Will we ever be without currency?

[psijac]

A sister concept is post-scarcity. A resource becomes so abundant that it has no monetary value, like the oxygen you breathe or internet porn.

Is it possible to destroy all wants? Not really. Concert tickets to your favorite band still cost money even though you can still see them on youtube and listen to their music.

Once your material needs/wants are fulfilled a person will want to have more interesting life experiences. and that will always cost money.

 

[direkiller]

replicators in startrek work off of a mass conversion system (it's in the fluff), else they would need the output of a sun to produce a jug of water

*ahem* we are making "suns" *points to post above yours*

that dose not come anywhere near the output needed,to the point I find it funny.
the ITER has an output of about 2000J/s
so to produce 1kg of anything you would need to run it for over 2800 years



When I said the sun, I mean the sun, as in the entire sun.

 

[Fieldy409_v1legacy]

I hope not, then people would be even fatter and lazier than they are now without the carrot on a stick to motivate them. A world where you dont need to do your job for money but do it because you want to? You know what most people would do in that world?



Fuck, drink, play videogames.

 

[rednose1]

Currency is value in physical form, we'll never be without it. What it is may change over the years, but it'll always be around

 

[Griffolion]

-snip-

That would be nice, but unfortunately it will never happen. I do like the idea of it though. It's just that it relies on the idea of an individual giving away for free something they may have spent years on. While the society may have provided for them above and beyond their basic needs (a good home, luxuries, etc), their humanness will kick in and they will demand something extra as recompense. Especially if what they invented was very "valuable".

As an interesting aside, you're more or less describing [a href="http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Eldar"]pre-fall Eldar[/a] society. [a href="http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Fall_of_the_Eldar#.UfB89o3Ouuk"]And look what happened to them[/a]...

 

[Evil Smurf]

I argued that with enough scientific and technological developments we might develop a Star Trek-like society where people do things because it's what they love, and there will be no need for currency when science advances to a certain level because we might have robots to the menial rap jobs, wihilst people just go into fields for jobs because it's what they love, and due to infinite resources and technology, there will be no need for currency (obviously highly hypothetical, but this is a hypothetical argument).

Congratulations, you're a Communist.

Seriously, you are.

More on topic? No, money is not going to go away any time soon. Perhaps at some point in the future your scenario will come about through the discoveries of infinite or near-infinite energy and resources.

Until then, greed and the hedonic treadmill will keep resources scarce.

Hey me too

Human greed weighs down society, ruining politics, friendships and society as a whole. No, we will never be without currency. it's a nice thought though.

 

[FPLOON]

But what is more likely to happen, bitcoins gaining global recognition or physical currency disappearing entirely?
Hmm, tough to say, my money is on bitcoin. XD

I say it would be a mixture of both, with only a physical way of keeping track of digital funds per person... like a holographic ID card or something...

Hmmm... I think I need to refer back to this video [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_9R45RLNR0] I saw a while back on bitcoins, though... This really is too close to call, so I'm not going to place any bets down yet...

 

[Sheen Lantern]

Money is but a tool to facilitate the need to trade easily for either services and materials.

Don't confuse it's original purpose with it's actual application.

Money has become a means of control.

 

[Eliwood10]

This reminds me of the DS9 episode "In the Cards" where Jake Sisko, a Federation citizen without the need for money, needs money to buy something - an authentic baseball card. The card he wants could technically be replicated, but the point of having this particular card is the fact that it's authentic and valuable. He spends the whole episode exchanging goods and services around the station to earn the card.

Here's a link to SF Debris' review of the episode since he gives some great insight on this topic: [a href="http://sfdebris.com/videos/startrek/d523.asp"]http://sfdebris.com/videos/startrek/d523.asp[/a]

 

[viranimus]

Always be in a capitalist society? No. Fact is that the economic turmoil over the last couple years is a direct effect of the fact that capitalism is invariably a locust economic system and we have been LONG past the point of its peak effectiveness and the troubles are specifically because that system can only support itself for so long when mass production is the most efficient means of production. What this means is that we are currently in a state where we have to manufacture artificial scarcity to keep the gears of capitalism turning.

And as long as someone has vested interest in maintaining that status quo that allows them to have superiority over others there will be no willing abdication of money and the power that goes with it. So it is unfortunate but there is little or no chance of a nice peaceable transition into such a future.

Technology repeatedly keeps forcing us against this glass ceiling and as the next set of technological revolutions starting with 3D/Bio printing it might well be the impasse that capitalism can no longer quell the populous by duping it into thinking it needs shit it doesnt. Eventually it WILL come to an end because while it was a logical and even good idea for its industrial revolution time, it has entirely too many failings that it can never hope to address and we are already pushing the boundaries of how far into a broken and flawed system people can exist in.

 

[spartan231490]

My friend and I were having a debate earlier about whether the human race will ever lose the need for currency due to hypothetical scientific advancements?

