Women on Death Row

[Blatherscythe]

I recently came across a late-nineties documentary about women on death row. It shows the lives of three women on death row and reveals some sexist bias towards the men on death row as is explained early in the documentary. I would like to post the documentary and for those who have enough time to view and comment on it I would like to know your thoughts on the prisoners and the treatment of women on death row. Though I would like to inform you that a bit after this documentary was aired there was apparently 9 female executions in the US from when it aired to 2002. One should also keep in mind that this was done in the 1990's and things may have changed dramatically since then. And also remember that regardless of your opinion of the death penalty try to keep the discussion on the documentary, but you can also say that you don't support the death penalty in your post.

Also, please inform me if I chose a documentary from a biased show or if showing a whole documentary is against The Escapist's rules. Nothing would be more more embarrassing than posting a bias documentary or breaking forum rules without knowing it.

Without further ado, here is the documentary...


I forgot how to post a youtube clip on the website so if someone could refresh my memory of it that would be appreciated.

As for my own thoughts on the documentary I was truly shocked to see the difference in prisoner treatment. They are not cooped up in a cell for 23 hours a day, are given access to luxuries that male inmates don't get and are allowed to see one another, this is clear gender bias, either male inmates should have these privileges too or the women don't get them either. I also believe the justice system made the right call with the first woman, as she was clearly insane and wouldn't hesitate to resort to violence, and doesn't regret what she did, that and her crocodile tears got on my nerves. The second one I believe should have gotten life, but not be executed, she had killed many people to support a nasty drug habit, including her own mother, but reformed while in prison and was a helpful inmate, the sheer amount of death she caused is the reason I say she should be locked up for life, if she did this without drugs I would say she deserves execution. The last woman they interviewed I believe should have been found guilty of second degree murder, she didn't plan to kill the officer, was on drugs, and was having a flashback to being molested, which lead to her doing what she did, she reformed in prison and at least publicly regrets her actions.

So after seeing the documentary what are your thoughts on the matter?

 

[Vault101]

I think women...no matter how awful the things they have done....I guess its harder for society to see them as "monsters" like men

because men are seen as stronger, women as weaker

men the predators, women the victims....seeing a woman mistreaded (generally) is seen differently to a man mistreated

but they don't deserve special privalges due to their gender

EDIT: cant watch now but may be an interesting watch for later

 

[Dags90]

Eh. If it's just a documentary about three women, I'd chalk it up to cherry picking.

Conditions in prisons are highly variable for both genders. Here's an article about prisons being too cozy in general.[footnote]http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/06/convicted-killer-luxurious-life-jail[/footnote]

I would want more data before I jump to any conclusions.

 

[Keoul]

Here's how to post youtube vids
youtube.com/watch?v=blaghblaghblagh
Turns into [ youtube=blaghblaghblagh ]

Now this is a REALLY long documentary, I don't really see any reason not to put Linda (no clue how to spell her last name) to death, she assisted in murdering an officer who was just arresting her husband for not having a drivers license, then led the police on a car chase and finally giving up.

This is just unbelievable, it's just so stupid, I don't live in america so I just can't fathom why they'd start a gun fight over the lack of a drivers license. Personally she should just get life in prison but that's probably not how the law works over there.

 

[manic_depressive13]

I don't see how it's really possible to keep the broader issue of the death penalty out of this discussion. Putting people to death is fucked up and there's not a single civilised country that still does it. On top of knowing that they are going to be killed people on death row are treated terribly and forced to live in deplorable conditions. Were the women in this video treated favourably compared to the men? Yes, and that's not fair. Men should be given the same concessions. However, I don't think treating the women as badly as the men are treated is really the way to go. The women's treatment should be used as a precedent for improving conditions for men, not the other way around. I think it's really fucked up that if one group of people is forced to live in deplorable, degrading conditions, instead of trying to fix that we think it's a suitable comprimise to simply force everyone to live in such conditions.

I'll give another example. When (some) men believe women are advantaged in some way, instead of fighting for the same advantage as feminists do, they instead prioritise dragging women down to their level. Take conscription. There are people who cry "How unfair! If men are conscripted, women ought to be too!" Um, no. No one should be conscripted. It's a violation of human rights. Why not fight for your rights instead of pushing for others to lose theirs?

Edit: Now that I actually watched it: Holy shit, biased documentary is biased. "Oh no we don't slaughter as many women as men, how unfair!" As for that governor who apparently spared the lives of four women in his final term, if he genuinely believed their being black had something to do with the sentencing of those women, massive respect to him. I also have quite a bit of admiration for the first woman. She was only trying to protect her family. Her nine year old son was in the car. If the husband is to be believed the officer reached for his weapon first, and honestly I don't doubt that. If the situation had been reversed and an officer had killed someone in order to protect his colleague, even if that colleague had been in the wrong and was abusing his power, no one would question what the second officer did. It's disgusting that a murder becomes excusable simply because it was committed by police and inexcusable simply because the victim was an officer.

