Wonder Woman's Vanishing Boyfriend

[LiquidGrape]

...specifically his theory about the superiority of the female gender.

Just a slight correction: it's the female sex, not female gender.

That aside, I really like the thesis of this article. It's these seemingly harmless constructs which ultimately produce ubiquitous societal expectations and presumptions, and that needs to be addressed.

 

[Grahav]

I feel so uncomfortable with this idea that I find hard even to imagine my heroines with weaker boyfriends. The need men have to be strong is not just cultural, it is marked in our instincts (of men and women).

This. It's not that there's a problem with women filling traditionally male positions within society, but physicality is a different matter. Males are genetically stronger and more athletic than women. When a woman embraces these male roles they quickly step beyond what it means to be female in order to emulate masculinity.

Spoiler

It is not just phisical. It is about anyfield where there is competition between genders.

 

[themanwithfournames]

hmmm. perhapes we are looking at this wrong. ok, i dont know if people know this, but on average men ARE stronger the women. men naturlay have more upper body strength. its been proven. another interesting tidbit is that most people dont like the unatural, dont like things dont dont conform to their world view. so when we see a girl rescuing a guy, which we see as the women being stronger then the man, we feel uncomfterble. not because we are sexist, but because we see this as unatural, and it is. thats not to say that a girl being stronger then a guy is bad, or even uncommen, just unatural. i would also like to point out that being unatural isnt a bad thing either.

perhapes sexism itself evolved from this feeling of discomfert. i dont know.

 

[WolfThomas]

... And then Marvel turned her into a slut that's become notorious for sleeping with everyone. Yeah, well, there went that dream of finding a girl in comics I relate to.

If it helps they ret-conned out a bunch of her sexual conquests by saying it was an alternate universe She-Hulk who was a giant slut (which given the comics tongue in cheek nature actually makes sense), I don't think she slept with Juggernaut anymore.

What about Batman? I am not a huge comic book fan, but I have seen some comics and specially animated movies/ series that show a connection between them.

I've always been a fan of this combination, the only problem is that there would always have to be a reason why Bruce just doesn't call for Diana's help.

"So apparently the industry has no problem with pairing super-powered men with human women, but a huge problem with pairing super-powered women with human men"

In the left corner we have a refutation

Astro Cities ASTRA; Matt (that one dude).
Huntress; to many to name over her long written history.
She-Hulk; a new guy every night.
Empowered; Thug Boy
Wonder Woman; Nemisis

A great example is Big Barda and Mr Miracle, sure he is actually a Superhuman (and New God) but he's much smaller than Barda physically yet that doesn't seem to worry him.

 

[Zom-B]

I feel so uncomfortable with this idea that I find hard even to imagine my heroines with weaker boyfriends. The need men have to be strong is not just cultural, it is marked in our instincts (of men and women).

I know this thread is ancient history, but I just thought I'd point out that in many species the female is the larger and stronger of the genders in order to protect offspring. Yes, I realize this isn't true in the case of humans, but at the same time, women are at their most ferocious when defending their children.

I think perhaps at some point in our evolutionary history men were indeed bigger and stronger for the purposes of hunting and for protecting family units from danger, but we are so far beyond that now that it's merely a cultural remnant and men's physical superiority is a vestigial trait.

 

[AdrianRK]

Hi there!
I consider your article very interesting, but I disagree with your conclusions.
You have to understand that humans are in fact animals, and as any other animals, we have specific behaviour. One rigorously studies behaviour is the hypergamy of women. Hypergamy means that most women will always look upwards on the social ladder when deciding on a sexual partner. Not because society expects this from them, but because it is instinctual.
One evolutionary psychologist did a test putting 20 women and 20 men in one room for a few hours without them knowing the purpose of the study. After some time, they noticed that 80% of all the women in the group war paying attention to only 20% off all the men. In conclusions women are naturally attracted to men they consider the best of the group. But this isn?t something new to us, we all noticed this in high school.
Knowing this, we instinctively consider that Wonder woman can?t possibly be attracted to Steve because he?s a wimp. He?s not a man to admire, his not a man you would notice in a group of 20 men (not as long as Superman is there)
Moreover, any couples therapist can tell you that, if you?re a woman in a relationship with someone you DON?T WANT to have sex with, all you have to do is emasculate them. Show them you?re better than them at their chosen profession or hobby, and he isn?t going to be able to have sex with you. In other words, a man will be faced with sexual impotence if he?s in a relationship with a woman he perceives as being better than him, and this will lead to an unhappy relationship. This is why most people perceive Steve?s relationship with Wonder Woman as being unrealistic. This is also why we perceive Superman?s relationship with Lois Lane as being more believable. Just as women look upwards on the social ladder, men look downwards. This is why a lot of girls date boys a few years older than them, and rarely boys younger than them.
The problem with Steve isn?t about sexism or the fact that we can?t deal with powerful women, it?s just that the story is just unconvincing.