I argued that with enough scientific and technological developments we might develop a Star Trek-like society where people do things because it's what they love, and there will be no need for currency when science advances to a certain level because we might have robots to the menial rap jobs, wihilst people just go into fields for jobs because it's what they love, and due to infinite resources and technology, there will be no need for currency (obviously highly hypothetical, but this is a hypothetical argument).

However he said that no matter how far science goes, replicators, infinite crops and energy, advanced robots etc. there will always be currency and we will always be a capitalist society.

What is your opinion (be srs pls)

Of course there will always be currency. It's basic economic theory and basic physics, no supply is infinite, even if we have replicator the amount of mass/energy is always constant so the supply is still limited. This means that only a limited number of the people will be able to have certain things. It also means that from a resources standpoint, opportunity cost still exists. Therefore, you would need some way to regulate purchases and manufacture, the only way to do this other than an absolute dictatorship is currency.

 

[Tono Makt]

There will always be a need for a currency of some sort - we've always had it, we always will. Even with the Star Trek replicators we're going to need something to contend with the items that can't be replicated; attending a music concert, travelling farther than one can be beamed (though in the NuTrek, that might not count anymore since you can beam from Earth to Qu'noS), an original piece of artwork, getting the neighbours kid to cut your grass or pull weeds from your garden, etc.

 

[Upbeat Zombie]

I think in the society you describe. The widespread use of currency may decline. But I believe there will always be exceptions where currency is needed. Suppose you want a service that can't be replicated. I don't think people will be lining up to provide services for free. So you would either have to give them something they couldn't replicate, or give them another service or favor. But eventually people will want a guarantee of that favor. So they will give some kind of physical or digital guarantee of service. Which would eventually just become currency. At least thats how I imagine it will be.

 

[DragonStorm247]

Even if resources as we understand them become redundant, humans will always find something to economize.

 

[SinisterGehe]

There will always be need for currency, there will always be something that has THE highest value that everyone wants and needs - and when something is used to trade with then it is currency.

Long as the humanity is installed in humans, there will always be need for a currency. And specially since in world in which our whole infrastructure has a lot of non-productive professions, there needs to be money. Example doctors are important, vital and necessary profession, yet they do not produce ANYTHING that could be traded objectively.

Of course there is always socialism, one true form of government. At least in theory, but thus far they all have lead up to massive dictatorships and failure. Still waiting for good test results.

 

[Headsprouter]

Well, the conspiracy theorist in me thinks we will always have currency for as long as our existence is, as even if a replicator is built, the greedy people will never let us be aware it exists, so they can keep their control.

But that's just me.

 

[Yearlongjester]

I'm working on it, I got a four-step plan and everything.

1) Create A.I, thus breaching the Technological Singularity and ushering a new age of enlightenment.
2) Pave the way for the full automation of our manufacturing industries through Robotics and aforementioned A.I.
3) Fix energy problem. Short-term: Get away from Fossil Fuels. Long-term: the creation of a new energy source that is renewable, relatively cheap and portable without the major loss in energy. (Currently there is no way to "save" energy, it is directed to areas and if the grid isn't fully utilizing the output than the energy is lost.)
4) Fix supply problem. Without a financial economy there will be a problem with demand, we won't have to cut back and watch what we get. I feel the solution would be to investigate altering Sub-Atomic particles, particularly that of waste. Think of it as a new way of recycling, that banana peel can now become something else, depending on the desire.

After those are established, it would be feasible but there would still be a ton of problems. Law Enforcement would be difficult when many officers would quit there jobs if it were no longer required to make a living, and if our laws were left in place as they are now we would have a serious problem enforcing any of them with a straight face.

The education system would need massive revisions as well, I shan't dive into that because it's late and I don't want to stir a debate, but I find even the school systems in some European countries (Which supposedly have the best schools in the world) to be lacking.

Honestly I think one of the biggest problems would be IP rights. After we eliminate currency, what differentiates fan fiction from the actual product? Should only the original creator be allowed to muddle about in his/her universe? Must they be consulted each and every time somebody has an idea and have to greenlight it? Or could we allow anyone to work on any IP, and let the fans decide which are worthy of achieving canon status.

Lots of difficulties in this endeavor, but it will be worth it. Starting to learn programming now. You're all welcome.

 

[Zack Alklazaris]

Currency is a false reality meaning, its only as real as society sees it. Because of this there is a chance it will not always exists.

 

[Blood Brain Barrier]

My friend and I were having a debate earlier about whether the human race will ever lose the need for currency due to hypothetical scientific advancements?

I argued that with enough scientific and technological developments we might develop a Star Trek-like society where people do things because it's what they love, and there will be no need for currency when science advances to a certain level because we might have robots to the menial rap jobs, wihilst people just go into fields for jobs because it's what they love, and due to infinite resources and technology, there will be no need for currency (obviously highly hypothetical, but this is a hypothetical argument).

That's bullshit though. The people in Star Trek do jobs for the same reason as we do - power. Money doesn't serve an and in itself, people want it because it gives us power. The whole "we don't do things for money" in Star Trek is a giant strawman, because people in modern society don't do things "for money" either.

Ask Picard why it should be him making the decisions instead of Riker, and he won't have an answer for you.