Wii U to be quickly outdated?

[dragongit]

You treat that one article like it's infallible.

What I said about Nintendo is my opinion, and that's not up for discussion. Not as long as we don't have reliable data. We don't.

Other M is an abomination.

There's only 2 types of people who believe Other M is an abomination. People who have an unhealthy attachment to the Metroid "mythos", and people who listen to the people in camp one. Other M is not an objectively bad game, people need to stop selling it as one.

Objectivly, I never played the game. But I watched the cutscenes, and it was horrendous. Every other word out of Samus' mouth was baby or how much she loved her commander. I thought the fact that she actually had all her weapons on her armor, but she was only able to use anything when givin permission. The guy could have been a complete ass if he had a grudge and prevented Samus from having useful equipment at a key moment in time.

Also, from a graphical standpoint. The in game cutscenes and even in game graphics are in my opinion on par with the PS2, the texture work and modeling on everything besides Samus were rather ugly, the shaders made everyone look like clay.

Maybe the gameplay was arlright, but from an asthetic point of view and judging from the story, it's a mess.

 

[Treblaine]

I'm not fed up with rumors. I'm fed up with you reusing the same article over and over again. And if a console isn't in production yet, upgrading the CPU and GPU isn't that big of a deal, either.

And there is no evidence, that's why I'm so fed up with that article. Or more precisely, I'm fed up with you treating this article like it contains conclusive evidence. It doesn't.


As for Other M, let me address your points one by one. When Samus agreed to join the squad to find out what happened in the Bottleship, she agreed to follow Malkovich's command. Like a soldier. That also means that she has to wait for authorization before she can use her shit. You better believe that real soldiers need to be authorized to use their equipment. If anything, it makes her more honorable of a character then I'd have given her credit for, seeing how she disregards direct orders in Metroid Fusion. The only reason people harp on this is because she's female, and I'm sick and tired of hearing it. If she was male, people would most likely say "Give him a bloody medal for facing a superheated lava chamber without his heat protecting suit, even though it's a clear oversight by his superior not to clear usage of that upgrade."

The excuses why Samus looses her Suit upgrades are flimsy at best, with probably the only one I liked being the end of Metroid Prime 1, where the final boss rips her upgrades literally out of her (Fusion did it alright, too). At least this excuse has a narrative background.

That Ridley scene, ever heard of post traumatic stress disorder? She's beaten that monster to a bloody pulp how many times now? And still the monster from her childhood keeps tormenting her over and over. Again, what if it was a male galactic bounty hunter? I find it sickening how OF COURSE Samus is less of a badass now that she showed a surprising, unprecedented moment of weakness.

So you've suddenly changed your mind on not liking rumours? When I reveal how much you cite rumours.

I keep using that report because it is so damning and yet it keeps getting rejected for the must asinine and bad reasons.

Upgrading a CPU or GPU is a HUGE deal this late in the game when the patent rights and manufacturing channels must have been secured. You can't just cancel a huge order for parts and except to get another different one on short notice without delays on them hiking the price tag for components.

There is evidence. You simply deny it for spurious reasons. The developers are conclusive.

Pah, Samus was impertinent to command when she was a soldier, yet when free she just happens to be slavish? Contrived.

You better believe soldiers break rules on weapon procurement all the time when their lives are on the line. Better the possibility of facing Court Marshal than the certainty of death. And none of this is ever established, it looks exactly like Samus is merely slavishly enamoured with Adam she loses all sense of basic reasoning. Its not honourable to follow callous orders. The thing is, no where in any fiction are admired men ever presented this way, only small children... and women as depicted by sexist writers.

I do know about PTSD and that is NOT Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. PTSD is when a soldier returns and in normal peacetime you cannot escape or suddenly revert to the modes of thought developed in a warzone, a car backfiring will make you dive to the ground, paranoia that there are snipers in every window to spite rationally knowing it's a peacetime city. The problem is inability to switch it off. It cripples people as they remain in this heightened state of stress perpetually, so they can't mentally rest and are unable to respond, this stage of PTSD is known informally as "shell shock".

Samus suddenly freezing and blubbering like a little girl in the face of an enemy who she'd dominated before only has grounding in the minds of sexists who find women fragile and useless against adversity. Not in any film nor book nor video game has any male warrior ever been depicted in such a way.