Sorry for the long post

 

[fulano]

When Lois is flown out of danger in Superman's arms, it fits with our traditional view of women as the inherently weaker sex, but when Wonder Woman carries Steve Trevor in her arms, it makes him weak because we have this outdated idea that being male means you have a responsibility to be physically superior to women.

It's not dated perse. It's just the cultural baseline settings of most males, apparently. I mean, hasn't anyone wondered how come they are still there? Thousands of years into our recorded history and even longer in our existence as a species? Those freaking drives to thump our chest and prove our masculinity are there due to intrinsic natural causes. We exist in a natural world, not one made up merely of ideals.

I'm all for culturally phasing out instinctual drives that have little place in our society any longer, but to just come out and say that something is dated b/c we feel threatened or b/c of this or that without offering actual context of those fears other than "Dood, it's old news!" doesn't seem very conductive towards a productive debate. Just saying.

One of my favorite comic book romances was She-Hulk and Wyatt Wingfoot. She was the "strong" one, yet she dated and loved Wyatt for several years because, at the end of the day, he was a smart, charming, courageous gentleman that still opened doors for her, pulled out her seat at dinner, and would surprise her with flowers and listen to her "girl problems" when she had them.

... And then Marvel turned her into a slut that's become notorious for sleeping with everyone. Yeah, well, there went that dream of finding a girl in comics I relate to.

I'm all for sluts, and all, but that does sound like a serious character demotion if she suddenly isn't as well rounded as she was before in favor of her having a schtick to live up to. That doesn't sound fun.

 

[userwhoquitthesite]

I just have to wonder why it matters, since wonder woman is a crappy character in the first place.

Her writing is some of the most scatterbrained nonsense, with no one ever able to settle on a single personality, and half the time making her powers and abilities change because the latest writer doesn't know what they are. I'm told she now has a better, more solid writer, but I'm still just not interested in this one-note superwoman.

She's as lame as Superman is!

 

[Requia]

Also, shouldn't she have only one breast if she's really an amazonian? How's she supposed to fire a bow with those things?

XD
Yeah, historical accuracy is not something DC is too terribly worried about, methinks.

There's absolutely nothing historically accurate about that. Aside from the dubious nature of the Amazons' actual existence (possibly it derives from Scythian women, but the warriors there were still mostly men with some women choosing to be warriors), there's seriously no reason to do that, women archers (and men with large enough moobs) wear a half binder that keeps the right side out of the way.

I'm also not sure that I buy the whole men are insecure thing. Maybe in the 40s, or maybe I just hang out with too many weightlifters, but in general guys responses to strong women is one of attraction.

 

[Seracen]

In all honestly, I am tired of superheroes dating non-superheroes in general. Comics handle relationships poorly as a whole, regardless of gender. I am tired of the Lois Lane/Mary Jane damsels-in-distress. It's a cheap gimmick that's lost it's luster long ago. That sort of thing is what innocent bystanders are for.

Not having the principles actually get with anyone is another dynamic shows and comics use to keep the fans interested. For example, any females that enter the "Supernatural" series are either friend-zoned or killed.

As the studio sees it: ladies like fantasizing about finally being the one to "heal" the brothers, whereas the guys want to fantasize living the unattached lifestyle. I can see the reasoning, but I think good writing trumps it, so I disagree with it. The TV show Castle deals with this in a palatable and interesting way.

I've never particularly ascribed to the "commitment = stagnation" ideology. I just think that heroes deserve appropriate matches. For instance, I supported turning Spiderman into a bachelor again, simply because they handled MJ so poorly. I'll admit I've always been a Black Cat fan (never a distressed damsel). But even if MJ is his fated one, at least handle her properly, for pete's sake (pun intended).

I think a valid excuse, however, is turning away fans who have one favorite or another. For example, there are Wonder Woman/Batman fans, and those who think she can only be with Superman. There are those who think Lois is great, others who hate her. For the record, I have hated every incarnation of Lois Lane until Smallville and Amy Adams (although she was palatable in the Death and Return arc in the comics). But that doesn't mean I'll stop reading Supes just b/c he's with Lois, or start reading b/c Wonder Woman is with him, only if the stories get dull.

Rogue...there's another pisser. Her and Gambit are clearly attracted to each other, and she ends up with Magneto-clone due to some ham-fisted loophole?! Bull...controllable "Genosha collars" work just as well as magnetic body condoms. They turned her into an powerless, indecisive caricature. Gambit became an arse for even looking at another woman, but hey, who can blame him right (sarcasm)? Contrived reasons to extend needless drama frustrate me.

If the love interests aren't contributing to the story, at least have them be the normalizing factor that keeps the hero sane. But for the love of God, don't make every other arc about their kidnapping/death, and don't trivialize them.