Furthermore, there were a few freaky motherfuckers insisting that "justice had not been served" becaue some of the women sentenced to death were still alive. It's my understanding that death row is very frequently an incredibly long and drawn out process, what with the processing of all the appeals and such. I studied loads of cases in which men were put to death whole decades after they had been sentenced, yet the people in the documentary were vehement that those women were still alive because they were women, which leads me to the conclusion that some people are fucking stupid.

I loved the bit where the narrator says "Even in Texas, where they are proud of how many people they have executed, they are reluctant to execute women." Apparently the issue here is that they are reluctant to execute women as opposed to the fact that they think executing people is something to be proud of. Fucking hell, priorities.

 

[StBishop]

Just copy paste from here.

It's the easiest way.

OT: I'll watch it when I have more time.

 

[SpectacularWebHead]

AAAaaagh, why is a woman on death row any different to a man on death row?
It's exactly the same, it really doesn't matter if you have a vagina or a penis, seriously guys, enough with these threads.

 

[surg3n]

Fricken captcha, wants a dry slap.

 

[surg3n]

What you have to consider, is why the male prisoners aren't allowed to socialise etc. Would it be because there's every likelihood that the smallest little chance to escape, to bring another court case in and try to delay their death sentence...

Women might be allowed more privaleges because they don't try to kill or rape each other at every chance. Myself, I wouldn't grudge someone on death row a little piece and quiet, time to reflect, maybe express themselves, they are paying their debt to society.

Thing is, it's not the death row folk who I feel sorry for, it's the guys who made a stupid mistake, and end up in jail, and have to deal with the rapists, murderers and nut jobs over some stupid tax evasion, or selling some harmless weed.

Really though, the legal system is fucked, in pretty much every country. I mean, polititians were bragging about how in the UK the crime rate has fallen lower than it's been in the last 20 years... yet 2 days later there's a report of how our prisons are almost at capacity. I won't get into the subject of US law, as it seems to greatly vary between states.

If I had to go to jail, then I'd probably rather be locked up all day than risk being stabbed in the eyes with an aid's infected shiv. In fact, really I'd rather be sent to that prison at the end of Papillon, where the inmates slowly go crazy, but at least they're by the sea, and have their own little huts. That place looked awesome.

 

[Blatherscythe]

I also believe the justice system made the right call with the first woman, as she was clearly insane and wouldn't hesitate to resort to violence

Of course, we are lucky that no such thing as psychiatry exists, so someone with several mental problems could never recover and become stable, and we can kill them knowing full well we made the right choice.


When it comes to prisons, the US is really about a century behind the rest of the western world. People are just thrown in a cell, isolated, subjected to extremely rigid rules and harsh enforcement of those, isolated untill they lose all sense of day and night, and the only treatment is stuffing them full of sedatives that have no medical effect and are merely meant to convenience handling the prisoners.

...And then the prison wardens go on documentaries and bleat 'well, would you look at how weird and violent these guys are? who could've expected that? We only made them like that ourselves after all, so what a surprise'.

Did you watch the documentary? She was part of an anti-government group, carried an arsenal of guns with her husband with 1000's of rounds of ammunition, driving around with no license, not paying taxes and all while her son was in the back seat. Her husband started a gun fight with a police officer who asked for his license and when he was going to arrest him for it her husband pulled a gun out and started shooting. She see's this, and by some accounts she pulls her gun out, assumes a crouched firing pose and shoots the police officer, and does so again while he's driving away. She then gets into a car chase until they are blocked off from all exits and give themselves up. All with her child in the back-seat.

She even says she doesn't regret what she did and is constantly looking for a loophole in the law that would allow her to get away with murder. She also whines about not being able to see her son, yet the documentary shows that the police officer's mother can't see hers any more either. And maybe she isn't insane, that actually makes it worse because there is nothing affecting her judgement.

And I would love to see how you would deal with inmates who's crimes range from petty crimes to capital crimes in what amounts to a fortress with them outnumbering you. Yes the rules are strict and the prisoners are isolated, you need to keep the inmates under control and prevent riots, and certain inmates need to be kept apart, they do this with different gangs and paedophiles because they'll kill each other or a certain prisoner. And how would you move a dangerous criminal from one part of the prison to the other without drugging him/her or chaining them up? I know the justice system is there to punish and reform, but once the crime is murder reform goes out the window and they are supposed to be kept away from society. How are prisoners treated where your from and what are their crimes?