are good con-men selling old mutton as lamb.

No it was directly competing with the 360 and PS3 because consumers had to make a purchasing decision between the two. I chose the wii over the 360, I had to because it was competing for the privilege of being my home console this generation. Also what do you mean con-men? that would assume they are scamming people. They are simply selling a less powerful but cheaper machine with a niche, if you call that a scam that's pretty sad.

"the privilege of being my home console this generation"

You don't have to own just one console. The Xbox 360 now sells for less than the Wii sold for at launch.

I'll admit it's not the worst scam in the world, but it's still hugely disingenuous for Wii to act like it's a new and modern system when it isn't. It is secretly an overclocked gamecube from the previous generation. It is leeching off the reputation of PS3 and 360 that are well established 7th gen consoles. PS3 and 360 tout games like Arkham Asylum, Red Dead Redemption and Battlefield 3, NONE of which are on the Wii.

This isn't a new generation that is less powerful than the others, it's not like how the PS2 was less powerful than the Xbox. This is a whole generation BEHIND yet it's leeching off the reputation as if "well I'm done with my PS2, time to move on to then next generation. Wii!".

It's a trick in how it presented itself back in 2006 launch.

"ooh, Wii is $50 less than the $299 Xbox 360 Core. Good deal"

When really it should be presented as costing $100 more than the $150 Playstation 2 which it was far closer to in capability and you were likely to own already.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxCqJ3CA0qY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0AljWxGPQc

Was the Wii remote worth another $100? Sure Wii had a few good exclusives

So you are saying that simply because it was on par with the PS2 it was a scam because it wasn't next gen, despite the fact that generations aren't defined by hardware?

 

[Atmos Duality]

It certainly looks like it's shaping up to be the Fisher Price Wankfest the Wii is.
Their gimmick is less...gimmicky (if that makes any sense...the tablet thing is more practical than waggling) but their success/failure will stem primarily from two things:

1) Lower Pricing on hardware
2) Fad-mentality

Those are what sold the Wii and made Nintendo a big pile of money.
Waggling started out as a fad, and now most people see it as the gimmick it is.