Also... if they were TRYING to go for Post Traumatic Stress Disorder WHY WOULD THEY DO THAT! That is NOT what Metroid is supposed to be about. You know what it reminded me of? It's a fucking terrible idea that sounds like what this clown suggested:


1:10

That seems to be all too similar to what they did with Other M:

"Hey, imagine the drama as we take an admired strong and capable heroine and afflict her with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder... or some weird adulteration of it... and never explain that it is PTSD but have it look a hell of a lot like we think she's a stereotypical weak willed woman.

 

[Treblaine]

One console in 2? What does that even mean? Are they lego and have to be joined into one? Don't you mean "the same console". Anyway, it's 2 consoles in one hence why the Wii has awesome value. That's another reason I will get the WiiU, for that sweet sweet BC. Even though the launch may not go well (what launch has, amirite?), I can play some Wii classics.

I didn't say you would lie, just that you may skew the information or will believe dubious stories. You jumped all over that "tech sheet" even though you knew nothing about the CPU bar the amount of cache and the number of cores. And let me remind you, cores don't mean a lot, bulldozer and SB taught us that. I saw a pretty good post on neogaf that speculates that it may use IBMs form of hyperthreading, that's pretty interesting.

The Wii came with a free game too, don't forget about that. Not bad. Talk about value. They gave us 2 consoles in 1 and a free game and still made a profit. Nice going Nintendo. Truly, they are looking out for the consumer. That, and the fact that they haven't bowed to using DRM.

The thing is you are taking an anon source as fact, until we know who they are, we can't take them seriously. We can take the guys at epic seriously as they didn't hide behind anonymity. For all you know the "source" could be the guy who refills the coffee machines and thought to himself "that doesn't look that good" while looking at the guys making the game.

You know what I mean. I already explained it. Argument from incredulity is a fallacy.

Well then you are a fool to say I untrustworthy or without credibility as you didn't know what you were saying.

Knowing about the cache and number of cores of a CPU tells us A LOT! It tells out what kind of CPU it is not, it is not more powerful than an Xbox 360's. I work in a pc repair shop and benchmark rigs for my boss. the central processor DOES mean a lot! Rumour of hyperthreading?!? So what? Xbox 360's CPU can do that.

Free game? Yeah, Wii sports which is nothing but a glorified Wii-mote tech demo.

It IS a fact. Gamesindustrybiz verified the fact that WiiU developers really did say this and they aren't going to just ask the coffee guy but someone they have verified is an actual WiiU developer. What would you do if you knew their names? Hmm? What then? I have explained why they need anonymity to speak honestly and fully due to NDA liability. What do you have to say about NDA's then?

 

[Davroth]

As for Other M, let me address your points one by one. When Samus agreed to join the squad to find out what happened in the Bottleship, she agreed to follow Malkovich's command. Like a soldier. That also means that she has to wait for authorization before she can use her shit. You better believe that real soldiers need to be authorized to use their equipment. If anything, it makes her more honorable of a character then I'd have given her credit for, seeing how she disregards direct orders in Metroid Fusion. The only reason people harp on this is because she's female, and I'm sick and tired of hearing it. If she was male, people would most likely say "Give him a bloody medal for facing a superheated lava chamber without his heat protecting suit, even though it's a clear oversight by his superior not to clear usage of that upgrade."

But there's no reason for her to follow his orders. She just arbitrarily decides to do so, for no other reason beyond daddy issues with Adam. And your logic falls apart when, later in the game, Samus activates her Space Jump without a direct order and then activates her Power Bombs despite being told that use of them would never be authorized. And if Samus was male, people would still say "Wow, that was pretty stupid" because we expect our badass action heroes to disregard the rules.

That Ridley scene, ever heard of post traumatic stress disorder? She's beaten that monster to a bloody pulp how many times now? And still the monster from her childhood keeps tormenting her over and over. Again, what if it was a male galactic bounty hunter? I find it sickening how OF COURSE Samus is less of a badass now that she showed a surprising, unprecedented moment of weakness.

Okay, Samus freezing up, I could potentially accept, but keep in mind that "Oh, he keeps coming back, so of course she gets spooked" falls apart when she's shown no such reactions in any of the other half-dozen times she faces Ridley throughout the series.

Samus is still a badass, because people ignore Other M as the sexist piece of trash it was. Individual things, you can reason away, but taken as a whole, it's just heavy-handed bullshit. Like being repeatedly hit over the head with the whole 'mother' thing. Mother in the title of the game, the 'bottle' ship, the 'baby's cry' distress call. And the thing with the baby metroid. You know, the life form that she was about to kill when she found it? The life form that she gave up to the scientists to study without a second thought? Yeah, now it seems she's grieving its loss as if it were her own child. And then the death becomes ho-hum again in Fusion. The freezing up against Ridley, the having to be saved by the boys, the fact that canonically 6' tall Samus is DWARFED by the black guy in the final cutscene, who must be at least 7'6".

The fact that she's a woman makes it sexism, but even if Samus wasn't a woman, it wouldn't make it any less jarringly wrong. It's like Batman refusing to use any gadget that Commissioner Gordon didn't specifically tell him he could use. It's like John McClane from Die Hard having to be rescued at one point by the hostages. It's like Inigo Montoya freezing up when he sees the six-fingered man.

Ah, a fellow ZP fan. Nice to make your acquaintance.

http://metroid.wikia.com/wiki/Posttraumatic_stress_disorder

Except that she always showed reactions to Ridley, and that her stress disorder, whatever it is specifically, is well documented in the Metroid manga, which should be considered canon, shouldn't it? I suppose Metroid has always been a pile of sexist shit, we just didn't know before Other M.

Ridley is the one thing that can still scare her because no matter how many times she kills the bloody thing, it always comes back.

And the black guy is big, what's your point? Some people are freakishly big. Samus could kill any of those clowns with her arsenal. What difference does the size make?

Also this:
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HeroicBSOD

Might not be a very popular trope among action movie goers, doesn't mean it isn't used in media, for male and female characters alike. I think it makes for more relatable characters, but appearently unless a woman is a stoic warrior type, basically a male action hero who just happens to have an inverted penis, it's a sexist portrayal of women.

 

[Davroth]

So you've suddenly changed your mind on not liking rumours? When I reveal how much you cite rumours.

I keep using that report because it is so damning and yet it keeps getting rejected for the must asinine and bad reasons.

Because it's journalism doesn't mean it's the truth. And no media outlet is above some sensationalism. Don't treat it like ultimate truth.

Upgrading a CPU or GPU is a HUGE deal this late in the game when the patent rights and manufacturing channels must have been secured. You can't just cancel a huge order for parts and except to get another different one on short notice without delays on them hiking the price tag for components.

There is evidence. You simply deny it for spurious reasons. The developers are conclusive.

Who says there wont be delays? We don't have a release date yet, either.

Pah, Samus was impertinent to command when she was a soldier, yet when free she just happens to be slavish? Contrived.

You better believe soldiers break rules on weapon procurement all the time when their lives are on the line. Better the possibility of facing Court Marshal than the certainty of death. And none of this is ever established, it looks exactly like Samus is merely slavishly enamoured with Adam she loses all sense of basic reasoning. Its not honourable to follow callous orders. The thing is, no where in any fiction are admired men ever presented this way, only small children... and women as depicted by sexist writers.

There's more to being a man then being stoic in the face of battle. Writing only badass male characters is just as sexist as anything else.

Want me to pull up some examples of strong male characters having psychological breakdowns? Okay, here goes:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HeroicBSOD

I do know about PTSD and that is NOT Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. PTSD is when a soldier returns and in normal peacetime you cannot escape or suddenly revert to the modes of thought developed in a warzone, a car backfiring will make you dive to the ground, paranoia that there are snipers in every window to spite rationally knowing it's a peacetime city. The problem is inability to switch it off. It cripples people as they remain in this heightened state of stress perpetually, so they can't mentally rest and are unable to respond, this stage of PTSD is known informally as "shell shock".

Samus suddenly freezing and blubbering like a little girl in the face of an enemy who she'd dominated before only has grounding in the minds of sexists who find women fragile and useless against adversity. Not in any film nor book nor video game has any male warrior ever been depicted in such a way.

Also... if they were TRYING to go for Post Traumatic Stress Disorder WHY WOULD THEY DO THAT! That is NOT what Metroid is supposed to be about. You know what it reminded me of? It's a fucking terrible idea that sounds like what this clown suggested:


1:10

That seems to be all too similar to what they did with Other M:

"Hey, imagine the drama as we take an admired strong and capable heroine and afflict her with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder... or some weird adulteration of it... and never explain that it is PTSD but have it look a hell of a lot like we think she's a stereotypical weak willed woman.

http://metroid.wikia.com/wiki/Posttraumatic_stress_disorder

It's always been part of the Metroid canon that Samus suffers from a psychic trauma due to her experiences with Ridley.

 

[Treblaine]

If you work in a hardware repair shop then why did you buy bulldozer? Sure it's decent but the 2500K is quite a bit better.

Cool, the 360 has hyper-threading, I didn't know that. But yeah, the fact you bought bulldozer puts your tech knowledge into question. I mean, why? I know you said you got talked into it, maybe the guy was trying to unload stock that he couldn't shift?

You do benchmarks? You mean running an .exe, setting the settings then recording the values. Benchmarking isn't hard, hell I did some myself today in budget PC thread when it got derailed into a "post your rig" thread. The 7850 is quite a card. What are you running, just for curiosities sake?

We can all be friends.

I bought the bulldozer because I didn't have an Intel socket. I remember explaining all the benefits to you. The point is I have SEEN how different CPU's affects games and trying many different CPUs and GPUs we have in stock.

Yes, lets be friends, I think we have all said what we need to say about this and all related subjects and I take back all the not-so-nice things I said about you. Let's not take any personal stakes in this, and just wait and see what actually happens.

 

[Threeseventyfive]

Is anyone here concerned that we still don't have a price, release date or true specs?

Good things don't usually need to be hidden.

By that logic I fear for the PS4 and XBox 3 as we haven't heard anything.

There isn't any info about the PS4 and the Nexbox because they don't exist yet

 

[Treblaine]

snip

Right, so you claim gamesindustrybiz could be lying. Evidence they are lying: none. Burden of proof: on you

OK, I just kind of assumed they wouldn't delay as that would increase costs with partners. A redesign this late would still be very expensive and disruptive. I suppose it's not impossible, just implausible and no evidence it's going to happen

"Writing only badass male characters is just as sexist as anything else."

As it is there are only badass males and utterly compromised females.

I clicked through to TV tropes and not any examples to the extent that Samus was depicted in Other M where Samus freezes in front of her mortal enemy, cries like a little girl, freaks out uselessly like a ditzy woman and needs to be saved by some random guy. Other M did NOTHING to establish the gravity of the situation that anyone would be overwhelmed by, only that Samus is weak and fragile, much more so than the hardened male soldiers.

PTSD is still a terrible thing to imbue on Samus that makes the game unpleasant to play and ruins the feel of solitary and resolute adventure to melodramatic and hackish exploitation.

 

[Davroth]

snip

Right, so you claim gamesindustrybiz could be lying. Evidence they are lying: none. Burden of proof: on you

OK, I just kind of assumed they wouldn't delay as that would increase costs with partners. A redesign this late would still be very expensive and disruptive. I suppose it's not impossible, just implausible and no evidence it's going to happen.

It's not lying. They are quoting people. Developers even. It's just feeling very sensationalist, and doesn't have to be the truth about what Nintendo is going to do with the Wii U. Again, wouldn't be the first time a magazine had to print a correction.

"Writing only badass male characters is just as sexist as anything else."

As it is there are only badass males and utterly compromised females.

That's just a broad generalization you just know it's wrong. Unless you are talking about videogames. Then you are still wrong, but you can be forgiven for thinking that.

I clicked through to TV tropes and not any examples to the extent that Samus was depicted in Other M where Samus freezes in front of her mortal enemy, cries like a little girl, freaks out uselessly like a ditzy woman and needs to be saved by some random guy. Other M did NOTHING to establish the gravity of the situation that anyone would be overwhelmed by, only that Samus is weak and fragile, much more so than the hardened male soldiers.

I don't think you have read the list carefully enough, or maybe you'd have to see the examples in detail to understand the similarities. Not much I can do about that, though.

And it's all in the mangas, it has always been. Yeah, this is the strongest we have ever seen her react, but she also snaps out of it after a few seconds and kicks Ridley's ass.

And that random guy was her squad mate for years. Why do people want to make this a gender issue? Just goes to show how far we are still away from achieving gender equality in people's heads.

PTSD is still a terrible thing to imbue on Samus that makes the game unpleasant to play and ruins the feel of solitary and resolute adventure to melodramatic and hackish exploitation.

...to you. It ruins the feel of solitary and resolute adventure to you. For me, seeing a character showing a bit of humanity just makes them more compelling.